Eternity Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire Pre-Release Thread [BETA RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Quillon]

Wow Lacrymas, I've never read so much positivity from you on anything that wasn't MCA-related. What's going on, are you feeling the balance now?

The balance is always in everyone. You just need to unlock your potential.

I thought we are still operating on the assumption that it will be mediocre at best?

You and what army?

It will be GOTY 2018. This is still the early days of Sawyerism.

Balance will be achieved and world will finally be at peace.

 

[Lacrymas]

Wow Lacrymas, I've never read so much positivity from you on anything that wasn't MCA-related. What's going on, are you feeling the balance now?

I've never been opposed to the balance, so no :p It's easy to be positive about single, disconnected elements, like sea monsters, some SFX (while being wary about them going overboard with them) aaand ...some graphics improvement, I guess? I still think the big picture will be mediocre at best.

 

[FreeKaner]

Wow Lacrymas, I've never read so much positivity from you on anything that wasn't MCA-related. What's going on, are you feeling the balance now?

I've never been opposed to the balance, so no :p It's easy to be positive about single, disconnected elements, like sea monsters, some SFX (while being wary about them going overboard with them) aaand ...some graphics improvement, I guess? I still think the big picture will be mediocre at best.

The good old expect nothing so there is no room to be disappoint tactic.

A safe bet.

 

[Sizzle]

Wow Lacrymas, I've never read so much positivity from you on anything that wasn't MCA-related. What's going on, are you feeling the balance now?

I've never been opposed to the balance, so no :p It's easy to be positive about single, disconnected elements, like sea monsters, some SFX (while being wary about them going overboard with them) aaand ...some graphics improvement, I guess? I still think the big picture will be mediocre at best.

While I find graphical improvements nice and all (anything which will result in clearer combat is a welcome change), the biggest changes (and the ones we have most reason to be excited and optimistic about) are multi-classing, Fallout: New Vegas style factions and companions, and a setting that's not just a Sword Coast pastiche - those are the real big picture elements of this sequel.

 

[Rev]

While I find graphical improvements nice and all (anything which will result in clearer combat is a welcome change), the biggest changes (and the ones we have most reason to be excited and optimistic about) are multi-classing, Fallout: New Vegas style factions and companions, and a setting that's not just a Sword Coast pastiche - those are the real big picture elements of this sequel.

They also said the game will be more reactive to your choice, which, if true, is another bit of incline.

 

[Lacrymas]

Sizzle, the problem is that those things can be total decline. We all know how shitty factions and the setting can be. Multi classing doesn't excite me on its own, I need the context of the game play. All they've promised is the ingredients to make a good game, but that's called marketing.

 

[Sizzle]

Shittier than the "factions" from PoE1? Those barely had anything to do with the game at all, and here they are a focus. I'd say it's a pretty safe bet they'll be miles above those from the first one.

As for the setting - anything is better than than the standard "Central Europe, XIII century" they pulled off (albeit with some welcome additions) in PoE1. Especially since pirates and Polynesian-inspired cultures and colonial themes aren't that common in CRPGs.

The only part that could potentially turn out to be worse than the first one is the multi-classing, but it also sounds like it could produce some fun class combinations and combat encounters.

 

[Sentinel]

Factions were a focus in Tyranny too and they're shit there. Being "a focus" doesn't mean anything.

 

[Sizzle]

Tyranny handled factions a lot differently than F:NV, and they said they would follow F:NV's faction model here.

Besides, we are talking about clear improvements here. Do you honestly believe that the factions in PoE2, which are said to be a core focus of the game, can possibly be as bad as those from PoE1, which were basically just "Do one quest for us to get access to our spiffy store. Do two more, and we'll get you in to speak with the Duke!"?

 

[luj1]

\m/ \m/

window lightning, ship customization, physiqued flails wow... they prioritize superficial garbage like this all the time over more important stuff like writing, reactivity and core system design. Gotta love Simsidian

 

[Lacrymas]

I don't think PoE can be a measuring stick for anything. It was clearly rushed and nothing could shine. We also don't know what they mean by "F:NV's faction model", at least I don't know what they mean. The setting could only be pretty pictures in the background, changing nothing and meaning nothing. It shouldn't be just window dressing on which we do the same shit, but it's easy to be just that.

 

[Prime Junta]

We also don't know what they mean by "F:NV's faction model", at least I don't know what they mean.

If you've played FO:NV, you should have a pretty good idea of what it is.

What it is, is rather good. Can't think of many games that gave such a convincing illusion of actually aligning with, and later joining, a faction.

