Putting the 'role' back in role-playing games since 2002.
Donate to Codex
Good Old Games
  • Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.

Torment and the Nameless One's past

Qwinn

Scholar
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
666
Eh, I'd say wait for v4 of my mods at this point. It will have some changes that should make the combat significantly more interesting. For example, you will no longer get a billion more HP than you were supposed to due to getting a constitution bonus after every single level, even after level 10. That was a big reason in why late game combat was retardedly easy and unchallenging (and I've fixed most of the other reasons too).

Also a couple new tweaks that I think will be pretty cool to play with... you'll be able to reduce TNO's stats below 9. There are actually checks in dialogue for stats below 9 that have never been seen in game because that was the minimum. And, also, there are five levels of TO difficulty in the endgame, but due to retarded level requirements, almost no one would see harder than the 2nd, and pretty much only thieves would see the 3rd variant. I plan on a tweak that will un-retard the level requirements and it'll actually be possible to fight the hardest TNO that the BI guys coded for.

Qwinn
 

Qwinn

Scholar
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
666
Well you see the first line is in reference to the content of General Discussion where kc has moderator powers. One activity of a moderator is to move threads to Retardo Land. The second I believe is a quote from Terry Pratchett's Discworld novels of which kc is a fan. Thus both fit quite perfectly and make sense to have in a signature. Which kc only need type once and can change whenever he likes.

I see. Well, honestly, the reason I bring it up is cause I think it's kinda funny that he describes having to read the single five letter username after my posts as "tedious" (although, if he's looking at the left side to see who posts it, doesn't that require the same amount of tedious effort? I'm saving him having to roll his eyes across the screen, but is he grateful? Nooooo.)

But the 34 words that follow every last single one of his posts? Somehow -not- tedious.

Qwinn
 

VentilatorOfDoom

Administrator
Staff Member
Joined
Apr 4, 2009
Messages
8,600
Location
Deutschland
DarkUnderlord said:
Qwinn said:
Why are people more curious about that than they are over why someone sees fit to have this:

Some may question my right to Retardo ten billion threads. Those who understand realize I have no right to let them live.
--
"And now I must fly," said the Bursar, "Except that I mustn't."

...appear after every post?

Qwinn
Well you see the first line is in reference to the content of General Discussion where kc has moderator powers. One activity of a moderator is to move threads to Retardo Land. The second I believe is a quote from Terry Pratchett's Discworld novels of which kc is a fan. Thus both fit quite perfectly and make sense to have in a signature. Which kc only need type once and can change whenever he likes.

Qwinn said:
One, it's a habit from ages ago, back when the closest thing to the internet was local BBS's run on 16k TRS-80s with a 300 baud modem, and even the code necessary to automatically sign every post was better used elsewhere.
So you're saying you haven't actually posted on a forum since about 1977, thus haven't had the opportunity to develop the habit of not signing posts? Do you still try and insert a floppy disk whenever you want to load a program? Personally I had a MicroBee.

Qwinn said:
Plus, it has sometimes gotten me better results when I have, for whatever reason, needed to do searches for my own posts (like, for example, when someone has misquoted me, and I have needed to find the original) Not all board search engines allow you to filter by user.
So what happens if everybody starts doing that?

Qwinn

Dear Dicksmoker

is it really necessary to deliberately fuck up Qwinns way to find his old posts? Just for teh lulz?

Sincerely
Qw.. - eh i mean - zerotol
 

VentilatorOfDoom

Administrator
Staff Member
Joined
Apr 4, 2009
Messages
8,600
Location
Deutschland
Qwinn said:
Eh, I'd say wait for v4 of my mods at this point. It will have some changes that should make the combat significantly more interesting. For example, you will no longer get a billion more HP than you were supposed to due to getting a constitution bonus after every single level, even after level 10. That was a big reason in why late game combat was retardedly easy and unchallenging (and I've fixed most of the other reasons too).

Also a couple new tweaks that I think will be pretty cool to play with... you'll be able to reduce TNO's stats below 9. There are actually checks in dialogue for stats below 9 that have never been seen in game because that was the minimum. And, also, there are five levels of TO difficulty in the endgame, but due to retarded level requirements, almost no one would see harder than the 2nd, and pretty much only thieves would see the 3rd variant. I plan on a tweak that will un-retard the level requirements and it'll actually be possible to fight the hardest TNO that the BI guys coded for.

