Pillars of Eternity Beta Discussion [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Semper]

i am not talking about mmo's threat meters driven through damage and other shit, but about combat maneuvers to instantly switch the engagement around or ways to exit its range.

 

[Sensuki]

Yeah fuck taunt mechanics.

Cone slow was just an example, hobbled would be better - just have to think of various disables/status effects that would be useful for stickiness. Currently the player benefits from the Engagement targeting clauses only, never disengagement attacks - which is pretty dumb.

Slow is good - slow, run away, pepper with ranged

Slow could be good for enemy :

if current target =< 30% health
use cone slow

not as cheesy as a disengagement attack

 

[Infinitron]

Say they make all obs employees play PoE for 5 hours. Say they have 40 people on the team. It's 200 hours spent on finding out what everyone already knows. It takes much more than 5 hours to really appreciate the whole situation, and none of them will put in that much time. So after 200 of manhours spent, all they have is superficial remarks. Everyone congratulates everyone, pats on the back across the office, "good job everyone"... "Oh, and don't forget - don't read those forums on account of all the trolls there that just want to see us fail. I swear, the negativity there, bweh!"

This is what their internal playtesters are for.

 

[imweasel]

The steamtards actually think PoE is going to be like a hypothetical Baldur's Gate 3 because of the visual resemblance.


I can hardly wait for that delicious butthurt.

:kwafuckyeah:

 

[Doctor Sbaitso]

If I turn from you and you are swinging at me, natural consequences should be enough. Increase damage from an attacker when turning away from someone you have attacked. Make the increase in damage significant for me to have to consider it within the larger context of the battle. Natural consequences should be enough if you support them. This idea of bucky ball magentism does not work.

 

[tuluse]

If I turn from you and you are swinging at me, natural consequences should be enough. Increase damage from an attacker when turning away from someone you have attacked. Make the increase in damage significant for me to have to consider it within the larger context of the battle. Natural consequences should be enough if you support them. This idea of bucky ball magentism does not work.

This sounds even worse than we have currently since the player doesn't have control over facing, and it would make the game super annoying to play if we did.

 

[Shadowfang]

imweasel thanks for the link, i got to read this:

Why not just buy dragon age?

Aah i bet i have hours of entertainment awaiting within these walls.

 

[Frusciante]

The steamtards actually think PoE is going to be like a hypothetical Baldur's Gate 3 because of the visual resemblance.


I can hardly wait for that delicious butthurt.

:kwafuckyeah:

For 99% of the people this will be exactly like a BG3. Not everyine is into systems as much as people here on the Codex.

 

[imweasel]

For 99% of the people this will be exactly like a BG3. Not everyine is into systems as much as people here on the Codex.

Best excuse for shitty systems design that I've heard in quite a while.

 

[Frusciante]

Some steam comments:

Erm, the price is a BIT over scale for an avarage gamer. £45 o.O
It is a low/medium(?) budget, decent, oldschool, izometric game. There are no post processing effects, advanced motion caputre combat systems and physics or what it's often called - new generation graphics.

Yeah, I think I can safely say on this forum is not happy with the price. I think $19.99 is just about right, maybe even a bit too much. For example Icewind Dale got a remake and was put on Steam and that costs $19.99 and it is, in my eyes, no different to this.

Barely any voice acting and generic party members?
Game will be an epic fail.

Let's wait for metacritic and see if it suceeds.

Why not just buy dragon age?
This game has to be dirrected at those people who have potatoes as a pc. This has to be a joke right?

It looks like the kind of hybrid pseudo-tb system used in Dragon Age, real time with pausing to issue commands. No turns as such so not like Baldur's Gate, because Baldur's Gate's mechanics (as many true TB games from that time) allocated units of time to actions and demarcated one turn from the next, and could be played in a pure turn-based way (using options like pause at end of turn etc).

yeah...to whom still continue defending this crazy prices..i want only remember that THIS ARE DIGITAL GAME!! NO COSTS FOR SHIPPING, NO COST FOR MASTER, NO COSTS OF DVD FOR DEVS\PUBLISHER...it can't be costs as a retail copy...bear in mind this before saying we are whining

If there are so many great RPGs coming out that are cheaper, then why not play those first and get this game on the inevitable STEAM sales?

 

[Rake]

Steamtards gonna steamtard.

 

[Answermancer]

Some steam comments:

Erm, the price is a BIT over scale for an avarage gamer. £45 o.O
It is a low/medium(?) budget, decent, oldschool, izometric game. There are no post processing effects, advanced motion caputre combat systems and physics or what it's often called - new generation graphics.

Yeah, I think I can safely say on this forum is not happy with the price. I think $19.99 is just about right, maybe even a bit too much. For example Icewind Dale got a remake and was put on Steam and that costs $19.99 and it is, in my eyes, no different to this.

Barely any voice acting and generic party members?
Game will be an epic fail.

Let's wait for metacritic and see if it suceeds.

Why not just buy dragon age?
This game has to be dirrected at those people who have potatoes as a pc. This has to be a joke right?

