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Would you still be willing to play a Silent Storm mod?

Diogo Ribeiro

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Messages
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Location
Lisboa, Portugal
kingcomrade said:
I'm pretty interested in it, I'm just perplexed why you want to stick with the original SS storyline, it's terribly stupid.

In an effort to try and save you from the abyss of ineptude that others have fallen, doing a follow up to the story of the original was one of possible scenarios. I said so in my first post, I even suggested a crossover with Hammer and Sickle. In short, I'm not doing it just yet; I'm coming up with several scenarios and will eventually decide over one.

And while I understand what you mean about "fixing" Panzerkleins, you're going to have to give us a better idea how you are going to make them fun to play with.

I'd think giving out a small list (check towards the end of the post) of possible improvements or changes possible to implement would have sufficed. If not for making them fun, at least more tolerable. Problem is that most people aren't willing to have Panzerkleins in the first place, so they're going to keep pissing all over any discussion that includes improving them.
 

Diogo Ribeiro

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Messages
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aweigh said:
Links please.

Nearly all your posts. The minute I brought up Panzerkleins you didn't talked about almost anything else. Nevermind that I said they wouldn't be the focus of the mod, all you kept doing was talking against them ad nauseum. Considering that there were various other subjects to discuss - subjects which you, like your partner, refused to address so you could continue to harp about Panzerkleins - your unwillingness to do so can only be ascribed to either trolling or an assumption you made that Panzerkleins were the only thing that was going to be featured in the mod, or the one that was going to be featured more proeminently. Otherwise you wouldn't decide to continue with your propaganda.

aweigh said:
Wee, pot: meet kettle. You're the one who keeps ranting with the personal attacks, long after everyone expressed their hatred of the Panzerklein's and SS's storyline.

When confronted with your claims that I was being antagonist without a reason, all I had to do was link to your first three posts on the thread: pointless, baseless trolling. We're still waiting for your excuse over that one.
 

suleo

Scholar
Joined
Mar 22, 2006
Messages
473
Role-Player said:
True, and hence why I agreed with suleo and Crichton. I'm trying to incorporate a more Hidden and Dangerousesque approach: players choose equipment before each campaign and are stuck with it - and anything else they find on missions - until they can return to base at the end of the campaign. It just seems more credible and natural to me.

This to me is a good approach, seeing as I liked H&D (hence I used it as an example). I am also perplexed, like others, as to why you want to stick to the storyline of SS and SSS which is, basically, retarded and for 5-year olds.

I am really interested in an H&D-style game but using the tactical turn-based engine of SS. But of course, that means NO panzerkleins, laser weapons or any other sci-fi junk. Just focus on special ops, like sabotaging heavy water plants, stealing documents, killing high-ranking generals, whatever. WW2 has ample material to draw from when it comes to special ops. Oh, and just for kicks, I'd like to see an evil (i.e. Axis) storyline as well.

Now as for tanks, frankly I don't think tanks fit into the setting of the game, because the scope of the tactical map is too small for tanks to be of any actual tactical use. They are probably going to be more of a liability (as it should be, tanks sucked in urban warfare and in close encounters with infantry in anything but an open field). H&D had tanks, but it also had a much larger playing field (e.g. the mission where you drive the half-truck trying to escape).

I think the best implementation of tank warfare in conjunction with infantry action was done in the combat mission series, but the maps there spanned several kilometers. Consequently, you can actually use some decent tactics concerning tanks (i.e positioning, overwatch, smoke etc). But combat mission focuses on companies and batallions, not just 5 dudes...

In squad-based games, tanks have always been a problem at least for me. X-Com had them but I rarely used them for anything else than expendable scouts. JA has them being static pillboxes, which makes sense as the maps in JA are about the size of the SS maps, but still, their use was pretty limited (plus, the player couldn't use them). All those design choices stem from the basic fact that tanks are just not suitable for the scope of these games.

Consequently, I think it's best if tanks are actually left OUT of squad-based games that focus on small maps. If you try to put them in and try to overcome their shortcomings in terms of urban warfare (but still try to have a heavily armored beast moving around blasting things), you end up with PKs. So it's not so much a matter of implementation, as it is a matter of messing up the tactical aspect of the game.
 

