Oblivion Re-Rated by the ESRB

[kris]

This spurs an alarming predecence for Fallout3. Of course I thought it would suck anyway, now it will suck, but not in a arousing way.

 

[yipsl]

I'd like to pat myself on the back for calling this as soon as someone said there was a nude skin shipped on the disc.

It's pretty awesome that Pete Hines is doing the exact same lying routine that Rockstar did. "Hacked into the art files".

So, is this a PR ploy, or a stupid fuckup?

I had to hold off getting the game till this month, the Collector's Edition will arrive Friday via UPS. I have seen screenshots and read descriptions of the Dark Brotherhood quest line and I wondered how the game could get a Teen rating.

Nudity does not bother me, neither does reasonable gore. If they're going to have a ratings system at all then it needs to be accurate. Oblivion seemed a Mature game from the day it went gold. Mature because of gore and artwork involving genitally mutilated corpses, and child skeletons in the Night Mother's lair. That's fitting for a horror title and the devs did promise to bring a new level of horror to TES.

I just wish they'd been accurate in the ratings. I can imagine a Den Mother watching her early teen or preteen Scout playing the Dark Brotherhood questline and then freakin' out when he Havok physics poses corpses or gets to the Night Mother's lair. Then, she goes online and finds that gasp there's mild nudity available via a mod that uses a Bethsoft created mesh designed for certain types of female clothing.

As for Pete, he's in marketing, what do you expect? I'd buy Oblivion from him, it is as close to classic TES as we're getting in this generation, but I would not buy a used car from the man.

What I can't figure out is why the mild nudity is getting more attention than the gore that's clearly accessible in the video segments provided to the ESRB. I'd love to see that 60 page document leaked, the ESRB is blaming Bethsoft, Bethsoft is blaming modders for nudity and the ESRB for not understanding vulgarity and gore, and they're "patching" the game with a detrimental to modders patch.

All the while it provides Bethsoft with some street cred as a company that rocks the boat like that Scottish outfit. The whole thing could be a stunt pulled by Bethsoft and Take 2 using the ESRB as unwitting dupes.

We all know the kids want an M rated game more than a Teen and when Jack Thompson gets ahold of it, then maybe Oblivion will surpass the latest Sims 2 expansion in sales.

All the while fan modding gets the rap and Pete winks and smirks, claiming that the safest mods to get are the "official downloadable content".

Oy gevalt! I just want the next Daggerfall, not the next GTA set in Cyrodiil.

This spurs an alarming predecence for Fallout3. Of course I thought it would suck anyway, now it will suck, but not in a arousing way.

Actually, they promise Fallout 3 as the most violent game ever, or they did in a sidebar to the October 2004 Lame Informer preview of Oblivion, you know, the one where the Nine Divines was a joinable faction.

I think they'll push the envelop with Fallout 3, it will get an M rating but skate close to AO and they'll try to hide the fact from the ESRB. Then, they'll sell a couple of million copies with their content while issuing a patch that "corrects" what the ESRB sees in the game.

Not having played the Fallout's, I can't say that Bethsoft will be true to the series, but I did play Wasteland and you can't have post nuclear apocalyptic for the Den Mother crowd. From "A Boy and His Dog" to "Wasteland" there's always troubling content.

It's like if they'd tried to make "Call of Cthulhu" Teen, it just would not work. So they must keep the genre in mind, the thing is will the ESRB still consider it an M game when it goes gold or will they add more than just sexual scenes to their AO rating?

They sure do like Americans when we liberate their countries ...

Or when we feed their countries. Sadly, the government is into liberating oil rich countries and sending ineffectual U.N. or African Union "peace keepers" to stop genocide. I'd rather see the Marines in Darfur saving lives than in Iraq pushing Halliburton, Enron and Exxon foreign policy.

We should have guarded the hospitals, museums and schools and ignored the oil ministry, we should have stayed no longer than a year, if we had to go in. Better yet, we should have pushed for Kurdish and Marsh Arab independence from the Sunnis and let Iraq become the 3 countries it actually is. Afghanistan was warranted, but not Iraq. Not before Osama bin Laden is in prison or dead.

When I see Europeans hating America, or Americans who take Fox News too seriously hating the French, I just shake my head. Everyone needs to read de Tocqueville. We have more in common than simply differences of opinion over how to relate to the non-Western world.

 

[Nutcracker]

Was that breast actually one of yours twinfalls?

If so, it gets my seal of approval.

