Incline Shoot'em up goodness (review and discuss)

[Great Deceiver]

Another excellent video. This guy is a bro.

 

[Matador]

Another great video. This guy put a lot of effort and love.

 

[Great Deceiver]

I really liked the mention of Knightmare on the MSX. It was a big game for me growing up, even if I didn't own an MSX myself, most of my friends had one and I played that game a LOT back in the day. Killer soundtrack and it influenced some very cool games that came out years later, like Undeadline which I covered previously in this thread.

Konami was a beast on the MSX in general.

 

[Matador]

I really liked the mention of Knightmare on the MSX. It was a big game for me growing up, even if I didn't own an MSX myself, most of my friends had one and I played that game a LOT back in the day. Killer soundtrack and it influenced some very cool games that came out years later, like Undeadline which I covered previously in this thread.

Konami was a beast on the MSX in general.

That game looked very interesting and cool music showcased in the video.

Also was laughing a lot in the Parodius games reviews. Those looked hilarious.

 

[Matador]

I have continued grinding Dodonpachi. What an absolute blast. My game of the year.

I am now able to beat up to stage 3 without dying some times, with C-Laser.

One of the most satisfying things was routing my way the first half of the 3rd stage with a very high rate and no bombs and seeing in youtube a survival 1-ALL with the same approach after I implemented it.

For the green spamming ships with big ship bullet cancel I needed some help from the video, but I optimized the route just pushing all the way to the top of the screen for one of the big cancels with 100% survival rate.

Also made very efffective No-Bomb survival route for the red mothership before the boss, being extremely aggressive with the laser and positioning. This game rewards controlled recklessness in some parts where the enemies spam chaotic patterns if you don´t kill them instantly.

I think I'm gonna start trying a bit stage 4.

In Ketsui I find the patterns faster and more elaborated, but less chaotic and more manipulable. Different kinds of difficulty.

 

[Morenatsu.]

DOJ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> shitsui

 

[Morenatsu.]

To double post, what is it that people love about Ketsui? It's a game I only play whenever someone mentions it. When it was new to me I did play it a bit more, but I got sick of it immediately and forgot about it. I like games that let you actually fly around fast and shoot things. Ketshitty is all about being forced to engage with stupid shitty annoying patterns in a particular way while you sit around and slowly crawl through bullets. Just bomb that shit lmaoooo. Admittedly the game feels actually kind of fun with Type B and never locking on, but that's not very effective so it still sucks.

 

[Great Deceiver]

Ketshitty is Most Cave games are all about being forced to engage with stupid shitty annoying patterns in a particular way while you sit around and slowly crawl through bullets.

 

[Morenatsu.]

Ketshitty is Most Cave games are all about being forced to engage with stupid shitty annoying patterns in a particular way while you sit around and slowly crawl through bullets.

It's true, CAVE sucks. I liked Esprade and Guwange and Donpachi and Ibara and Muchi Muchi Pork and Dai-Ou-Jou and Mushihimesama (in original mode) and Daifukkatsu (in power mode) and Deathsmiles (in loli mode), but other than that GAYVE can suck my massive Raizing COCK!!

 

[Matador]

I like both styles of shmup. For the old school, the ones I liked the most are Slap Fight and V-Five, both by Toaplan.

I have to play more horizontal ones.

 

[Great Deceiver]

I like both styles of shmup. For the old school, the ones I liked the most are Slap Fight and V-Five, both by Toaplan.

I have to play more horizontal ones.

If you enjoy Slap Fight, make sure to check out the Mega Drive version (Slap Fight MD).

In addition to being a great port of the original (which wasn't trivial back in the day), there's an awesome arrange mode with a kickass OST by Yuzo Koshiro (both remixed versions of original stages and entirely new tunes for the new mode). I love Slap Fight, grew up playing it at the arcades, and the MD version has become my favourite.

The original OST is very reminiscent of Gradius, which is fitting.



