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If you could change one event in gaming history. . .

PorkaMorka

Arcane
Joined
Feb 19, 2008
Messages
5,090
Simple.

In order to save gaming, I would travel back in time and stop the 3d accelerator from ever being invented.

Without 3d acceleration,many of the major problems that plague gaming today would never have occurred.

The focus on graphics over gameplay would be reduced.

Development costs would be lowered, so we'd see more games coming out.

Everyone who owned a new PC could play games on it, so PC gaming would remain strong.

When a system is 2d it also changes the type of games that developers put out for it. For example, the GBA had tons and tons of mediocre turn based strategy/strategy rpg titles.

Action RPGs would still exist but they'd be pretty boring without the eye candy, so hopefully they'd be less popular.
 

Volourn

Pretty Princess
Pretty Princess Glory to Ukraine
Joined
Mar 10, 2003
Messages
24,924
"MotB and The Witcher are both excellent PC exclusives though."

MOTB is excellent. TW ie. The Witcher sucks the shit.



"Bioware and Bethesda are already on the console bandwagon"

BIO has been on the 'console bandwagon' since their inception.


"CD Projekct and indie RPGs (for which you don't need a good gaming PCl)?"

CDP have alreayd discussed making console games or console versions of their games. *shrug* And, indy games - by and large - suck. Most of their are basically rip off mainstream games anyways. *shrug*
 

Mareus

Magister
Joined
Apr 5, 2008
Messages
1,404
Location
Atlantis
J1M said:
Mareus said:
Furthermore consoles are evolving too, but one thing I am sure off when it comes to japanese developers. They will put a lot of effort into the story. Some of you may hate japanese games, but I am most of the times amazed by the story they manage to produce. Even games like Kingdom Hearts, which I thought would be just a silly FF clone, turned out... WOW for me.
Unfortunately, those of us who had parents that read us the Berenstein Bears as children find jap game stories sorely lacking in all respects. Especially character design, dialogue, plot, motivation, and internal consistency.

Frankly, calling Kingdom Hearts' story coherent is a stretch. I don't have the diction to describe what calling it "WOW" would be.

Well, I must say I don't agree with you. I find Japanese storytelling good and characters are very often very emotional. Maybe a bit too emotional, but they certainly feel more alive than what we have been getting out of PC games lately. Their heroes usually have a flaw and a big hearth. Sure, it may not be as deep as PST, or original as Arcanum, but I find it quite refreshing from typical Tolkien clones.

As for people who have started this conversation about if a consoles are a good investment, I must say that in today's day and age you can very easily own both. Computers are not 2000 $ investment like some guy mentioned. You can really get a decent computer for less than 1000$ and you don't need to upgrade it for at least two years. Consoles are cheap and if you buy them from a friend or someone who doesn't play it anymore, you can really get it practically for free.

But consoles are in no way responsible for drop of quality in PC gaming. Like I said, there are some very good console titles, so console is capable of creating good titles. The problem is in developers who are trying to combine the impossible. Casual with hardcore and PC with consoles. You don't see console games doing stupid stunts like that and that is why consoles are evolving, while PC gaming is going backwards. PC developers mostly come from the west and we all know how greedy westeners are. Japs at least do things the way they want to do them and money as much as it is important, is not the only reason for making their games.
 
Joined
Apr 4, 2007
Messages
3,585
Location
Motherfuckerville
SpaceKungFuMan said:
Are there 360 exclusives that are more appealing to you than MotB, TW, SoZ, or DA?

To a degree....yeah. Ninja Gaiden 2 is the last game in a while that hasn't had a large amount of parts in it that feel like nothing more than a chore or timesink designed to make the package feel like more of a value. Barring Dragon Age being as fun as BG2 was to me, I don't see any of those games not loading me up with chore-like gameplay to get to the good stuff. Why do I have to fight a horde of epic gnolls or a cave full of spirits with the abysmal Neverwinter Nights 2 combat engine and Obsidian's "I can't believe it's not challenging" combat design to get to some meaty role-playing in Mask of the Betrayer? Baldur's Gate 2 had a lot of combat, but at least it was engaging and fun and wasn't a chore. The same thing worries me about The Witcher, but even more because action combat, no matter how crappy, doesn't at least let you zone out in the boring parts and still win. Dragon Age is the one I'm most excited (and most likely to be disappointed by) about because it seems to promise a (hopefully) slightly less generic high fantasy flavored BG2, which I wouldn't mind. I'm just hoping "tough noogies" is the word all throughout the design process.

And Age of Decadence or Scars of War (games that look to have that fun almost all over feel) don't require me to be in the hardcore, modern PC gaming realm so I see even less reason to re-enter it.

