Skyrim is worse than Oblivion in every way

[RK47]

fuck it. downloading estrus.

 

[DraQ]

Well, they do make some strides in that direction - NPCs do react to a lot more stuff in Skyrim, there are some provisions for NPCs deaths and so on.

There indeed were some nice touches in Skyrim. E.g. this one women in Whiterun that wants a mammoth tusk died in one game (don't even know why) and I got a letter stating that she left me some money or something. I then went to Whiterun to check how far Bethesda had fleshed that out and there indeed even was her coffin in the halls of the dead.

What I really liked is that game has enough generic (as in not based on particular quests or unique triggers) reactivity for ripples to propagate.
For example: you steal something from someone, they find out and send a bunch of thugs after you. The thugs find you while you're in a city where you have helped some NPC. Said NPC jumps to your defence and gets ran through by one of the thugs.
You have a causal chain that was in no way scripted as a whole nor particularly predictable, just player behaviour, some random events and scripted triggers interacting, triggering scripted triggers and so on.

I guess I'm a bit butthurt about the Toddspeak we get before release about such stuff that then turns out to be 80% bullshit.

Then again, Toddspeak. I expected 99.9% bullshit based on Oblivion, so 80% bullshit was a massive unexpected incline as it meant 20% of actual cool stuff I expected to be bullshit instead.

While nothing special in terms of depth, they do provide a good way to deliver some filler. It's not that the whole game consists of radiant quests.
But e.g. faction quests benefit from it - standard thiefing stuff in the Thieves guild or the Kill/rough up NPC in the Companions questline. Why not?
I think there are also hybrid quests, i.e. normal quests with some radiant component that can lead to some randomization. Haven't replayed it often enough to notice, however (still less than 7 times...).

This and yeah, some scripted, one shot quests have somewhat randomized location.

Of course one could argue that you usually don't play TES games for the great quests. They are nice games for hiking, dungeon delving and such stuff (at least with some mods), but not exactly deep (well, Morrowind had nice lore and a cool world design, both gave some depth at least).

Morrowind had pretty meh quests, but they were often interlinked in interesting manner, offered decent amount of freedom in regards to solution and often hid a lot of extra depth - ciphertexts, implied motivations, this sort of stuff.

Didn't like some part of Requiem. They removed the nord Battle cry racial ability - and also changed the Signs bonuses. I made a trip to the Tower to get that Expert lock ability - only to discover it was changed to Carry Capacity.
I better read the documentation.

So you wanted to bypass the need to actually invest in lockpicking perks in order to actually be able to open stuff and the game didn't allow you to?
How terribly sad.

Not sure wtf is up with Requiem. Maybe it's bugged, after tweaking it to deal 1.00 damage taken and dealt - there's always a random mage with a one-hit kill fireball around or fucking Draughts that just dragonshout me to death. Literally just FUS RO DAH'ed in the face - BAM, dead.

It's not bugged.

Spell damage scales with spellcaster's skill and perks too in Requiem - quite dramatically to let wizards be actually powerful. Draugr's FUSRODAH shouldn't be very damaging, but if it makes you fall a long way, then bam dead. Draugr also have other shouts including nasty ice damage one thatv tends to end you.

Anyway, instead of tweaking damage and complaining that the game no longer scales to your level with Requiem, how about picking your fights and trying more diverse tactics than running up to enemy and stabbing their face?

 

[Manjuice Nutella]

I felt that actually quite a few of Oblivion's quests were honestly decent, with nice scripted encounters that weren't all about killing. DB questline, local recommendations in Mages Guild, some investigations (like corrupt imperial commander), that creepy Lovecraft village, more unique daedric quests; even little shit like looking for a painting or talking with someone otherwise.

In terms of similarly designed quests, Skyrim has, what; Windhelm murders, Markarth Forsworn intrigue, Raven Rock's Hlaalu conspiracy? I honestly can't remember anything else. The rest were all about killing and any other dialogue

 

[RK47]

So you wanted to bypass the need to actually invest in lockpicking perks in order to actually be able to open stuff and the game didn't allow you to?
How terribly sad.