Qwinn

That sounds good. There are some thing i don't like about your changes though (previous changes). It's the change to this fighter/mage stuff. THAC0 and the like.
Actually I always prefer casters in my DnD games so you won't see me weeping if I have to play TNO as a true wizard. But I think this creates a whole lot of new problems that you do not address. Here they are:

- where are my ranged weapons if I may humbly ask?
- where are my combat protection spells, Mirror Image, Stoneskin, Improved Invisibility, Fireshield and why is the duration of the existing protection spells too short?
- where are my summoning spells, to keep my Mage out of Melee?
- why is the damage dealt by many spells so ridiculously low?
- since many enemies have very good saves and high MR, where are Malison and Lower Resistance?
- where are the possibilities to rest to regain your spells let's say in Curst Prison? Or at least the possibility to retreat to where you can rest?

I could go on. Case in point: I think depriving Mages from a decent Melee capability causes just one thing: In the end Dakkon, Annah and Morte do all the work, and TNO just watches. You'd have to include a lot of Spells and weapons to make playing a true DnD wizard viable.
 

Qwinn

Scholar
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
666
Fair enough. Here's my responses. Switching the order around cause it matters.

- where are the possibilities to rest to regain your spells let's say in Curst Prison? Or at least the possibility to retreat to where you can rest?

The area next to the Curst Prison has a hermit that will allow you to rest through dialogue. I usually visit him at least once or twice while working the prison. There is a place to rest in every section of the game.

- why is the damage dealt by many spells so ridiculously low?

Depends on the spell, but really, most of the opponents have pretty low HP as well, so I think it balances. Frankly, most of the spells actually do reflect proper damage done by 2nd edition spells. It's just that no one ever used 'em cause Fireball was available and it outdamaged everything else. I actually enjoy having to rely on the -rest- of the spell list for once.

- where are my combat protection spells, Mirror Image, Stoneskin, Improved Invisibility, Fireshield and why is the duration of the existing protection spells too short?

Yeah, the spell list is short on these - however, let's be honest - aren't those spells primarily used when you -are- trying to have your mage go into melee? For my fighter mages, those are his bread and butter. For my mages, rarely cast 'em.

where are my summoning spells, to keep my Mage out of Melee?

Your party members should be able to keep stuff off you while you're casting spells.

since many enemies have very good saves and high MR, where are Malison and Lower Resistance?

Several of TNO's higher level spells bypass saves and MR. (In one case, Mechanus Cannon, critters were getting saves against it which I judged they shouldn't be, and I removed it... it hits pretty damn hard now).

- where are my ranged weapons if I may humbly ask?

Not sure how this affects mage viability... but missile of patience might as well be considered ranged combat, and it's only available to the mage, and at higher levels it is quite effective.

And I will say this. There is an insanely broken (well... not broken... INTENDED... but insanely overpowered) spell available to mages that makes them very effective in combat even with mage THACO (and no, I'm not going to tell you which, figure it out :P Before the fix, with fighter THACO -and- use of that spell, the use of that spell was so utterly overpoweredly broken it staggers belief.

Qwinn
 

Helton

Arcane
Joined
Jan 29, 2007
Messages
6,789
Location
Starbase Delta
Wyrmlord said:
7. He finally reached the Gray Wastes in a blood soaked body and his clothes torn down to mere rags discoloured by blood and dirt. When the hag he searched for was finally found, she was touched by his predicament, in seeing that he transformed himself into a better man, and was willing to endure enormous pain to atone for his wrongs. She could not have thought a mortal man was capable of such a thing, and he was the one who could finally answer her eternal question of "What can change the nature of a man?"

Well, no, that question was not eternal. TNO is the person who asked Ravel the riddle, she could not answer -- very frustrating for her.

Also, I do not believe TNO had any regrets at that point. He was attempting to escape his fate in the Blood War and the immortality was supposed to ensure he had enough time to find a way. I'm not sure how much of that is heavily implied and how much I've just come up with over time, though.

That should probably cover most of the story of the original incarnation. Beyond that, as he went through endless reincarnations, at one point, he would become a masterful Practioner of the Arts, who would go on to traverse the planes, and then cheat and bind any person of value to serve him. These included a githzerai zerth of a destroyed city in limbo, a blind archer, the very same bureaucrat who led him to the hag, and a foreseeing Sensate.

