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Is Bethesda inclined?

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FeelTheRads

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Apr 18, 2008
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I'm not sure why you bolded that part. It's not like any of them play any differently than that guy was trying to play.

I bet Sawyer thought it's the game's fault, though.
 

Glaurung

Liberal's alt
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186
So what is actually your point? That Skyrim is better than Oblivion?
You need to learn how to read, my point is stated very clearly.

It's incline in the sense of being fun to play and having a lot of good stuff in it

We're not even comparing it to Oblivion at this point, Oblivion had no fun and no good stuff in it whatsoever, on any level, be it writing, gameplay, roleplaying, exploration, voice-acting graphics - yes, even the graphics were crap, with ugly bloom and bobble-headed NPCs. Oblivion is gone and no one will miss it.

But it still is way worse than Morrowind
Not really. Skyrim lacks some of the appeal that Morrowind had, such as a fully original and exotic setting, complex and layered main story, fun spell effects, etc.

However, Skyrim also improves on a great deal of features that were either entirely lackluster or were missing entirely in Morrowind.

Morrowind had a terrible clickfest combat system with one motion animation per weapon type and a message saying "you missed" despite visibly making contact with the enemy. Combat in Morrowind was beyond fucking crap.

Morrowind had a terrible dialogue system where every NPC was a walking library giving paragraphs of encyclopaedic information at prompt.

Morrowind world was beautiful but dead, NPCs were rooted to one spot doing nothing 24/7. A few months later Gothic 2 would come out with its beautifully scripted NPCs who actually went through the motions of daily life.

Morrowind had a ridiculously unbalanced overpowered broken Alchemy system that could give you 1000 points in any stat, essentially making every other system obsolete.

Morrowind had tiny, crappy, uninspired dungeons. With the exception of some of the Dwemer dungeons, they were usually not worth anyone's time.

Morrowind had no crafting. Weapon and armor crafting, that is.

As much as I liked levitation as a sort of guilty pleasure, it was ultimately detrimental to exploration satisfaction, because you could easily bypass any and all enemies and terrain features without putting any real effort into it. With levitation, dungeon traps would lose their meaning, as you could lazily glide over them instead of studying how the trap mechanism works and then trying to avoid them/put a crate on the pressure pad to jam it/use them against the enemies.

Skyrim improved greatly on all the aforementioned systems.

utterly broken lockpicking systems
What exactly is broken about Skyrim's lockpicking? I should remind you that Morrowind's lockpicking consisted of "equip lockpick instead of weapon, click lock, have it break, repeat clickfest ad nauseum until the stars align and the lock opens".
 

hell bovine

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I will NEVER EVER play any of that fucking shit "action game!!!11" garbage from BioWare/Bethesda. Period.

I have standards.
To be honest, that is one argument I don't get. I'm quite choosey when it comes to food, but that doesn't mean I have to dine in a classy restaurant every time I go out to enjoy myself. Skyrim with Requiem is the gaming equivalent of fast food; its made of questionable ingredients and not good for your health, but it's fun. :P
 

Nomad_Blizz

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Joined
Dec 18, 2014
Messages
335
The only reason I play Skyrim is because of the modding community- there are some great mods out there like 3DNPC, Falskaar, Wyrmstooth, Legendary Cities, etc that can keep you occupied for a long time. We'll even get mods like Skywind allowing us to play the best game in TES series in the new engine. Honestly, Skyrim is more like an adventure simulator rather than a game cause you can change it how you want.

I do have one gripe though...the general gameplay/combat sucks and no amount of modding can make it as good as dark souls.
 

Rostere

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It's incline in the sense of being fun to play and having a lot of good stuff in it, despite being affected by consoletard restrictions. Get your head out of your ass, anyone who enjoyed playing Morrowind will also enjoy Skyrim, the two games are essentially similar. Nobody is impressed with your edginess.

Says the guy with the D3 avatar, eh? :kingcomrade: Okay, I'm not going to read too much into that but I guess that next, you will be saying that DA:I is "fun to play and having a lot of good stuff in it" and "incline compared to DA2".

Meanwhile, when you are poking around in poop with a stick I'll be playing actual CRPGs. Have fun playing retarded games. Here's another game that surely is suitable for you considering your intellectual pedigree (now hopefully that will keep you busy so that you won't come to the Codex to post about banal, shit, boring games).