I'm sorry, you actually thought using an alternative solution when the original method is sealed is a sad way to play the game? And here I am actually trying to approach a problem from another angle in a sandbox game that preaches the free-roaming style of exploration. Isn't the point of sandbox RPG is giving the player flexible options to approach an obstacle. Not - find this KEY, JUST THIS KEY, nothing else will do. Go play Quest for Glory and explore some options, hardcore-man.

Here's another example how I TRIED to approach the issue of locks being unpickable - in a quest where I have to find out a missing son in Whiterun, I had to break into the house and find a journal indicating where the son is imprisoned. I went past the novice front door. Yet the office is EXPERT lock. I can't do this, but I notice one of the Battle-born sons is in the house, alone. I thought, 'Hey, why not?' I shot him on the head, took his 'key' - yet disappointingly, it didn't work again. The key was just for the front door. This office door is obviously MEANT TO BE PICKED AND ONLY PICKED by Bethesda devs yet with the Requiem mod in effect, it's inaccessible to anyone without the expertise in lockpicking.

Was it a sad way of approaching a sandbox quest or am I trying to figure out alternate solutions when it really doesn't exist? Hey maybe the quest log should just spell it out 'PICK LOCK OF OFFICE. FIND BOOK. READ IT. TAKE BACK TO MAN.' instead of wasting the player time and giving no reward, DraQ. I'm sure it'll improve the whole gameplay experience.

I already accepted I couldn't pick it and moved on to find another way, therefore I remembered the Tower sign being my favorite option for early robbery in Morrowind - no dice. Too bad, wasted a trip to Dawnstar. BTW, I did find another spell 'Dance Lockpicks' later that uses Alteration magic when exploring another dungeon - but that's still not high enough to open Expert locks.

Anyway, instead of tweaking damage and complaining that the game no longer scales to your level with Requiem, how about picking your fights and trying more diverse tactics than running up to enemy and stabbing their face?

I picked my fights. I avoided tombs till I can actually get a build together to beat the undead easily - but meh, Light armor - dual swords / bow seems ok vs other types. Just that the random projectile - can and will fuck you over. One Frost Atronach was nigh unstoppable when I encountered it. I just ran past a bandit fort - watching it club those idiots to death. Then I made it to Riften, the whole 4 gate guards and khajit merchants tried to bring it down, to no avail. It's just one slow grind where the guards die/flee - return, while the immortal cats kneel down, catch a breath and return to beating it around while the Atronach is putting his icicle inside an immortal cart horse' anus.

That cart horse is the savior of Riften.

 

[RK47]

local recommendations in Mages Guild

You're fucking kidding, right?

 

[DalekFlay]

Lockpicking is an easy call out as a useless perk tree. The rest are much more relevant, however.

 

[IDtenT]

Everything is shit. The only redeemable thing about Skyrim is Loverslab for lulz.

 

[Commissar Draco]

Civil war was nice if short and giving no consequence to the rest of the game; atleast this time it was not Good Romans VS Bad Snowniggers or vice verso. (Both Sides were pricks but had believable motives to fight)

 

[RK47]

Lockpicking is an easy call out as a useless perk tree. The rest are much more relevant, however.

Yes, much like pickpocket and speechcraft. They shd just merge Speechcraft - Lockpicking - Pickpocket together into Streetwise skill. When 90% of the content is combat - I fail to see how these perks are actually worth plunging points into - especially when the extreme difficulty mods are installed. Unless you limit yourself to thieves break in missions .

I do appreciate Requiem's character creation having lower baseline skills though. It makes you stop and think what you want to make instead of classic Skyrim where whom you pick is just for the racial and not about the starting skills.

 

[Turisas]

So Requiem or SkyRe - which is better and why?

 

[RK47]

I'm gonna give SkyRe a try later maybe. I see Requiem as 'people who want excessive challenge' kind of mod.
Its default setup of Player taking 300% damage while dealing 25% is honestly wtf. That's just way out of touch with fun.

 

[IDtenT]

So Requiem or SkyRe - which is better and why?

Combatfag/mechanicfag mods can't fix this broken game design. That said Requiem seems to be the preference, but afaik it's not being updated in any foreseeable future.

 

[Manjuice Nutella]

local recommendations in Mages Guild

You're fucking kidding, right?