I'm also curious why you think Morte is that bureaucrat (in fact I don't recall the bureaucrat but whatev). It is an intriguing thought, though. Is Morte's dialogue at the pillar documented somewhere I think the wording there would be important.

Also, I'm pretty sure the Mage who took Morte (and duelled with Demon lords which TTO references I think) is not Practical. Practical got the tatoos, though, warning later incarnations not to trust Morte.

Are there any more details that you guys remember, perchance? None of this was ever told in chronological order, and I am curious to sum up exactly what happened.

I think the Mage incarnation who took Morte was the same as Ignus' master. He's probably the only one we cross tracks with multiple times who is not in the Fortress.

Maybe its time for another replay already.
 

VentilatorOfDoom

Administrator
Staff Member
Joined
Apr 4, 2009
Messages
8,600
Location
Deutschland
Qwinn said:
The area next to the Curst Prison has a hermit that will allow you to rest through dialogue. I usually visit him at least once or twice while working the prison. There is a place to rest in every section of the game.

I tried to get back to the Hermit but couldn't find the exit where I came in. And I searched for it. Hard to find?

Depends on the spell, but really, most of the opponents have pretty low HP as well, so I think it balances. Frankly, most of the spells actually do reflect proper damage done by 2nd edition spells. It's just that no one ever used 'em cause Fireball was available and it outdamaged everything else. I actually enjoy having to rely on the -rest- of the spell list for once.

I almost never use Fireball anyway, I'm more of a flame arrow guy :lol:
There should be better Damge spells on earlier levels though.

Yeah, the spell list is short on these - however, let's be honest - aren't those spells primarily used when you -are- trying to have your mage go into melee? For my fighter mages, those are his bread and butter. For my mages, rarely cast 'em.

Of course you need them on your mages too. You can hardly avoid getting into melee and casting spells at the same time. It might be bearable in this case because you'll have AC-10 pretty early on, but still.

Your party members should be able to keep stuff off you while you're casting spells.

This is what I meant with too much reliance on partymembers.

Several of TNO's higher level spells bypass saves and MR. (In one case, Mechanus Cannon, critters were getting saves against it which I judged they shouldn't be, and I removed it... it hits pretty damn hard now).

At higher levels. And before? Well you made a spell bypassing MR and allowing for no save. That's a good start. :cool:

Not sure how this affects mage viability... but missile of patience might as well be considered ranged combat, and it's only available to the mage, and at higher levels it is quite effective.

Your enemies are too numerous to defeat them all with spells. - There should be more bonus spell slot giving equipment. - So you can't cast all the time and might want to use a sling once in a while so you don't get dragged into melee combat where you don't hit the wide side of a barn.

And I will say this. There is an insanely broken (well... not broken... INTENDED... but insanely overpowered) spell available to mages that makes them very effective in combat even with mage THACO (and no, I'm not going to tell you which, figure it out :P Before the fix, with fighter THACO -and- use of that spell, the use of that spell was so utterly overpoweredly broken it staggers belief.

Are you referring to Nordoms duplication spell? This one was awesome.

Why don't you rather use multi- or dualclass THAC0 tables, or a modified version of it. Wouldn't that make more sense?
 

inwoker

Arcane
Glory to Ukraine
Joined
Apr 27, 2007
Messages
15,698
Location
Kyiv, Ukraine
The only way to improve PST combat is -
- redo system completely;
- make option to skip combat by choice.

I don't believe some combat tweaks can fix that crap of a combat system.
 

Qwinn

Scholar
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
666
I tried to get back to the Hermit but couldn't find the exit where I came in. And I searched for it. Hard to find?

Not really. Not sure why you had a problem finding it.

There should be better Damge spells on earlier levels though.

Well, you can pretty easily be a 5th level mage before you even leave Mebbeth's hut, which does kinda decrease this drastic need.

There are some pretty effective lower level spells. Horror (in fact, Horror was massively overpowered due to bugs, was better than some 7th level spells, needed fixing, but still very very useful). Chromatic Orb. Swarm Curse. Elysium's Tears.

I take it you are okay with the damage dealing capabilities at higher levels?

You can hardly avoid getting into melee and casting spells at the same time.

I've never had problems with my TNO in PS:T getting swarmed if he was casting spells. Not sure why you are.

It might be bearable in this case because you'll have AC-10 pretty early on, but still.