TBH I think Morrowind was pretty boring as well: I gave the game 5-6 hours and found that it had little merit as a CRPG. In my mind, a CRPG should have either tactical (turn-based or RTWP) combat based on progression of skills and acquirement of items, or well-written dialogue and C&C. Morrowind had pretty bland writing and god-awful FP combat so I saw no reason to continue. I haven't played Oblivion myself but the little I've seen when others play makes me cringe. Same with Skyrim. I hear that Morrowind has "great lore" and an interesting setting - and I still retain some respect for those who claim that - but I have no patience to rake through a sea of shit to confirm it myself.
 

Karwelas

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Codex Year of the Donut I helped put crap in Monomyth
Bethesda.
Inclined.

tumblr_lx9jb1SPMr1qdrpdr.gif



Hell no. Skyrim is like damn console average game simulator. It is interesting for first 5 hours and then you do same "Go to cave, kill everything quest". Even in damn main quest. Only thing that save are mods and community. Only it.
 

Perkel

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Mar 28, 2014
Messages
15,909
More like Betsheda can't keep with fucking up its system as fast as they would want.

Every new game from them in decline in complexity on all accounts at same time improving in places which are least important.

Biggest change was in spells system. With each new game you can literally do less because new dungeon design would be fucked up if you could have something like levitate.

Hell no. Skyrim is like damn console average game simulator. It is interesting for first 5 hours and then you do same "Go to cave, kill everything quest". Even in damn main quest. Only thing that save are mods and community. Only it.


True. To many people forget what vanilla Skyrim is.
 

Greatness

Cipher
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Messages
288
I'm pretty sure it's just Bioware's decline was so steep and comprehensive that it actually makes just about everyone else out there look to be on an incline in comparison.

I lost all faith and haven't bothered with a Bioware game in a very long time. For some reason I still find myself giving the TES games a chance. Stupid Daggerfall/Morrowind made me fall in love with the lore/setting, but boy have they been trying their hardest to butcher the series (and have definitely been succeeding at doing so).
 

Glaurung

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ITT people who don't play Bethesda games swoop in to tell us all about their superior intellectual pedigree. :popamole:

Sadly, the topic is about whether or not Bethesda has inclined, about which, as someone who hasn't played Morrowind, Oblivion or Skyrim (and presumably Fallout 3), Rostere has no fucking clue. You'd think a delicate genius boasting intellectual pedigree the size of Jupiter would be able to read the thread title and come to the conclusion "I have no valuable input to provide on this topic", but alas, genius works in mysterious ways. I am only glad that esteemed neckbeard took the time out of his busy schedule of playing "actual CRPGs" (sadly, failing to mention even a single title that pertains to this not-at-all vague and entirely non-subjective category) to say absolutely nothing on topic, beyond 'I r smurt u is dumb'. Typical behavior of delicate genius with high intellectual pedigree, and not at all mentally-deficient poser with the mental maturity of a twelve year-old, dime a dozen on the electronic retard network. :roll:
 
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Inclining the series by making Skyrim incorporate a great deal of ideas from Morrowind, despite the financial success and critical acclaim of Oblivion. This means that somebody in Bethesda (probably not Todd Howard) was prepared to listen to the feedback given by long-standing fans of the series and invest effort into reviving some of the good concepts from Morrowind, even though they could have simply cloned Oblivion with all of its game-destroying flaws/total lack of personality and even further dropped the quality of writing/conceptualizing the game, hoping that the market would pick up this shit again by reflex.

That's the exact opposite of what Bioware did with Dragon Age Inquisition, at any rate. Clone DA2, multiply every encounter by a dozen, multiply eveyr location by a hundred (and forget to add the little touches that would make it feel alive and interesting), and rely on an army of shills to carry the product into the open arms of the consoletard sheeple market.
lol what?:retarded:

what great fucking ideas from Morrowind?

Spellmaking?
Actual fun and useful spells like levitation, Mark/Recall?
Minor/Major skills and fucking attributes?
Interweaving guild quests excluding you from becoming headmaster of every possible guild?
Actual quest directions instead of fucking GPS?
Fast travel thats not just simple "click on any location and teleport there instantly"?
Hand placed and interesting loot?
Handcrafted and unique world that encurage you to explore instead of following fucking quest compas?

they even couldnt incorporate best parts of Oblivion into Skyrim :lol::lol::lol: both Dark Brotherhood and Thieves Guild are pure shit in Skyrim:roll:
 

Starwars

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I had a lot of fun playing Skyrim. Would I call it a good RPG? No, I wouldn't. Fun game, definitely. Way better than Oblivion, by miles.

