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Winter voices (new indie turn based rpg)

zeitgeist

Magister
Joined
Aug 12, 2010
Messages
1,444
waywardOne said:
to me it's an expensive beta until all the episodes necessary to complete it are available. graphics are compelling for now only because they're not typical, so in the end it will be this unfinished story that keeps me playing. right now, it could be the worst story ever just because of a terribad ending. no one would know until they've got X hours and $Y invested.
Isn't that the main principle behind episodic content, though? Once you get people hooked, they will find it much harder to resist buying new episodes, even if they don't like where the story is going, or they think game mechanics could use an overhaul etc - they will always have a feeling that their issues might be attended to in the next episode. And of course, once someone has three of five episodes of something, they feel as if they might as well get the last two, because without them, they'll feel as if the three episodes they bought are incomplete. A lot of people will, in this case, buy the last two even if they've stopped playing the game entirely because they don't like it enough.
 

SkeleTony

Augur
Joined
Aug 17, 2006
Messages
938
This looks like more Jap-faggotry, pre-generated character nonsense. I have zero interest in anymore "You play a young girl/boy named *something stupid* with a troubled past out to blah, blah, blah...". If I want to play an adventure game I will boot up Monkey Island or something.
 

waywardOne

Arcane
Joined
Aug 28, 2010
Messages
2,318
zeitgeist said:
Isn't that the main principle behind episodic content, though?

'tis, but the first two episodes have to be incredible for many people to keep going. i can think of several (recent) games that, had they been sold in pieces, i would never have gotten more than 25% in because (a) i never gave a shit about the story and (b) i never gave a shit about the characters. i wouldn't keep hoping the devs will eventually justify my purchase.
 

Flatlander

Liturgist
Joined
Aug 11, 2009
Messages
242
Location
Paradise Valley
PorkaMorka said:
asper said:
I for one do not like the art style. It looks like one of those throwaway clickfest casual games.
"it looks like a cheap flash game"
Looks like vector graphics (pre-rendered probably). I hate vector graphics, it _always_ ends up looking crappy.
 

Black Cat

Magister
Joined
Jun 1, 2009
Messages
1,997
Location
Skyrim .///.
SkeleTony said:
This looks like more Jap-faggotry, pre-generated character nonsense. I have zero interest in anymore "You play a young girl/boy named *something stupid* with a troubled past out to blah, blah, blah...". If I want to play an adventure game I will boot up Monkey Island or something.

thenamelessone_2.jpg


*runs*
 

Phelot

Arcane
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
17,908
Black Cat said:
SkeleTony said:
This looks like more Jap-faggotry, pre-generated character nonsense. I have zero interest in anymore "You play a young girl/boy named *something stupid* with a troubled past out to blah, blah, blah...". If I want to play an adventure game I will boot up Monkey Island or something.

thenamelessone_2.jpg


*runs*

Like he said, if he wants to play an adventure game...
 

adure

Liturgist
Joined
Jun 24, 2010
Messages
154
SkeleTony said:
This looks like more Jap-faggotry, pre-generated character nonsense. I have zero interest in anymore "You play a young girl/boy named *something stupid* with a troubled past out to blah, blah, blah...". If I want to play an adventure game I will boot up Monkey Island or something.

but guybrush has no stats! :retarded:
 
Joined
Nov 8, 2007
Messages
6,207
Location
The island of misfit mascots
zeitgeist said:
I'm not sure I fully understand the complaints about the pricetag - it costs about as much as games do nowadays, maybe a bit less. Are you really trying to say that indie games are automatically inferior to "real" games? With lower prices, do we also have lowered expectations? With no AAA studio behind it, are we conditioned to expect something absolutely inferior to a "real" game in every way, from art, game design, sound and writing, to marketing, support and price?

And when one of those elements somehow transcends the box we put it in even before playing, will the game receive unwarranted praise on all fronts?

Saying "35€ is too much for an indie game" sounds an awful lot like saying "35€ is too much for a bad game", which of course it is, because bad games ideally shouldn't be bought at all. A really really bad game shouldn't suddenly become worthy of spending 20+ hours of your time on, if you find out it costs only $1. Or should it?

Of course it's overpriced. It's almost 1/2 to 2/3 as expensive as Dragon Age, FO3 and Oblivion were when they were released (adjusted for inflation). And they were AAA games, so they MUST be better.

Actually I've got no idea at all whether this game is good or not - for all I know it might be a pile of shit. But the 'indies must cost less than AAA games' mentality just reeks of 'I secretly play and LOVE all of Bioware and Bethesda's games, and hate that gameplay-over-graphics turn-based indie crap aside from that one idealised perfect indie game I have in my head but which doesn't actually exist yet'.
 

Baron

Arcane
Joined
Jul 10, 2010
Messages
2,887
I like the pricing strategy, it oozes confidence. An initial 5€ investment to check out, and the only way you pay 35€ was if you loved parts 1 - 6. Plenty of other companies force you to pay full price for a game you loathed during the intro movie.

Anyway, even if it is priced the same as a AAA title, you can't expect an indie game to reach the same economies of scale. Plus it encourages Indie devs to produce niche titles where people pay a premium. Given all the complaints on the Codex about the state of mainstream games why would gamers here bitch about the price if they found a game that fit their niche? (-although I shudder to think what that would be.)
 

mondblut

Arcane
Joined
Aug 10, 2005
Messages
22,263
Location
Ingrija
Mortmal said:
100 or more skills to flee or surrender , french design at its finest

Good one :D

its sill not as expensive as some indies like dominion 3 at 54.95$, i hardly see anyone complaing about it.

