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Gamasutra Design Essentials: 20 RPGs

obediah

Erudite
Joined
Jan 31, 2005
Messages
5,051
Brother None said:
...once again prolonging the legend that WoW is "influential"...

And to the 90,000 other posts lambasting WoW.

If you want to talk influence in RPGS, you need to mention a MMORPG, and the two viable choices are Everquest and WoW. I think both are equally valid. EQ took the UO niche idea and broke it into the mainstream. WOW took mainstream EQ and catapulted it into the stratosphere. Sure, I've never played it. I never will. And from everything I here it's a cesspit of casual gamers. But every MMORPG and most if not all RPGs have been influenced by WoW's success.
 

bhlaab

Erudite
Joined
Nov 19, 2008
Messages
1,787
Hell, dungeons and dragons was (arguably) influenced by WoW
 

Relayer71

Liturgist
Joined
Dec 23, 2006
Messages
538
Location
NYC
Good list? Sure.

BUt it doesn't really go in-depth as far as the design elements of those games, it barely scratches the surface. Lame article really.

And I could NOT believe that Fallout and Phantasy Star were left out and PS:T was just a foot note. It's unforgiveable. Phantasy Star was ahead of its time with each release as far as themes and gameplay elements. And Fallout & PS:T are the pinnacle of the PC RPG genre.

What a joke.
 

AzraelCC

Scholar
Joined
Jan 2, 2008
Messages
309
What are the elements of Phantasie Star that made it quite innovative? What are these themes that you found fresh during the games' release? I'd like to know since I found the article helpful especially the ones about jRPGs. Not a big jRPG gamer, and I've started scouring the Internet for those mentioned in the article, if only to see how the jRPG evolved.

I agree that the exclusion of PS:T was questionable, given its fresh take on storytelling. Probably the only RPG where you don't find evil. It's more of a detective story, really.
 

Volourn

Pretty Princess
Pretty Princess Glory to Ukraine
Joined
Mar 10, 2003
Messages
24,924
"PS:T are the pinnacle of the PC RPG genre."

No.



"And I could NOT believe that Fallout and Phantasy Star were left out"

Actually, FO was mentioned in the Wasteland section. Most everyone knows that FO was basically a defacto WL sequel, anyways. *shrug* I'd personally have place FO instead of WL because WL is a nothing that wouldn't even be remembered if it wasn't for FO.

But, people should be Butthurt over lists.

R00fles!
 
Joined
Nov 1, 2008
Messages
7,953
Location
Cuntington Manor
Volourn said:
"PS:T are the pinnacle of the PC RPG genre."

No.



"And I could NOT believe that Fallout and Phantasy Star were left out"

Actually, FO was mentioned in the Wasteland section. Most everyone knows that FO was basically a defacto WL sequel, anyways. *shrug* I'd personally have place FO instead of WL because WL is a nothing that wouldn't even be remembered if it wasn't for FO.

But, people should be Butthurt over lists.

R00fles!

Actually, quite a few people bought Fallout because it was a spiritual successor to Wasteland. It even mentioned Wasteland as a selling point on the box of Fallout. I guess the developers of Fallout thought a little differently to you.

I am also fairly certain that a large percentage of posters here, and indeed many that lambast Wasteland, did not even know of Fallout when it came out and only bought it years later.

In any case, I remember distinctly thinking, while playing Fallout the first time (straight after its release) "this is a damn good game, but it just isn't quite as good as Wasteland". Apart from being a much smaller game, it basically rips off the storyline, including many of the sidequests, with a couple of twists thrown in. Just about every area/quest in Fallout has an incredibly similar, if not identical location/quest in Wasteland.

The main differences is that Wasteland has a lot more of everything except talking and graphics. Wasteland is challenging, it makes you actually have to think and remember things. Fallout is incredibly easy, has little challenge at all, and everything is dumbed down apart from the talky.

Seriously, from someone that played older RPG's, Fallout was not the superduper game that everyone has made it out to be. An excellent RPG? certainly, but better came before it in my opinion.

Easiest way for younger people to understand: Pick a game that you loved that has a sequel that you also enjoyed, but thought elements were dumbed down even if it looked prettier. That is how I have always felt about Wasteland - Fallout.
 

Wyrmlord

Arcane
Joined
Feb 3, 2008
Messages
28,886
Blackadder said:
It even mentioned Wasteland as a selling point on the box of Fallout.
Was it common in 1996 to advertise games based on the merit of another game made 8 years before? :shock:

Really, "quite a few" people bought Fallout, because of the hope of a Wasteland successor? Wasteland, which was made in 1988?
 

Mackerel

Augur
Joined
May 17, 2009
Messages
700
Wyrmlord said:
Blackadder said:
It even mentioned Wasteland as a selling point on the box of Fallout.
Was it common in 1996 to advertise games based on the merit of another game made 8 years before? :shock:

Really, "quite a few" people bought Fallout, because of the hope of a Wasteland successor? Wasteland, which was made in 1988?
I did, it had "Remember Wasteland?" on the box.
 
Joined
Nov 1, 2008
Messages
7,953
Location
Cuntington Manor
Wyrmlord said:
Blackadder said:
It even mentioned Wasteland as a selling point on the box of Fallout.
Was it common in 1996 to advertise games based on the merit of another game made 8 years before? :shock:

Really, "quite a few" people bought Fallout, because of the hope of a Wasteland successor? Wasteland, which was made in 1988?

Wasteland was very popular, something Volourn above must not have realised. Perhaps he was too busy playing Nintendo and Sega RPG's? Who knows.

All I know is that Wasteland was a very popular game, and a lot of people were raging when Meantime fell through (sort of a spiritual sequel using the Wasteland engine). As soon as I heard about Fallout, and the constant name dropping of Wasteland in all the press, I was heavily enthused and couldn't wait until its release. Day one, I was at the store with money in hand to buy this game in an odd shaped box (it was long rather than tall, which most games boxes were like). Plastered in big writing "Remember Wasteland?" on the box.

In any case Wyrmlord, you seem to forget that there are a lot of Fallout fans too. The same fans that are largely pissed at what Fallout 3, a game that is over 10 years after the original, has turned out to be. 8 years isn't such a long time you know...
 

bhlaab

Erudite
Joined
Nov 19, 2008
Messages
1,787
Wasteland's too old for me. I really wish it wasn't, but I just can't get past the hurdles and really get into it
 

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