The Authentic RPG and its Tragic Demise

[DraQ]

Guys, I'm confused - is HL2 an RPG or not?
I know that I play out the role of Gordon Freeman in it.

 

[Hobo Elf]

What the fuck do you negroids mean when you say that an RPG is a game with stats? Every game has stats. You have to have stats. Does anyone want to be more specific with what you mean by stats?

Hey you guys ever played this game? When you pick up these gems, you get level-ups and your strength, defense, speed, etc. get bonuses, best RPG ever!

When you collect heart upgrades in Zelda your HP goes up by 4! Better weapons do more damage! I'm still waiting to see what you faggots mean specifically by stats. Do you mean every NPC has to have stats? Every action you do needs to be stat based?

 

[Lockkaliber]

For gameplay to be molded around those stats to a higher degree, unlike in Zelda where player skill is a major factor, or something like that? idk lol.

 

[Awor Szurkrarz]

Shut the fuck up.

Having the majority/mainstream believing in the contrary is not going to falter my confidence in my definition of RPG, and neither is an overabundance of games being marketed as more concentrated forms of Role-Playing than they actually are.

The world declines on the back of people like you. Request that your registration here be reversed and take to avoiding using your feeble mind in the presence of other humans in the future.

Someone needs a hug.

Sad to say it, but nothing you just said matters. The world is going where it's going, and there's nothing you can do to stop it, or more accurately: nothing YOU are doing is stopping it.

As for the rest of your "post," don't bother. I don't glean my sense of self worth from internet fuckwads.

Sup drog?

 

[SuperNintendo Chalmers]

Damn, now I see where we've been going wrong all this time. He's right, kids; everyone who disagrees with the Great Consensus should just sit down, shut up and accept whatever shit they're fed, because that is what the collective have deemed acceptable. Shut down the forum now, please, we see where we've been going wrong all this time. Everyone get in line to preorder Ass Defect 3 Collector's Edition; it's what real RPGs are made of.

Also, why are you here?

Well it's a video game. You may not like where the genre is right now, but you're not doing anything about it other than complaining. The guy who wrote the original article is an idiot, and a shit stirrer, and so are you. I choose to sit back and enjoy my entertainment as it's presented, or not, because I don't feel it's worth my time and energy to "change" it, especially when there is so much more going on that requires attention.

Yes, I generally accept the consensus when it comes to what's "fun" in video games and other forms of entertainment. If I don't find it fun, I don't play it, and I leave it at that. I certainly don't troll internet forums and masturbate myself to sleep with obscure indie "masterpieces" from 1987.

You can, though.

 

[DraQ]

So, is HL2 an RPG or not? I still haven't received a definitive answer.




Also:

 

[Clockwork Knight]

That's nice and all, but what's fun and what's not has fuck all to do with a game being a rpg or not. Of course, the discussion is boring as fuck and tends to attract aspies, but fuck it.

See, gaming is a hobby. I think that gardening is boring, but I won't go "lol, who cares, plants grow with rain anyways" because people enjoy spending time and effort on it as a hobby. This "oh, but there are more important things to worry about" approach is retarded because people need entertainment and fun. We're not in the stone age anymore, we're allowed to worry about superficial shit.

Looks like you're just another person that can't accept there is a tiny handful of people in some site that don't think your favrit gaems are the best thing ever.

No Chalmers, you are the butthurts. Ironic, isn't it? Considering you came here to mock people for that very reason, and all.

*sound of ignore button being clicked*

Feels good, man.

*Disclaimer: The Ignore button wasn't actually clicked*

 

[Silellak]

So, is HL2 an RPG or not? I still haven't received a definitive answer.

Half Life 2 is whatever you want it to be, DraQ. No one can tell you what it is or isn't. Is it an RPG? It is if you want it to be, and if you believe hard enough. That is the magic of gaming.

 

[Admiral jimbob]

Damn, now I see where we've been going wrong all this time. He's right, kids; everyone who disagrees with the Great Consensus should just sit down, shut up and accept whatever shit they're fed, because that is what the collective have deemed acceptable. Shut down the forum now, please, we see where we've been going wrong all this time. Everyone get in line to preorder Ass Defect 3 Collector's Edition; it's what real RPGs are made of.

