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Underrail [PRE-RELEASE THREAD, GO TO NEW THREAD]
- Thread starter Styg
- Start date
villain of the story
Arcane
How will separation of movement and other actions work? What's your approach to the point costs? Eg. are you going for a gamist abstraction with minimal concern for time consistency or do you intend to nail down costs as they would in real-time and translating those into point costs that scale well with each other?
You can use movement points for movement only, action points for movement or anything else. Once you perform a hostile action, such as shooting or invoking a psi power you will instantly deplete all your movement points and won't be able to move even with action points. I might remove this restriction later depending on how well it plays out. It's primary intent is to prevent hide-shoot-hide and similar exploits.
My primary concern is to balance the turn based combat. Real time combat will be reserved for npc vs npc interaction only. As for the AP costs, in some areas it is closer to being proportional to it's RT time cost (such as AP required to use the weapons) while in some areas it's been more custom tuned to fit TBC better (abilities, psi); but no, I'm not planning to use some time-to-AP conversion function when determining the AP cost of an action.
Areas, Shadows, Stats
Been doing a lot of different stuff the previous week. Here's the highlights:
- I've created graphics for a new type of area. In contrast to the Lower Underrail stations which are large open areas, there's a vast network of narrow passageways around and below them. Around the active stations they are usually patrolled and safe, but the farther you stray the more dangerous they become.
- I've added blob shadows to characters.
- I've removed the Wisdom stat. It served no purpose anymore except for forcing the psi-based character to split stat points between it and Will. All psionic skills will now use Will stat instead, just as all science skills use Intelligence; and Persuasion skill will now use Intelligence.
- Redesigned the stat system somewhat too. Previously you could assign values between 5 and 15 for each stat (Strength, Dexterity, Agility...etc) at the character creation. The system had D&D like purchase aspect (or whatever you call it) where the higher the stat goes, the more expensive it is to increase it. The new system works much like the stat system in Fallout. Where you start with 5 points in each stat and have 5 additional points to spend, or more if you decrease some of the stats (no stat can go below 3). You'll still gain stat points as you advance levels, but it'll now be only on even levels. Basically I made it a bit more straightforward.
Been doing a lot of different stuff the previous week. Here's the highlights:
- I've created graphics for a new type of area. In contrast to the Lower Underrail stations which are large open areas, there's a vast network of narrow passageways around and below them. Around the active stations they are usually patrolled and safe, but the farther you stray the more dangerous they become.
- I've added blob shadows to characters.
- I've removed the Wisdom stat. It served no purpose anymore except for forcing the psi-based character to split stat points between it and Will. All psionic skills will now use Will stat instead, just as all science skills use Intelligence; and Persuasion skill will now use Intelligence.
- Redesigned the stat system somewhat too. Previously you could assign values between 5 and 15 for each stat (Strength, Dexterity, Agility...etc) at the character creation. The system had D&D like purchase aspect (or whatever you call it) where the higher the stat goes, the more expensive it is to increase it. The new system works much like the stat system in Fallout. Where you start with 5 points in each stat and have 5 additional points to spend, or more if you decrease some of the stats (no stat can go below 3). You'll still gain stat points as you advance levels, but it'll now be only on even levels. Basically I made it a bit more straightforward.
Continues to look good 
General Maxson
Arcane
Styg, I wish you good luck, and hope you finish this game. Don't give up, as this really looks great! 
I'll continue to follow it's development here, hopefully.
I'll continue to follow it's development here, hopefully.
I think the shading is off.
If you compare it to other objects on the screen, I'd expect it to look more like the one on the left of these two rocks I threw together.
Ok, thanks. Just wanted to make sure, but I actually got that complaint a few times before.
I doubt I'll be redoing them completely, but at some point I'll be fixing the shading to look less metallic for sure.
TB Combat Stealth
Last week I worked on more graphics for Lower Underrail areas.
I also added pistol and crossbow blueprints and some basic parts to be used to create "lower tier" weapons.
But most importantly I went back and worked out the remaining real-time to turn-based combat conversion stuff, including stealth. You will now properly detect stealthed characters during your turn as well as be detected.
So to explain in a bit more details: previously the detection checks were performed every 0.5 seconds against all the surrounding characters.They added or subtracted from your stealth buffer for that particular detecting character (your stealth value is being tracked against each individual NPC, it's not a global thing) depending on your stealth skill and their detection value (which is based on their level and perception). These mechanics have been retained for the real-time mode, and in turn-based mode this check is performed after every 10 action/movement points you spend, but the stealth buffer change that it causes is halved. This is because in turn-based mode while you are playing out your turn you are both detecting and being detected. So basically you are being detected both during your turn and your opponent's turn, unlike in real-time when everything is happening simultaneously; hence the halving of the stealth buffer change value.