Diogo Ribeiro

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Daigoji_Gai said:
Role Player:
Now then, the panzercrap broke the game... but part of the reason I was interested in your posts Role player about this mod because I was wondering if you could adjust the movement/action cost tables for all units.

I really need to go, but I will do my best to put forth a legitimate argument why, at its core, SS had horribly implemented its turn based system. It did not become apparent until the panzercrap arrived, but it became moreso apparent playing through their follow-up to SS based on the russian supernatural film Nightwatch.

Sure, that'd be a great discussion and good feedback. I agree that the cost tables can be improved.
 

Diogo Ribeiro

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suleo said:
This to me is a good approach, seeing as I liked H&D (hence I used it as an example). I am also perplexed, like others, as to why you want to stick to the storyline of SS and SSS which is, basically, retarded and for 5-year olds.

...Doing a follow up to the storyline of Silent Storm and Sentinels was one POSSIBLE direction. I didn't said I was going to do it; I presented some material for discussion as that being one of the choices. I've gone over several scenarions here. You shouldn't go by what others say.


Great example of worthwile feedback. You have my sincere thanks :)

Regarding an Axis (or "opposing force", in the context of any force that would oppose the Allies) campaign, I would like to include one too as a means to present different perspectives, missions, and story. Of course, in such a campaign some missions would have to necessarily keep with the alternate timeline idea insofar as having the Axis 'win'. It's still manageable but I'd just like to point out that in the event of pursuing that direction, some historical accuracy would be lost in comparison to that of the Allies.

The issues you bring up regarding tanks are very good, and in a way were why I was considering the inclusion of Panzerkleins as they provided a similar opponent but under a more restrictive map area. It is true that something that large in smaller maps would provide daunting and even clunky to work with. Still, I think they may be used in other situations even if just as static mission objectives. Maybe one or two moving tanks can be used for a map of larger scope, even.

(e.g. the mission where you drive the half-truck trying to escape).

That mission and the final mission of leading the defector out of the airport caused so many sleepless nights :)
 
Self-Ejected

aweigh

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Messages
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Role-Player said:
Nearly all your posts. The minute I brought up Panzerkleins you didn't talked about almost anything else. Nevermind that I said they wouldn't be the focus of the mod, all you kept doing was talking against them ad nauseum. Considering that there were various other subjects to discuss - subjects which you, like your partner, refused to address so you could continue to harp about Panzerkleins - your unwillingness to do so can only be ascribed to either trolling or an assumption you made that Panzerkleins were the only thing that was going to be featured in the mod, or the one that was going to be featured more proeminently. Otherwise you wouldn't decide to continue with your propaganda.

My first three posts consisted of infantile Codex humor, nothing else. If you saw them as antagonizing then you can only blame your own paranoia. However, there is no explaining away your own antagonizing, which you began with personal attacks on anyone who disagreed with your mod ideas. That, and that alone, is the reason I keep posting. I could care less about Panzerkleins or your mod, but if you're going to keep spewing vitriol I won't let it go without comment.

No matter how well argumented your case, as long as you keep hiding behind ad-hominem remarks then it is worthless. If this bothers you, I already sent you a PM about it.

Oh, and:
Role-Player said:
I'd also like to point out that I expect Panzerkleins to very much be in it. I am not going to remove them because presumably "everyone" disliked them.

Role-Player said:
Sure. As I've said (too many times to the wrong people, unfortunately), their inclusion was a reflection of pursuing a storyline which still dealt with Thor's Hammer or any other faction getting a hold of their technology, but this isn't the only scenario possible so it's still possible they won't be in

Nice to see you finally listened to reason. It only took, oh, everyone else saying Panzerkleins were stupid, and Thor's Hammer was stupid, for you to see the light. Sure, you lose all credibility, but for me, it's:
6_22_bush_mission_banner.jpg


Have fun making your mod, I wish you the best of luck, but unless you're going to buy plane tickets then stop acting like a child and keep your ad-hominem attacks to yourself.

Everyone has made it perfectly clear they don't want Panzerkleins or a continuation of the game's storyline. It can only be your fault if you can't accept the fact that the premise you've outlined for your mod isn't completely palatable to its intended audience.

