Dragon Age: Inquisition Pre-Release Thread

[Valestein]

Which leads to the issue that they expect to be catered to equally in a luxury item based on supply and demand. They bitch even when they're given two gay/bi 'mances (DAO/ME3).

And what's the deal with black people? I mean we let some of them into white universities and now it's like all of them want to go. Some people just need to learn their place.

And that deals with handling an entertainment product for best returns.... how exactly?

 

[Valestein]

Honest question, where's your limit? Only Isabela makes her orientation known in all playthroughs, with Anders doing the same if you're playing a male character and pick diplomatic options when talking to him after his first companion quest. Isabela brings it up in banter and stuff all the time since sex is all she talks about, but Anders never mentions liking men again if you reject him that one time.

Essentially, 1.5 out of 9 companions mention not being straight. Is that really too much? Go on and hate on the romances if you don't like them, I'm just curious when things break down for you when it comes to LGB content.

All the companions getting endless heart dialogs bugged me. No, they don't go away if you ignore them once, not all of them anyway. It felt unrealistic and stupid that they were all Hawke-sexual. I don't really give a fuck if you disagree, nor do I give a fuck if you choose to frame that as some kind of pent-up homophobia. I'm 100% okay with well-written homosexual characters. I am not okay with sexbots eager to come on to me filling up my entire roster.

Most of the DA2 crew aren't even straight, bi or gay but sexually confused virtual blow up dolls for the player.

 

[Rake]

The only reason I would ever point out the gay romances in particular is in the case of a Dragon Age 2 where every single companion is bisexual and is super eager to let you know about it. That was a little too much of a hammer to the face for me.

Otherwise the romances in general are what I bitch about.

Honest question, where's your limit? Only Isabela makes her orientation known in all playthroughs, with Anders doing the same if you're playing a male character and pick diplomatic options when talking to him after his first companion quest. Isabela brings it up in banter and stuff all the time since sex is all she talks about, but Anders never mentions liking men again if you reject him that one time.

Essentially, 1.5 out of 9 companions mention not being straight. Is that really too much? Go on and hate on the romances if you don't like them, I'm just curious when things break down for you when it comes to LGB content.

LGB content isn't the problem there. The whole "in your face approach" is, something that Bioware is incapable to avoid. Player-sexual and the heart icons every third dialogue are the latter shit in their games. It doesn't feel like talking to your teammates, it feels like going to a whorehouse and choose your fuckdolls.

Take PoE for example. I wouldn't mind if every single companion was romancable. But they should stick to their orientation, no matter what it is. I don't care if its LGB or necrophilia. And their standards should be more that just "male". Sagani for example. If you are male, dwarf, above 13 charisma, pro dyrwood, racist against elves, and you choose the spesific faction she likes, plus she agree with your in game choices, then you get a couple of lines on top of her normal dialogue. It doesn't need to be "married-for-ever-after-and-had-babies-in-inventory" Bioware romance either, it could range from just flirt, to just sex, to love depending on the companion. And it shouldn't make someone mute if you don't choose to fuck.It should just be flavor on top of an existing character arc, like with Annah and Grace in Torment, just with you most likely missing it due to character choices.

That way romance becomes again a little "cool" instance of reactivity and the game acknowledging your choices, and not the dating sim Bioware made it to be.

 

[Kidd]

All the companions getting endless heart dialogs bugged me. No, they don't go away if you ignore them once, not all of them anyway. It felt unrealistic and stupid that they were all Hawke-sexual. I don't really give a fuck if you disagree, nor do I give a fuck if you choose to frame that as some kind of pent-up homophobia. I'm 100% okay with well-written homosexual characters. I am not okay with sexbots eager to come on to me filling up my entire roster.

There's tons of heart icons available for you to pick, yeah. Even for the characters who aren't even romanceable. The option to flirt will not go away even if you tell Isabela and Anders that you're not interested, but they will only proposition you once. Merrill, Fenris and Sebastian don't ever voice any feelings toward the PC, they're just happy to comply should Hawke-senpai ever notice them.

And hey, I know better than to mistake general Codexian linguistics and tastes for simple homophobia. I may be a Biodrone but shit, I play Fallout as well, you know? All right, that was probably the worst lingual handshake ever, but whatevs.

LGB content isn't the problem there. The whole "in your face approach" is, something that Bioware is incapable to avoid. Player-sexual and the heart icons every third dialogue are the latter shit in their games. It doesn't feel like talking to your teammates, it feels like going to a whorehouse and choose your fuckdolls.

Yeah, I get where you're coming from. Only reason I chose to ask a question is because I never felt like DA2 ever rubbed its LGB content in your face - it was simply there if you wanted to, like a sweet little gay doll-house in the corner of the room should you ever feel like imagining having a tea party. So it confused me where those feelings were coming from.

