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Rate the NPCs! (NWN2 + MotB)

Starwars

Arcane
Joined
Jan 31, 2007
Messages
2,829
Location
Sweden
Saw this on the NWN2 forum, and thought it'd be fun to for a few games that features a lot of character interaction. Figured I'd start off with NWN2+MotB since I saw it on those forums.

So, focus on whatever characters you want (party member or no), and rate them on a scale of -10 to +10. Criticize the hell out of them for fun, or gush all over them. Do them all, or do just one. I'm bored, so I'll do all the party members. It may be pointless, but hey. Will probably be some spoilers here.

NWN2:
Khelgar (+3). Yeah, this guy is a very cliché battlecrazy dwarf, with a cliché dwarf voice to boot. But I find him to be fairly likeable, and fairly easy to bond with as a "brother in arms".

Neeshka (+2). The streetsmart Rogue girl. Has some pretty fun lines here and there. I think the voiceactor does a good job, but the direction is awful. They went with a way to squeaky and annoying voice. There are also some really annoying volume problems. Annah is still the coolest rogue girl.

Elanee (-4). This is a pretty damn boring character. I think Druids could make for pretty interesting characters, but Elanee is not. Has some extremely cheesy lines, which could be good for reading only, but does not work at all when voiced.

Qara (-2). Has some potential, but it's never explored. The whole assassination attempt plot bit is just strange, and doesn't seem to affect anything about her. In the end she's just to obviously stupid and impatient.

Grobnar (-8). Argh. OK, so this character actually has some funny lines, but someone kill the voiceactor. A good example of a voiceactor (or perhaps the direction) completely killing a character.

Casavir (-10). One of the most boring character ever. Everything about him oozes boredom. And that "heroic and honourable" voice, urk. Terrible.

Shandra Jerro (+2). A bit to much of the "stupid farm girl" thing going on here. But nice in the sense that she actually seems to care about the PC. Her head also freaks me out sometimes, her eyes are *weird*.

Bishop (-5). Another potentially interesting character ruined by the voiceacting. Seems like he has an interesting history, though it's not that fleshed out. Voiceactor sounds like the typical "Bioware thug", so overtly evil. For some reason, despite the fact that you have to take all companions with you in your roster, it's only in the case of Bishop that this *really* annoys me.

Sand (-2). A few funny lines, but extremely underdeveloped. The whole sarcastic personality can be fun, but he is so overacted. A common problem among the NWN2 companions I feel, they are just to damn *extreme*!

Zhjaavee (0). And yet another case of the voiceacting bringing a character down. I've always been a sucker for the Planar lore, so I enjoyed what she could tell me about this. But... The whole "oooh, I'm so mystical and strange" voiceacting gets tired really fast. And wereas the whole *know* business worked for Dak'kon, it simply doesn't work here due to the larger amount of voiceacting. It would've killed me to listen to Dak'kon if PS:T had the same amount of voiceacting as the companions in NWN2.

Ammon Jerro (+7). Possibly the only companion of NWN2 that I really liked. His main flaw is that he joins the party at such a late time, which makes it difficult to care for him. I liked that he was trying to save the Realms in his own rather messed up way. Has got an interesting history of binding demons, and being imprisoned in the Lower Planes etc etc. A pretty good voice, though it makes me wanna reach for that bag of throat-sweets. And I liked that you can convince him to admit his flaws at Shandras homestead, nice moment for the character.

MotB:
Safiya (+3). My least favourite of the MotB companions. Not annoying or anything, but rather flat and characterless. Explained by the plot, but not so sure it's a good decision to write a character like that into the players party. She gets a little plus for Kaji, which is a type of character I normally dislike, but who I found to be quite funny and likeable.

Gannayev (+5). Pretty interesting concept. A charismatic hagspawn Spirit Shaman. Manages to be annoying in a likeable sense, and has some great lines. Voiceactor is pretty good. Doesn't fit in as well in the party as the other characters though. His moment is in the Hag Coven, but other than that he's not particularly tied in with the plot.

Kaelyn (+9). A very good character. A pretty interesting backstory, and extremely likeable if you share her views on things. Loyal to her cause, and will diss you if you don't agree with her. Extraordinary voiceacting. A "goody-goody" character that I actually really like. Sees things in black and white (there's even an ingame conversation about that). She is delicious to trick and betray if you're playing evil. Really liked Kaelyn.