But yeah, I'd much rather play Skyrim than Bioware's recent offerings. In fact, I'd much rather play Skyrim than most AAA games out there. Skyrim is fun, even moreso modded.
 

Rostere

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You know what? You're correct - I have wasted enough time here already. I reacted to the stupid tone of one post but my answer was technically speaking off-topic. I'll leave this thread, have fun.

gotta_go_fast_by_francosj12-d6yzexq.gif
 

Snorkack

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You need to learn how to read, my point is stated very clearly.

It's incline in the sense of being fun to play and having a lot of good stuff in it

We're not even comparing it to Oblivion at this point, Oblivion had no fun and no good stuff in it whatsoever, on any level, be it writing, gameplay, roleplaying, exploration, voice-acting graphics - yes, even the graphics were crap, with ugly bloom and bobble-headed NPCs. Oblivion is gone and no one will miss it.
If Skyrim wasn't a Bethesta game, your point might be somewhat valid. However that is not the case because it was made by the same guys that brought us Daggerfall and Morrowind. So you have to face the fact that they deliberately dumbed their games down regarding various gameplay elements which I and many other people valued very high. In my understanding, this is very much the opposite of decline.
Not really. Skyrim lacks some of the appeal that Morrowind had, such as a fully original and exotic setting, complex and layered main story, fun spell effects, etc.

However, Skyrim also improves on a great deal of features that were either entirely lackluster or were missing entirely in Morrowind.

Morrowind had a terrible clickfest combat system with one motion animation per weapon type and a message saying "you missed" despite visibly making contact with the enemy. Combat in Morrowind was beyond fucking crap.

Morrowind had a terrible dialogue system where every NPC was a walking library giving paragraphs of encyclopaedic information at prompt.

Morrowind world was beautiful but dead, NPCs were rooted to one spot doing nothing 24/7. A few months later Gothic 2 would come out with its beautifully scripted NPCs who actually went through the motions of daily life.

Morrowind had a ridiculously unbalanced overpowered broken Alchemy system that could give you 1000 points in any stat, essentially making every other system obsolete.

Morrowind had tiny, crappy, uninspired dungeons. With the exception of some of the Dwemer dungeons, they were usually not worth anyone's time.

Morrowind had no crafting. Weapon and armor crafting, that is.

As much as I liked levitation as a sort of guilty pleasure, it was ultimately detrimental to exploration satisfaction, because you could easily bypass any and all enemies and terrain features without putting any real effort into it. With levitation, dungeon traps would lose their meaning, as you could lazily glide over them instead of studying how the trap mechanism works and then trying to avoid them/put a crate on the pressure pad to jam it/use them against the enemies.

Skyrim improved greatly on all the aforementioned systems.
I won't bother adressing every single point. Some are highly subjective (I preferred the informative wiki style dialogue over the fully voiced-over dialogue remnants), some improvements are to be expected to happen with 8 years of technology advancement and a budget thats multiple times larger, some are some are justified indeed. Morrowind was far from a perfect game (actually I still think the biggest flaw is that you move like a cripple for the first few hours), but complaining about broken alchemy system in MW while praising the crafting system in Skyrim... Oh, whatever.
What exactly is broken about Skyrim's lockpicking? I should remind you that Morrowind's lockpicking consisted of "equip lockpick instead of weapon, click lock, have it break, repeat clickfest ad nauseum until the stars align and the lock opens".

Have you ever spent a Perk in the Lockpicking tree? Have you ever bought lockpicks? Well, I ddidn't with my pure mage character and yet there wasn't a single Lvl 100 chest I wasn't able to open with some patience after, like 3 hours in the game. When you swim in dropped lockpicks and figured out how the minigame works.
 

Greatness

Cipher
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Morrowind had a terrible clickfest combat system with one motion animation per weapon type and a message saying "you missed" despite visibly making contact with the enemy. Combat in Morrowind was beyond fucking crap.

