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Invisible Inc.

Jaedar

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Project: Eternity Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pathfinder: Kingmaker
Wait, is there a gadget/augment that suppress alarm countdown ? What is it and where do I find it ?

Also, I'm trying to use Faustus and Brimstone. What agents they synergize with ? Central seems to be the logical one (since she gains POW each Daemon installed), but what other combinations should I loom for ?
Central and anyone else really. Xu is a good choice since he allows for some hacking even if you get one of the "no hacking for X turns" daemons. You won't have much power issues as long as you visit a server shop early on. There is no way to stop the alarm counter from increasing each turn. Afaik the only increase that can be stopped is the one from killing, which is stopped by an aug.
 

Metro

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They also use overwatch instead of shooting you outright whenever they spot you. Basically the equivalent of 'hands up or I'll shoot'.
I'm 95% sure that the one time I tried standing there to see what would happen I got shot anyway.
Oh they'll definitely flat out kill you after the 'hands up' turn. It's just that they don't immediately kill you on discovery.
 

Metro

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Not really a fan of Rapier on the harder difficulties. It quickly becomes horribly inefficient versus standard lockpick.
 

Silva

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Well, just finished it for the second time on Experience with Rapier. Yeah, by the last missions (specially the last one) its extremlly inefective and you better have Dagger or Lockpick v2 at this point. Early-to-mid game though ? Rapier rocks, and coupled with Prism it means you will be swimming in POW as long as you dont go slow or get delayed by some reason.

BTW, last playthrough Ive found Shalem on detention center. I got pissed at first but then 2 great things hapenned:

1. the following mission Ive found that nice Dart Rifle that does 1-armor piercing, which coupled with his natural 1-AP made him a great support until endgame.

2. Ive began to use him as bait, in a pretty careless way. While he distracted guards (openin doors, getting in their LOS, etc) the other agents did their work. This made the game so much more liberating and... easy, in a way. This coupled with the Ping program almost seems like cheating. I caused such a distraction mayhem on the last mission that it was hilarious seeing that bunch of guards running from one point to another exactly as I wanted.

Now Im wondering if Decker could be the perfect distractor - he start with more movement, which is good for this, and he also starts with that cloaking device, which is even better. Imagine attracting everybody to a corner and then vanishing in front of their eyes, while running back to exit.

Well, going to Expert mode now.
 
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spectre

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What other sinergies did you guys found out ?

Ive found that Prism works nicely with Rapier for POW efficiency.
Obviously, Monster and Central were designed to go togehter.
Need a +5 pwr boost, just fire that overclocked zapper of his.

Still, what works best for me is:

Archived Banks + Xu + Seed + Lockpick
I'm very fond of seed. During the first missions, you can make do with just breaking 1-2 firewalls per turn making it very power efficient.
It's even possible to use Brimstone successfully, but I always consider this a wasteful program.
Break all safes with Xu to save even more PWR.
Your PWR count resets to 10 after each mission (it carried over in ea builds), which should let you do all the hacking you need.

This way you can ignore getting pwr from consoles, opening up the possibility to convert it to cash with banks' chip.

It's challenging for the first two, three missions cause archived banks has shit starting zapper which I usually sell at the first nanofab after expending the ammo, but Xu sorta makes up for it, as he's got a door trap and a hand zapper he can share.
After the startup period during which you should invest a few points in Hacking to maximize the rewards and possibly get a -1 cooldown augmentation for the guy who'll be using the chip, you should be swimming in cash,
easily making 1k - 2k per mission on just the consoles.
Maxing out your agents gets trivial at this point, and nanofab vestibules should start feeling like christmas.

It's important to hit a server farm soon-ish to upgrade your hacking tools. Dagger 1.0 or 2.0, Lockpick 2.0 and Hunter (Taurus will do in a pinch) make for a nice package that can handle any firewall for very cheap.
Add a parasite or data blast to hack multiple stuff at once and you're all set.