Okku (+6). A Rainbow Bear. The gruff and honorable character. Didn't like him all that much at first, but warmed up to his character as the game went on. Kicked butt (to much butt in fact) in battles. Liked his voiceacting.

One-of-Many (+7). OK, so there's not much character development going on here. But this thing is deliciously evil. Thousands of evil souls inhabiting the dead husk of Okku. This thing is just a lovely sidekick for any crazed evil character. Very good for the "bwahahah" factor. I don't normally enjoy characters like this, but something about One-of-Many made me giggle. I also found his voice(s) to be quite creepy (reminscant of good ole Darth Nihilus).

Phew.
 

Lesifoere

Liturgist
Joined
Oct 26, 2007
Messages
4,071
I couldn't quite get over Okku's coloring. I mean, what the hell? D:

My first playthrough was with Kaelyn, Gann, and Safiya, so I've no insight into the other characters. Strangely enough, I rather liked Safiya. She strikes me as being pragmatic without being particularly evil, sympathetic without being stupid or naive. Kaelyn I liked for her backstory and drive to wage a crusade, but her personality was meh for me. Gann was about all right. Charming, not too emo, though his romance was out of nowhere.

An all-caster party was quite a shitty idea, however. Combat was boring as fuck with everybody (my PC was a sorcerer) spamming bombardment/storm of vengeance/meteor swarm. It became a horrible, horrible trek of watching lights explode on my screen. I think I'll go with a melee PC next time, with Okku or One-of-Many in the party.
 

vrok

Liturgist
Joined
Jul 23, 2005
Messages
738
Grobnar & OoM: +10

Kaelyn: +7, mostly because of the sexy voice acting, would be 10 if she was fuckable too

The rest: -10, only there to help carry stuff and open side quests
 

Helton

Arcane
Joined
Jan 29, 2007
Messages
6,789
Location
Starbase Delta
Sand and Grobnar were my favorites in NWN2.

The MotB cast was better rounded and of superior quality overall. I didn't get OoM but the rest were interesting enough. Gaan, actually, probably stood out the most despite me being prejudiced against his girly-man persona.
 

Texas Red

Whiner
Joined
Sep 9, 2006
Messages
7,044
NWN2:
Khelgar (-10). You are on an adventure through which you will likely lose your loved ones, witness horrible events yada yada. Fortunetly for the kids there is Khelgar, the friendly dwarf, who reminds you that combating nasty beasts in abandoned castles is completely safe and fun.

Neeshka (-10). Her picture should be next to the word "stereotype" and "cliche" in dictionaries. She has nothing else to say other than some childish bullshit indicating that she is a thief.

Elanee (-10). A woodelf druid. The idea is fascinating. The only distinctive trait she possess in extreme pretentiousness. You ask her for her name and she starts bullshitting you that titles or names are unimportant to her.

Qara (-10). "Me burn" and "Me arrogant" completely describe this "character".

Grobnar (-10). A crazy, good natured scientist gnome who speaks nonsense. Another great and original concept!

Casavir (-10) Some typical paladin that manages to be uninteresting to absolutely EVERYONE who plays the OC.

Shandra Jerro (-10). An undistinctive character. Some farmer who, after joining you, becomes a level 16 fighter overlord who can rape 10 men at once.

Bishop (-10). Hai guyz, I'm eval in a most cliche way possible!

Sand (dunno). An actually interesting character! He has personality, depth and all that without being over the top.

Zhjaavee (-10). Who the fuck is this? Oh, it was one of those companions completely devoid of any personality.

Ammon Jerro (positive). A good character. It doesn't matter though, since he disappears in the flood of shit that are other companion.

I don't believe Avellone lacked creativity or inspiration with NWN 2 companions. More likely, for some reason(probably because ofAtari's marketing research) the general direction of the game was supposed to be completely childish and devoid of anything original.
 

sabishii

Arbiter
Joined
Aug 18, 2005
Messages
1,325
Location
Gatornation
Khelgar (-1): Cliche, of course, but one that I didn't mind. IMO he was given decent dialogue/portrayal, and his sidequest is a plus also. Note that it might just be the quality of the other NPCs that make Khelgar seem decent.

Neeshka (-10). Eh, boring. Cliche, like Khelgar, but this is the annoying/whiny cliche with no humor value.

Elanee (-10). Boring, don't remember anything special.

Qara (-10). Boring.

Grobnar (-10). Boring.

Casavir (-10). See a pattern?

