The PS5 and Xbox 2 thread - it's happening

[Ezeekiel]

>100fps with its <10ms frametime is such a non-concern ,

Such a non-concern and yet Sony bothered with a 120fps mode.

and will be, because ray tracing won't be used on its own but complement screen space effects, ss reflections etc. (even damned SSAO isn't surpassed ), and screen space is computed in linear time vs. resolution , latter always getting the upper hand vs. frametime, so you will see screen space computed at resolution approaching native ( cyberpunk's SSR is already 1 example) , INSTEAD of frametime going down.

Your thoughts here don't really change anything about Sony's push for a 120fps mode, or am I misunderstanding you?

 

[tritosine2k]

>100fps with its <10ms frametime is such a non-concern ,

Such a non-concern and yet Sony bothered with a 120fps mode.

and will be, because ray tracing won't be used on its own but complement screen space effects, ss reflections etc. (even damned SSAO isn't surpassed ), and screen space is computed in linear time vs. resolution , latter always getting the upper hand vs. frametime, so you will see screen space computed at resolution approaching native ( cyberpunk's SSR is already 1 example) , INSTEAD of frametime going down.

Your thoughts here don't really change anything about Sony's push for a 120fps mode, or am I misunderstanding you?

Push is inconceivable nowdays, you can look at VR for what toll it takes on gfx complexity to sustain >75hz with high pixel count ( latter means high screen space load in ordinary game) , and something has to give. (They won't compromise on their screen space stuff.) Most likely 1440p upscaled to 4k at 30fps, 1080p at 60fps just like now, but finally first nice examples of async compute.

 

[DalekFlay]

I have an RTX card and have tried out ray tracing in 4-5 games now and I would take a higher framerate every time. Even if I could have 60fps with ray tracing, I would take 120fps without it. There are brief moments where ray tracing makes a real difference like Control's floor to ceiling office walls, but it's rare and overall makes for little visual difference when actively playing the game. It's a very good thing that consoles are allowing users to choose between modes like a PC version would.

 

[tritosine2k]

I have an RTX card and have tried out ray tracing in 4-5 games now and I would take a higher framerate every time. Even if I could have 60fps with ray tracing, I would take 120fps without it. There are brief moments where ray tracing makes a real difference like Control's floor to ceiling office walls, but it's rare and overall makes for little visual difference when actively playing the game. It's a very good thing that consoles are allowing users to choose between modes like a PC version would.

Inconsequential stuff ,and RTX is a screen space fix in practice, with 1 sample per pixel - 1SPP (apparently it can also fix TAA , but that's expensive, and DLSS sells cards https://hexus.net/tech/news/graphics/120656-nvidia-adds-ray-tracing-tech-temporal-anti-aliasing-taa/ ). Until now screen space itself was less than 1SPP ( turning it up to 0.75 made Fallout4 ENB MUCH nicer), so , if fixed screen space will also run at 1SPP in future = goodbye to short frametime enjoyed by PC at end of console gen.

 

[tritosine2k]

"What?"
http://c0de517e.blogspot.com/2020/12/hallucinations-re-rendering-of.html

see rendering pipeline of cyberpunk. EVERYTHING there has temporal component , supposed to converge over multiple frames (or irl, simply can't ).
So you think,this kind of trailing/smearing pipeline at 120fps , has anything to do with True 120fps ?

What happens if you defeat temporal component ? You need more of instantaneous samples instead of temporal, that's what.

 

[Gerrard]

First get proper shadows like games with deferred shading had 10 years ago before you start masturbating over MUH REFLECTIONS you fucking cucks.

 

[tritosine2k]

Well, the point is, with "temporal" , "converging" (?) stuff you won't get 120 TRUE frames anyhow , but 120 "converging"(?) SUBframes, AND don't even get equivalent of fullHD resolution at an instant .

 

[Kem0sabe]

We’re excited to announce the first assortment of backward compatible titles that will support FPS Boost – available beginning today – are Far Cry 4, New Super Lucky’s Tale, Sniper Elite 4, UFC 4, and Watch Dogs 2. We chose this initial collection of titles not only because they are popular among fans, but to highlight several different ways that FPS Boost can improve your experience. For example, New Super Lucky’s Tale can now run up to 120 frames per second (fps) and UFC 4 delivers improved framerate performance specifically on Xbox Series S and can now run at 60fps.