If you're going to bother responding further, please, surprise me and show me you're capable of stringing together a sentence without resorting to childish behavior.
 

suleo

Scholar
Joined
Mar 22, 2006
Messages
473
Role-Player said:
Regarding an Axis (or "opposing force", in the context of any force that would oppose the Allies) campaign, I would like to include one too as a means to present different perspectives, missions, and story. Of course, in such a campaign some missions would have to necessarily keep with the alternate timeline idea insofar as having the Axis 'win'. It's still manageable but I'd just like to point out that in the event of pursuing that direction, some historical accuracy would be lost in comparison to that of the Allies.

Frankly, I wouldn't mind losing historical accuracy in *that* context. In fact, I really enjoyed the games of old (like Secret Weapons of the Luftwaffe, from the days when lucasarts would produce things worth a damn), where it was quite possible for the Axis to win the war (not to mention fun, as they were in pretty bad shape, it being 1944 and all).

Apparently, at some point it became politically incorrect to allow the evil guys to win, so games haven't been doing alternative timelines since (Hearts of Iron being a notable exception).
 

Crichton

Prophet
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Jul 7, 2004
Messages
1,212
I don't know if you checked it but earlier I asked you if you saw any advantage of replacing Panzerkleins with actual tanks. Do you think there's some level of tactics that can be improved with standard tanks rather than with PKs (and possible improvements I've mentioned)?

From a tactical standpoint, I don't know that it'll make much difference. (Obviously people that just hate the star wars bullshit will appreciate it).

There are two considerations with tanks that really aren't present with TankSmalls.

1. WWII Tanks accelerate and decelerate very, very poorly. So in the context of a turn that's about 12 sec of real time, A tank can't really trade movement for firepower, it's either slowing down, speeding up or stationary and if it's moving at all, it's firepower is next to nothing (unless it's american and hence has gyrostabilization). This places a lot of emphasis on having your tank in place before the fight starts because if you have to keep moving it, it's still scary, but the gunner will have a hell of a time hitting something on so unstable a platform.

2. There's a huge difference between frontal, side, rear, top and bottom armor on a tank. Even light tanks (panzer I or II, sheridan) were invulnerable to any infantry anti-tank weapon from the front, but were in danger on the side. Medium tanks (T-34, Panzer III or IV, sherman) aren't likely to notice a panzerfaust or a bazooka unless it hits the rear, though something from the side or front might rattle the crew a little. Heavy (Panther, Stalin II) and Super Heavy (Tiger, Stalin IV) tanks will completely laugh off WWII infantry anti-tank weapons under any normal circumstances, but if the infantry can set up a glacius to expose the bottom armor, it just might work.

So WWII tanks have a combination of inelastic speed and a strong facing dependence, coupled with real firepower worries if they try to use their speed. It doesn't provide much in the way of tactical thinking because it's still just a tank cruising down the road, but it's better than nothing. However I have no idea about what the engine is capable of implementing, I don't remember any real vehicles in the game.

Edit: bottom armor,not rear armor
 

Diogo Ribeiro

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Messages
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Location
Lisboa, Portugal
aweigh said:
My first three posts consisted of infantile Codex humor, nothing else. If you saw them as antagonizing then you can only blame your own paranoia.

The issue was about how you were only making attacks against the possibility of Panzerkleins being in, not whatever else:

aweigh said:
Role-Player said:
When I talked about Panzerkleins some dolts immediately assumed that it would be PK combat from start to end, and that it would mean everything else that was good about the game was going to get canned.

Links please.

The three links I provided were the evidence you wanted of how that was all you kept talking about. Your following posts after those three, which I've quoted for similar reasons, are also largely about the same issue. It doesn't matter if you try to describe them as humorous or not, your posts about the subject matter were nearly always about your uhnealthy fixation about the Panzerklein issue wheter you care to admit it or not, and we're still left waiting for an explanation about why you kept sounding like a broken record and did not engage in the discussion of any other features.

However, there is no explaining away your own antagonizing, which you began with personal attacks on anyone who disagreed with your mod ideas. That, and that alone, is the reason I keep posting.

Bullshit argument from a bullshit liar, that's all there is to your posts. The only people being remotely insulted were you and bryce, and that was because of the unbearable level of stupidity you were dumping on this thread along with your own attacks, which are there for everyone to see. Of course, if I am lying, do provide with links of me investing in personal attacks against those I disagree with or those that disagree with me - other than you or him. Of course, if it's like any of your previous posts, we'll all be waiting a long time for any clarification.