At least in Morrowind your statistics mattered (that's kind of important in an RPG right?). Skyrim is even worse mechanically in my opinion. Sure there's a few more animations and a block button, but in the end every single encounter plays out pretty much exactly the same, except now your stats are meaningless and the magic system is trivialized. Now you can take on dragons at level one with shitty bow and and an iron dagger, hows that for character progression.

Morrowind had a terrible dialogue system where every NPC was a walking library giving paragraphs of encyclopaedic information at prompt.

I'd still take the wiki NPCs and personalized journal entries over the horribly voiced 2-3 sentence questgivers whom are really just there to active the easymode quest compass.

Morrowind world was beautiful but dead, NPCs were rooted to one spot doing nothing 24/7. A few months later Gothic 2 would come out with its beautifully scripted NPCs who actually went through the motions of daily life.

Morrowind as a setting had a ton of depth. Various factions both allied and opposing, multiple religions with differing ideologies and mythologies, multiple political parties fighting over islands resources, etc. Skyrim has NPC's who will eat consumables and sleep on a schedule.

Morrowind had a ridiculously unbalanced overpowered broken Alchemy system that could give you 1000 points in any stat, essentially making every other system obsolete.

Big deal you can abuse and break the system. That's half the fun with these types of games anyways. It's not like anything in Skyrim is ever even a slight challange, so stats are obsolete there as well.

Morrowind had tiny, crappy, uninspired dungeons. With the exception of some of the Dwemer dungeons, they were usually not worth anyone's time.

Everything in Morrowind was handplaced. Many dungeons had out of the way passages and hidden places you could only find by thoroughly exploring in multiple ways, such a levitating/waterbreathing. Both games had a lot of shit dungeons and some decent ones. Since stats and equipment don't matter in Skyrim though I couldn't give a fuck about any dungeon.

Morrowind had no crafting. Weapon and armor crafting, that is.

The MMO style crafting in Skyrim was one of the dumbest things I've ever seen in an RPG.
 

A horse of course

Guest
I would sacrifice every single staff member at Larian, Obsidian, InXile, Beamdog, CDProjektRED, DoubleBear, Iron Tower Studios, Harebrained and whatever fourth-wall-breaking meme-spouting imbecile vomited forth Barkley, all in exchange for another masterpiece from Todd.

Without Bethesda, there are no waifus. No 40k squad command sims, no dog rapist cooldown buffs. No detailed stat modifiers for aged ejaculate plastered over argonian snouts, no magical counters to rat impregnation.

In short, there would be no modern RPGs.
 

Glaurung

Liberal's alt
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Messages
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Spellmaking?
Actual quest directions instead of fucking GPS?
I will agree with these two. I didn't say SKYRIM HAS EVERY SINGLE THING WE LIKED IN MORROWIND, did I?

Actual fun and useful spells like levitation
I've addressed the levitation issue in the post you failed to read due to the vomit-spewing neckbeard shitlord instincts kicking in. :roll:

Mark/Recall?
Rendered obsolete by fast travel system, which was the staple of every single TES game with the exception of Morrowind. I myself prefer Morrowind's in-universe transport system myself, but there's nothing wrong with fast travel.

Fast travel thats not just simple "click on any location and teleport there instantly"?
You mean, like fast travel from Daggerfall? :roll: No, not like that. In Skyrim you need to visit the location before being able to fast travel there.

Minor/Major skills and fucking attributes?
A gameplay abstraction that ultimately amounts to little more than hand-holding. Roleplaying a specific class involves using skills that pertain to this class - if you need the game to remind you "YOUR MAGE ISN'T SUPPOSED TO QUICKLY LEVEL SWORDS AND HEAVY ARMOR", then you're doing something wrong. I'm playing as a mage in Skyrim, and I only get regular skill growth in magic skills, Alchemy and Smithing, plus a skillpoint in Lockpicking every now and then, because these are the skills I actually find useful and consistent with my envisioned character class (there's no reason why a mage can't be an expert goldsmith who crafts his own amulets before enchanting them).

Now, if you were to get equal skill points in every skill, regardless of what you use in the game - that would be a broken system, because it would not reward effort nor keep track of what you use vs. what you don't use. This is not the case in Skyrim. You use swords and heavy armor often enough to get from Novice to Expert - therefore you're a warrior. This makes more sense than the other way around - you call yourself a warrior, therefore you're suddenly handicapped at picking locks and sneaking.