Maybe that's because Dominions are proven as awesome, and their DLC (new races added in patches) come free?

Not interested in the "french design" as noted above though. Give me kicking asses or give me death.

Also,
SkeleTony said:
This looks like more Jap-faggotry, pre-generated character nonsense. I have zero interest in anymore "You play a young girl/boy named *something stupid* with a troubled past out to blah, blah, blah...". If I want to play an adventure game I will boot up Monkey Island or something.

this.
 

Melcar

Arcane
Joined
Oct 20, 2008
Messages
35,478
Location
Merida, again

Lumpy

Arcane
Joined
Sep 11, 2005
Messages
8,525
waywardOne said:
'tis, but the first two episodes have to be incredible for many people to keep going.
It's very easy even for incompetent writers to create a nice, interesting mystery, intriguing the audience to go on, even if the resolution is fucking stupid. See Lost for an example.
So this could easily be the plan here - make it look like it's a nice story in the first eps, with no reviewers knowing the whole story to call the scam, and then lead people on to buy all seven eps due to OCD.
 

Topher

Cipher
Joined
Dec 5, 2007
Messages
1,860
DramaticPopcorn said:
Topher said:
The developer just released some new screenshots. They're from the very beginning of the game and are supposed to show off combat situations but I'm not quite seeing that.

http://www.dpadnews.com/?p=2107
I don't know, maybe ther is something wrong with me, but damn this looks amateurish.

It's not just you. I loved the first screens they released but the new ones look boring.
 

Mortmal

Arcane
Joined
Jun 15, 2009
Messages
9,188
Topher said:
DramaticPopcorn said:
Topher said:
The developer just released some new screenshots. They're from the very beginning of the game and are supposed to show off combat situations but I'm not quite seeing that.

http://www.dpadnews.com/?p=2107
I don't know, maybe ther is something wrong with me, but damn this looks amateurish.

It's not just you. I loved the first screens they released but the new ones look boring.

The small little flames are obviously the opponents, they are refered as shadow of doubts, in the text window bottom left corner. Its true they diddnt put much work in those sprites, i dont think they are placeholder with the release so close sadly.
It wont cost much to check anyway, graphics dont make everything, i recently had fun with a game with only crude cube graphics .
 
Joined
Nov 8, 2007
Messages
6,207
Location
The island of misfit mascots
Lumpy said:
waywardOne said:
'tis, but the first two episodes have to be incredible for many people to keep going.
It's very easy even for incompetent writers to create a nice, interesting mystery, intriguing the audience to go on, even if the resolution is fucking stupid. See Lost for an example.
So this could easily be the plan here - make it look like it's a nice story in the first eps, with no reviewers knowing the whole story to call the scam, and then lead people on to buy all seven eps due to OCD.

Actually I'd hold up Lost as an example of how difficult it is. You've got a professional team, with the assistance of some of the better hollywood screenwriters for some of the beginning and ending parts of each series, and it's one of the most successful 'episodic serial over multiple series' ever sold on TV and....yet it's still pretty mediocre.

If they can't pull it off, and everyone else who has tried to keep that format going over multiple seasons has failed even worse (and usually much much worse), why would an indie game developer be expected to produce something 'easily'.

Ok, you might say it's the multiple seasons thing that makes it nigh-impossible. And that's definitely a big part of it - the whole concept of Lost is flawed in that serials have never ever worked well over multiple seasons. I'm excluding here show where each season is essentially it's own standalone serial, such as Dexter and Breaking Bad, where each season is largely self-contained.

And once you look instead at one-season serials and new-serial-each-season shows (Dexter, Dr Who, The Prisoner etc) things pick up massively. But that format is still considered 'risky' by tv standards - very few writing teams can do it well, and the flops vastly outweigh the benefits. To list some recent failures: Flashforward, Wolf Creek, Persons Unknown...none of those made it past their first season. And then there was the utter shite that hit our screens when Heroes tried to do serial past its first season.

Yes, the British have a much better track record. They've been doing serials for decades and have honed the method pretty well. Traditionally, British shows are written for 1-2 seasons ( I think its to balance out Dr Who, which I'm fairly certain is going to keep running, with the odd 10 year break, as long as Britain does), and knowing that in advance lets them give a serial a clear beginning, middle and end. But it's certainly not an 'easy' style to write - the British success is mainly down to their BBC-centered working model, where instead of having one set of writers (and actors for that matter) doing one show for 10 years, you have a handful of writing teams doing multiple shows which then end and the same team (same writers, production team, often the same actors) move on to a new project.


Serials are a trap for inexperienced writers, who tend to use the serial format in lieu of actually having a well-developed beginning and end of each episode and each arc, thinking 'I can wrap that end up, or address that issue later in the series'. Getting the pacing right for a serial format, where you've got to balance the internal pacing of each episode with the cross-series pacing, is fucking hard.

And audiences are VERY quick to turn off. Just take a count of all the serials that were greenlighted after the early success of Lost, Heroes and Battlestar Galactica - and see how few of them actually made it through to finishing the serial. Many of them didn't even get through the 1st season.
 

Topher

Cipher
Joined
Dec 5, 2007
Messages
1,860
Each episode of this game is being made at the same time. They are only staggering the releasing rate to be one episode every seven days. They could probably release it all at once.
 

J1M

Arcane
Joined
May 14, 2008
Messages
14,642
Has anyone tried this game?
 

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