ME3 was much worse in this regard, with Traynor and Cortez pretty much wearing neon signs of "I'm your gay option." Traynor is introduced with a most awkward attempt at comedy which just happens to contain information that she's totally into ladies, and Cortez spends most of the game talking about his dead husband. While there's theoretically nothing wrong with having a grieving gay guy, I feel it's creepy as hell to introduce a character who essentially makes his personal arc about his newly lost love life and how some Shepard dick can get him in a better mood. Looking at DA2's NPCs that mostly just sit there all quiet-like until you proposition them feels like the subtlest piece of writing ever in comparison.

But yes, I'm quite aware that "I think ME3 did it worse" is not really a way to say "but DA2 did it well."

 

[7/10]

Inclusion of gay romance does not cater to gay people, it caters primarily to political sensibilites of a certain subset of the player community and the political sensibilites of a certain kind of videogame journo. Providing gay people with desirable romance options is merely a by-product of blatant, politically motivated design choices.

 

[Delterius]

I don't know why you get rivalry points when rejecting Anders. Its not that big of a deal but I kinda don't like how someone supposedly getting that pissed just from telling him, no thanks, I am straight.

Most likely because people don't tend to deal with rejection in a calm and rational manner.

If anything, its the obsessive compulsiveness of some who won't let them man up and accept the disapproval points like they should. 'Oohhh I don't want to be cynical around Morrigan but I still want to be her frienddd!' The shitty gift DLC is for you, friend.

Honest question, where's your limit? Only Isabela makes her orientation known in all playthroughs

A lot of people won't read this question as they are meant to. The 'all playthroughs' part is a reference to how the writers justified sexuality in DA2 -- meaning that the companions exist in a state of doubt until you hit on them. The player is actually meant to process things in the following way: if you don't hit on Anders as a guy, who knows, he could have been straight all along.

In other words: they are all Schrodinger's Blow Up Dolls. If this isn't ridiculous to you, I don't know what else could be.

Naturally, this design choice is about social inclusion of all and every majority. The gay people, the yuri/yaoi folks, the straights -- everyone must get their perfect waifu.

This is all fine and good but I being a self important codexer I must include my all important input. To me this doesn't feel like inclusion. Adding a gay/lesbian/transexual character does. This, on the other hand, feels like my character being So Fucking Awesome that the whole world revolves around him. And to me, the player, Merril/Anders/Isabella et al being just cardboard cutouts to strenghten that ideal.

And that deals with handling an entertainment product for best returns.... how exactly?

People can't ask for what they want to consume now?

 

[Deleted member 7219]

I liked how Avellone handled romance in Torment. Sure, you could try and pursue one of the other characters but the game let you know that you were one manipulative, selfish prick for doing it - they were all damaged and vulnerable, and you were taking advantage of them.

I would forgive Gaider for all of his past transgressions if he put something like this in Inquisition. He just needs to have it for one character, encourage the typical Bioware romance obsessives to go after them, give them plenty of warnings along the way that what they are doing isn't a good idea, and then completely humiliate them at the end of it. He can keep all other trashy romances just the same as before, I just want to see it happen for one.

To be fair to Gaider I don't think it is his fault, I think it is some of the other writers on the Dragon Age team that are responsible.

 

[Delterius]

Gaider once told me to fuck off in the BSN. Apparently I and my own were all a thing of the past, a dying breed of consumers full of negativity. I'd still forgive him if he added the perfect biodrone romance thread bait and then made them completely uninterested on the player.

 

[Commissar Draco]

More Heretic burning and less fagottery wherever homo or hetero Pliz; itz supposed to be Game about Holy Inquisition not Sims.

 

[DalekFlay]

LGB content isn't the problem there. The whole "in your face approach" is, something that Bioware is incapable to avoid. Player-sexual and the heart icons every third dialogue are the latter shit in their games. It doesn't feel like talking to your teammates, it feels like going to a whorehouse and choose your fuckdolls.

So much this.

 

[Valestein]

Inclusion of gay romance does not cater to gay people, it caters primarily to political sensibilites of a certain subset of the player community and the political sensibilites of a certain kind of videogame journo. Providing gay people with desirable romance options is merely a by-product of blatant, politically motivated design choices.

This and there's no doubting that the majority of those who pursue "lesbian" romances are dudes.

 

[Kidd]

I liked how Avellone handled romance in Torment. Sure, you could try and pursue one of the other characters but the game let you know that you were one manipulative, selfish prick for doing it - they were all damaged and vulnerable, and you were taking advantage of them.

I would forgive Gaider for all of his past transgressions if he put something like this in Inquisition. He just needs to have it for one character, encourage the typical Bioware romance obsessives to go after them, give them plenty of warnings along the way that what they are doing isn't a good idea, and then completely humiliate them at the end of it. He can keep all other trashy romances just the same as before, I just want to see it happen for one.