And I bet you can't provide a single argument as to why a good TES game absolutely MUST have attributes and minor/major skills beyond "THAT'S HOW IT'S BEEN IN OLD-SCHOOL DAYS!!!11!"

Interweaving guild quests excluding you from becoming headmaster of every possible guild?
Oh yeah, like the way you totally can't become leader of both Telvanni and Mage's Guild, or both Imperial Cult and Almsivi Temple, right? :roll: Morrowind had you choose one out of three Dunmer Houses, but in all honesty, the only real in-universe option was House Hlaalu. There's no possible way that Telvanni or Redoran would accept an outlander n'wa among their ranks, let alone become their leader. This includes outlander Dunmer, and especially all other races. Yeah, I'm sure there's nothing ridiculous about an Argonian or Khajiit becoming leader of House Telvanni. :lol:

Oh, and interweaving guild quests - please, name one.

Hand placed and interesting loot?
There's plenty useful unique loot in Skyrim, including Sheogorath's Wabbajack that has a random effect, up and including transforming your enemy into a mudcrab or a dremora lord.

Handcrafted and unique world that encurage you to explore instead of following fucking quest compas?
Following the quest compass is unnecessary in Skyrim, you can pretty much disable it entirely. It's true that NPCs don't give you directions to the quest location, but once you look it up in the journal/map, you can freely explore the game world and find it on your own, provided you remember the general direction and what you're supposed to be looking for. That's how I do it, at any rate, no quest compass.

both Dark Brotherhood and Thieves Guild are pure shit in Skyrim:roll:
I wouldn't know, I'm playing as a mage, and since I don't need the game to slap my wrists every time I do something non-mage-related, I never tried to join thieving organizations due to not being a thief. :smug:
 

Sykar

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You need to learn how to read, my point is stated very clearly.

It's incline in the sense of being fun to play and having a lot of good stuff in it

We're not even comparing it to Oblivion at this point, Oblivion had no fun and no good stuff in it whatsoever, on any level, be it writing, gameplay, roleplaying, exploration, voice-acting graphics - yes, even the graphics were crap, with ugly bloom and bobble-headed NPCs. Oblivion is gone and no one will miss it.


Not really. Skyrim lacks some of the appeal that Morrowind had, such as a fully original and exotic setting, complex and layered main story, fun spell effects, etc.

However, Skyrim also improves on a great deal of features that were either entirely lackluster or were missing entirely in Morrowind.

Morrowind had a terrible clickfest combat system with one motion animation per weapon type and a message saying "you missed" despite visibly making contact with the enemy. Combat in Morrowind was beyond fucking crap.

Morrowind had a terrible dialogue system where every NPC was a walking library giving paragraphs of encyclopaedic information at prompt.

Morrowind world was beautiful but dead, NPCs were rooted to one spot doing nothing 24/7. A few months later Gothic 2 would come out with its beautifully scripted NPCs who actually went through the motions of daily life.

Morrowind had a ridiculously unbalanced overpowered broken Alchemy system that could give you 1000 points in any stat, essentially making every other system obsolete.

Morrowind had tiny, crappy, uninspired dungeons. With the exception of some of the Dwemer dungeons, they were usually not worth anyone's time.

Morrowind had no crafting. Weapon and armor crafting, that is.

As much as I liked levitation as a sort of guilty pleasure, it was ultimately detrimental to exploration satisfaction, because you could easily bypass any and all enemies and terrain features without putting any real effort into it. With levitation, dungeon traps would lose their meaning, as you could lazily glide over them instead of studying how the trap mechanism works and then trying to avoid them/put a crate on the pressure pad to jam it/use them against the enemies.

Skyrim improved greatly on all the aforementioned systems.


What exactly is broken about Skyrim's lockpicking? I should remind you that Morrowind's lockpicking consisted of "equip lockpick instead of weapon, click lock, have it break, repeat clickfest ad nauseum until the stars align and the lock opens".

Do you believe the crap you type there actually? Seriously?
 

naossano

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In short, there would be no modern RPGs.

Since when dumbing things down is supposed to be modern ?
There were also utterly dumb games before. It is not a Revolution they brought.

Anyway, i should that i have more faith (not sure i could call it faith) in Beth the publisher. FoNV, Evil Within & the last Wolfenstein seem better than their in-house products.
The best thing they could do is avoid devellopping entirelly and hire real professionnals to do the job.
 