Maybe if I was really into fast paced first-person shooters, or real-time strategy or other PC staples that aren't in such a decline, I'd have more reason to be in the market. But as of now, the games I like aren't being made and it doesn't seem very smart to kick in the money for PC gaming when consoles are available to me cheaper and without the hassle of modern PC gaming (I actually "owned" my copy of Mass Effect...or it least it felt more like a product-based model).

I guess I don't want to jump through hoops getting into PC gaming only to have the games make me jump through hoops to get to the good content. I suppose I'm lazy.

Also, for what its worth the upgrade prices are the lowest now they've been in years. You can get a fantastic crysis playing video card for $200 now.

Laptops unfortunately can't be upgraded to the best of my knowledge in regards to graphics cards. Desktops....don't really work for me. At least I don't know how to do it. Hell....if I could.....I might pick up a cheaper one to run Starcraft 2 and Dragon Age.
 

Dark Matter

Prophet
Joined
Jun 17, 2007
Messages
1,227
Location
Toronto
"Are there 360 exclusives that are more appealing to you than MotB, TW, SoZ, or DA?"

Wasn't DA announced for consoles?
 

Volourn

Pretty Princess
Pretty Princess Glory to Ukraine
Joined
Mar 10, 2003
Messages
24,924
"tough noogies"

Nope. Regenerating mana *and* health during combat. *yawn*
 
Joined
Nov 8, 2007
Messages
6,207
Location
The island of misfit mascots
The decision to co-develop Deus Ex 2 for the console. The saddest part is that if you read the Warren Spector interviews a few years later, you get the picture that the guy really really thought that he could make a decent follow up to his Deus Ex 1 despite console limitations and simplification, and actually realises the mistakes he made. He started off in denial but later on was known to make comments pleading that he really didn't mean to dumb it down so much. And the saddest part is that the game's crappness really seemed to break the man - the guy who did (correct me if I'm wrong) Ultima Underworld, System Shock (one of them) and Deus Ex 1 basically went into career meltdown and retreated to making mobile phone games.
 

RK47

collides like two planets pulled by gravity
Patron
Joined
Feb 23, 2006
Messages
28,396
Location
Not Here
Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
I think a lot of good can be done by just stopping EA from taking over several gaming studios. Let them stick to their FIFA 20XX
 

Pegultagol

Erudite
Joined
Feb 4, 2005
Messages
1,183
Location
General Gaming
I wish it could have been Troika that snapped the rights to Fallout up, making it possible to regroup the development team and attract potential publishers. If there would have been shortfalls, they probably could have even counted on donations.

At least this place would be a lot more optimistic in its opinions on RPGs then.

Or what if Black Isle was able to successfully complete either of Torn, Black Dog, or Fallout 3? Probably that would entail more than just a single moment in history of gaming revised, but one thing could have led to the other, you know?
 

Herbert West

Arbiter
Joined
Nov 19, 2007
Messages
1,293
Hm, I dislike John Romero for what he's become, but I'd prevent his pathetic fall from grace, since it had influenced the entire industry's image in a really bad way.
Either that or prevent him from doing anything post-quake.
 

Annonchinil

Scholar
Joined
Mar 12, 2007
Messages
844
RK47 said:
I think a lot of good can be done by just stopping EA from taking over several gaming studios. Let them stick to their FIFA 20XX

Why? ActiBliz already is dropping Brutal Legend? And EA or the copanies it owns/partners make some pretty good games, several of them PC exclusive too.
 

Gold

Augur
Patron
Joined
May 18, 2007
Messages
504
Dead State Project: Eternity Wasteland 2
Trojan_generic said:
I'd cancel EA's acquisition of Origin.
+1
Jasede said:
I'd cancel the founding of EA.
+1

Actually if EA had stayed as a smaller developer rather than the publishing empire it became, it's own quality might have stayed decent.

my 2cents.
 

Jaesun

Fabulous Ex-Moderator
Patron
Joined
May 14, 2004
Messages
37,262
Location
Seattle, WA USA
MCA
Trojan_generic said:
I'd cancel EA's acquisition of Origin.

So you would have wanted Origin to go bankrupt and do a Troika?

Granted, we then would never have seen Ultima 8 and 9, which really would not be that much of a loss.

Though that would mean that Origin/EA did not create the first successful MMOG. That would be interesting...
 

Trojan_generic

Magister
Joined
Jul 21, 2007
Messages
1,565
Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming!
So you would have wanted Origin to go bankrupt and do a Troika?

Maybe. Origin doesn't exist anymore anyway, and the UO was the only significant thing they made with EA. It could also have been another company buying Origin.
 