 

[yipsl]

how do I get my refund? I'm deeply offended.

I'm deeply thankful that my copy's in a UPS facility waiting to be delivered by Friday. I'd hate to have gotten a "patched" DVD without the poorly done topless mesh. The way I see it, it's at least proof that someone at Bethsoft thinks there's more to female clothing in TES than the Robes of Saint Dibella the Chaste Who Would Never Provide Erotic Instruction Just In Case a Den Mother is Watching Her Bloodthirsty Son Play The Game That Todd Howard Wanted To Make Instead Of The Next Daggerfall.

HAAAHAHAHA, once again it's the Great American Fear of the Female Nipple!

LOOKOUT!!!

They're roaming the countryside!! Take the children and RUN!

People, this has nothing to do with Bethesda, and everything to do with the gigantic comedy network that is the US Christian Right.

You know, I have no problem with nudity. But I did have a problem awhile back with junior high lunchtable style "gay" comments. Porn is porn and smirky snarky talk is just that, but a breast is natural. Nudity is natural.

Nudity and fantasy religion with magic gets the mundanes upset so, it's not a Christian Right thing, it's an American culture thing that accepts Girls Gone Wild softcore commercials on G4/Dreck TV and which thinks that GTA is for kids, but can't tolerate even anime style nudity in games.

 

[Section8]

Well, if the nude meshes are anything like the faces in Oblivion, I don't blame the ERSB for rating the game M...

I seem to remember someone pointing them out when the game was first released and the nude models almost instantly discovered, and they looked pretty horrible. I'd rate them as being as nasty as the typical American porn star's. Eurotrash FTW.

Can't see the fuss over a pair of tits myself - seems hard to believe a "civilised" country cares more about mild graphical nudity in a game than the fact you can go around killing anyone you choose and then drag the bodies around etc. Where's the moral high ground there?

It's something that ought to baffle absolutely anyone capable of rational thought.

 

[Rhombus]

Oooh.. sexy polygons and pixles!.. I want a screenshot!

 

[REX]

yeah only ones that have an abundance of oil :wink:

Which, if we were benefiting from oil, our gas prices wouldn't be in excess of $3/gallon right now, but that's a different subject for a different thread.

-D4

Lucky bastards... in Denmark 1 gallon would be about 7,2 dollars rigth now.

 

[Zomg]

What I can't figure out is why the mild nudity is getting more attention than the gore that's clearly accessible in the video segments provided to the ESRB. I'd love to see that 60 page document leaked, the ESRB is blaming Bethsoft, Bethsoft is blaming modders for nudity and the ESRB for not understanding vulgarity and gore, and they're "patching" the game with a detrimental to modders patch.

Eh? Are the video segments they sent as representative publically available?

All the while it provides Bethsoft with some street cred as a company that rocks the boat like that Scottish outfit. The whole thing could be a stunt pulled by Bethsoft and Take 2 using the ESRB as unwitting dupes..

This sets some precedent. The modern video game income structure works a lot like Hollywood movies now - the vast majority of the money is made in the first few weeks, not in the long tail. So, a little ESRB fraud might be worth it if it's going to take them months to catch up.

 

[Lumpy]

This must be the first time most of the Codex is defending Bethesda. Choosing the lesser of two evils, I suppose.

 

[Rhombus]

I want a mature game. But gore and nude polygons don't make it mature...

And for defending Beth, well, ESRB sounds like a bunch of worse morons yes.

 

[Perishiko]

I want a mature game. But gore and nude polygons don't make it mature...

And for defending Beth, well, ESRB sounds like a bunch of worse morons yes.

Indeed. I believe the dialogue and storyline is what sets things to a mature/immature feeling. Well, half way the blood/nude can make it "feel" a little more mature, but not if it's done in bad taste or makes no sense. (Much like the TV and movie industry...)

Sexy Blonde: "Oh dear god, we're about to die and the vampire is right on our tail."
Macho Man: "Alright, let's get naked and have sex before we die."
*Sex Scene*
--- 5-15 minutes later...
Sexy Blonde: "Wow, look, a change of clothes and a wet washclothe to clean off with."
Macho Man: "How convenient. And look, my shirt is ripped because of my big awesomely worked out muscles."

 

[HardCode]

yeah only ones that have an abundance of oil :wink:

Which, if we were benefiting from oil, our gas prices wouldn't be in excess of $3/gallon right now, but that's a different subject for a different thread.