Re: Danmaku/classic style - I tend to prefer older style games, with navigational challenges and more aimed bullets instead of the mosquito style popularized by Cave, but I still enjoy many Cave games regardless, especially Mushi Futari, DDP DOJ and Guwange.

But I do think that, in general, later games went too far in the masturbatory pixel dodging direction or degenerate scoring gimmicks - i.e. Espgaluda, a game that for me is all flash and no substance - in addition to being easy and boring.

For me a good "limit" would be something like Batsugun most of the time. It depends on mood. Raizing strikes a good balance between patterns, aimed bullets and cool levels. I'm not a big fan of Garegga, though, I think rank goes way too far in that game. I'm more of a Mahou guy.

 

[Matador]

I like both styles of shmup. For the old school, the ones I liked the most are Slap Fight and V-Five, both by Toaplan.

I have to play more horizontal ones.

If you enjoy Slap Fight, make sure to check out the Mega Drive version (Slap Fight MD).

In addition to being a great port of the original (which wasn't trivial back in the day), there's an awesome arrange mode with a kickass OST by Yuzo Koshiro (both remixed versions of original stages and entirely new tunes for the new mode). I love Slap Fight, grew up playing it at the arcades, and the MD version has become my favourite.

The original OST is very reminiscent of Gradius, which is fitting.



Re: Danmaku/classic style - I tend to prefer older style games, with navigational challenges and more aimed bullets instead of the mosquito style popularized by Cave, but I still enjoy many Cave games regardless, especially Mushi Futari, DDP DOJ and Guwange.

But I do think that, in general, later games went too far in the masturbatory pixel dodging direction or degenerate scoring gimmicks - i.e. Espgaluda, a game that for me is all flash and no substance - in addition to being easy and boring.

For me a good "limit" would be something like Batsugun most of the time. It depends on mood. Raizing strikes a good balance between patterns, aimed bullets and cool levels. I'm not a big fan of Garegga, though, I think rank goes way too far in that game. I'm more of a Mahou guy.

From Raizing I liked Sorcer Strike the most but didn´t play too much. Battle Garegga is ugly for me and can´t see the bullets, so I'm not gonna play it anytime soon.

I tried a lot of games until I decided to stick with Dodonpachi.

 

[Morenatsu.]

I'm disgusted by the Codex's lack of love for Garegga. Y'all're fags.

 

[Matador]

I'm disgusted by the Codex's lack of love for Garegga. Y'all're fags.

I can't see the bullets.

 

[Morenatsu.]

I'm disgusted by the Codex's lack of love for Garegga. Y'all're fags.

I can't see the bullets.

What a shame, I expected better from a carrot.

 

[Insect Hordes]

Get the PS4 version of Garegga because they ain't never gonna put it on PC the right way. That and the Ketsui M2 deal are the gourmet expensive stuff ’cause when I drink it, I wanna taste it. Yer gonna pay 35 bucks and grumble the whole fucking way.

 

[Matador]

https://store.steampowered.com/app/2025840/Gunvein/

 

[Great Deceiver]

Get the PS4 version of Garegga because they ain't never gonna put it on PC the right way. That and the Ketsui M2 deal are the gourmet expensive stuff ’cause when I drink it, I wanna taste it. Yer gonna pay 35 bucks and grumble the whole fucking way.

Garegga is pretty well emulated on the PC and you can get next-frame response with Retroarch/runahead. The ShotTriggers M2 port is awesome, as are all the others on that same line, but it's not like some other games that are badly emulated (like Ketsui where the sound is botched).

I'm all for supporting M2, though. Does anyone know of an easy way to buy the Mahou PS4 port if you're not in Japan?

 

[Great Deceiver]

I'm disgusted by the Codex's lack of love for Garegga. Y'all're fags.

I can't see the bullets.

I also have a real problem seeing the bullets. The PS4 M2 port has an option to change the colours of certain enemy bullets, which is very welcome.