Yes, and this is something that mages in PS:T get that they don't in other games. In most games, fighter AC blows away mage AC. In PS:T, it's the opposite. That counts for something. And in fact, this is the single biggest reason for my change to THACO. It was insane that a 15th level fighter could switch to level 3 mage, put on all the awesome mage AC gear, and actually be -significantly better at combat- as a 3rd level mage than as a 15th level fighter. I mean, come on. That's nuts.

This is what I meant with too much reliance on partymembers

I disagree that having fighter partymembers acting as meat shields when you are playing as a mage is "too much reliance". That's more like "bare minimum expectation".

There should be more bonus spell slot giving equipment.

MORE? Erm. PS:T has more spell-slot giving equipment than any other game I'm aware of. Yes, they mostly apply to 1st and 2nd level spells. And that can keep you casting for a long time, believe me. There are spells at both those levels that scale very well all the way to high levels.

Are you referring to Nordoms duplication spell? This one was awesome.

Yes, it is an awesome spell which makes many of those "weak" spells almost overpowered, but no, it's not what I'm referring to.

If all those lower level spells were made more damaging as you request, they would be one-shot AE kills with Enolls Duplication.

Why don't you rather use multi- or dualclass THAC0 tables, or a modified version of it. Wouldn't that make more sense?

I think I answered what was messed up about this in the question about AC. In this game, mages -are- a bit weaker, and they get massive AC boosting items to help. The way THACO worked broke that attempt at balance. The kensai mage build was the only build that made any sense, it was leagues more potent than any other possible build.

Qwinn
 

Korgan

Arbiter
Joined
Apr 13, 2008
Messages
4,238
Location
Fahrfromjuden
HHHHHHHHHHHEEEEEEEEEEEEE WWWWWWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAAAAAASSSSSSSSSSSSSS AAAAAAAAAA JJJJJJJJJJEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEWWWWWWWWWWW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Qwinn

Scholar
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
666
"I don't believe some combat tweaks can fix that crap of a combat system."

If you also hated combat in other IE games (BG1, BG2, IWD, IWD2), then you're right, nothing I can do will make you like it, because that's what it was meant to be like.

I do think with what scient and I are doing, though, we can make it -as good- as the combat in those other IE games was. Or at least in the same ballpark. Pre-mods, the combat in those other IE games, I would agree, is worlds better.

Qwinn
 

Helton

Arcane
Joined
Jan 29, 2007
Messages
6,789
Location
Starbase Delta
Missle of Patience is pretty badass man I don't think you should be running out of spells if you're using that except maybe in the Modron maze.
 

ghostdog

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Dec 31, 2007
Messages
11,086
Wyrmlord, Qwinn is right, most of this stuff comes from sensory stones that you can't know if they're directly associated with TNO.

As for TNO's history , Rhys Hess, the guy who wrote a very accurate book based on the game (not the crappy official one), has collected whatever facts and hints we get from the game. I think it's pretty accurate, but of course also vague, since the game doesn't give you many certain facts about TNO's past. He has made it look like a manuscript written from one of TNO's companions.



The following was found on a sheet of vellum shuffled in among a manuscript of Candrian's On Planar Travel bought in the Clerk's Ward. It is a history, believed written by one of his companions, of the man known by various names, but most commonly as the "Nameless One" in Sigil.

What of the original incarnation? There was an advisor, whose lying advice wrought betrayal. Hints of a contract signed. A crime was committed, one so awful the acts of all future incarnations are as nothing compared to it. The crime itself is unknown, save the implication that the planes are still slowly dying because of it.

He sought help of the night hag Ravel Puzzlewell, to grant him immortality, so he could escape his punishment and perhaps atone for his crime. And for love of him, Ravel granted his request, stripping his mortality from him. But a dreadful price was paid, since although the death of the body was no longer permanent, it did injure the mind, and memories were forgotten. Thus were born many incarnations, each starting with only fragments of memory of past existences.

There is also a sliver of another memory of Ravel, which seems to tie in with the myth of the three wishes. In the myth a man wishes for the awful knowledge of who he is. Perhaps this refers to a time when the original incarnation realized the full extent of his crime, and what the punishment must be?

There are only fragments from the many incarnations which followed. General of armies, a mage trained by a puissant sorcerer, a bloody-handed criminal chased by the mercykillers, a thief reduced to skulking beneath the streets of Sigil. Wandering many planes, acts of cruelty and kindness, chaos and law. One constant was the symbol of torment on his body, which drew other tormented souls to him. And many to their doom as well, no doubt.