-D4

Lucky bastards... in Denmark 1 gallon would be about 7,2 dollars rigth now.

Yea, but you can drive across the whole country with 2 gallons of gas

 

[fizzelopeguss]

They can't even model a decent pair of tiddies.

 

[Doppelganger]

Someone needs to mod in some dick meshes pronto and send screenies to the ESRB.

This comment alone deserves a recall in my book:

"We remain enormously proud of Oblivion and the standard of excellence in game development it represents. Oblivion is one of the highest rated games of all time and one of the most popular games available on the Xbox 360 and the PC. We greatly appreciate the understanding and support of our fans."

Start the campaign now.

 

[obediah]

damnit kingcomrade, it looks like maybe your persecution complex wasn't a complex at all.

 

[Doppelganger]

Not directed at me, I hope ^

 

[Bosco]

Doesn't a nudie mean it's an automatic AO rating?

 

[obediah]

Not directed at me, I hope ^

no, directed at the two breasts (or same breast posted twice) in the thread, with no removal, let alone bannination.

 

[kingcomrade]

Well, duh. Alleged chicks who post pictures of breasts are obviously going to have a different standard from kingspamrade

 

[Drakron]

It seens so.

Funny thing is how I know that in my country the game rating is given after a review boards looks at its content (PEGI does not count, DGE does since all games have to get a DGE stamp) just like when they review games as ESRB simply gives a rating after reading a a damn questionary.

ESRB is a flawed system for parental guidance, you dont see movies getting a new rating because they content is viewed by a board, in ESRB you are "guessing" they got the questionary right.

I understand the issue but we already have a 2 weeks delay from when a game goes gold and that sould be enough for review the final game build, issue a rating and shove a stamp on the box.

I do give the politicians the right to attack ESRB is its failing on doing its job (and it is) however things got into the state because the goverment is more that happy in letting the "iindustry to self regulate" intead of issue guidelines, the politicians do not want for the ESRB to go away, they want to use the ESRB rating as a way for censorship.

THAT is not addressing the issue with the ESRB and the rating systems.

 

[Drakron]

no, directed at the two breasts (or same breast posted twice) in the thread, with no removal, let alone bannination.

KC was banned because he posted "not safe for work" shock images, breasts pictures on the other hand are safe.

Unless you are one of those retarded that think breasts=porn=evil="think of the children" and if you are then you sould be IP banned from this site in the grounds you no longer qualify as a inteligent lifeform.

 

[obediah]

I can't wait to have a kid.

He won't be allowed to play violent games, but I'll be damned if I'm going to quit playing them or the thousand or so profanity-laden cd's I have. And thanks to Dave Chapelle, I'll end up calling my 3 year old daughter a bitch in a friendly way.

Oh well, I could chop her fucking leg off and still be a better parent than anyone else in my family.

 

[Zomg]

According to the ESRB website, there's twelve games they've rated M with the "Nudity" tag on them, although I haven't played any of them so I can't report what exactly that means (i.e. if lingerie or something counts). I'd assume it's like the "R" rating in the US - breasts and bare asses, plus the ritualized Hollywood R-rated love scene (closeups on kissing, suggested penetration OK, thrusting not, suggested oral/manual sex OK, head bobbing and hand pumping not, etc.)

 

[dongle]

KC was banned because he posted "not safe for work" shock images, breasts pictures on the other hand are safe.

Unless you are one of those retarded that think breasts=porn=evil="think of the children" and if you are then you sould be IP banned from this site in the grounds you no longer qualify as a inteligent lifeform.

What about members who stand to get fired if their boss sees one on the screen, regardless of what the member themselves think?

 

[Greatatlantic]

Doesn't a nudie mean it's an automatic AO rating?

No, not necessarily. Though the only exception I can think of is Playboy Mansion. No I didn't play it, but I did read some of the reviews out of curiousity. It had full frontal nudity and even simulated sex acts. For whatever reason, that game was rated M for mature. I'm guessing the Sims like gameplay made it cartoony or something like that.

Basically, there is room for nudity on the M rating. I think the difference maker is genetalia... maybe.

 

[Elwro]

Playboy: The Mansion doesn't have full frontal nudity. The normal version is rated 16+, the expansion is rated 18+, so maybe that's where the ladies take off their panties. (Up to now I only played the normal version.)
The sex acts simulations are just funny, and quite well animated. The whole game is rather amusing and enjoyable for a while, "suggesting" more than it "shows". Definitely not a even a pinch of porno there.