So all that stuff that I explained in the original Stealth update way back still applies to the turn-based combat, but the detection checks are a bit more granular.
Since the character movement speed is reduced when in RT mode, it's movement points are reduced in TB mode.
The actual steath/detection levels still need tweaking for both RT and TB mode, though. Currently, you can unreasonably hard to detect with enough points in stealth even at very close distances and that's not the idea. I'll be fixing this at some point soon.
I also fixed other various problems with TB combat, so I can say that it is now pretty much fully functional with all the features that were present in the RT mode.
Last week I worked on more graphics for Lower Underrail areas.
I also added pistol and crossbow blueprints and some basic parts to be used to create "lower tier" weapons.
But most importantly I went back and worked out the remaining real-time to turn-based combat conversion stuff, including stealth. You will now properly detect stealthed characters during your turn as well as be detected.
So to explain in a bit more details: previously the detection checks were performed every 0.5 seconds against all the surrounding characters.They added or subtracted from your stealth buffer for that particular detecting character (your stealth value is being tracked against each individual NPC, it's not a global thing) depending on your stealth skill and their detection value (which is based on their level and perception). These mechanics have been retained for the real-time mode, and in turn-based mode this check is performed after every 10 action/movement points you spend, but the stealth buffer change that it causes is halved. This is because in turn-based mode while you are playing out your turn you are both detecting and being detected. So basically you are being detected both during your turn and your opponent's turn, unlike in real-time when everything is happening simultaneously; hence the halving of the stealth buffer change value.
So all that stuff that I explained in the original Stealth update way back still applies to the turn-based combat, but the detection checks are a bit more granular.
Since the character movement speed is reduced when in RT mode, it's movement points are reduced in TB mode.
The actual steath/detection levels still need tweaking for both RT and TB mode, though. Currently, you can unreasonably hard to detect with enough points in stealth even at very close distances and that's not the idea. I'll be fixing this at some point soon.
I also fixed other various problems with TB combat, so I can say that it is now pretty much fully functional with all the features that were present in the RT mode.
General Maxson
Arcane
TB Combat Stealth
Last week I worked on more graphics for Lower Underrail areas.
I also added pistol and crossbow blueprints and some basic parts to be used to create "lower tier" weapons.
But most importantly I went back and worked out the remaining real-time to turn-based combat conversion stuff, including stealth. You will now properly detect stealthed characters during your turn as well as be detected.
So to explain in a bit more details: previously the detection checks were performed every 0.5 seconds against all the surrounding characters.They added or subtracted from your stealth buffer for that particular detecting character (your stealth value is being tracked against each individual NPC, it's not a global thing) depending on your stealth skill and their detection value (which is based on their level and perception). These mechanics have been retained for the real-time mode, and in turn-based mode this check is performed after every 10 action/movement points you spend, but the stealth buffer change that it causes is halved. This is because in turn-based mode while you are playing out your turn you are both detecting and being detected. So basically you are being detected both during your turn and your opponent's turn, unlike in real-time when everything is happening simultaneously; hence the halving of the stealth buffer change value.
So all that stuff that I explained in the original Stealth update way back still applies to the turn-based combat, but the detection checks are a bit more granular.
Since the character movement speed is reduced when in RT mode, it's movement points are reduced in TB mode.
The actual steath/detection levels still need tweaking for both RT and TB mode, though. Currently, you can unreasonably hard to detect with enough points in stealth even at very close distances and that's not the idea. I'll be fixing this at some point soon.
I also fixed other various problems with TB combat, so I can say that it is now pretty much fully functional with all the features that were present in the RT mode.
Nice man, very nice!
- Joined
- Jan 9, 2011
- Messages
- 2,728
This continues to get better and better. Keep up the good work!
Ventilation
Most buildings in the Underrail will have a ventilation system you can access and use it to move around or hide from the enemies. It'll be a particularly good way to scout ahead, as I intend to implement a 'peek' action you'll be able to use from within the ventilation to see what's outside a particular ventilation opening before stepping out (have to implement context menu on objects first for this, though).
All this doesn't mean that ventilation ducts are the safest place in the game, however. There will often be nastier things than you hanging out there.
