Games with brutal 'skill' based difficulty.

[Mangoose]

http://www.rrrrthats5rs.com/games/dont-shoot-the-puppy/

 

[JrK]

http://www.youtube.com/user/LordsOfTheG ... UUV5itZAPs

Lots of savestate abuse but it is not nearly as much fun without. :D

 

[spectre]

I thought Jets and Guns require some fricken tight reflexes.

But that's just me, I am ambi-sinister when it comes to twitch gameplay.

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

The ones with the best quality/difficulty ratio are the 2D Oddworld games (that would be Abe's Oddysee and Abe's Exoddus).

It will get easier after some time of practice and all that, but they're never forgiving.

I absolutely love those two. It also bears mention that the games have aged very gracefully in every way, they still look nice for example.

Though the lack of Quiksave in Oddyssee was really annoying in retrospect.

They're also a classic example of less-is-more approach on gameplay design.

 

[Palikka]

Except in games like this you have to let bullets overlap with your character sprite to squeeze through. Some I've played there's no real logic to where hitbox ends and cosmetic bits of spaceship/flying loli begin so it feels really cheap.

Well, that boss was the True Last Boss(tm). Something you will not meet unless you really become pro at that particular game. The normal gameplay looks more like this. Not too much of bullet hugging on your regular playthroughs.

I'm sure once you figure out the size of your sprite's weak point, the challenge of holding down the fire button and squirming through a maze of slowly moving jelly beans is perfectly skill-based. I remember playing a japanese freeware shooter where your the player character/object was just a orange dot with some transparent rods rotating around it and I found it very entertaining without that contrived difficulty curve.

The hitboxes do sometimes get a bit silly (like in CAVE games even the bullets have smaller hitboxes than their graphics..) but it's really not that hard. Play one game for few hours and it should become a non-issue.

.. or play games with proper hitboxes, like Raiden II.

 

[Phelot]

I'm not sure if I understand OP maybe because I've never played Ninja Gaiden for XBox, but I assume we're talking tough on player skills, right?

Anyway

Blade of Darkness can be brutal at times. Certainly little room for mistake although some enemies can be exploited pretty easily.

A lot of old NES games can be tough. The original NES Ninja Gaiden's are a challenge. I'd say 2 is the easiest with 3 clearly being the toughest and in a lot of ways because Ryu is nerfed, especially his sword.

Street Fighter 2010 Final Fight is pretty tough. You have to perform a lot of difficult jumps, though NG1 was probably tougher.

Castlevania 1 and maybe 3 are tough. Castlevania 1 had the most rage inducing Frankenstein boss of all the games IMO. Fucking hunchbacks. Actually those are one of the most annoying critters in a platformer ever. If you don't kill them immediately then their jumping can be a pain.

Except in games like this you have to let bullets overlap with your character sprite to squeeze through. Some I've played there's no real logic to where hitbox ends and cosmetic bits of spaceship/flying loli begin so it feels really cheap.

I like these style games, but not when you have to be autistic to figure out the dodge pattern. Pretty lame and in a lot of arcade games, they were a blatant way of killing a player's quarters.

 

[Falkner]

No one has mentioned I Wanna Be The Guy?

 

[Xor]

No one has mentioned I Wanna Be The Guy?

Also there's I Wanna Be The Guy

 

[XenomorphII]

The Ghouls and Ghosts (I think that's the name) games for NES/SNES were ridiculously hard.

 

[bussinrounds]

I'm not sure if I understand OP maybe because I've never played Ninja Gaiden for XBox, but I assume we're talking tough on player skills, right?

Anyway

Blade of Darkness can be brutal at times. Certainly little room for mistake although some enemies can be exploited pretty easily.

A lot of old NES games can be tough. The original NES Ninja Gaiden's are a challenge. I'd say 2 is the easiest with 3 clearly being the toughest and in a lot of ways because Ryu is nerfed, especially his sword.

Street Fighter 2010 Final Fight is pretty tough. You have to perform a lot of difficult jumps, though NG1 was probably tougher.

Castlevania 1 and maybe 3 are tough. Castlevania 1 had the most rage inducing Frankenstein boss of all the games IMO. Fucking hunchbacks. Actually those are one of the most annoying critters in a platformer ever. If you don't kill them immediately then their jumping can be a pain.

Except in games like this you have to let bullets overlap with your character sprite to squeeze through. Some I've played there's no real logic to where hitbox ends and cosmetic bits of spaceship/flying loli begin so it feels really cheap.

I like these style games, but not when you have to be autistic to figure out the dodge pattern. Pretty lame and in a lot of arcade games, they were a blatant way of killing a player's quarters.

Yea, as far as the original Castlevania goes, Frankie was a bitch and Igor was the pain in the balls. I never did beat that damn Grim Reaper. I'm gonna have to play that shit on an emulator and beat it now.

 

[Satori (original)]

The Ghouls and Ghosts (I think that's the name) games for NES/SNES were ridiculously hard.