At some point an incarnation which knew of the Fortress of Regrets, more accurately the Fortress of His Regrets, had a conversation with Trias the deva in which he described what he knew of the fortress.

One incarnation lead a revolt in what was then the prime ward, opening all the gates in the ward to the lower planes using an artifact known as the Shadow-Sorcelled Key. The Lady of Pain finally crushed the revolt. Could his scarring be explained by having fallen under the Lady's shadow? Could even an immortal survive that?

Several centuries ago Ravel attempted to open all the portals in Sigil. Whether it was to prove she could solve any puzzle, or as she later claimed to free the Lady from her cage, the Lady mazed her, removing a source of knowledge from access by later incarnations.

More than 200 years ago an incarnation was a member of the Sensates. Apparently this was a happy time for him, but he disappeared, with only rumors of his murder following in his wake.

At some point after this was the time of the 'practical' incarnation, who, but for one, came closest to defeating his enemy. A cold, ruthless incarnation. He kept detailed notes, and had tattooed instructions on his back to future incarnations. He tricked Pharod into a quest for an object he could not be bothered to find himself, and imprisoned the mercykiller Vhailor in a cell only he could release him from merely on the chance that Vhailor's abilities might one day be of use.

He commissioned a dream machine from Xeno Xander, to force the dreams which he could not have. He also commissioned from the Godsmen a portal to reach Ravel in her maze. In the end, he did not have time to make use of either item.

He attempted to thwart his unknown enemy with false bodies, by hiding on outer planes, even building a tomb which was both a trap for his enemy, and a repository of knowledge for future incarnations.

Nothing he could devise could throw off his enemy, so he decided to seek his enemy in his lair. To that end he gathered companions to himself.

He sought knowledge from the pillar of skulls in Avernus, and freed one skull from the pillar who he named Morte. Then he nearly killed the skull when it could not answer his questions. Unfortunately Morte still cannot wholly escape his past, and embroiders the truth. Thus he is not a very reliable source.

He tracked down a githzerai named Dak'kon in Limbo, because of the Karach blade he wields. He saved his life and gained his sworn service by cynically offering the words of Zerthimon. Words which meant nothing to this incarnation.

He enlisted a blind archer, Xachariah, one who could still see by other means, and whose arrows always found his enemies' hearts.

He professed a false love for Deionarra, so he could bind her and make use of her abilities.

Finally, a little more than fifty years ago, he and his companions traveled to the Fortress of Regrets, to scout his enemy, his Mortality. The first part of his plan went well. Deionarra was allowed to die, her love for him anchoring her to the fortress in death, and her powers gaining her insight into the fortress that no other could have provided.

Otherwise it was a disaster. He and his companions were separated. Dak'kon and Morte managed to escape, although wounded in faith and courage. Xachariah and the 'practical' incarnation died, although their bodies returned to Sigil. Possibly his enemy, after defeating him, transported him back to Sigil before killing him for fear that his dying in the fortress would be the end of himself as well?

What was likely the next incarnation was insane, quite likely because of his experiences in the Fortress of Regret. In his insanity he viewed his other incarnations as his enemies, as body-thieves. Although only extant for a few years, he was not unclever.

He destroyed his previous incarnation's laboriously constructed journals, a great loss, hardly balanced by the maunderings he inscribed in his previous incarnation's trapped tomb, and his own rambling journal. He also tried to burn the legacy left by this previous incarnation with Iannis the Advocate, but failed.

He left many traps for his other incarnations, the most devious of which was a sensory stone in the Festhall with two experiences, one overlaying another, the second a snare which only another incarnation could trigger.

He kept a journal, written in the tongue of Uyo, a tongue he guaranteed no one would be able to speak by murdering his teacher, Fin Andlye. This was not enough protection, so he required opening a puzzle box to access its contents, and trapped it besides.

This incarnation was also responsible for an amazing discovery. He found someone who told him his mind was weakening with every death of an incarnation, and who, somehow, was able to prevent memories from slipping away upon death. Unfortunately, this discovery would only benefit a future incarnation. Predictably, the 'insane' incarnation butchered his helper.

In fact, this incarnation viewed anyone who seemed to recognize him as a threat, and threats were all too easily eliminated. Even being mazed by the Lady did not stop his rampage, since he managed to escape his prison. His murderous fury was finally quenched when he met unexpected resistance from one of his victims, and plummeted to his death. This was roughly fifty years ago.

