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Was Dark Souls 2 the greatest game that From Software ever made?

Was Dark Souls 2 better than everything?

  • Yes

    Votes: 28 52.8%
  • Yes

    Votes: 6 11.3%
  • It was better than everything

    Votes: 5 9.4%
  • No. There has never been a better game than Dark Souls 2

    Votes: 14 26.4%

  • Total voters
    53

H. P. Lovecraft's Cat

SumDrunkCat
Joined
Feb 7, 2024
Messages
1,306
Also, I think I've only been notified a couple of times in Demon's Souls that my messages were found helpful, can't remember any in Dark Souls, so screw you ungrateful pigs.
You seem really butthurt over a big nothingburger. Also when was this? If you played the games late they would be less active, so naturally your messages wouldn't get rated because few people would see them. And there's also alot of people who ignore them like me.
 

Ezekiel

Arcane
Joined
May 3, 2017
Messages
5,545
I started playing Demon's Souls in February of 2012. Still plenty of invasions and cooperation at that time. You weren't supposed to take it so seriously.
 

REhorror

Educated
Joined
Dec 22, 2023
Messages
685
No, I prefer Dark Souls 3, even in the same series.

DaS2 cultists are something else.
 

Max Damage

Savant
Joined
Mar 1, 2017
Messages
661
No, I prefer Dark Souls 3, even in the same series.

DaS2 cultists are something else.
To this day, I have no idea why there's such rabid defense force around DS2 specifically, they make rest of Fromdrones look civil by comparison. With the exception of Crown of the Old Iron King, the whole game plays and feels like off-brand copy of DaS, there's like 2-3 levels in the whole game that aren't rushed filler, and there's very little tension because someone made brilliant decision to add lifegems when estus was giving you perfectly enough healing already. The whole game is "ok" at best, and just suggesting that sends its fanboys into spergout for some reason.
 

REhorror

Educated
Joined
Dec 22, 2023
Messages
685
No, I prefer Dark Souls 3, even in the same series.

DaS2 cultists are something else.
To this day, I have no idea why there's such rabid defense force around DS2 specifically, they make rest of Fromdrones look civil by comparison. With the exception of Crown of the Old Iron King, the whole game plays and feels like off-brand copy of DaS, there's like 2-3 levels in the whole game that aren't rushed filler, and there's very little tension because someone made brilliant decision to add lifegems when estus was giving you perfectly enough healing already. The whole game is "ok" at best, and just suggesting that sends its fanboys into spergout for some reason.
It all started with that radlib loser Hbombergay made a video to defend DaS2, it seems to attract a lot of mentally ills, trannoids and the likes.

And it seems some Russians actually DO like DaS2 since it feels like a janky action RPG?
 

HeatEXTEND

Prophet
Patron
Joined
Feb 12, 2017
Messages
3,995
Location
Nedderlent
To this day, I have no idea why there's such rabid defense force around DS2 specifically
People shit on it unproportionately so people are going to defend it unproportionately, business as usual.
the whole game plays and feels like off-brand copy of DaS
Like this right here. It feels like an off-brand copy if you rate it as a copy of DS, which it is not, it's a different game that does its own thing beyond the "Fromsoft basics".
 

REhorror

Educated
Joined
Dec 22, 2023
Messages
685
To this day, I have no idea why there's such rabid defense force around DS2 specifically
People shit on it unproportionately so people are going to defend it unproportionately, business as usual.
the whole game plays and feels like off-brand copy of DaS
Like this right here. It feels like an off-brand copy if you rate it as a copy of DS, which it is not, it's a different game that does its own thing beyond the "Fromsoft basics".
Legit don't understand what DaS2 does well here, is it the options thing again?

For an action/action RPG, I would rather play something that plays well, than something that puts a lot of options but don't play well.
 

HeatEXTEND

Prophet
Patron
Joined
Feb 12, 2017
Messages
3,995
Location
Nedderlent
Legit don't understand what DaS2 does well here, is it the options thing again?
Wouldn't say it does anything exceptionally well but the atmosphere is pretty unique among it's peers, it goes all-in on the fever dream quality that all FS games have more or less. Also the "clunkiness" makes it inherently feel more like an adventure game and less like an action game, especially combined with the secrets/"puzzles" that go at least a bit beyond "hit illusion wall". If someone only likes DS games for the action (lol) I can see how DS2 sucks but then again these people are missing out on 75% of what makes DS games so very enjoyable to begin with. Bottom line DS2 is a good game if you've got a taste for what it's offering.
 