 

[Sizzle]

luj1 The core system design went through an almost complete revision: classes work differently, enchanting works differently, engagement has been changed, etc. I understand you don't like this game, but saying it's the same shit as the first one, only with better graphics and more realistic cloth physics, is disingenuous.

We also don't know what they mean by "F:NV's faction model", at least I don't know what they mean.

Several main factions you can ally with/double-cross/betray, all vying for control over a resource/territory that's central to the PC's main objective - not to make fun of you, but it's pretty obvious (if you've played F:NV, that is).

 

[Lacrymas]

I hate all walking simulators, so I can't get past a certain point in F:NV, I get incredibly bored of walking, the terrible shooting gameplay doesn't help it. That doesn't mean I don't know about the factions and what they do, but "you'd know only if you've played it" doesn't sound convincing and looks like a cop-out. What is the difference between F:NV's factions and "generic" factions in other games?

 

[Sentinel]

A thing to note here is that a faction, regardless of the "faction model" it follows, is extremely reliant on its characters. All FNV factions had good characters that people enjoyed interacting with and were consistent. However that requires good writers.
Every writer from FNV pretty much left Obsidian and isn't playing any major role in PoE2 (inb4 b-but Eric is writing Eder that totally matters for the factions!! Josh is directing!).

 

[Infinitron]

The term "F:NV's faction model" is misleading, as if we're talking about some auxiliary system that's extraneous to a purported "base game". We're talking about F:NV's main quest design.

 

[Lacrymas]

AFAIR, you can be independent, so not really.

 

[Infinitron]

AFAIR, you can be independent, so not really.

No, the independent path is effectively a fourth faction. In fact, it's when you first encounter Yes Man, the character who guides you on that path, that you realize how brilliant the game's main quest design is, and how everything you've been doing fits into it.

 

[Delterius]

Several main factions you can ally with/double-cross/betray, all vying for control over a resource/territory that's central to the PC's main objective - not to make fun of you, but it's pretty obvious (if you've played F:NV, that is)

Well, I haven't so I need some clarification. Are we talking 'narrative' faction conflict or is that something that happens in-game? How open ended is the whole 'ally/double-cross/betray' deal?

 

[Lacrymas]

So, this is what having a great faction system is? Literally being the main quest?

 

[Quillon]

window lightning

I strangely don't remember anything about this you keep repeating. When did they talk about it?

 

[Infinitron]

So, this is what having a great faction system is? Literally being the main quest?

All of these games technically use the same faction "system". I would say that's an important part of having great factions, period.

It's not the only thing, though. Open world, non-linearity, with lots of supporting content is also important. Being put on a linear path where at a certain point you're told "Welp, time to join a faction" isn't exciting.

Unsurprisingly, factions are most interesting when they're actually, you know, factions, with a pervasive presence and impact on the world. And not when they're just souped up questgivers in special uniforms. This is why PS:T's factions were forgettable too.

 

[FreeKaner]

Trying to explain NV factions to someone who hasn't played it is like trying to explain colours to someone blind.

 

[Quillon]

they prioritize superficial garbage like this all the time over more important stuff like writing, reactivity and core system design.

Yeah man, who needs 170 maps when you can just fill one map with 35 NPCs with shitton of dialogue? Or who needs good animations? Who wants to sheath their weapons after combat? Bleh. This isn't a fucking visual entertainment software. Obsidian should just fire all the graphics artists, animators and hire writers & designers and they should write 1.2+ million words for Deadfire, so much reactivity, such pacing. I'm sure everyone will love that.

 

[Sizzle]

Several main factions you can ally with/double-cross/betray, all vying for control over a resource/territory that's central to the PC's main objective - not to make fun of you, but it's pretty obvious (if you've played F:NV, that is)

Well, I haven't so I need some clarification. Are we talking 'narrative' faction conflict or is that something that happens in-game? How open ended is the whole 'ally/double-cross/betray' deal?

Pretty open, you have a lot of leeway in how you approach the factions. And there's a lot of opportunities to screw over everyone involved (there's only one "immortal" NPC (and why that NPC is like that makes perfect sense, it's not Radiant AI Bethesda bullshit) in the entire game, it's designed to be completable even if you kill all the major NPCs) in many steps of the way. Also, like Infinitron said, F:NV's factions are visible and tangible forces in the gameworld, and are very well integrated into it (though the Legion has some problems, but this is a topic that has been discussed to death).

It's great, really, and I recommend you play through it (even if you hate the camera and engine) to see what it's like. The only other CRPGs I can think of off the top of my head which have a system that is comparable to it are Age of Decadence and certain Geneforges.