RPGs cannot have action-based movement or combat, Fallout: New Vegas is not an RPG

[Sentinel]

If we don't even know the definition of an RPG, these discussions are pointless.

 

[Quillon]

I have made a loooooooooooooooooooooooooot of arguments, and the only one that was somehow disputed was by FreeKaner

A hundred years from now scholars will dig deep in RPG Codex in ancient web archives and they will find the true meaning of RPG in between the sentences of user Lacrymas; they'll mark that day as Lachristmass & celebrate it yearly then on, until then your efforts to make people understand you are in vain, unfortunately you came to this world ahead of your time.

True story.

 

[Sigourn]

It's obvious a lot of people have enshrined the thought of F:NV being an RPG for some reason and hold onto it like a sacred artifact, even though it's not different than Bethesda's Fallouts in terms of genre, causing untold buttmadness when someone dares to say it isn't an RPG.

Bethesda makes RPGs, though. Morrowind, Oblivion, Fallout 3, Skyrim, Fallout 4. RPGs, all of them.

 

[onemananadhisdroid]

Critical hit.

 

[Kyl Von Kull]

Critical hit.

Oh shit, the Looking Glass guys totally get it.

"This probably sounds like we don't think role-playing can work on computers, but we do. It's a hard technical and design problem, but we like hard problems or we wouldn't be in this business. What many games have done, which isn't hard, is to copy the forms of a paper role-playing game, which keeps all the sheets of paper from the gaming table at the expense of all the people around it. A computer game can have all the trappings of a paper role-playing game (the Tolkienesque dwarves and elves, the "character classes," "to-hit rolls," and "experience levels"), but without role-playing it's not an RPG. It's computer strategy game about paper RPG's. Some of them are okay."

Daaaaaayuum.

 

[HoboForEternity]

Congratulations lacrymas you just hit a new level of autism

 

[Bladeract]

RPG is orc murdering tactical simulation, looking glass software is talking about late era larpfest bullshit, early DnD was nothing to do with that garbage.

 

[Micormic]

Already 7 pages on an obvious troll thread, this one might beat out the fallout 2/fallout 3 one.

 

[Jezal_k23]

GzDoom is the best RPG. Also op is autistic.

Another very good RPG I frequently recommend is Duke Nukem 3D. Play it people.

EDIT: Blood might be even an even superior RPG.

 

[Kyl Von Kull]

RPG is orc murdering tactical simulation, looking glass software is talking about late era larpfest bullshit, early DnD was nothing to do with that garbage.

I really don't think that's what the guys who made Thief meant. Sure, early D&D was an orc genocide simulation, but it was orc genocide as a team sport. You don't get the same vibe from controlling the whole party yourself (even if your p&p party ran like a well oiled killing machine). Like the desperate, last-ditch attempts to convince your wizard to just fucking cast web instead of throwing a damned fireball like douchebag.

Already 7 pages on an obvious troll thread, this one might beat out the fallout 2/fallout 3 one.

Fabulously optimistic. Although if Lacrymas is really that good at putting on a show, I tip my cap to him. My guess would be drunkenness--nothing else causes that level of conviction..

 

[Paul_cz]

Stupidest fucking thread I've seen in a long time.

 

[Generic-Giant-Spider]

I don't know what the fuck is going on anymore so here's a picture of Hulk Hogan eating pasta.

 

[aweigh]

We had this discussion already ffs.

Codex bruh

 

[Parabalus]

Lacrymas

So what should be banished form the top RPGs list according to you?

Morrowind, F:NV, Wizardry, Gothic, VTM:B, Deus Ex , Dark Souls, seems like a lot already. Don't keep us in suspense, what would you cull?

 

[Prime Junta]

Can't be arsed to read through this whole garbage fire of a thread but

Lacrymas

FO:NV has VATS. It's a pseudo-turn-based mode which pauses the game and lets you use action points to plan your combat actions, e.g. to target specific body parts.

YOU CAN PLAY THE WHOLE FUCKING GAME WITHOUT SPENDING A SECOND IN TWITCH SHOOT-EM-UP COMBAT

:cries:

so basically you would be wrong even if we accepted your train-wreck of a RPG definition, which we don't

 

[aweigh]

RPG restores definition. Definition fiddles next to a lecturer. The behavior shares the inspired pant underneath the anger. RPG persists outside the profile. Definition grinds against the waste.

 

[Lacrymas]

Shit thread for retards. No, I wasn't trolling, I don't troll. I haven't seen such obvious bias, twisting of facts and definitions and mental gymnastics in a while.