Joined
Mar 18, 2009
Messages
7,343
I can only imagine that people who think action is the most important part of DS are people who never played a great action game. These games are about exploration first and that's something I enjoy way more in DS II than in III. I also have played plenty of RPGs with real janky combat so when somebody says DS II combat is janky it doesn't even compute for me. It is fine for the type of game it is, everything works like it should and I definitely prefer it to DS III rollspam crap. Never experienced hitbox issues that were worse than in any other Souls game either. But then I never played with low AGL, that shit always goes up to 100 by the time I'm done with first area.
 

Max Damage

Savant
Joined
Mar 1, 2017
Messages
661
DaS series are action games, of course the action part and level/encounter design is very important. Let's say none of that matters, then what exactly are these games good for?
 

Hell Swarm

Educated
Joined
Jun 16, 2023
Messages
675
DaS series are action games, of course the action part and level/encounter design is very important. Let's say none of that matters, then what exactly are these games good for?
Unique levels with interesting paths through them. Dark souls 2 excels at creating interesting locations with multiple ways to traverse them in ways Dark souls 1 and 3 don't. Unless an area is an open (probably) swamp then there's basically a single way you can get from A to B unless you unlock a short cut. While the wharf in Dark souls 2 has multiple paths through it with varying risks and rewards. Enemies caring you lit a torch makes the top path pretty safe but no torch makes it more dangerous. The Gutter is excellent for creating a sense of exploration into the deep under world where you have to manage your torch time as you explore. Vendrik's castle has doors you may or may not want to open with little puzzles of where to kill enemies to do it. Heide's tower of flame has challenging enemies gatekeeping making the boss easier or harder. The rat covenant has an immense amount of bullshit to pull you into. The bell ringers and no lights in the Crypt make for a tense experience, especially when you get invaded by NPCs or you run into massive shield guys who refuse to move and have little room to fight them. Compare the Crypt's ghosts attacking you from the walls to the later games ghost hands and see a huge difference in design philosphy. One is a trap you trigger by being too close and the others an invisible hazard spread across multiple areas designed to be annoying rather than something you can react to.

Interesting boss designs. Demon of song is easy but it's an interesting boss to look at with a gimmick played out through the whole shrine. Flexible Sentry is 2 different enemies where you control which you fight. The Ruin Sentinels are a complete panicfest as soon as you realize there's 3 of them and you have to kill 1 on a tiny ledge before the other 2 fuck you up. Nothing in Dark souls 1 or 3 has that same sense of dread. Lost sinner breaking your lock on and NG+ adding an ambush in a boss room. Royal rat vanguard is an interesting take on Fools idol. Cuvetus demon is a push over but a cool design. The poison lake right after makes for an interesting challenge you solve by exploring the level (I won't defend how). The Rotten is an amazing design and is all about space control. If you lose your space the fire kills you and he takes up a lot of room. Smelter demon is an interesting way to pressure enemies with a lot of healing. He will never stop damaging you if you get close to him. Pursurer is a solid boss fight and having him reappear adds a sense of paranoia through out those areas. Guardian dragon is one of the best dragon fights in any From game because it's not just hitting his ankles and hoping he doesn't fly up and roast you and have context for why he doesn't just fly up and roast you as every other dragon should. The Iron king is a huge demon fucker who approaches you and seems over whelming at first.