Of the next few incarnations little is known, although one was a powerful mage, and tutored an apprentice named Ignus who loved fire.

Finally there is the last incarnation, who awoke in the Dustmen's Mortuary, the one whose memory is not veiled at death. Curiously, the person who found this incarnation's body and took it to the Mortuary was drawn to the remains. How drawn? Was it Fell? His enemy? Possibly even the mark of torment, drawing another tormented soul even in death?

This last incarnation set out on a quest to backtrack figures from his past, a path which eventually led to his enemy, his Mortality. This was mirrored by his enemy's desire that he follows the path, so that remaining clues to his enemy's location could be eliminated.

He fought Ravel, Trias and his Mortality. He also faced three of his former incarnations. Interesting examples of the Rule of Three.

He and his companions defeated his Mortality, and undid the separation which made him immortal so long ago. His long delayed punishment caught up with him, and he was sentenced to serve in the Blood Wars.

look here for an easier read:
http://www.bootstrike.com/Torment/Online/tti4.html
 
Joined
Nov 8, 2007
Messages
6,207
Location
The island of misfit mascots
One thing I think is worth mentioning - it is more likely that the original incarnation was the powerful magic practitioner, rather than the pragmatic incarnation. It is outright confirmed that the pragmatic incarnation is not the powerful mage that taught/created Ignus - that was earlier. And whilst there is no direct evidence of it, dramatically it seems to indicate that it was the original incarnation, prior to his regret and attempt at reformation. My reason? When you meet the incarnations, you get the opportunity (if you know enough about Ignus) to ask the practical incarnation what happened to him - an obvious question, because the practical incarnation is the obvious one to ask. Ignus's master seems to match with his personality. And the practical incarnation knows nothing about Ignus (despite being a good researcher of what came before him - the version that created Ignus wasn't a nobody, he was a powerful mage leader, the head of one of the mage schools). I always took it that it was supposed to indicate - not for certain, but just as a dramatic pointer of a possibility - that it was the original incarnation, the one that now seems to be the 'good and wise' guy, that was the evil bastard that tortured Ignus into becoming a monster.
 

Wyrmlord

Arcane
Joined
Feb 3, 2008
Messages
28,886
No. It is implied that the Nameless One is centuries old, while Ignus' girlfriend was still alive.
 

Black

Arcane
Joined
May 8, 2007
Messages
1,872,665
Nameless One also had something to do with Lum the Mad.
Lum and his Infernal Machine have been featured in the computer games Baldur's Gate II: Throne of Bhaal, as being imprisoned in Watcher's Keep, and briefly at the end of Planescape: Torment when the final boss refers to a time when the Nameless One “danced sorceries with Lum the Mad.”
TNO is kinda old.
 

Qwinn

Scholar
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
666
Azrael:

Can't be. If Ignus had been changed that way that long ago, his girlfriend Drusilla would've been long dead. In fact, I think it's referenced that Ignus burned down the Alley of Dangerous Angles sometime in the last few decades, not centuries or millenia ago.

Reading ghostdog's post (great find, by the way, gd) made me realize that, actually, when it posited Ignus's teacher as among the most recent incarnations. Yeah, due to Drusilla and the timing of the burning of the Alley, my theory - that the mage who burned Ignus was actually Yemeth - probably doesn't work. The description of the Pendant of Yemeth places his existence much too long ago for them to be the same incarnation.

Qwinn
 
Joined
Nov 8, 2007
Messages
6,207
Location
The island of misfit mascots
Qwinn said:
Azrael:

Can't be. If Ignus had been changed that way that long ago, his girlfriend Drusilla would've been long dead. In fact, I think it's referenced that Ignus burned down the Alley of Dangerous Angles sometime in the last few decades, not centuries or millenia ago.

Reading ghostdog's post (great find, by the way, gd) made me realize that, actually, when it posited Ignus's teacher as among the most recent incarnations. Yeah, due to Drusilla and the timing of the burning of the Alley, my theory - that the mage who burned Ignus was actually Yemeth - probably doesn't work. The description of the Pendant of Yemeth places his existence much too long ago for them to be the same incarnation.

Qwinn


Ah, I see - yep.
 