Glaurung

Liberal's alt
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Messages
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At least in Morrowind your statistics mattered (that's kind of important in an RPG right?). Skyrim is even worse mechanically in my opinion. Sure there's a few more animations and a block button, but in the end every single encounter plays out pretty much exactly the same, except now your stats are meaningless and the magic system is trivialized. Now you can take on dragons at level one with shitty bow and and an iron dagger, hows that for character progression.
Playing on minimal difficulty can do wonders, I'm sure. :roll: Now try turning difficulty to max and tell me how quickly the dragon drained your health bar - 1 second or 2?

I'd still take the wiki NPCs and personalized journal entries over the horribly voiced 2-3 sentence questgivers whom are really just there to active the easymode quest compass.
You've never actually played Skyrim, have you? NPCs are not horribly-voiced, there's plenty with more than 2-3 dialogue options, and they give more than 2-3 sentences, and talk about more than just giving a quest. Dialogue in Skyrim is fine. Better than Morrowind, at any rate. Most NPCs in Morrowind didn't even have unique lines, beyond the wiki keywords - it was rare to see a fisherman say something about fish and poverty, or a duke say something about ruling. Which is odd, because Morrowind didn't have voice-overs, they could easily have personalized each NPCs lines to reflect their personality/status and chose not to do it. Remove generic wiki entries, and most Morrowind NPCs will have one character-specific keyword giving a briscue one-two sentence reply. If that.

Morrowind as a setting had a ton of depth. Various factions both allied and opposing, multiple religions with differing ideologies and mythologies, multiple political parties fighting over islands resources, etc.
It was very deep when the guildmaster of Mage's Guild joined House Telvanni and became their leader, after than became head of both Almisivi Temple and Imperial Cult. :roll:

Skyrim has NPC's who will eat consumables and sleep on a schedule
Now you're comparing lore to NPC AI, which makes you an utter fucking retard. :lol:

In the aspect of lore, Skyrim has the conflict between Stormcloaks and Imperials, the decline of the Emprie of Tamriel, the struggle between worshipers of Talos with Thalmor-enforced worship of the Eight Divines, the return of the dragons and Alduin, and guess what - in side game you can't join both Stormloaks and Imperials. :smug:

In the aspect of NPC AI there's no comparison - Morrowind had none.

Big deal you can abuse and break the system. That's half the fun with these types of games anyways. It's not like anything in Skyrim is ever even a slight challange, so stats are obsolete there as well.
A broken system that renders all other mechanics meaningless and the game effortless is indeed a big deal. There's a challenge in completing actions the way they are meant to be completed, and they are by no means easy or trivial in Skyrim, provided you don't play at minimum difficulty which you obvious do. There's no challenge in removing the enemy/lock/obstacle with one click because you've crafted a spell/enchantment/potion of over 9000 points with the grandmaster alchemy alembic you stole from an unguarded room in a random mage guild.

Everything in Morrowind was handplaced. Many dungeons had out of the way passages and hidden places you could only find by thoroughly exploring in multiple ways, such a levitating/waterbreathing. Both games had a lot of shit dungeons and some decent ones. Since stats and equipment don't matter in Skyrim though I couldn't give a fuck about any dungeon.
90% of dungeons in Morrowind were a couple of rooms with little to nothing in them beyond a couple generic enemies. Skyrim has vast, sprawling dungeons filled with traps, puzzles, dungeon-specific enemies, quest items, and a unique boss fight in the end. Again, no contest, Skyrim wins by default because Morrowind had next to nothing.

The MMO style crafting in Skyrim was one of the dumbest things I've ever seen in an RPG.
Your post is the dumbest thing I've seen in my life.
 

Glaurung

Liberal's alt
Shitposter
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Messages
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If Skyrim wasn't a Bethesta game, your point might be somewhat valid. However that is not the case because it was made by the same guys that brought us Daggerfall and Morrowind. So you have to face the fact that they deliberately dumbed their games down regarding various gameplay elements which I and many other people valued very high. In my understanding, this is very much the opposite of decline.
In other words, it's popular to hate Bethesda in our neckbeard clique, therefore we must mindlessly reject anything that draws it in a vaguely positive light. :roll:
I remember when Morrowind came out, forums were filled with butthurt neckbeards screaming in outrage over how much Bethesda raped and violated the sacred basics of the series that were established in Arena and Daggerfall, calling Morrowind a dumbed-down piece of shit - sound vaguely familiar?