Well, some were a waste of time, but that one in Anvil, or Cheydinhal, or Leyawiin weren't terrible.

For example, take that Chorrol one. You could resolve it in two ways with different rewards and it was done mostly via dialogue and in city itself. Whether it was good or not doesn't matter; it's different from slamming a radiant dungeon as a fix for everything,

 

[Turisas]

I'm gonna give SkyRe a try later maybe. I see Requiem as 'people who want excessive challenge' kind of mod.
Its default setup of Player taking 300% damage while dealing 25% is honestly wtf. That's just way out of touch with fun.

Aren't those values adjustable at all? Not a huge fan of it either usually, but since the AI is so braindead and mods can't do much to fix that, what else is there.

 

[Manjuice Nutella]

So Requiem or SkyRe - which is better and why?

SkyRe is more flexible, less hermetic and a bit faster-paced than Requiem. It can also be no less lethal and tough than Requiem.

For example it's more friendly for other mods, as it even comes with a tool that i.e. adapts custom items to SkyRe's values and variables and you can combine it more freely with i.e. Apocalypse spell package.

It's also completely finished, while Requiem is i.e. not updated for Dragonborn compatibility.

 

[Manjuice Nutella]

 

[DraQ]

local recommendations in Mages Guild

You're fucking kidding, right?

Well, some were a waste of time, but that one in Anvil, or Cheydinhal, or Leyawiin weren't terrible.

For example, take that Chorrol one. You could resolve it in two ways with different rewards and it was done mostly via dialogue and in city itself. Whether it was good or not doesn't matter; it's different from slamming a radiant dungeon as a fix for everything,

Actually Chorrol one is particularly insulting because it involves either getting that book to that bitch to get the spell, then having to steal it back for the guild, or getting the book to the guild, then stealing it back for that bitch for the spell.

The very essence of non-choice.

As for DB quests, they may be not that bad on individual basis, but even those hang in the vacuum without relation to the world as a whole, and doing DB quests require you to put with a bunch of unprofessional edgy retards and then being given an idiot ball.

Essential good because NPCs get killed by random shit

There is a feature in game that allows NPCs to behave like essentials unless they are personally killed by player, so there is no point to actual essential NPCs

HURR unrelated

Fix'd.

So you wanted to bypass the need to actually invest in lockpicking perks in order to actually be able to open stuff and the game didn't allow you to?
How terribly sad.

I'm sorry, you actually thought using an alternative solution when the original method is sealed is a sad way to play the game? And here I am actually trying to approach a problem from another angle in a sandbox game that preaches the free-roaming style of exploration. Isn't the point of sandbox RPG is giving the player flexible options to approach an obstacle. Not - find this KEY, JUST THIS KEY, nothing else will do. Go play Quest for Glory and explore some options, hardcore-man.

Here's another example how I TRIED to approach the issue of locks being unpickable - in a quest where I have to find out a missing son in Whiterun, I had to break into the house and find a journal indicating where the son is imprisoned. I went past the novice front door. Yet the office is EXPERT lock. I can't do this, but I notice one of the Battle-born sons is in the house, alone. I thought, 'Hey, why not?' I shot him on the head, took his 'key' - yet disappointingly, it didn't work again. The key was just for the front door. This office door is obviously MEANT TO BE PICKED AND ONLY PICKED by Bethesda devs yet with the Requiem mod in effect, it's inaccessible to anyone without the expertise in lockpicking.

Was it a sad way of approaching a sandbox quest or am I trying to figure out alternate solutions when it really doesn't exist? Hey maybe the quest log should just spell it out 'PICK LOCK OF OFFICE. FIND BOOK. READ IT. TAKE BACK TO MAN.' instead of wasting the player time and giving no reward, DraQ. I'm sure it'll improve the whole gameplay experience.

DURRRRR

Fixed.

True, you can't find the key for the inner door (unless Requiem adds it and given Requiem's philosophy it wouldn't be unlikely), you can however:

Spoiler

1. Blackmail certain person into bringing you the journal (requires some NPC observation and pickpocket skill).
2. Persuade some other person into spilling the beans.
3. Get yourself a follower of questionable morals (to not have them outright refuse picking someone's lock) and have them pick the lock for you.