It looks like the kind of hybrid pseudo-tb system used in Dragon Age, real time with pausing to issue commands. No turns as such so not like Baldur's Gate, because Baldur's Gate's mechanics (as many true TB games from that time) allocated units of time to actions and demarcated one turn from the next, and could be played in a pure turn-based way (using options like pause at end of turn etc).

yeah...to whom still continue defending this crazy prices..i want only remember that THIS ARE DIGITAL GAME!! NO COSTS FOR SHIPPING, NO COST FOR MASTER, NO COSTS OF DVD FOR DEVS\PUBLISHER...it can't be costs as a retail copy...bear in mind this before saying we are whining

If there are so many great RPGs coming out that are cheaper, then why not play those first and get this game on the inevitable STEAM sales?

I think I just got brain damage.

 

[Doctor Sbaitso]

If I turn from you and you are swinging at me, natural consequences should be enough. Increase damage from an attacker when turning away from someone you have attacked. Make the increase in damage significant for me to have to consider it within the larger context of the battle. Natural consequences should be enough if you support them. This idea of bucky ball magentism does not work.

This sounds even worse than we have currently since the player doesn't have control over facing, and it would make the game super annoying to play if we did.

I have only watched video and so don't speak from experience but it seems better to me to support natural consequence. If I have clicked on a creature to attack, these things should be true and predictable:

1) I can turn away if I want to simply by clicking on some other creature to attack or spot to move to.
2) In doing so, the creature I am already engaged with should get attacks of opportunity at increased damage while I turn away, intent on movement rather than defense
3) use of an ability such as cautious retreat or somesuch can mitigate

If these things just make the actual experience worse then the whole thing is probably not savable and Buck Ball engagement is likely to prevail.

 

[Sensuki]

2) In doing so, the creature I am already engaged with should get attacks of opportunity at increased damage while I turn away, intent on movement rather than defense

No, because it's a real time game and they can attack you anyway. Attack of Opportunity is a turn-based mechanic.

 

[Doctor Sbaitso]

2) In doing so, the creature I am already engaged with should get attacks of opportunity at increased damage while I turn away, intent on movement rather than defense

No, because it's a real time game and they can attack you anyway. Attack of Opportunity is a turn-based mechanic.

I disagree and challenge that assertion. Just because we have predominantly seen it in turn-based implementations does not mean it is not applicable.

I propose a duel. You with yours and me with my lucky machette. It will be in realtime. If you turn away to move somewhere else, I am willing to bet that I strike you and do more damage than if you were facing me & engaged. If there is no cencept of facing in this game then its shit.

 

[tuluse]

I have only watched video and so don't speak from experience but it seems better to me to support natural consequence. If I have clicked on a creature to attack, these things should be true and predictable:

1) I can turn away if I want to simply by clicking on some other creature to attack or spot to move to.
2) In doing so, the creature I am already engaged with should get attacks of opportunity at increased damage while I turn away, intent on movement rather than defense
3) use of an ability such as cautious retreat or somesuch can mitigate

If these things just make the actual experience worse then the whole thing is probably not savable and Buck Ball engagement is likely to prevail.

Instead of turning away, why wouldn't you back away slowly so as not to provoke a sword in the back?

 

[Doctor Sbaitso]

Yeah that's why I mention the ability. I am not suggesting no risk movement at will but it sounds now like once you er melee engaged that's pretty much it unless you use an ability.

 

[Sensuki]

I propose a duel. You with yours and me with my lucky machette. It will be in realtime. If you turn away to move somewhere else, I am willing to bet that I strike you and do more damage than if you were facing me & engaged. If there is no cencept of facing in this game then its shit.

Sure, you swing and miss and I'll move away during your swing recovery. You can still follow me though.

Automatic faggot mechanics like AoOs are horrible in RT. Pretty much all games that don't have taunting mechanics use status effects and disables to control movement in combat. Playing those is actually fun.

 

[Doctor Sbaitso]

Maybe I will miss but what are you saying then? The status quo is OK?

 

[Bester]

Doctor Sbaitso , they're not trying to create Clang here, and you keep saying that a certain element must be in game because of how real life is.

People swing less hard and less fast if they are hurt in real life. People move slower if they are low on hp in real life. People move slower with armor. And directly related to what you're saying, it's possible to a dextrous/fast/lightly equipped person to disengage from a fight by jumping back and then running away. It might also depend on their enemy's weapon speed factor, equipment, natural speed, recovery (if they just took a swing, they can't take another one RIGHT NOW), etc. Also if we're talking real life engagement, no way in hell could you engage 3 people by "taking some talent". I could go on. Engagement in this case is not something super natural, it's just a game mechanic. As a game mechanic in rtwp, it's meh.

 

[Doctor Sbaitso]

Bester, that is all pretty apparent and it isn't about making a simulation. I'm just sparking conversation about ways it could maybe not be so shitty.

 

[Infinitron]

IT'S ON: http://www.twitch.tv/paradoxinteractive

 

[Duraframe300]

Now its starting

 

[Starwars]

Who is this annoying person playing, and why is he there in the first place?

 

[Frusciante]

I see some new outfits. Aumaua heads seem to be improved as well. I like how the wizard looks.