This is just the beginning. We will announce and release more titles featuring FPS Boost soon, as well roll out new menu icons and system settings in an upcoming system update. Starting this Spring, you can go into the “Manage Game” section for any title, where you’ll be presented with a new “Compatibility Options” button that will allow you to toggle FPS Boost (as well as Auto HDR) on or off. There will also be a new indicator informing you when a game is running with FPS Boost whenever you hit the Xbox Button on your controller. You decide how you want to play your favorite games, whether in its original form or with FPS Boost

https://news.xbox.com/en-us/2021/02/17/making-backward-compatible-games-even-better-with-fps-boost/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dxJFCgkNws

 

[IDtenT]

The best shadows I ever saw was in Severance Blade of Darkness.

 

[Zeriel]

I have an RTX card and have tried out ray tracing in 4-5 games now and I would take a higher framerate every time. Even if I could have 60fps with ray tracing, I would take 120fps without it. There are brief moments where ray tracing makes a real difference like Control's floor to ceiling office walls, but it's rare and overall makes for little visual difference when actively playing the game. It's a very good thing that consoles are allowing users to choose between modes like a PC version would.

I think the idea is eventually you will be able to get that feature with no performance cost, or little performance cost. That was the marketing promise of the 3000 series, vastly improved RTX. I don't have one so can't comment on whether it delivered, but that's the end goal. Now the issue here is whether Nvidia releases parallel cards without RTX cores that provide similar or better non-RTX performance at lower cost--see the 1660 for example. If they continue to do that, then consumers will be able to ask: "Why am I paying for RTX?" but if RTX is just baked in as an assumption and you eventually get the benefit with no performance cost because everything has RTX cores, well, that's okay.

 

[tritosine2k]

Afaict they say the more RTX features you enable the more the INDIVIDUAL cost is amortized inbetween because the same acceleration structure is used for each.

.Now the issue here is whether Nvidia releases parallel cards without RTX cores that provide similar or better non-RTX performance

They are killing off GTX evidently because "direct storage" will be RTX feature by the looks of it.
Also "direct storage" & co can make realtime ray tracing non starter because precise precomputed ray tracing results can be transferred.
Anyway I'd count on R for Radeon ending up ahead with consumer chip because of that onchip memory stuff seems cool as hell (as in, no wasted heat) and fits this new direct SSD paradigm like a glove.

 

[anvi]

There needs to be another graphics card developer to force prices down.

 

[Melcar]

There needs to be another graphics card developer to force prices down.

Will it? I mean, do you really think someone like Intel (probably the only one that could even come close to releasing a competing GPU) will decide to undercut AMD and nvidia in a price war? I think they would just price their cards competitively enough and not force things.

 

[Wirdschowerdn]

There needs to be another graphics card developer to force prices down.

This might help a little bit.

https://videocardz.com/newz/nvidia-...rtx-3060-driver-will-limit-mining-performance

 

[Melcar]

There needs to be another graphics card developer to force prices down.

This might help a little bit.

https://videocardz.com/newz/nvidia-...rtx-3060-driver-will-limit-mining-performance

Haven't they tried that before? Such a card would have 0 resell value, which will turn miners off (most of them look to offload their old cards on the used market).
Now the driver idea seems plausible. Has been done before to segment markets and product lines. Wonder why the fuck it took them this long to think about that?

 

[Wirdschowerdn]

Why would you buy a used miner card in the first place?

Anyway, Nvidia can't afford to alienate gamers for too long. It's still their bread & butter business, so a hard decision to segment the market (temporarily?) had to be made.

 

[Melcar]

People still buy former mining cards. Yeah, you are often advised not to and the more informed users stay away from such cards, but the cards still end up in the used market and they have buyers.

 

[Ezekiel]

I haven't been in a movie mood lately but Total Recall is at the top of my list when I am. Shame it's a flawed disc.