Also, why are you here?

Well it's a video game. You may not like where the genre is right now, but you're not doing anything about it other than complaining. The guy who wrote the original article is an idiot, and a shit stirrer, and so are you. I choose to sit back and enjoy my entertainment as it's presented, or not, because I don't feel it's worth my time and energy to "change" it, especially when there is so much more going on that requires attention.

Yes, I generally accept the consensus when it comes to what's "fun" in video games and other forms of entertainment. If I don't find it fun, I don't play it, and I leave it at that. I certainly don't troll internet forums and masturbate myself to sleep with obscure indie "masterpieces" from 1987.

You can, though.

Let's break this down.

You may not like where the genre is right now, but you're not doing anything about it other than complaining

I buy and fund indies, provide feedback on them, and provide LPs and general information to let people know that there are RPGs out there that aren't sub-par third-person shooters with gay sex options. I've made plenty of converts. The indie scene has never been healthier, and it's due to people like us bitching and moaning that people like Vault Dweller and the guy who made Knights of the Chalice have launched into their own indie careers, making the kind of games we actually want. Supply and demand, mate. If they didn't know we wanted it, they wouldn't make it, and now they're doing so.

The guy who wrote the original article is an idiot, and a shit stirrer, and so are you.

I'm an idiot for finding the wrong things fun and asking for a bit less mindlessness in my entertainment, and I'm a shit stirrer for talking about it on a forum where everyone is pretty much on the same page as me. Unlike the guy who just wandered in and started demanding that we all love Mass Effect. He's not a shit stirrer at all. Check.

I choose to sit back and enjoy my entertainment as it's presented, or not, because I don't feel it's worth my time and energy to "change" it, especially when there is so much more going on that requires attention.

Fuck yeah man, apathy is king. It's not at all possible that I'm capable of time management and devote my time equally to entertainment and actually important pursuits. Why does leisure time mean you need to completely switch your brain off and become a passive moron accepting whatever you're given? Are you in the habit of running up to people reading Dostoyevsky in public, tearing the book out of their hands screaming that they're morons for not exclusively reading books from Oprah's book club recommendations and forcing Twilight into their hands instead?

If I don't find it fun, I don't play it, and I leave it at that. I certainly don't troll internet forums

No, apparently you don't. You join forums for people who find it fun and troll those instead. That's a far more worthy and intelligent pursuit, right? Nothing like them and their futile rage.

and masturbate myself to sleep with obscure indie "masterpieces" from 1987.

Haha, I know, right? Who enjoys games from 1987? They... like... don't have bloom or anything! It can't possibly be that people have different taste to you, they must just be doing it to pretend to be superior!
That's all it fucking comes down to. We have different taste to you. Is it so hard to believe that some people have a hobby that they enjoy, they enjoy discussing it with like-minded people, that they want games to be like they used to be, that they've been told directly by the industry that they're never going to be catered to again, and that they're justifiably angry at that?

But carry on. Futilely raging at people for liking the wrong things is nothing at all like what we do, which is futilely rage at people for liking the wrong things.

 

[Admiral jimbob]

Disclaimer: I know I'm falling for a Drog, I'm in a really fucking boring lecture about the free movement of goods in EU law. Don't judge me.

 

[Xor]

I don't think anyone really gives a shit about the definition of RPG. What we discuss here is generally what we want to see in a game and how modern releases don't have those elements. Since many posters here have different ideas about what they want to see in a game, we end up arguing about that. Then Drog registers another alt and trolls us. My ignore list gains a new name and the cycle continues.

 

[Hobo Elf]

I just think the biggest bullshit is when people come over and say "old RPGs are shit, they need to be changed to be more action paced like CoD". Why? You clearly aren't the target audiance for RPGs, so why try to change the genre? Why cannot you just go and enjoy one of the genres that are tailored for you and leave the people who DO enjoy RPGs play their damn RPGs? Oh, but no. Instead every single genre has to be homogenised to appease to you. The people who enjoyed RPGs for being RPGs are left out without a genre to call their own anymore.