VentilatorOfDoom

Administrator
Staff Member
Joined
Apr 4, 2009
Messages
8,600
Location
Deutschland
Qwinn said:

I will replay the game soon and see for myself. If it sucks i'll not hesitate to let you know.

I'm doing this right now with BG2 to verify your berserker stuff.

What is this Missile of Patience spell? I obv overlooked it.

Also tell me teh sikrit spell already. :(
 

RK47

collides like two planets pulled by gravity
Patron
Joined
Feb 23, 2006
Messages
28,396
Location
Not Here
Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
inwoker said:
The only way to improve PST combat is -
- redo system completely;
- make option to skip combat by choice.

I don't believe some combat tweaks can fix that crap of a combat system.

Change combat into dialogue?

The rats approaches you
1. (Strength) Bash them to pieces
2. (Magic) Destroy them with spells
3. (Charisma) Engage in Rat Diplomacy
 

Qwinn

Scholar
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
666
Eh, like I said, I'd recommend waiting for version 4 of the mods at this point. At this point, telling me version 3 sucks or is unbalanced (no one has said this yet, btw, crossin' fingers) won't make me change anything, cause version 4 changes things significantly and could already counter whatever imbalances you spotted in indirect ways.

I'd be more grateful for honest evaluations of v4, when it's released.

I'm doing this right now with BG2 to verify your berserker stuff.

Oh, you mean my argument that berzerker-mage blows away kensai mage? Hehe. Yep. You'll like it, I bet.

What is this Missile of Patience spell? I obv overlooked it.

It kicks ass. Seriously. Not so much at lower levels, but at higher levels it's nasty. And you get -tons- of 'em if you've got the mage specialization tattoo.

Also tell me teh sikrit spell already.

No :P

Qwinn
 

Helton

Arcane
Joined
Jan 29, 2007
Messages
6,789
Location
Starbase Delta
Missle of Ptaience is a low level spell. Level 2 or 3 I think. It upgrades as you level up, doing more damage and firing more shots. At higher levels it fires at least half a dozen shots per casting with each shot being comparable to direct damage spells several levels higher. Each shot can target a different opponent, so great for swarms.
 

Qwinn

Scholar
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
666
MoP is a level 1 spell, actually.

And it's easy to overlook, considering the description:

SCROLL OF MISSILE OF PATIENCE
Allows user to cast "Missile of Patience"
Allows user to copy "Missile of Patience" into Spell Book
Level: 1 / Wizard
Range: ?
Duration: ?
Speed: ?
Area of Effect: ?
Saving Throw: Special
Weight: 0
Usable only by Mages

"Could this spell be any more useless??!" cried Eelnek, mage of Amnar. The bane of mages everywhere, could this be the practical joke of an arch-mage, or living dis-proof of the old Prime Material axiom that "good things come to those who wait"?

Qwinn
 

VentilatorOfDoom

Administrator
Staff Member
Joined
Apr 4, 2009
Messages
8,600
Location
Deutschland
Helton said:
Missle of Ptaience is a low level spell. Level 2 or 3 I think. It upgrades as you level up, doing more damage and firing more shots. At higher levels it fires at least half a dozen shots per casting with each shot being comparable to direct damage spells several levels higher. Each shot can target a different opponent, so great for swarms.

Aarrgggh that sounds like the spell I needed but wasn't there. Except that it was there. :oops:
 

VentilatorOfDoom

Administrator
Staff Member
Joined
Apr 4, 2009
Messages
8,600
Location
Deutschland
Eh, like I said, I'd recommend waiting for version 4 of the mods at this point. At this point, telling me version 3 sucks or is unbalanced (no one has said this yet, btw, crossin' fingers) won't make me change anything, cause version 4 changes things significantly and could already counter whatever imbalances you spotted in indirect ways.

I'd be more grateful for honest evaluations of v4, when it's released.

Then you will get them.

Code:
Oh, you mean my argument that berzerker-mage blows away kensai mage?  Hehe.  Yep.  You'll like it, I bet.

It has advantages. And disadvantages. As was to be expected.

However having your AC coming mainly from equipment rather than spells can be very helpful. I'm playing currently with SCS2, and installed all options that somehow benefit the enemies. If your generic SoA wussie-mage suddenly start to dump Dragon Breaths, Pit Fiends and Dark Planetars onto you - after dispelling you - having decent AC is convenient. :lol:


You like torturing me? That sounds a bit chaotic-evil to be honest. :wink:
 

As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.
Back
Top Bottom