Shandra Jerro (+2). I liked that you could (or had to? I forget) take her on as a protege. Plus she was pretty "realistic" as in not Mary Sue. It was very unfortunate that she had to be killed off, because since she was so "ordinary" she definitely had room for character development.

Bishop (-9). +1 more than the others because of his role in MotB.

Sand (0). Actually had a personality - compared to most of the above - and his behavior during the trial gives him points.

Zhjaavee (-10). Boring. Says lots of mumbo-jumbo, but is any of it interesting? Not to me. Fine, I don't care for a walking encyclopedia of lore - No, but seriously, it didn't add anything to her as a *character*.

Ammon Jerro (0). Much better concept than the others... but yet again is a flat, static character that sees no development.


MotB
Safiya (+5). Maybe it was different in my playthrough, but there were a lot of chances to butt heads, and a lot of chances for agreement. She's seemed decently 3-dimensional to me because the many times she would speak up, and then her varied reactions to what you or another NPC had to say.

Gannayev (0). Eh. I suppose the concept was interesting, but to me he just seemed Mary Sue-ishly "deep" (<- the bad connotation). He would interject now and then, but with "deep" comments that were IMO just stale. His best part was with the farmer's daughter, because that might have been the only time you can really get insight into his personality and beliefs.

Kaelyn (undecided). Well, a lot of people like her. I would give her a 0 after my playthrough, but I acknowledge that I didn't really work on her influence (I was a Chaotic Barbarian... she was a Lawful Cleric :( *sigh*, heartbreak). So she rarely spoke up.

Okku & One-of-Many. Dur. I didn't have either one in my playthrough. For some reason I never found the door that led to One-of-Many (I killed Okku). I do remember getting the forge key (?) and then spending an hour looking for a forge. I'm really bad at finding things.
 

Lesifoere

Liturgist
Joined
Oct 26, 2007
Messages
4,071
I didn't expect to see the term "Mary Sue" used outside of fanfic/writing communities. Huh.
 

sabishii

Arbiter
Joined
Aug 18, 2005
Messages
1,325
Location
Gatornation
Lesifoere said:
I didn't expect to see the term "Mary Sue" used outside of fanfic/writing communities. Huh.
I think someone talked about it a couple weeks back and as I read about it, I found the embodiment of all that I hate.
 

ghostdog

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Dec 31, 2007
Messages
11,086
So basically all NWN2 OC chars are cliche and boring... yeah that's also what I've gathered so far (I'm near the end of act1) and I don't know how much longer I'll keep playing this mess of a game...
 

cardtrick

Arbiter
Joined
Apr 26, 2007
Messages
1,456
Location
Maine
ghostdog said:
So basically all NWN2 OC chars are cliche and boring... yeah that's also what I've gathered so far (I'm near the end of act1) and I don't know how much longer I'll keep playing this mess of a game...

If you're actually near the end, I'd persevere. That's about where I gave up my first time through, but I replayed the game later (after playing MOTB and knowing I had that to look forward to if I managed to drag a character through the OC) and discovered that it was much better in Acts II and III. I really liked managing Crossroads Keep, and some of the areas you explore are really quite interesting (a couple even reminiscent of MOTB or Torment), and two of the better NPCs (Shandra and Ammon Jerro) take center stage. Even in Acts II and III it's still not great, but it's no longer painful and occasionally quite decent.
 

Radisshu

Prophet
Joined
Jul 16, 2007
Messages
5,623
Khelgar 2.5/5
Pretty funny buddy-character that has some development, but very cliché.

Neeshka 2/5
COULD have been an interesting character, but her voice annoyed me and her backstory and lineage was always hinted at without being explored at all. And not even hinted at in the interesting sublime way which makes you like the mystery and makes an explanation redundant, just hinted at in the "well we couldn't fit the backstory with her lineage in so fuck it" way.

Elanee 1/5
Manages to be both incredibly boring AND annoying at the same time, cheers.

Qara 2/5
OMG I'm so gonna destroy this and that and shut the fuck up. If the cut cutscenes with her "true power" manifesting in front of Sand she might've been cooler, but now.. no, fuck her.

Grobnar 2.5/5
Not THAT annoying, but redundant and... well, that's it.

Casavir 1/5
STOP ACTING AS IF WE HAVE SOME SPECIAL BOND JUST BECAUSE I PLAYED A FEMALE CHARACTER. She was like 20 years old, you're this old paladin guy, fuck off already, sheesh.