Looks like it's safe to import the Italian version by Eagle, though. It doesn't have these blurry 3 mbps dips in HDR10.

https://www.screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/11191/picture:0

The sound is apparently better too.

 

[soulburner]

There needs to be another graphics card developer to force prices down.

This might help a little bit.

https://videocardz.com/newz/nvidia-...rtx-3060-driver-will-limit-mining-performance

This won't help anything. If what is said in this video is true (edit: and a follow up here), and this guy is pretty credible with all kinds of leaks and shit, the truly professional miners don't care about the drivers. They write their own (due to the complexity of them, they probably just modify the official releases, but who knows). They do not need to buy an Asus or Sapphire, they buy GPU chips directly from Nvidia and use them on their own boards. Besides, what's stopping an amateur crypto digger from using an older driver? The problem is things like Ethereum are built from the ground up with the intent of running on a GPU. If a GPU is capable of being, well, a GPU, it is capable of mining - if you somehow cripple the computational capabilities suitable for mining, you also cripple the GPUs capabilities for gaming.

Also, I do not think there is space for a new player on the GPU market. With all the complexities of designing a GPU from scratch aside, where would they produce them? At TSMC? At Samsung? They are barely capable of fulfilling their orders. Overreliance on just a few fabs in Asia seemed like a problem to me a long time ago, just waiting to happen.

edit: fun fact - Intel is trying to enter the GPU market now and where will they build their GPUs? At TSMC. We're fucked.

 

[aweigh]

NVIDIA never does anything for the benefit of the customer.

Whatever "anti-mining" method they are advertising right now is guaranteed something that will only be of benefit to NVIDIA, and of little-to-none to the customer, regardless of how it may seem right now.

 

[soulburner]

NVIDIA never does anything for the benefit of the customer.

Whatever "anti-mining" method they are advertising right now is guaranteed something that will only be of benefit to NVIDIA, and of little-to-none to the customer, regardless of how it may seem right now.

Exactly right. This is true about any corporation. For example, right now AMD seems to have the most dedicated fan base, because they offer good products for a slightly more reasonable price than the competition (although Ryzen 5000 and RX 6000 prices don't seem competitive that much anymore) and react to consumers' outrage (like 400 series chipsets not supporting Zen 3 - after people spoke, AMD changed their mind and suddenly a supposed hardware limitation became an easily solvable software one). But once their profits reach a certain point, the company will stop caring about people and focus solely on the numbers. Today Nvidia can give the middle finger to PC gamers, because they get the most profit from AI and other CUDA based calculations. They do not care who buys Ampere as long as it keeps selling. As much as the employees themselves may be PC gaming enthusiasts, the corporation exists for one reason only: profit.

This all comes down to one thing: do not ever be a fan of a single brand. Always buy things that offer the best price to performance ratio. Never buy "COMPANY_NAME" just because you "like" them. They don't like you. They don't even know you.

 

[Dexter]

https://www.gematsu.com/2020/12/sir...nt-japan-studio-establishes-bokeh-game-studio

Keiichiro Toyama, creator of the Silent Hill, Siren, and Gravity Rush series, left Sony Interactive Entertainment Japan Studio and established the independent Bokeh Game Studio on August 13.

Kazunobu Sato and Junya Okura, who have worked alongside Toyama for many years, also left Japan Studio and joined Toyama as core members of the new studio. Toyama is the chief executive officer (CEO), while Sato is the chief operating officer (COO) and Okura the chief technology officer (CTO).

“Having parted with Sony Interactive Entertainment which I have been with for a very long time, we have independently established a new development studio.

“Looking back at my inner self, nothing has really changed at all since day one when I set foot into this industry. Firstly I want players to enjoy games built from ideas with originality, and secondly I want to enjoy making those games—this is all there was to it. Thankfully it was possible for myself and team to develop and release many games. However the gaming industry has rapidly grown globally and is still drastically changing all the time. Day by day, living in these times, I have felt the need for a substantial change to pursue my own ambitions. This is why I have decided to become independent.