 

[Matador]

I'm disgusted by the Codex's lack of love for Garegga. Y'all're fags.

I can't see the bullets.

I also have a real problem seeing the bullets. The PS4 M2 port has an option to change the colours of certain enemy bullets, which is very welcome.

That's great. Maybe some day I buy the PS4 Garegga then.

I purchased PS4 Ketsui and was impressed with all the content and quality. I was glad to support such good work, but I tend to play in retroarch in the PC anyway. Would double dip if released on steam.

What is exactly the sound problem with Ketsui port?

 

[Morenatsu.]

it's not like some other games that are badly emulated (like Ketsui where the sound is botched).

You were saying that about DOJ too. I know MAME says the emulation is imperfect, but footage from the PCB barely sounds better? All CAVE games past a certain point have terrible audio.

 

[Great Deceiver]

I haven't played the PCBs of Ketsui or DOJ, but I find it hard to believe the audio quality would be worse than earlier games like ESP Ra De, DDP or Guwange...

The MAME audio driver for later Cave games sounds very tinny to me, especially compared to the audio from some of the excellent console ports by Arika or Cave themselves, like Galuda and DOJ on PS2, or Mushi on the 360.

But this is just my personal experience and, as such, anecdotal.

There is a physical release for some of these ShotTriggers releases, I'd like to buy them but they're pretty expensive, especially in my location.

 

[Lutte]

I haven't played the PCBs of Ketsui or DOJ, but I find it hard to believe the audio quality would be worse than earlier games like ESP Ra De, DDP or Guwange...

The MAME audio driver for later Cave games sounds very tinny to me, especially compared to the audio from some of the excellent console ports by Arika or Cave themselves, like Galuda and DOJ on PS2, or Mushi on the 360.

But this is just my personal experience and, as such, anecdotal.

There is a physical release for some of these ShotTriggers releases, I'd like to buy them but they're pretty expensive, especially in my location.

No, the PCB really is that bad. CAVE was one of the cheapest arcade developer when it came to the components they picked for their boards. The xbox 360 ports are all strictly superior to the arcade games if you don't care about arcade-perfect replication of the games (ie having the same slowdown sequences and so on which people who care a lot about scoring need to be perfect if they want to compare scores across platforms), the sound quality alone makes them worth it, although some of the unique game modes they added to some of the ports also greatly enriched the games. I kinda dislike the original modes for Daifukkatsu, but I love Ketsuipatchi.

In fact it was because of how cheap they are that CAVE games are so uniquely difficult to emulate. They relied on the slowdown from the hardware which was crappy as fuck as a gameplay component. Many parts of their games would be impossible to play if the game didn't choke on itself and stutter while many bullets are on the screen.
The problem is, finding ways to make the slowdown identical in emulation is much harder than just making the games run well at 60 fps, lol.
They are quite unique in how much of a bunch of cheap fuckers they are. None of the other shmup developers were that bad.

Ultimately, none of the ports of the last crops of CAVE games were accurate. None. They're better than playing MAME though.

 

[Morenatsu.]

I have Deathsmiles II on my computer and it has 8-bit 24000hz music. It's a Windows game from 2009.

 

[Morenatsu.]

Ok guys I really am getting completely fed up with this dumb piece of shit game Battle Bakraid. Scoring in this game is total fucking shit, for some reason medals give you shit tons of rank, but chaining instead gives you shit tons of points that give you shit tons of extends that let you die shit tons and get shit tons of bombs and negate all that rank so it doesn't even matter BUT that's only if you're willing to learn some ridiculous kamikaze routes that the developers apparently couldn't conceive of because the original version of the game had a counter stop. So you either break the game, get broken by the game, or just don't score. Actually, just don't play. Go play Batrider. People who think they prefer this to Garegga have brain damage, autism, and/or only play in baby mode. This game keeps trolling me and I can't stop playing it.