Shandra Jerro 2.7/5
She reminded me a bit too much of a moralising teacher, but she was okay and actually had some plot attached to her.

Bishop 2.7/5
He was alright, even though I was annoyed at the whole Bishop/Casavir drama when my character had shown no interestist in any of them whatsoever.

Sand 3/5
The voice actor fit this guy perfectly and made him quite enjoyable. Sarcasm FTW.

Zhjaavee 2/5
Uhh, she was alright, but why that stupid outfit? And why the veil? And why was she even in the game?

Ammon Jerro 3/5
His voice actor annoyed me, and you SHOULD have been given the opportunity to kill him, but as a character he was pretty cool and worked as a mentor-like figure to my evil guy. Even though I wouldn't consider him very evil.

Safiya 2/5
Was really interesting at the start, but she became incredibly dull since she was played in the same key during the entire game no matter what happened. "Oh, I'm just a reincarnated clone of a long dead mage woman? Well that explains a lot. BTW I love you."

Gannayev 4/5
Gann is fucking awesome, I don't care what you say.

Kaelyn
SEEMS interesting, but I didn't use her in either of my parties.

Okku 3.8/5
Really nice and works well as some kind of mentor to make you feel proud when you've done what he considers to be the right thing. And looks great.

One-of-Many 4.5/5
The best sidekick an evil character can have. Especially the voice. THE VOICE.
 

afewhours

Scholar
Joined
Dec 26, 2007
Messages
562
Location
UK
ghostdog said:
So basically all NWN2 OC chars are cliche and boring... yeah that's also what I've gathered so far (I'm near the end of act1) and I don't know how much longer I'll keep playing this mess of a game...

Yep, it's generic epic high-fantasy pulp with a broadly painted ensemble cast. I very much enjoyed the game - if you're after some kind of deeply profound personal experience, it's not gonna deliver, but it kept me entertained right to the end. I played it through twice. Once with an elf rogue and once with a halfling paladin. (HALFLINGS FTW) The halfling went on to be my MotB character.

But then again, I *am* an avowed trash maven, so read anything I write with that in mind!
 

El Dee

Scholar
Joined
Jan 25, 2006
Messages
461
I haven't got to MOTB yet because I am determined to finish the OC first, and I am hoping that MOTB lives up to all I have heard about it.

I just started Act III and have found the most interesting characters to be Sand and Ammon. My character is a Fighter and my current party consists of Khelgar, Ammon, Sand and Neeshka, and I found that arrangement to be a good one.

I have rarely used the others besides Zhjaavee and Shandra.
 

Lurkar

Scholar
Joined
Feb 22, 2006
Messages
791
The actual thread on Bioware is fucking hilarious in a horrible dark way. "BISHOP 10/10 HE IS SO DEEP AND MISUNDERSTOOD." And there's that one crazy bitch who's making the romance mods about him, the one that seems really creepily obsessed about it.
 

afewhours

Scholar
Joined
Dec 26, 2007
Messages
562
Location
UK
Lurkar said:
The actual thread on Bioware is fucking hilarious in a horrible dark way. "BISHOP 10/10 HE IS SO DEEP AND MISUNDERSTOOD." And there's that one crazy bitch who's making the romance mods about him, the one that seems really creepily obsessed about it.

Oh dear. Way to ruin a perfectly good cunt of a character by scripting some horrid redemptive romance arc. Romance is supposed to be about depravity, angst, despair and resentment, dammit!
 

dolio

Scholar
Joined
Dec 18, 2007
Messages
294
Bishop was the alternative 'romance' option to Casavir for girls in the game (I decided to play through as an evil lady, so I actually got to see it). It's just that he dicks you over in the end, in some alleged attempt to 'save' you or something, as I recall. That was at least somewhat more interesting than the rest of the Bioware-esque romances, as I understand them. I was actually rather pleased at the ending. Garrius tried to get Bishop to fight against me with him, but I had enough influence that he just said, 'she's going to tear you a new asshole, Garrius,' and left.

But then, I'm not actually attracted to men. Maybe if I were, I'd be more hurt that that whole plot line ended up with my getting betrayed, instead of getting to bone the dark, misunderstood ranger guy (although, I kind of doubt it; I haven't been particularly captivated by the romances of any game beyond getting through them to see the whole of the story).

