Torment Planescape Torments Me

[Lord Andre]

wall of text

My dear man, let's get a few things straight: Planescape Torment is GOD of rpgs, Fallout is the Holy Ghost, Arcanum is Jesus and Bloodlines is John the Baptiser. In other words, you are threading holy ground.

Apart from that, you indeed have a point. There are some early quests and dialogs that are boring. But you must have faith and endure them with stoicism. Good things come to those who wait.

Also do not exaggerate. Here are the boring parts.

1. Centaur that won't shut up.
2. Idiot paladin from another world that won't shut up.
3. Becoming a mage quest. Nicely written but the bitch makes you run for half an hour fetching crap.
4. A few(4-5) minor NPC-s that are there for fluff, easily detected and avoided.

The rest is important to the story, and typically well written.

My advice is to install unfinished business and fix pack, start over(punishment for pussying out) and push past the 4 hubs to the dialogue with Pharod. From then on it's a heck of a ride. Oh, and hold on to the bronze sphere.

Also, Torment isn't a game you can play for 1-2 hours after work when you're tired, stressed and generally just want to relax. Torment is a bitter-sweet delight that you have to savor. It's meant to be played when you're in a certain mood.
It's not beer god damn it, it's age old whisky ! You don't crack it open on a Wednesday afternoon !
Put it on the shelf for now - if you must - and let it mature. When the time is right it will call to you.

Upon reading the above I must say I give pretty good fellatio to a game when I want to...I should be on EA's payroll.

 

[someone else]

lol u hate reading and u r on codex lol u mad

 

[RK47]

You should just start killing the whole town. Roleplaying an immortal mad man like I did. You'll unlock a secret content too.

 

[Antihero]

You should just start killing the whole town. Roleplaying an immortal mad man like I did. You'll unlock a secret content too.

Not sure if it'll help, but make sure you save over the same game slot repeatedly while questing for that secret content.

 

[Castanova]

push past the 4 hubs to the dialogue with Pharod. From then on it's a heck of a ride.

I have pushed forward, ignoring all NPCs when possible, and I've arrived in the junk town or whatever it's called. Haven't found Pharod yet but I have found several more NPCs asking me to run FedEx quests for them. I've also found several more Thugs hanging around for the sole purpose... umm... well, no purpose really. I almost suspect Thugs were inserted after a management meeting where a suit exclaimed, "WTF IS THIS SHIT WHERE IS THE COMBAT"

If this doesn't get much better, much quicker once I meet Pharod then I will officially declare this game a steaming pile of shit, quality of the writing aside.

 

[Alex]

@Zomg

I still stand by what I said in the other Planescape thread. It isn't a crappy game with good story. Its gameplay is the story. Its gameplay isn't in equipping good weapons to beat some strong enemy, or in determining the positioning of the party so it isn't annihilated by the enemy. It is, instead, in choosing how TNO reacts to the story and seeing the story change (even if only slightly) from that. It still isn't very good gameplay, as it is far from being as interactive as I think it should be. But it is somewhat unique what it accomplishes, which makes it worthwhile.

@Castanova

Interacting with the NPCs is the whole point of the game. Each NPC acts as a little glimpse into the setting and (at least a goodly amount of the time) as an opportunity to roleplay the TNO. Interacting with them may have few consequences, but it allows you, the player, to decide on some foreshadowing for the rest of the story. This is what is so great about Planescape. For example, a few fun NPCs I remember that you should have already met are: O (at the smoldering corpse bar), Dak'kon, the woman with chattering teeth, the guy who wants you to remember his city, Mebbeth, among many others. If you have interacted with all these people and didn't have fun with any of them, I would say this game really isn't for you.

 

[Xor]

So this is what the Codex has been reduced to.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Yes, complaining about things you don't like in a game.

whuda thunk it

 

[Castanova]

If you have interacted with all these people and didn't have fun with any of them, I would say this game really isn't for you.

Probably not, because these NPCs were text-dispensers not role-playing opportunities. I didn't find their little back stories quite so engaging considering they're context-less, irrelevant to any plot that I've yet to see, they don't affect my character in any way, and half of them asked me to run a FedEx quest for them. Honestly, why couldn't they have just made Sigil a bunch of menus with illustrations so I don't have to actually watch my characters walk back and forth all the time?