Wow, never thought I'd get hype for a romance while reading on the Codex. I want a Cole romance so bad right now. For those who don't read tie-in material, let the biodrone inform you. Cole is

Spoiler

some kind of creature from the Fade from the tie-in book Asunder, who took the form and memories of a child mage. The mage died forgotten by the templars responsible of him, and the Fade entity continues his life - originally unaware he's not the real deal.

He's a mass-murderer who feels the need to kill to stay alive, and his mental state is very much like a little child's even though his physical form has grown up. The recent trailer showed a companion who looked spot on to the artwork released of Cole found on the book's back cover. So basically, he's mysterious and he's a kid in a hot man's body. You can do so many things with that. So many things.

 

[Harg Harfardarssen]

Which leads to the issue that they expect to be catered to equally in a luxury item based on supply and demand. They bitch even when they're given two gay/bi 'mances (DAO/ME3).

And what's the deal with black people? I mean we let some of them into white universities and now it's like all of them want to go. Some people just need to learn their place.

Right? They should just stay in school instead of going to college.

Also in defense of the moar gay dude romance in DA:O it was really just that creepy elf. They couldn't romance Alistair, even though he was clearly gay. :rimshot:

 

[Lhynn]

Fucking useless discussion right here gentlemen, if bioware romances had good writing all of this comments about it would go away. In the end it doesnt really matter that they are there, or that they are morally wrong, it just matters that the execution is shitty.

 

[Delterius]

Fucking useless discussion right here gentlemen, if bioware romances had good writing all of this comments about it would go away.

Sounds like you object to people pointing out how something is bad writing.

 

[kris]

Fucking useless discussion right here gentlemen, if bioware romances had good writing all of this comments about it would go away. In the end it doesnt really matter that they are there, or that they are morally wrong, it just matters that the execution is shitty.

No it wouldn't. Because some, if not many, here are against the concept of Romance in RPGs altogether. and even if they were greatly written and so much in the background that none would notice it, then it would still be discussed.

Not to forget that it is in several ways quite subjective what constitutes a "well written romance".

 

[Lhynn]

Fucking useless discussion right here gentlemen, if bioware romances had good writing all of this comments about it would go away. In the end it doesnt really matter that they are there, or that they are morally wrong, it just matters that the execution is shitty.

No it wouldn't. Because some, if not many, here are against the concept of Romance in RPGs altogether.

Yeah, and some are against icecream or chicken, i dont particularly fancy either but i dont mind having them.

And even if they were greatly written and so much in the background that none would notice it, then it would still be discussed.
Not to forget that it is in several ways quite subjective what constitutes a "well written romance".

What? fuck no, good quality is not something invisible. And yes, it would still be discussed, i am not against that.
Bioware writting is shitty, it doesnt matter if they write about a black pilot docking on shepards bay or whatever. They could have handled the subject differently, it could have been good, even with all the same elements, and if it had been then people wouldnt be speaking of blow up sex dolls as something wrong with the game, even if they were that, provided that it was acknowledged and dealt with in the narrative.

 

[Harg Harfardarssen]

blow up sex dolls as something wrong with the game, even if they were that, provided that it was acknowledged and dealt with in the narrative.

It would be a pretty epic troll if someone, anyone, marketed a game based on romance options only to have it be discovered upon release that all of them are literal blow-up dolls. The loyalty quests would be amazing.

 

[DalekFlay]

Honestly if Bioware's next game has zero romance in it what-so-ever can you imagine the backlash? The stupid fucking Kotaku articles? They've dug themselves a real hole.

 

[Avellion]

The problem I have with Romances in RPGs is that most of them dont really add anything of value to the game and just feel tacked on. This applies to both homosexual and heterosexual romances. They should either add something meaningful to the story and go well along with the themes or provide with interesting gameplay opportunities. Making a romance more of a tool for social engineering and advancing in the political world would be a lot more interesting than romance for the sake of romance and sex.

 

[RK47]

Well modern games are just not long enough for believable romance to develop.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Honestly if Bioware's next game has zero romance in it what-so-ever can you imagine the backlash? The stupid fucking Kotaku articles? They've dug themselves a real hole.

Absolute zero romance would probably be excused as a "new direction for the company". But if the next game doesn't include gay romances, now that's gonna cause some Chernobyl-level meltdowns. And no amount of "well not many players took part in those according to our stats" excuses is gonna save them from Tumblr's wrath.

some stats for fun

lol @ Kaidan's survival rate

 

[RK47]

58% didnt click to interrupt garrus, cause no one expected a fucking qte in mid convo

 

[Tom Selleck]

Holy Jesus:

Two PC players completed Mass Effect 2 28 times.

28 Times.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

(Yikes!)