It's like when the settlers came to america and drove out the indians from their homeland.

But it's also pissing me off how devs are trying to shoe horn "RPG influences" (level ups and item vendors make an RPG!) into every single shitty FPS, car game, RTS, flight sim, whatever they are making these days. This bleeding of genres into one mixed up soup needs to stop.

 

[J_C]

Instead every single genre has to be homogenised to appease to you. The people who enjoyed RPGs for being RPGs are left out without a genre to call their own anymore.

This.

The most annoying thing for me is that almost every RPG in the market wants to be an action oriented mess. How beautiful would it be, if games like Fallout 1-2, PST, Vampire etc were still made. Bioware could make a dozen Dragon Age and Mass Effect, and Bethesda could release a Fallout 3 type game every year, I wouldn't care, because I got the game I wanted. Why can't the two genres co-exist in the market?

 

[Fowyr]

First potemkin, now SuperNintendo Chalmers. Awaiting new moron.

You're saying I'm a moron because I'm saying some games you think are RPG arent? You can have fun with Mass Effect only if people agree that it is an RPG?

I've just defined a set of simple rules to say what is and isn't an RPG, I'm not defining which game is better! And these rules say that Fallout is an RPG and Mario isn't, so unless someone comes up with a game that is clearly an RPG for whatever reasons but wouldn't be according to my rules, I'm happy with it.

Your rules are faulty. First are indeed good rule, second and third - optional. The glorious Pool of Radiance trumps on your feeble definition. But clearly you are trolling, this level of stupidity can be present only in Best Thread Ever.

 

[Fowyr]

I choose to sit back and enjoy my entertainment as it's presented

Enjoy your Dragon Age 3 Collectors Edition with prepackaged anal vibrator.

But it's also pissing me off how devs are trying to shoe horn "RPG influences" (level ups and item vendors make an RPG!) into every single shitty FPS

Ironically, as far I know, it was D.W. Bradley who first used it in the Cybermage.

 

[Hobo Elf]

Hexen 2 did it as well, but 2 years later. The thing is that it was done relatively well and it made sense. Also, it wasn't the norm back then. Now every game needs to have RPG influences to give the game an illusion of depth and enhance the longevity of the game with superficial grinding.

 

[OminousBlueDot]

Hobo, I'll give it a shot, eh? Why not.

Stats, in an RPG, are derivitive of a particular character.

Lets take HP. In Diabio (I'm bullshiting my way through this because I don't recall the actual formula and am too lazy and/or stupid to dig it up, nyeh!)
health_Diablo = baseClassHealth * Endurence + (Strength / 3);
Health changes throughout the game, based on attributes applied to Endurence and Strength.

Whereas in Mario, health is fixed. You can only have so many hearts and there are no attributes alterable by the player to change this value. You either have it or you dont.

The same reason Half-Life 2 is not an RPG while System Shock 2 could be considered one: derivitive stats.


Ugh. Now I must go shower.

*Butthurt regarding Semantics: The usage of definitions is it allows us to understand us better and determine the perspective inwhich each of views something. The whole point is to be descriminatory. You think dungeon crawlers are RPG, with or without narrative, that's fine by me. For me, personally an RPG has the narrative that a dungeon crawler might lack. It's all personal. All of this, on this thread, is people expressing their opinion. I'm not trying to change your views, explain mine (to both you and myself). I assume it's the same for the rest of you.

 

[Fowyr]

I want game compared to Fallout, I want Aethra Chronicles 2, I want spiritual sequel of Exile 3, not this dumbed down Avernum shit, I want Darksun 3, I want another dozen of Goldboxes, I want new Arcanum and PST, I want something hard and unfair as Dark Heart of Uukrul, I want game with exploring like in the M&M, I want (quasi-)historical RPG better than Darklands, I want sandbox game like Daggerfall. Gladly, new roguelikes are still produced.