No matter how well argumented your case, as long as you keep hiding behind ad-hominem remarks then it is worthless. If this bothers you, I already sent you a PM about it.

Ah yes, your brilliant PM:

aweigh said:
From: aweigh
To: Role-Player
Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 11:15 pm
Subject: Send the plane tickets on May 31st.

Here's my address:

Urb. Toa Alta Heights
Calle 2, F6
Toa Alta
P.R. 00953

Make sure they're valid for May 31st or later, as that is when my classes/work ends. (I work inside the campus). I didn't post this in the thread because I didn't want you to think I was joking; I am 100% serious. Here are my phone numbers:

Home: 787-730-4951
Cel: 787-241-5050

If someone in my family answers just say, "Esta Julio?". I am more than ready to take this to the final step. Hopefully, I'll see you on May/June. If you don't have the cash, let me know and we can work something out through PayPal. See you then.

_________________
Only multiple generations of inbreeding between the combined Codex bloodlines will produce Teh Chosen One.

This would reek of Internet Tough Guy Syndrome if it weren't so pathetically embarassing and revealing of just how much you're begging for attention of any kind.

Oh, and:
Role-Player said:
I'd also like to point out that I expect Panzerkleins to very much be in it. I am not going to remove them because presumably "everyone" disliked them.

Role-Player said:
Sure. As I've said (too many times to the wrong people, unfortunately), their inclusion was a reflection of pursuing a storyline which still dealt with Thor's Hammer or any other faction getting a hold of their technology, but this isn't the only scenario possible so it's still possible they won't be in

Nice to see you finally listened to reason. It only took, oh, everyone else saying Panzerkleins were stupid, and Thor's Hammer was stupid, for you to see the light.

And it's so amusing to see how your vendetta against Panzerkleins clouded your judgement to the point of just wasting away in this thread with ridiculous attacks and assumptions, and despite having been told dozens of times that the follow up to the original storyline and the inclusion of Panzerkleins were but one of possible scenarios, you still keep at it. If you weren't so determined to make a fool out of yourself, you could have found the posts where I indicated that scenario to be one possibility and the posts where I actually discuss alternate scenarios - which has been happening for like two or three pages now.

I may just recant when I claimed you're stupid. You might just be retarded instead.

Everyone has made it perfectly clear they don't want Panzerkleins or a continuation of the game's storyline. It can only be your fault if you can't accept the fact that the premise you've outlined for your mod isn't completely palatable to its intended audience.

Likewise it's only your fault for being beaten over the head for deciding to be a poster child for hysterical, bludgeoning stupid attitudes in a clear attempt to destabilize the thread. Sorry, but your posing doesn't fool me. Your attempt to sound educated falls flat after all the previous posts where you commited yourself to the basest levels of invective and stupidity just to attack a planned feature and myself; and for all the wrong reasons.

If you're going to bother responding further, please, surprise me and show me you're capable of stringing together a sentence without resorting to childish behavior.

How about you surprising me and finally catching up with times instead of repeating the same drivel over and over? Wait, screw that. You've made it patently clear you're not in any way serious about any of this, no matter how much you try to make it sound otherwise. Thank you for ruining my thread with your idiocy but despite your best efforts, your attitude only makes me feel more positive about the project.
 

Diogo Ribeiro

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suleo said:
Frankly, I wouldn't mind losing historical accuracy in *that* context. In fact, I really enjoyed the games of old (like Secret Weapons of the Luftwaffe, from the days when lucasarts would produce things worth a damn), where it was quite possible for the Axis to win the war (not to mention fun, as they were in pretty bad shape, it being 1944 and all).

Apparently, at some point it became politically incorrect to allow the evil guys to win, so games haven't been doing alternative timelines since (Hearts of Iron being a notable exception).

I agree, it's a shame more of that hasn't been done. The alternate timelines and subsequent scenarios are always fun, and from a gameplay point of view can greatly improve the overal experience.
 

Diogo Ribeiro

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Crichton said:
*snip*

So WWII tanks have a combination of inelastic speed and a strong facing dependence, coupled with real firepower worries if they try to use their speed. It doesn't provide much in the way of tactical thinking because it's still just a tank cruising down the road, but it's better than nothing. However I have no idea about what the engine is capable of implementing, I don't remember any real vehicles in the game.