The biggest problem about tis build is when you have shit luck with finding stuff in the first 2-3 missions. Without Torque injectors the cooldown on the $ chip takes forever, forcing your moneymaker to drag along. It also gets pretty shitty if you don't find a second neural disrupter or a gun to save you from an accasional fuckup (I'm typing this from the perspective of Expert Ironman I am trying to pull off atm.).

An EXTREME version of this build would use Monst3r instead of xu, since he starts with Hacking:3, you will get about +100$ per console, making it very likely to end mission one with a metric fuckton of cash.
Unfortunately, it also emphasizes the weakness of the first version of the build, as your zapping ability will be really crappy unless you luck out on the nanofabs.

Another interesting combination for me is Archived Shalem + Xu (same set of programs as above, I really like Seed + Lockpick, but there's nothing fundamentally wrong about power drip). Xu can disable heart monitors for a turn, and Shalem's three shot gun is very efficient (it could probably work just as well with archived Decker, but I'm not a big fan of the guy). Cleanup cost is really peanuts in my view, given the freedom you get from offing just one guard or two - it's often enough to pick the level clean.
 
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Silva

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Nice explanation, spectre. I'll try this Alt Banks + Xu duo.

How does Parasite fair ? In what situations is it good ? In combination with which agents ? I admit not seeing what's the point of it.
 

Infinitron

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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
So, should I put this on the curator? A bit hesistant because it doesn't say RPG anywhere in its description. Which is an interesting choice on Klei's part, because most games of this type are eager to adopt that label no matter how well it fits. They're comfortable branding it as a "tactical stealth game", period.

So, Athelas, can you describe Invisible Inc in 152 characters? +M
 

Athelas

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So, should I put this on the curator? A bit hesistant because it doesn't say RPG anywhere in its description. Which is an interesting choice on Klei's part, because most games of this type are eager to adopt that label no matter how well it fits. They're comfortable branding it as a "tactical stealth game", period.

So, Athelas, can you describe Invisible Inc in 152 characters? +M
What, a blurb for the curator page? I suppose, although I've only done and a half playthroughs, so I'm not even that knowledgeable about the game. Let's see:

'A turn-based stealth RPG that manages to evoke the thrill and suspense of the best stealth games, further reinforced by an unpredictable roguelike structure and a cyberpunk dystopia setting. Oh, and the tactical turn-based side isn't half bad either.'
 

Metro

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Too much redundant language.

Hang on, Codex's reply editor is shitty:

'A tactical turn-based stealth RPG that evokes thrill and suspense reinforced by an unpredictable roguelike structure and a cyberpunk dystopian setting.'

There.
 
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Infinitron

I post news
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
97,642
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
So, should I put this on the curator? A bit hesistant because it doesn't say RPG anywhere in its description. Which is an interesting choice on Klei's part, because most games of this type are eager to adopt that label no matter how well it fits. They're comfortable branding it as a "tactical stealth game", period.

So, Athelas, can you describe Invisible Inc in 152 characters? +M
What, a blurb for the curator page? I suppose, although I've only done and a half playthroughs, so I'm not even that knowledgeable about the game. Let's see:

'A turn-based stealth RPG that manages to evoke the thrill and suspense of the best stealth games, further reinforced by an unpredictable roguelike structure and a cyberpunk dystopia setting. Oh, and the tactical turn-based side isn't half bad either.'

That's about 100 letters too long. :)

Also, you probably want to start with something that describes more simply what the game is about ("control a team of agents who infiltrate corporations in a cyberpunk world" or whatever) before going into further detail with however much space you have left.
 

Infinitron

I post news
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Messages
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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Too much redundant language.

Hang on, Codex's reply editor is shitty:

'A tactical turn-based stealth RPG that evokes thrill and suspense reinforced by an unpredictable roguelike structure and a cyberpunk dystopian setting.'

There.

Thank you for occasionally reminding us that you're a lawyer (with the verbal talent that comes with that) and not just a raving forum bully.
 

Jaedar

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Project: Eternity Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pathfinder: Kingmaker
Nice explanation, spectre. I'll try this Alt Banks + Xu duo.