That's three solutions available even in vanilla Skyrim that don't include picking the internal lock.

With Requiem you can also bash most doors and containers (excluding any with master level lock and sturdy stuff like metal doors), although expert level doors will be demanding. Requiem also adds Animate Lockpick spell that may prove helpful.

Finally, I don't think game should be obliged to make all side content accessible to the player regardless of build, so even if those several alternative solutions didn't exist it would be disappointing but not exactly damning (although in such case game should have the decency to wrap up that content as failed after a while).

Anyway, there is nothing worse than criticism from ignorance - if that's your thing then go back to playing with specular poo and tentacles.

I picked my fights. I avoided tombs till I can actually get a build together to beat the undead easily - but meh, Light armor - dual swords / bow seems ok vs other types. Just that the random projectile - can and will fuck you over.

So don't expose yourself to random projectiles?

How about using some cover, sneaking, using guerilla tactics to thin enemy numbers or employing a summonned distraction?

One Frost Atronach was nigh unstoppable when I encountered it.

I wonder why? I mean what can be easier than stabbing a walking glacier the size of a horse dead with a piece of iron designed for much smaller, softer and leakier meatbags.

 

[deuxhero]

There's a problem in that NPC archers are inhumanly accurate, even at the highest inaccuracy settings (nice AI codeing Bethesda!) which kind of kills the point of light armor allowing you to dodge..

 

[Bahamut]

There's a problem in that NPC archers are inhumanly accurate, even at the highest inaccuracy settings (nice AI codeing Bethesda!).

Its common problem, creatures/NPC that use ranged attacks just enter TARGET ENGAGED mode and throw crap at you at straight line, same for dragons i could never dodge the fire shout at open fields because it always was locked on perfecty at me

 

[DraQ]

There's a problem in that NPC archers are inhumanly accurate, even at the highest inaccuracy settings (nice AI codeing Bethesda!) which kind of kills the point of light armor allowing you to dodge..

Effectiveness of dodging is not a function of enemy accuracy.

Dodging relies on moving out of the way of projectile that would hit you.
If you're already doing it the only difference inaccurate enemies can make is allowing you to dodge into a projectile that would have missed you.

The problem with Requiem is that almost all projectiles are 2x faster, but that only makes dodging non-cheesy.

 

[RK47]

Hm, managed to get Requiem to work with Rape Mods. Now losing has its rewards.

Isn't that right, Aria?

Mmmmmmhmmmmhmmmhmmhghh

Yes... suck it down... you lost.. You deserve all that humiliation.

 

[DraQ]

You're beyond all help.

 

[RK47]

Eh, it wasn't so bad. It's another alternative way of killing bandits for sure. Was making my way to a bounty camp - and suddenly this mountain lion jumped me. I popped stam and health pot, running, trying to get distance - when suddenly the bandit mage cast cold spell on me slowing me down. One arrow later, I was disabled, raped, and taken prisoner. The lion killed one of them. Somehow, I managed to convince the master to undo the handcuffs after a blow job. The shackles will slow my footwork- but hey, dual Bound Swords on the back, killed the enslaver, grab my bow, sniped unsuspecting bandit mage and then pincushion the leader with poison laced arrows.

All in all, alternative solutions.

Last night was fun.

 

[IDtenT]

There's a problem in that NPC archers are inhumanly accurate, even at the highest inaccuracy settings (nice AI codeing Bethesda!) which kind of kills the point of light armor allowing you to dodge..

Player skill based games never change.

 

[deuxhero]

There's a problem in that NPC archers are inhumanly accurate, even at the highest inaccuracy settings (nice AI codeing Bethesda!) which kind of kills the point of light armor allowing you to dodge..

Effectiveness of dodging is not a function of enemy accuracy.

Dodging relies on moving out of the way of projectile that would hit you.
If you're already doing it the only difference inaccurate enemies can make is allowing you to dodge into a projectile that would have missed you.

The problem with Requiem is that almost all projectiles are 2x faster, but that only makes dodging non-cheesy.

The inaccuracy is based on degrees it can deviate, but at close range, what matters is an enemy's crazy tracking.