BUT DUE TO FAGGOTS LIKE YOU ALL I GET IS THE FUCKNG DATE SIMS AND UNHOLY BASTARD OFFSPRINGS OF HALF LIFE AND DIABLO, GAMES FOR RETARDS BY RETARDS.

 

[OminousBlueDot]

GAH! I AM FOOL. NOW YOU KNOW THE SHAME THAT I'VE BROUGHT WITH A DOUBLE POST.

HL2, to me is not an RPG -- see above.
(might as well fight the good fight with my post-in-err)

 

[Sceptic]

Guys, I'm confused - is HL2 an RPG or not?

Best RPG since Mass Effect 2.

Also, Hexen is 3 RPG's in one! You play the roles of either...

Fuck can't remember their names

But anyway you get a choice of which of 3 unique characters to role-play! Clearly CRPG of the decade.

Hexen II ruined it by diluting the RPG elements with useless third person shooter elements like XP, levels and so on.

 

[Grunker]

I don't get the hate on the writer of the article. Maybe he is not as an RPG expert as most Codexers, but at least he is not happy with the way RPGs are going nowadays. You can't say the same about most of the gaming journalists.

What, so my enemy's enemy is my friend, even though he's got retarded opinions like "Skyrim is the only REAL RPG left!" and "I know it's weird that I make points about tabletop when I haven't played it, but I did LARP in WoW!"

Fuck that shit. The man kindda floats around some good points, but ultimately you see his ignorance when he reveals he's just a LARPer sad to see LARPing go.

 

[OminousBlueDot]

I don't get the hate on the writer of the article. Maybe he is not as an RPG expert as most Codexers, but at least he is not happy with the way RPGs are going nowadays. You can't say the same about most of the gaming journalists.

What, so my enemy's enemy is my friend, even though he's got retarded opinions like "Skyrim is the only REAL RPG left!" and "I know it's weird that I make points about tabletop when I haven't played it, but I did LARP in WoW!"

Fuck that shit. The man kindda floats around some good points, but ultimately you see his ignorance when he reveals he's just a LARPer sad to see LARPing go.

Perhaps we should start providing scope in our discussions.

Stephen_K.RPG.describe() == Skyim, Oblivion, Fallout 3, Dragon Age

I win this thread again, admit it.

 

[J_C]

I don't get the hate on the writer of the article. Maybe he is not as an RPG expert as most Codexers, but at least he is not happy with the way RPGs are going nowadays. You can't say the same about most of the gaming journalists.

What, so my enemy's enemy is my friend, even though he's got retarded opinions like "Skyrim is the only REAL RPG left!" and "I know it's weird that I make points about tabletop when I haven't played it, but I did LARP in WoW!"

Fuck that shit. The man kindda floats around some good points, but ultimately you see his ignorance when he reveals he's just a LARPer sad to see LARPing go.

I'm not saying that he is a friend, I just don't think he deserved that much hate, at least he made some good points (even if he made some bad ones too). Nowadays most of the journalist says that Mass Effect is the way to go in terms of RPGs, so if someone tries to argue with this, it is good in my book.

 

[J_C]

Perhaps we should start providing scope in our discussions.

Stephen_K.RPG.describe() == Skyim, Oblivion, Fallout 3, Dragon Age

Yes, that part was bullshit in the article.

 

[Grunker]

Oh shi-

Didn't even notice the thread was fucking 6 pages

@J_C: I can sympathize with your point, but consider the alternative for a bit. Instead of critizing the weak points in an article, should we instead read the article, weigh the amount of retardation, and then utilize a "harshness of criticism" appropriate to that level of retardedness?

In all honesty, I consider it more honest to call him an ass with ears. We might agree on his overall point "OMG-DECLINE-OF-RPG", but when the very foundation on how he reaches that conclusion is so different from ours, it doesn't matter.

It's like if PC GAMER came to the conclusion that RPGs were declining because they stopped using cover and regenerating health and started using medkits and healing spells instead. Sure, we would agree on the overall premise of a declining industry, but I'm pretty sure that wouldn't hold us back from calling PC GAMER a bunch of retards.