Good point. As for vehicles, I only recall sidecars, trucks and cars similar to this. None of them were drivable, however characters could get on the passenger side of a sidecar and use its mounted gun.
 
Self-Ejected

aweigh

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I attacked the mod, you attacked the person. See the difference? Therefore, your argument is worthless.

PLANE TICKETS BITCH!
 

Diogo Ribeiro

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Messages
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Location
Lisboa, Portugal
Worthless... Yup, that describes you right there. Then again, that seems a byproduct of your inbred nature. All you third world country faggots should be shot and dumped in some common ditch. For real.
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
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Messages
28,035
Role-Player said:
Worthless... Yup, that describes you right there. Then again, that seems a byproduct of your inbred nature. All you third world country faggots should be shot and dumped in some common ditch. For real.
Was that really necessary, RP? I remember when you bitched at me for giving less than a warm welcome to some dumb noob who thought he was some kinda expert on DnD. So, what happened to you?
 

Diogo Ribeiro

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Messages
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Vault Dweller said:
Was that really necessary, RP? I remember when you bitched at me for giving less than a warm welcome to some dumb noob who thought he was some kinda expert on DnD. So, what happened to you?

No, it wasn't necessary. Neither was aweigh's stupidity. Then again, considering you know me well I find it surprising you took that post for real.
 

bryce777

Erudite
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Messages
4,225
Location
In my country the system operates YOU
Role-Player said:
Vault Dweller said:
Was that really necessary, RP? I remember when you bitched at me for giving less than a warm welcome to some dumb noob who thought he was some kinda expert on DnD. So, what happened to you?

No, it wasn't necessary. Neither was aweigh's stupidity. Then again, considering you know me well I find it surprising you took that post for real.

It's hard to tell with hysterical homo-sexual boys like yourself. Teh aids makes you crazy in the final stages.
 

Daigoji_Gai

Scholar
Joined
Mar 24, 2006
Messages
261
bryce777 said:
Role-Player said:
Vault Dweller said:
Was that really necessary, RP? I remember when you bitched at me for giving less than a warm welcome to some dumb noob who thought he was some kinda expert on DnD. So, what happened to you?

No, it wasn't necessary. Neither was aweigh's stupidity. Then again, considering you know me well I find it surprising you took that post for real.

It's hard to tell with hysterical homo-sexual boys like yourself. Teh aids makes you crazy in the final stages.

Sorry sir, I didn't forget about my promise to discuss my issues with the action cost tables and weapon balancing in respect to them.

Actually putting some thought into it so it would be worthy of your evisceration.
 

Daigoji_Gai

Scholar
Joined
Mar 24, 2006
Messages
261
Role-Player said:
Ah yes, your brilliant PM:

aweigh said:
From: aweigh
To: Role-Player
Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 11:15 pm
Subject: Send the plane tickets on May 31st.

Here's my address:

Urb. Toa Alta Heights
Calle 2, F6
Toa Alta
P.R. 00953

Make sure they're valid for May 31st or later, as that is when my classes/work ends. (I work inside the campus). I didn't post this in the thread because I didn't want you to think I was joking; I am 100% serious. Here are my phone numbers:

Home: 787-730-4951
Cel: 787-241-5050

If someone in my family answers just say, "Esta Julio?". I am more than ready to take this to the final step. Hopefully, I'll see you on May/June. If you don't have the cash, let me know and we can work something out through PayPal. See you then.

_________________
Only multiple generations of inbreeding between the combined Codex bloodlines will produce Teh Chosen One.

This would reek of Internet Tough Guy Syndrome if it weren't so pathetically embarassing and revealing of just how much you're begging for attention of any kind.

Hmm, I think I have yet to have my arse handed to me in this fashion. Are you sending him plane tickets? What have I done?

Heavenly father, forgive me, for I am a naive lamb amongst the vicious wolves.
 

Diogo Ribeiro

Erudite
Joined
Jun 23, 2003
Messages
5,706
Location
Lisboa, Portugal
Daigoji_Gai said:
Hmm, I think I have yet to have my arse handed to me in this fashion. Are you sending him plane tickets? What have I done?

I'm sending him my contempt, which is more than he deserved.

Heavenly father, forgive me, for I am a naive lamb amongst the vicious wolves.

It's all gone to hell. Might as well take advantage of it.
 

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