How does Parasite fair ? In what situations is it good ? In combination with which agents ? I admit not seeing what's the point of it.
Parasite used to be really good, since it cost 1 power all the time. Too good in fact, so they nerfed it a lot. It's honestly not very good now, it's too slow and quickly gets too expensive, especially later on. The only real point is the ability to "keep hacking" after you get locked out of incognita if you place a lot of them before triggering the daemon. But that is a very edge case usage.
 

spectre

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In early access I used to run Parasite and Lockpick 1.0/rapier, it was very efficient, but you need to invest a few points in hacking for that little extra pwr to keep it going.

Sadly, it seems they changed that and you now have to take one pwr generator and one breaker, probably to prevent cretins from fucking themselves over.
Parasite alone is doable, but infuriating, cause you now have to wait until eot until it hacks a measly camera. It really slows you down at alarm level 2 and you'll probably need to take archived Xu for the EMP to compensate for this.
Parasite makes for a very good auxiliary breaker, but hard to use it on your own.
 

Darth Roxor

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mhTuN4.jpg


ALARM LEVEL 5

EVERYONE ON THE LEVEL MASSIVELY PISSED OFF

TWO AGENTS DOWN, INCLUDING THE RESCUE MISSION OBJECTIVE

BANKS HEROICALLY REZZES ONE OF THEM WHILE DRAGGING THE OTHER TO SAFETY

WELL DONE, OPERATOR!


This game is pretty fucking brilliant. When I lost those two dudes (although that happened only due to the retarded pathfinding that doesn't avoid guard vision fields on its own), I was sure I was done for. I even alt+f4'd in panic hoping it would rewind, but it didn't, so I had to hulk the fuck up and do it like a man.

Banks first retreats to a nano fabricator which I unlock by spending my last power. It unleashes a daemon lowering her ap by 2. It's further lowered by 2 when she buys a medigel + dartgun with my last fukken credits. Then come two turns of dancing around 4 guards, finally ending with shooting one, rezzing Internationale and knocking out another. Then Internationale rushes to the teleport while Banks drags Shalem to it, just in time for the alarm level to rise to 5, spawn a heavy enforcer and pinpoint the agents' location.

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED, TIME FOR BRANDY!
 

WhiteGuts

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Too much redundant language.

Hang on, Codex's reply editor is shitty:

'A tactical turn-based stealth RPG that evokes thrill and suspense reinforced by an unpredictable roguelike structure and a cyberpunk dystopian setting.'

There.

Thank you for occasionally reminding us that you're a lawyer (with the verbal talent that comes with that) and not just a raving forum bully.

Oh, so Metro is the scum of the Earth both on and off line.
 

Athelas

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although that happened only due to the retarded pathfinding that doesn't avoid guard vision fields on its own
Avoiding guard vision is part of the gameplay of any stealth game, I'm not sure why you think the developers should have removed that.

Also, sometimes you will want to alert guards.
 

Darth Roxor

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Avoiding guard vision is part of the gameplay of any stealth game, I'm not sure why you think the developers should have removed that.

When the agent is positioned like this:

_a_
_xx
oxx

where _ are empty fields, x are watched by a guard that you have spotted, a is agent and o is your objective (not watched), I expect the game to have the common decency to take the agent to his objective through the empty fields, particularly when the AP cost to do that doesn't change. It's like the auto-pathing not ignoring detected traps on its own in Blackguards, it adds nothing to the game except tedium.

Also, sometimes you will want to alert guards.

You will more often not want to do that.
 

Athelas

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The shortest route there is the diagonal one and I'm pretty sure diagonal pathing is more AP-efficient, though I'm not sure how exactly it's calculated. And again, many a strategy revolves around deliberately alerting guards. I'm all for removing tedium, but this would have been detrimental to gameplay.

You will more often not want to do that.
That doesn't actually contradict anything I said. Even if it's a viable strategy only 10% of the time, that would still make it worthwhile to allow.
 

Darth Roxor

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The shortest route there is the diagonal one

The agent either goes 1 down then diagonal to the left for 2.5 AP or he goes diagonal to the left and then 1 down for 2.5 AP. It's exactly the same.
 

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