The Megadrive/Genesis games were good too, check them out if you haven't yet as they have different levels than the Nintendo versions.

 

[bussinrounds]

God Hand.


Every attack can be dodged, luck only factors in on crate drops.

I watched my friend playing that once, and i could of sworn that game was made by fags.

 

[Satori (original)]

It's just throughly tongue in cheek. You should play it for yourself, it really is a fucking brutal game that punishes you badly if you fuck up but you get such a high when being on your top game.

 

[Seymour]

The Ghouls and Ghosts (I think that's the name) games for NES/SNES were ridiculously hard

The NES saw a port of Ghosts 'n Goblins, which really was impossible to beat. The SNES entry in the franchise (Super Ghouls 'n Ghosts) is actually easier than is Arcade predecessor, though it's shitty design and long, drawn-out stages made for a much more harrowing experience.

Now, Ghouls 'n Ghosts, that's where it's at. Probably the second best example of difficulty done right, after Ninja Gaiden Black. The Genesis port is decent, though nowadays you can just emulate the Arcade version.

Castlevania 1 and maybe 3 are tough

Castlevania 3 is definitely the harder one. Some of the later stages were hair-pullingly tough (the one with the Doppleganger as boss, stage 9 I think), with action-heavy stair-climbing sequences in Castlevania stair physics. The second quest also had Medusa Heads replaced with some flying skulls which had very random movement patterns and made some sections very hard.

I never did beat that damn Grim Reaper

If you get to him with Holy Water and any multiplier you can just stun-lock him to death as he spawns, jumping and throwing it repeatedly at the platform in the upper right corner. With other weapons he's probably harder than Drac, especially since you're likely to get hit in the tough section right before him.

 

[Phelot]

The NES saw a port of Ghosts 'n Goblins, which really was impossible to beat. The SNES entry in the franchise (Super Ghouls 'n Ghosts) is actually easier than is Arcade predecessor, though it's shitty design and long, drawn-out stages made for a much more harrowing experience.

Now, Ghouls 'n Ghosts, that's where it's at. Probably the second best example of difficulty done right, after Ninja Gaiden Black. The Genesis port is decent, though nowadays you can just emulate the Arcade version.

Yeah, I recall the stages on the SNES one were much longer than the arcade one, no? Just watched a youtube vid of the NES version and even that one seems a lot shorter. Those games were incredibly frustrating. They don't even give you the decency to have more than a few hits and quite literally "few."

Castlevania 3 is definitely the harder one. Some of the later stages were hair-pullingly tough (the one with the Doppleganger as boss, stage 9 I think), with action-heavy stair-climbing sequences in Castlevania stair physics. The second quest also had Medusa Heads replaced with some flying skulls which had very random movement patterns and made some sections very hard.

The Medusa Heads (and their sprite replacement) are probably the most irritating enemies in that series. Who did you rescue? I usually went for the girl just for her spells. Alucard is too tall lol. Never really got the little guy (Grant?)

If you get to him with Holy Water and any multiplier you can just stun-lock him to death as he spawns, jumping and throwing it repeatedly at the platform in the upper right corner. With other weapons he's probably harder than Drac, especially since you're likely to get hit in the tough section right before him.

Alternatively, the boomerang is pretty good on him, especially since they can knock out a lot of his scythes. The holy water is pure exploit, but hey, that boss isn't very fair to begin with. Though, I can't even recall what Medusa does since I believe I have ALWAYS used holy water spam on her

Boomerang with double or triple shot seemed to be the answer to just about every boss, except, oddly enough the first one in which the axe seems best.

 

[Seymour]

I find that Ghouls n' Ghosts had a pretty balanced (if hard) difficulty level, really. Once you learn the order in which items spawn on chests you'll know which ones to avoid and when to get the Silver Armor back, and it's really well-distributed in levels.

Who did you rescue? I usually went for the girl just for her spells. Alucard is too tall lol. Never really got the little guy (Grant?)

I'm actually big enough a sperglord to have played once with each one (and one solo, for the extra ending). Alucard's projectiles are piss weak, his sprite is too tall as you say, taking some cheap shots for it, and his bat flight ability isn't all that handy. Grant's dagger was nerfed for the american release (he threw it like the subweapon in the original japanese) but he's good for moving around - bigger jumps that allow you to change direction in midair, climbs walls and ceiling. Syfa is probably the better one, her fire spell is common as dirt (I think it replaces both the Dagger and the Axe in candles), cheap to use and plows through bosses.

Alternatively, the boomerang is pretty good on him, especially since they can knock out a lot of his scythes

The problem with the cross/boomerang is really the Axe Armors in the previous screen, who are almost immune to it. But after I read somewhere that using the subweapons to kill normal enemies made them more likely to drop hearts and even multipliers I found that spamming them like crazy on those fuckers and the Medusa Heads works wonders, and it does feel a lot less cheap than offing the hardest bastard in the game via exploit.