Dark souls 2's strength is in the quantity of interesting experiences it has to offer. I never used life gems in my first play through and coming back to it I realized they're there because the game isn't about managing your healing resources but it's about exploring a hostile world where healing can't save you. There are plenty of ambushes and instadeath traps in the same way Demon's souls had them. Instead of focusing on 1 v 1 combat with increasingly spastic enemies (Dark souls 3, Bloodborne and Elden Ring) it focuses on being an explorer in a hostile land where most dangerous enemies are swarms of chumps banding together to get a free meal. There's almost no memorable locations in the PS4 era From games because they're all set up to be combat encounters rather than dungeons. I can play better action games with more depth than souls games, but I can't find many modern games that focus on quality exploration. Elden Ring is 70 hours of open world boredom and a few hours of really good dungeons. Demon's souls and Dark souls 2 feel like those legacy dungeons all the way through. I don't cry Heide's tower is misplaced in Majula because I'm too busy enjoying Heide's tower's gameplay and atmosphere to count how many pixels it should be in a background. The volcano castle didn't feel a shocking misplaced location to me despite being at the top of an elevator over Earthen peak because I was excited for the katana knights and explorating the location. My immersion wasn't broken by an unrealistic transition because I was enjoying the content both locations provided and the way you get between those zones is basically irrelevant filler you probably miss because you're taking a sip of your drink any way.
 

Silverfish

Arbiter
Joined
Dec 4, 2019
Messages
3,242
Legit don't understand what DaS2 does well here,

Second best in terms of customization (and was only knocked off the pedestal by Elden Ring), tied for best story / setting (with Demon's Souls) and the best pvp in series history since, especially at launch, basically everything was overpowered, making the game surprisingly well balanced.
 

DJOGamer PT

Arcane
Joined
Apr 8, 2015
Messages
7,524
Location
Lusitânia
1709437321400896.png


1709468186397038.png
 

H. P. Lovecraft's Cat

SumDrunkCat
Joined
Feb 7, 2024
Messages
1,306
I started playing Demon's Souls in February of 2012. Still plenty of invasions and cooperation at that time. You weren't supposed to take it so seriously.
So 3 years later when the messages were irrelevant. The messages only mattered on that special month, the year of our lord February 2009. This is the case with every Souls game. And I'm not taking it seriously. I love that the messages still exist for butthole jokes and trolling. If they ever took that away from us I would be devastated.
 

H. P. Lovecraft's Cat

SumDrunkCat
Joined
Feb 7, 2024
Messages
1,306
DaS series are action games, of course the action part and level/encounter design is very important. Let's say none of that matters, then what exactly are these games good for?
Unique levels with interesting paths through them. Dark souls 2 excels at creating interesting locations with multiple ways to traverse them in ways Dark souls 1 and 3 don't. Unless an area is an open (probably) swamp then there's basically a single way you can get from A to B unless you unlock a short cut. While the wharf in Dark souls 2 has multiple paths through it with varying risks and rewards. Enemies caring you lit a torch makes the top path pretty safe but no torch makes it more dangerous. The Gutter is excellent for creating a sense of exploration into the deep under world where you have to manage your torch time as you explore. Vendrik's castle has doors you may or may not want to open with little puzzles of where to kill enemies to do it. Heide's tower of flame has challenging enemies gatekeeping making the boss easier or harder. The rat covenant has an immense amount of bullshit to pull you into. The bell ringers and no lights in the Crypt make for a tense experience, especially when you get invaded by NPCs or you run into massive shield guys who refuse to move and have little room to fight them. Compare the Crypt's ghosts attacking you from the walls to the later games ghost hands and see a huge difference in design philosphy. One is a trap you trigger by being too close and the others an invisible hazard spread across multiple areas designed to be annoying rather than something you can react to.

Interesting boss designs. Demon of song is easy but it's an interesting boss to look at with a gimmick played out through the whole shrine. Flexible Sentry is 2 different enemies where you control which you fight. The Ruin Sentinels are a complete panicfest as soon as you realize there's 3 of them and you have to kill 1 on a tiny ledge before the other 2 fuck you up. Nothing in Dark souls 1 or 3 has that same sense of dread. Lost sinner breaking your lock on and NG+ adding an ambush in a boss room. Royal rat vanguard is an interesting take on Fools idol. Cuvetus demon is a push over but a cool design. The poison lake right after makes for an interesting challenge you solve by exploring the level (I won't defend how). The Rotten is an amazing design and is all about space control. If you lose your space the fire kills you and he takes up a lot of room. Smelter demon is an interesting way to pressure enemies with a lot of healing. He will never stop damaging you if you get close to him. Pursurer is a solid boss fight and having him reappear adds a sense of paranoia through out those areas. Guardian dragon is one of the best dragon fights in any From game because it's not just hitting his ankles and hoping he doesn't fly up and roast you and have context for why he doesn't just fly up and roast you as every other dragon should. The Iron king is a huge demon fucker who approaches you and seems over whelming at first.