Some are highly subjective (I preferred the informative wiki style dialogue over the fully voiced-over dialogue remnants)
This is not subjective nor is it a matter of taste. It's a matter of having taste and being able to recognize a half-assed fluke when you see one. Morrowind monologue system was the laziest, most pointless piece of shit seen in a video game - even Daggerfall and Arena had better NPC interaction than that. Any game that lets you interact with NPCs is supposed to provide the means, by which the player gradually discovers facts about the game world, its history, metaphysics, etc. Morrowind was the only one that info-dumped the entire exposition as a list of generic non-interactive character-non-specific wiki entries, instead of trying to actually create dialogue and incorporate the information into the characters' responses. It was shit, pure and simple. And the most damning factor was the lack of voice-over - which I actually prefer in CRPGs because it removes restrictions from developers, allowing them to create as much text as they need, without being restricted by how much they need to pay voice actors. Morrowind could have had the best dialogue system in the history of the series, and it ended up having the worst.

Have you ever spent a Perk in the Lockpicking tree? Have you ever bought lockpicks?
I have indeed, because I had neither the time nor patience to waste twenty lockpicks on each Master lock, trying to find the perfect angle that doesn't insta-break the lockpick. Since the angle randomly resets every time you access the lock, you can't even accuse the system of being susceptible to save-scumming. So, unless you enjoy when a game arbitrarily forbids you to even attempt to engage in lockpicking because "YOU NEED X POINTS IN LOCKPICK BEFORE WE EVEN LET YOU TRY", there's really nothing wrong with Skyrim's lockpicking. Some games have better, others have worse, but it's certainly superior to Morrowind's "let's clickfest the lock to death".
 
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Deleted member 7219

Guest
No.

Bethesda Game Studios are the people responsible for Oblivion and Fallout 3. Skyrim was a big improvement, but had zero reactivity, unresolved plot points and shit DLC.

The publishers gave us Fallout: New Vegas and Dishonored, but also Rage and The Elder Scrolls Online.
 

Jaesun

Fabulous Ex-Moderator
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So it was a genuine question because you actually don't know shit. Owkay.

In before "I don't need to play it to know it's shit". Eh, do as you like, but IMO this only applies to THI4F and other stupid stuff like Arcania.

Seriously? What in the fuck has Bethesda done to INCLINE their games? Add Dragons? Getting wounded in the knee? Absolutely fucking nothing. They continue to churn out ACTION GEAME!!!!111 garbage labeled as a "RPG".

Can you give me this list of incredible INCLINE Bethesda is doing towards the RPG genre?

NEO Scavenger is MILES and MILES above Bethesda in INCLINING the RPG genre.
 

Sykar

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Sure, but that alone doesn't mean anything if, when you close your stats info window and perform the related actions ingame, they play like total shit. Combat in Morrowind is terrible and you know this, ffs, why even bother. If Big Rigs had a huge stats window full of customizable stuff like the truck's max speed, turning radius and so on, would you put it above a mediocre racing game just because it has stats and they mattered? Loyalty to the core RPG elements is essential to qualify as part of the genre and so on, but it doesn't guarantee quality at all, or we wouldn't have a lot of shit RPGs.

I feel weird saying this because generally I'm more of a mondblutian faction member myself when it comes to RPGs, and even weirder considering that I actually like MW and probably spent more than 300h in it since I first played it. But I know exactly why I like the game, it's because MW is incredibly atmospheric and Vvardenfell is a lot of fun to explore (even if sterile and static). I could bet a kidney that those are the reasons that made you like the game too, I doubt you go around saying "hey I loved that game because you had stats and could equip spears and lots of body part equipments". If MW's biggest strengths come from qualities not associated with the RPG genre, it feels dishonest to say the least when you criticize Skyrim for being just the same.

The real problem here is how Bethesda judged that, instead of improving and making their stuff more fun to use, they just took them away.

MELEE combat is bad, the rest is serviceable. And it's not much worse than the clickfest of Skyrim or Oblivion, in where any village retard who has never even wielded a stick for herding some damn goats becomes and immediate master fighter by merely picking up any type of weapon.

facepalm2.jpg
 

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