Edit: It's also possible that they originally planned more to the Bishop romance thing, but it got cut short to what happens now (although, I think there's still a Bishop-Casavir cutscene to demonstrate that they're both falling in love with you for no apparent reason). For instance, from what I've read, there was supposed to be a Sand-Qara cutscene that emphasized the conflict between the two, which was scrapped (but is still in the dialogue files somewhere). So now, you're blindsided by the conflict at the end where one or the other chooses to go with Garrius (unless you make a habit of taking them both with you everywhere you go, and even then, I'm not sure you get more than some intermittent bickering to clue you in).

It's similar to KOTOR2, actually.
 

Radisshu

Prophet
Joined
Jul 16, 2007
Messages
5,623
The Bishop romance was planned but never actually implemented by Obsidian. Some of it is in the game, but there was supposed to be much more. I don't think it would be much of a redeeming kind of storyline though, more of a choice for the evil players.
 

Lumpy

Arcane
Joined
Sep 11, 2005
Messages
8,525
sabishii said:
Okku & One-of-Many. Dur. I didn't have either one in my playthrough. For some reason I never found the door that led to One-of-Many (I killed Okku). I do remember getting the forge key (?) and then spending an hour looking for a forge. I'm really bad at finding things.
I think you have to get past the furnace to finish the game, no?
 

Starwars

Arcane
Joined
Jan 31, 2007
Messages
2,829
Location
Sweden
As far as I know, yes. Perhaps it's possible to go straight down to the lower levels using the real Sword of Gith instead of the replica, and thus never visiting the furnace at all? Not sure.
 

dolio

Scholar
Joined
Dec 18, 2007
Messages
294
Yes, the actual sword of Gith works (I believe that's what I used my second time through).
 

Lurkar

Scholar
Joined
Feb 22, 2006
Messages
791
There's a huge difference between what the Bishop thing is, what was planned, and what the crazy obsessive chick is doing. As was stated earlier, Bishop wasn't going to be some redeemed hero in the romance, he'd just be an option for very evil characters. Somehow he's been turned into some misunderstood anti-hero by the brain dead fan base - He has a fucking fan base! - on those forums.

I don't get the love for the character. He's the very goddamn avatar of every retarded I'M EVIL path in every Bioware game in existance.
 

Starwars

Arcane
Joined
Jan 31, 2007
Messages
2,829
Location
Sweden
I find that particular part of the fanbase quite strange. Some people were outraged that their favourite character turned up dead in MotB. And I mean outraged to the point where a few of them stopped playing the game. I mean it's just wtf.
That said, the way Obsidian did it felt rather tacked on (the conversations with Ammon Jerro), but still...

I was glad to hear that Casavir died.

But I do wish that you could run into one or two more characters (or at least something related to them) from the OC in MotB. Like I said before, I hated Bishops character, but it was nice to see him in MotB and laugh at him.

And yeah, there seems to be quite a bit of cut content in NWN2. But unlike KOTOR2, I don't think there's anything (that I've read about anyways) that would really improve the quality of the game all that much.

It's kinda interesting to play the game with 'showcomments' on though.
 

The Exar

Liturgist
Joined
Aug 30, 2004
Messages
259
Location
Smoldering Corpse Bar
From the OC I pretty much liked Sand. I found Elanee boring. Khelgar rocks. Amon was very cool.

But in MotB Kaelyn is the best. I like her voice. She seems so innocent... :twisted:

I think I'm going to try the evil way just to check out One of Many.
 

doctor_kaz

Scholar
Joined
May 26, 2006
Messages
517
Location
Ohio, USA
The best character in the OC was Sand. Amman was interesting but his character was such a worthless pussy that I never got to take him anywhere. Shandra was boring, not to mention butchy. Elanee, Casavir, and the Gith chick were boring as hell and added nothing. I actually kind of liked Khelgar in the end even though I didn't like him at first. He was the only guy with an interesting personal story.
 

Disconnected

Scholar
Joined
Dec 17, 2007
Messages
609
I think I could have forgiven everything but Bishop. What demented fuck came up with the idea of writing in an over-the-top MTV-style emo into a fucking RPG? I hope someone breaks into your homes while you're asleep, dear Obsidian devs, and shits in your shoes. Having that warm, moist shit bubble up between your naked toes when you're half awake early in the morning, is not only a just reward for that fucked up stunt, I've had the misfortune of trying it, so you have my personal guarantee that it is about as enjoyable as finding a fucking Bishop NPC that you CANNOT AVOID in your RPG. Fuckers...
 

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