Currently any character can access the ventilation, but I'll be adding skill checks later on. There will probably be two ways in which you can open a ventilation shaft:
Most buildings in the Underrail will have a ventilation system you can access and use it to move around or hide from the enemies. It'll be a particularly good way to scout ahead, as I intend to implement a 'peek' action you'll be able to use from within the ventilation to see what's outside a particular ventilation opening before stepping out (have to implement context menu on objects first for this, though).
All this doesn't mean that ventilation ducts are the safest place in the game, however. There will often be nastier things than you hanging out there.
Currently any character can access the ventilation, but I'll be adding skill checks later on. There will probably be two ways in which you can open a ventilation shaft:
- have enough points in lockpick and use a special tool (will probably need to rename 'lockpick' skill into 'burglary' or some such)
- have enough points in strength and use a crowbar
Agreed. You can always add the animations later. Not really a priority.
- Joined
- Jan 9, 2011
- Messages
- 2,728
Nice idea! An access route for stealthy chars is always a nice touch.
curry
Arcane
This game looks better and better with every update.
I hope you don't forget sweet quests and character interaction though.
I hope you don't forget sweet quests and character interaction though.
General Maxson
Arcane
This game looks better and better with every update.
I hope you don't forget sweet quests and character interaction though.
Yes man, your game looks better and more interesting every time you show something. Also what curry said. Keep up the good work. I don't know why, but I like your graphic presentation very much. I wish all indies could have similar style of graphics. I guess it reminds me of good old isometric crpgs.
General Maxson
Arcane
curry
Arcane
Yes, there's definitely something to show if you're thinking about starting a Kickstarter
Thanks a lot, guys.
I have no intentions of going into crowd-funding in the near future, but I appreciate the support anyway.
My current focus is on releasing a well rounded playable demo. There should also be an updated gameplay video sometime soon showcasing the new areas and the gameplay changes I've been posting about.
I have no intentions of going into crowd-funding in the near future, but I appreciate the support anyway.
My current focus is on releasing a well rounded playable demo. There should also be an updated gameplay video sometime soon showcasing the new areas and the gameplay changes I've been posting about.
Security Measures
I'm almost done with the first big "indoor dungeon" I've been showing ventilation plans for earlier. Two levels done, one more to go.
It's going quite slowly right now because I'm also adding a number of features, as well as refining AI and adding more special abilities to enemies you can encounter so far.
As I've mentioned before I would, I've added security cameras. They have two purposes:
1. You can use see what's happening in all different corners of the area if you find the surveillance room
2. If you are in a hostile area (and couldn't take control of the security system) you should avoid the cameras themselves because if they detect you, they will be calling in reinforcements (System Shock style).
And in this particular area it'll summon sentry bots that are patrolling around the area. I think I made these a bit too powerful for the level you're supposed to encounter them and they are all but impossible to deal with without cheats currently. They have a lot of mechanical resistance, a fairly powerful main attack and two types of disabling attacks. I might be toning them down a bit, though they are not that many and once I introduce EMP grenades they will be easier to handle.
Personally, I think it would be fun to have an enemy you circumvent in the early game (by using ventilation ducts, stealth, distractions, etc) before you are powerful enough to deal with them, but we'll see.
In other news, I've reworked the melee and ranged hit chance calculations. The final hit chance is now displayed when you mouse the target as well.
I'm almost done with the first big "indoor dungeon" I've been showing ventilation plans for earlier. Two levels done, one more to go.
It's going quite slowly right now because I'm also adding a number of features, as well as refining AI and adding more special abilities to enemies you can encounter so far.
As I've mentioned before I would, I've added security cameras. They have two purposes:
1. You can use see what's happening in all different corners of the area if you find the surveillance room
2. If you are in a hostile area (and couldn't take control of the security system) you should avoid the cameras themselves because if they detect you, they will be calling in reinforcements (System Shock style).
And in this particular area it'll summon sentry bots that are patrolling around the area. I think I made these a bit too powerful for the level you're supposed to encounter them and they are all but impossible to deal with without cheats currently. They have a lot of mechanical resistance, a fairly powerful main attack and two types of disabling attacks. I might be toning them down a bit, though they are not that many and once I introduce EMP grenades they will be easier to handle.
Personally, I think it would be fun to have an enemy you circumvent in the early game (by using ventilation ducts, stealth, distractions, etc) before you are powerful enough to deal with them, but we'll see.
In other news, I've reworked the melee and ranged hit chance calculations. The final hit chance is now displayed when you mouse the target as well.
General Maxson
Arcane
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