“Thankfully I am blessed with a team of colleagues who share the same ambitions as myself, which is why I am able to start this new chapter with a new game studio where we can form our original ideas. We are already under development for our first work, though obviously will need some time before release. We ask for your patience and to look forward to future announcements.”

https://www.gematsu.com/2020/12/ter...e-sony-interactive-entertainment-japan-studio

Teruyuki Toriyama—who worked as a producer on the Demon’s Souls remake, Bloodborne, Soul Sacrifice, and more—will leave Sony Interactive Entertainment Japan Studio at the end of December, he announced.

“I will be leaving Sony Interactive Entertainment Worldwide Studios Japan Studio at the end of December,” Toriyama said. “To all the users who have supported Japan Studio so far, thank you so much! I will continue to take on the challenge of creating new game IPs in my new company, and I ask for your continued support.”

Toriyama’s departure follows the departure of Keiichiro Toyama, Kazunobu Sato, and Junya Okura, who left to establish Bokeh Game Studio.

https://www.gematsu.com/2021/02/blo...rtainment-japan-studio-at-the-end-of-february

Masaaki Yamagiwa, who was a producer on Bloodborne, Deracine, and Tokyo Jungle, will leave Sony Interactive Entertainment Japan Studio at the end of February, he announced on Twitter.

“I’m leaving Sony Interactive Entertainment at the end of this month,” Yamagiwa said. “I’m going to continue working hard on creating games. Many thanks to everyone!”

Yamagiwa did not further detail his future plans.

The developer’s leave is the latest in a series of high-profile departures for Sony Interactive Entertainment Japan Studio. Teruyuki Toriyama, who was also a producer on Bloodborne, as well as the Demon’s Souls remake, Soul Sacrifice, and others, left Sony Interactive Entertainment Japan Studio back in December. And Silent Hill, Siren, and Gravity Rush creator Keiichiro Toyama left alongside colleagues Kazunobu Sato and Junya Okura earlier that month to form the independent Bokeh Game Studio.

 

[Dexter]

https://www.dualshockers.com/sony-reportedly-censoring-violent-depictions-in-games/

Sony Reportedly Censoring Violent Depictions in Games
By Md Armughanuddin
February 22, 2021 12:41 PM EST
Sony isn't allowing video games to depict dismemberment of human characters.
Sony is censoring violent depictions in video games according to a recent report. The degree of violence in video games has been a controversial aspect for quite a while now. It is often debated that games should have lower degrees of violence to make them accessible to a larger audience. Despite that, a number of developers have depicted some mature and dark tones in games.

According to a report on GameSpark Japan, Sony is asking developers to remove violent depictions in video games. This comes from the Japanese development studio Cyberconnect2’s President and CEO Hiroshi Matsuyama who states that Sony compelled the developers to make changes in the Naruto Ultimate series. One of the characters in the game, Minato Namikaze, was missing an arm in the original story. However, in the final game, his arm was present to comply with Sony’s policies.

He further mentions that the reason for that was that loss of limbs in characters that have a human appearance was not allowed by Sony Interactive Entertainment and not prohibited by CERO as such. CERO is the organization responsible for video game ratings in Japan. In the story, Minato is not technically a human considering that he was resurrected. However, considering that the character had a human appearance, it wasn’t allowed.

Quite notable of all is the fact that SIE has allowed such depictions in certain games. Matsuyama mentions that Dragon Ball Z Kakarot has a sequence in which Nappa’s arm was dismembered. Surprisingly, this wasn’t omitted from the game because there is a difference in impressions between the two games. What this difference isn’t mentioned, but it’s likely the fact that the Naruto series has a more realistic tone. Whether this policy is specific to Japanese video games isn’t clear.

Sony’s stance on this matter is quite surprising, considering the fact that some of its games have set a benchmark for mature tones in video games. For instance, The Last of Us 2 had several such brutal and gory moments which despite receiving some criticism was widely acclaimed as well. With Sony itself taking such bold directions in video games itself, it’ll be interesting to see what Sony’s justification for such a stance is.

 

[Konjad]

Sony always allowed only limited violence in gam...

One of the characters in the game, Minato Namikaze, was missing an arm in the original story. However, in the final game, his arm was present to comply with Sony’s policies.

 

[Dedicated_Dark]