Dark souls 2's strength is in the quantity of interesting experiences it has to offer. I never used life gems in my first play through and coming back to it I realized they're there because the game isn't about managing your healing resources but it's about exploring a hostile world where healing can't save you. There are plenty of ambushes and instadeath traps in the same way Demon's souls had them. Instead of focusing on 1 v 1 combat with increasingly spastic enemies (Dark souls 3, Bloodborne and Elden Ring) it focuses on being an explorer in a hostile land where most dangerous enemies are swarms of chumps banding together to get a free meal. There's almost no memorable locations in the PS4 era From games because they're all set up to be combat encounters rather than dungeons. I can play better action games with more depth than souls games, but I can't find many modern games that focus on quality exploration. Elden Ring is 70 hours of open world boredom and a few hours of really good dungeons. Demon's souls and Dark souls 2 feel like those legacy dungeons all the way through. I don't cry Heide's tower is misplaced in Majula because I'm too busy enjoying Heide's tower's gameplay and atmosphere to count how many pixels it should be in a background. The volcano castle didn't feel a shocking misplaced location to me despite being at the top of an elevator over Earthen peak because I was excited for the katana knights and explorating the location. My immersion wasn't broken by an unrealistic transition because I was enjoying the content both locations provided and the way you get between those zones is basically irrelevant filler you probably miss because you're taking a sip of your drink any way.
Hell Swarm knows his shit. I don't exactly agree with all of his disrespect towards later games but he just gets why Dark Souls 2 is special and explained it in the most elegant way. Let's be real, Dark Souls 2 haters are fucking despicable retards and play a large part in the decline. I fucking hate them. I really truly do.
 

soutaiseiriron

Educated
Joined
Aug 8, 2023
Messages
191
And it seems some Russians actually DO like DaS2 since it feels like a janky action RPG?
???
It's the same fucking game with nicer strength weapon movesets that chain together. There's like 2 issues that I can think of, and that's Heide Knights having weird teleporty animations, and drop attacks being nerfed compared to DS1.
basically everything was overpowered, making the game surprisingly well balanced.
Ah yes, the Icefrog method of game balance.
 

H. P. Lovecraft's Cat

SumDrunkCat
Joined
Feb 7, 2024
Messages
1,306
Elden Ring just has more shit in the toolbox.
I applaud Elden Ring for bringing back DkS2 stuff like power stance. That's a huge gamechanger. But I don't believe Elden Ring has the expansive weapon set of DkS2, or the way to mix and match, and I honestly don't think the weapons are nearly as interesting. You could do some insane shit in DkS2 with dual greatswords. I don't think Elden Ring pulled that off. Dark Souls 2 also had better greatswords. Also better fist weapons. Probably better everything. The more you try to compare a Souls game to DkS2, and bring in the microscopes and all that shit, the more the other game fails miserably.
 

Silverfish

Arbiter
Joined
Dec 4, 2019
Messages
3,242
I appreciate the bit, but nah, between summons, the ability to mix and match weapon arts on the fly and some additional status effects, ER has it all over DS2 in terms of buildfagging.
 

H. P. Lovecraft's Cat

SumDrunkCat
Joined
Feb 7, 2024
Messages
1,306
I appreciate the bit, but nah, between summons, the ability to mix and match weapon arts on the fly and some additional status effects, ER has it all over DS2 in terms of buildfagging.
It wasn't a bit, and in your very own post you unintentionally pointed out another reason why Elden Ring is inferior. Summons. Everybody and their grandma knows the summons trivialize the entire game. Elden Ring is better than Dark Souls 3, take pride in that. Don't compare it to a game that is vastly superior in every way. Would you toss a child into a pit of bloodthirsty demons? Absolutely not! So don't compare Elden Ring to Dark Souls 2. Same result.
 

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