4too

Arcane
Joined
May 20, 2004
Messages
288
Retro Darwinism At T Minus 33 RPM

Retro Darwinism At T Minus 33 RPM



As for all this Monday morning quarterbacking, rave on.

Always good to educate the possibilities, the delta streams of choice and consequence.
Continuous finger pointing and flag waving around 'what if' scenarios might cut a circular rut,
at that point, play it backwards and maybe we can channel a psychic hot line to John Lennon or Charles Manson.
Oh, if Manson ain't dead yet, that may be a direct psychotic feed. Please disregard.



Once upon a time in the analogue age,
when the vinyl LP spun at musical 33,
t'was a paper carpeted land with a superimposed hexagonal grid,
on which cardboard legions cross referenced their tables of fate to the roll of 6 sided dice.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strategy_&_Tactics

Wikipedia said:
...
When TSR took over SPI, it made a colossal blunder: it refused to honour commitments to these dedicated S&T subscribers. SPI unfortunately had no assets to its name when the takeover occurred, and over 1,000 subscribers had been accorded "life-time" status, meaning that they were entitled to all future issues without any further payment. TSR saved money in the short term, but alienated its best customers.
Greg Costikyan claims that this was the turning point in the wargaming industry; few S&T subscribers renewed, even though the magazine continued to be published (TSR published issues 91 through 111); many also refused to buy any TSR titles due to bitterness over the handling of their subscriptions.

SPI's design staff moved on to Avalon Hill, where they set up a sub-company based in New York called Victory Games. It produced many unique and popular titles, which by the late 1980's were outselling even Avalon Hill games. TSR continued making games, hoping to recoup its investment in SPI (another reason was the enthusiasm of some staff members for wargaming), but despite a healthier distribution chain than SPI had enjoyed, its wargame line was never successful. S&T Magazine was eventually sold to 3W, a small company which published The Wargamer magazine, a direct competitor. By this time, other companies were also stepping up production, and a splintered market ensured that the days of selling 50,000 copies or more of a title were gone. Publishers became happy to sell 10,000 copies, with 20,000 being considered phenomenal.
...


Board games were most often turned based, yet some of the small unit tactical simulations experimented with "phases".
Yah, in the 1970's, real time with pause, kids.
Hex grid made it's commercial debut in the 1960's, nothing new there , so move on.
Difficulty in arranging to meet with human opponent made the concept of AI a wistful 'gleam in the eye', and long spells of solitaire side swapping.
Fog of war efforts were silently begging for an umpire or game master.
The more complex games were a plea for digital representation.

I am suggesting that while p-n-p was d-n-d-ing,
a parallel enhanced growth of the board game demographic would have broadened the demand for strategic and tactical gaming,
even before the 8-bit processors had their day.
A broader base of educated gamers in the hundreds of .... well lets speculate, the hundreds of thousands would have been ready, willing, and able ...
to abandon the paper hexagonal grids and card board pieces for what ever 4 or 8 color glory that would have been awaiting them, if,
if,
SPI had survived to nurture this lost and forgotten market with even grander issues of STRATEGY AND TACTICS MAGAZINE!
No guarantee that the history buffs would have been any less addicted to tales of mighty thews grappling with lusty elven love goddesses,
still, many would have been ready at the drop of a Kepi to argue with extreme righteousness the number of grains of powder in the various paper cartridges at the Battle of Gettysburg.
Think of the shear gravitational mass of outrageous opinion that those valiant veterans of contrary discourse could have mustered, if ...
if they had not been demobilized after the fall of SPI.
D and D might have meant Dahlgrens and Dragoons!

Round and around we go,
some times, paraphrasing Douglas Adams, some times ... I think it was a mistake to come down from the trees.
But, that's an extreme retro Darwinism, I will just have to live without.
So all you Monday morning quarterbacks, you arm chair generals,
load up your turn tables, and,
rave on.

Rave On said:
Little things you say and do
Make me want to be with you
Rave on, this crazy feelin'
And I know it's got me reelin' ...


4too
 

MINIGUNWIELDER

Scholar
Joined
Sep 9, 2005
Messages
604
WoW would not exist, Blizzard would have never hired Zipatoni's founders to shit all over EQ.

So, either people play single player games or they play an actually interesting MMO.
 

MINIGUNWIELDER

Scholar
Joined
Sep 9, 2005
Messages
604
No, wait, the man responsible for the xbox should have died in a clinton era version of 9/11 that was unsuccesful.
 

Helton

Arcane
Joined
Jan 29, 2007
Messages
6,789
Location
Starbase Delta
Black Isle develops one more new, original IP and game.

Every extra hour of that goodness would swell our ranks factorially.
 

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