 

[Quillon]

No, I wasn't trolling, I don't troll.

 

[Sacred82]

I really don't think that's what the guys who made Thief meant. Sure, early D&D was an orc genocide simulation, but it was orc genocide as a team sport. You don't get the same vibe from controlling the whole party yourself (even if your p&p party ran like a well oiled killing machine). Like the desperate, last-ditch attempts to convince your wizard to just fucking cast web instead of throwing a damned fireball like douchebag.

sure, it's much worse to actually have strategic control over combat than being able to argue with the wizard not to fry your ass or the cleric to not waste his last lvl 2 spell on a self buff instead of healing the tank. That feeling is just incomparable. Like a weekend out with your men's healing group.

 

[HoboForEternity]

 

[Lacrymas]

What more can I say itt? Nobody is disputing my points, just repeating that F:NV is an RPG and that's that (and that I'm a troll, so that invalidates anything I say automatically), the most fun one is "it's better than Bethesda's Fallout, so it's an RPG!". I wonder why nobody is defending Alpha Protocol, which is basically the same thing, but I did say it also isn't an RPG. "Attempt at reality bending: The Thread".

 

[FreeKaner]

What more can I say itt? Nobody is disputing my points, just repeating that F:NV is an RPG and that's that (and that I'm a troll, so that invalidates anything I say automatically), the most fun one is "it's better than Bethesda's Fallout, so it's an RPG!". I wonder why nobody is defending Alpha Protocol, which is basically the same thing, but I did say it also isn't an RPG. "Attempt at reality bending: The Thread".

Alpha Protocol and New Vegas aren't really the same thing at all. People consider New Vegas a RPG because it has an extensive character progression and a very loose narrative.

 

[FeelTheRads]

FO:NV has VATS. It's a pseudo-turn-based mode which pauses the game and lets you use action points to plan your combat actions, e.g. to target specific body parts.

YOU CAN PLAY THE WHOLE FUCKING GAME WITHOUT SPENDING A SECOND IN TWITCH SHOOT-EM-UP COMBAT

Absolute lie.

No, you cannot. If you're out of action points you have to get out of VATS and run around like a retard until the action points regenerate.
That's as much twitch as anything, assuming someone would be so retarded as to play it like this instead of the way it's supposed to be played: just hold on fire and wave your mouse around until everything is dead.

It's pretty funny that some people think they're playing some elite monocled game just because Obsidian dressed up a turd with better writing and quests.

Sorry, the base game you're playing is still Fallout 3.

I wonder why nobody is defending Alpha Protocol

Oh, they must be hiding somewhere. Did you known AP is a great RPG because you can choose on the paths pre-scripted by the developers? WOW!

 

[MajorMace]

Nobody is disputing my points

but they have
they claim it's a rpg because of the pc agency being a thing, being supported through the game's story and missions and being dependant on the character's skills and stats in addition to the player's choice
it's a very simply definition, as long as you're playing a dude that you've partially or entirely created, and that elements of this creation (stats, skills, gender, religion, anything) has some impact on the game, whether story-wise, combat-wise or whatever, it's a rpg

you claim aiming makes it a fps, but I'm a bit perplex about this, because shooters and rpgs aren't incompatible
mostly because fps as a genre is defined through very simple technical aspects : as long as you're playing first person and shoot stuff, whether it's a military shit show, a rocket jump fest, a puzzle game or an atmospheric horror game, they're all fps. That doesn't define or clarify the game design, or even the broad genre (adventure, horror, action).
rpgs as a genre is defined (ahem) through very simple design aspects : see above

I find it interesting, also, that in order to press your claim, you felt the need to "fill the void" by talking about how it's a fps (or tps) without realizing it doesn't. Whether it's a fps or not doesn't matter, if it's not a rpg then what is it ? An interactive story ? A adventure game with combat and items ? Any other synonym of rpg ?

 

[Lacrymas]

Alpha Protocol and New Vegas aren't really the same thing at all. People consider New Vegas a RPG because it has an extensive character progression and a very loose narrative.

When is the character progression "extensive" enough for it to be an RPG? This is getting into some Eretrian paradoxes territory.

I find it interesting, also, that in order to press your claim, you felt the need to "fill the void" by talking about how it's a fps (or tps) without realizing it doesn't. Whether it's a fps or not doesn't matter, if it's not a rpg then what is it ? An interactive story ? A adventure game with combat and items ? Any other synonym of rpg ?

Isn't it called an Immersive Sim? I'm fine with that. It even exists in such lists.