Anyway, I just met Pharod and got.... a FedEx quest! I have to go fetch an Orb for him before I get to experience more of this masterful and highly-acclaimed storytelling. I stepped into the Catacombs and immediately got attacked by about 4,000 of these bat-looking monsters. I clicked on one of them, made a cup of coffee, and came back and the combat was only just finishing up. The whole time I was making that coffee I was wondering why modern cRPGs don't learn more from PST.

 

[Excidium]

So EDGY!!

 

[Alex]

Selecting which "Fedex quest" you will do is a roleplay opportunity in PS:T. Here is an advice: go talk with Mebbeth. She will give you a few Fedex quests, but they will show many of the themes that underlie the rest of the game. If it doesn't do anything to you, quit it.

 

[Jaesun]

4/10. At least you tried.

 

[Mastermind]

Yes, complaining about things you don't like in a game.

whuda thunk it

 

[Zomg]

@Zomg

I still stand by what I said in the other Planescape thread. It isn't a crappy game with good story. Its gameplay is the story. Its gameplay isn't in equipping good weapons to beat some strong enemy, or in determining the positioning of the party so it isn't annihilated by the enemy. It is, instead, in choosing how TNO reacts to the story and seeing the story change (even if only slightly) from that. It still isn't very good gameplay, as it is far from being as interactive as I think it should be. But it is somewhat unique what it accomplishes, which makes it worthwhile.

This is kind of a pointlessly fine and autistic point but gameplay is the stuff you do to eventuate a win condition, period. I'm not using it as shorthand for combat. This definition of "gamplay" is obviously a very harsh term of criticism to try to apply to a single player videogame with save/reload at any time and that kind of shit that ultimately renders it very ambiguous about win/loss at all. Now, unlike some of the new wave of post-modblut hardass video game criticisin' niggas on the Codex, having attenuated gameplay doesn't make a videogame instant trash to me. I do care about interactive narrative and toylike behavior and stuff. But it isn't gameplay if it isn't about eventuating a win condition.

The key to enjoying the kind of collecty grindy buildy gameplay of 99% of CRPGs/JRPGs is basically acting like there is a a meaningful "gamespace" and win condition even though there isn't. Poke around for gold, even though it has no purpose, find XP and loot you'll never need, learn the intricate build logic, whatever. This gives the videogame form, direction, an endoskeleton to hang the narrative, toy behavior, exploration, whatever on.

 

[Awor Szurkrarz]

You have successfully added Castanova to your ignore list.

Return to the post


Anyway, PST was good for what it is. Half awesome half awful.

 

[someone else]

I hope to get 6/10 one day... shall I do X-Com or Deus Ex?

 

[Stereotypical Villain]

BROS I STARTED PLAYING PLANESCAPE TOURNMENT HOPING THAT I WOULD GET TO PLAY AS A CHARACTER WHO HAS A COMPULSIVE NEED TO UPDATE HIS JOURNAL CONSTANTLY

THE BRO DID NOT DISSAPOINT

 

[SCO]

I feel unable to express the amount of scorn i feel towards the OP.

 

[Grunker]

Three FACTS, Castanova:

1: I completely agree with your OP.

2: Planescape: Torment is my favourite game.

3: In the rest of your posts in this thread you're just being an edgy smug bastard who makes himself sound like an idiot.

I had the same experience as you the first three times I attempted to go through Planescape: Torment at ages 14, 16 and 17 respectively. Then one day I decided to fucking finish this game, no matter the cost. MortuaryboringhiveboringnpcsboringcombatboringsewersboringfindingbronzesphereboringreturnbronzesphereHOLYSHITTHISGAMEJUSTBECOMEAWESOMEHOLYSHITTHESEPARTYMEMBERSAREFUCKINGWELLWRITTENHOLYSHITARGARGHARHG

In other words; the game picks up ALOT after you find the Bronze Sphere. At least, that was the point where the game really blossomed for me.

On another note, though I dislike early combat in PS:T, I don't have the same dislike of the gameplay as others on the 'dex. I think it becomes pretty good post level 9-10.

 

[DraQ]

PST is supposed to be a paragon of cRPG storytelling and yet it fails at one of the most basic, story 101 concepts: show, don't tell.

Unlike oblibion, I suppose.



In all seriousness, though, one of my pet peeves in computer games in general is devs mindlessly trying to apply rules and practices from other, non-interactive storytelling paradigms.

Sure, there is "show, don't tell" variant applicable to computer games - see the thread about biowhore NPCs repeatedly and loudly announcing their emotion rather than allowing you to infer them from their reactions - but in computer games there is the limitation of player *being* the protagonist - you're not just a passive audience, you're a decision making agent with both your goals and actions corresponding directly to goals and actions of the protagonist. In a movie or book there is no reason to limit your knowledge to that of the protagonist, in a game not doing so *will* either affect the plot, or make player run into invisible walls placed specifically so that he can't make use of the knowledge he has.

There are other problems too - for example IE is a simplistic isometric engine and, as such, is especially ill-suited for showing (compared to anything 3D or ancient fake-3D FPP of titles like Lands of Lore or final Wizardry trilogy.

All in all, hoping for significant amounts of anything but textual foreshadowing via conversation in such game is plain retarded - if anything, you should be grateful for the brief moments when the devs could break the interactive storytelling paradigm by showing stuff like mortuary shadows scene.

 

[Sannom]

I figured the npcs were there for a reason. But thanks for pointing out that the key to enjoying PST is to skip its content.

Every named NPC is there for a reason, except perhaps for the giant bearded man in the bar. Some delivers an amount of exposition that is completely useless and which holds no correlation to their plot importance, most notably the guy next to the giant bearded man, who will give you a complete exposition of all the planes in the setting. Just talk to him enough to know what is his specialty, and you should be able to guess what's use there is for him in one quest.

 

[Satori (original)]

Every named NPC is there for a reason, except perhaps for the giant bearded man in the bar..

What.

Spoiler

He's an Anarchist agent that appears in the later plane when shit is going all wack.

 

[l3loodAngel]

If you have interacted with all these people and didn't have fun with any of them, I would say this game really isn't for you.

Probably not, because these NPCs were text-dispensers not role-playing opportunities. I didn't find their little back stories quite so engaging considering they're context-less, irrelevant to any plot that I've yet to see, they don't affect my character in any way, and half of them asked me to run a FedEx quest for them. Honestly, why couldn't they have just made Sigil a bunch of menus with illustrations so I don't have to actually watch my characters walk back and forth all the time?

Anyway, I just met Pharod and got.... a FedEx quest! I have to go fetch an Orb for him before I get to experience more of this masterful and highly-acclaimed storytelling. I stepped into the Catacombs and immediately got attacked by about 4,000 of these bat-looking monsters. I clicked on one of them, made a cup of coffee, and came back and the combat was only just finishing up. The whole time I was making that coffee I was wondering why modern cRPGs don't learn more from PST.

I really dont understand what were you searching for? FedEx quests are a part of every RPG and MMO out there. Then again if you wanted an action game you should have played DA2. Then you wont be able to make coffee and every moment would be intense. Button - awesome intense, with no boring text and not a single chance to roleplay.

 

[RatFink]

i like to drink coffe and have a smoke while playing planescape torment! to be able to go and make meself a cup of coffee, roll a cigarette...this is what i call casual gaming.

plus you actually made me pick it up again...left it for a few months sitting on my hdd after i entered the foundry...last night i played 5 hours straight till the sun came up and i stood in front of

Spoiler

the hag of the grey waste

.

so good on ya, mr!

love it or hate it! the scenery/atmosphere alone is enough to make me enjoy the heck out of this gem of a game/novel.

well im off talking to this character which i was searching for, for quite some time/reading the novel that will surely be the conversation, see ya in a couple of hours

 

[DraQ]

i like to drink coffe and have a smoke while playing planescape torment! to be able to go and make meself a cup of coffee, roll a cigarette...this is what i call casual gaming.

For me that would be Wiz8 - there is no casual beyond TB (ok, phase based).

plus you actually made me pick it up again...left it for a few months sitting on my hdd after i entered the foundry...last night i played 5 hours straight till the sun came up and i stood in front of

Spoiler

the hag of the grey waste

.

so good on ya, mr!

love it or hate it! the scenery/atmosphere alone is enough to make me enjoy the heck out of this gem of a game/novel.

well im off talking to this character which i was searching for, for quite some time/reading the novel that will surely be the conversation, see ya in a couple of hours