Crispy™ Does a game really "suck" if you spend 100 hours on it?

[Tito Anic]

Is Deus Ex greatness incarnate? Yes.
Is it flawless? Fuckno.

Semantics? I agree. Deus Ex is GREAT? Agree too. Is there a flawless game? I dont know, maybe Tetris? Which is more revolutionary? Maybe both equally.

Bad use of UE1 graphics

What do you mean by that?

Same engine, different games:

Maybe WoT iis more beautiful, but imo this engine gave us most beautiful and greatest games which hold on good to this moment.

 

[DraQ]

Is Deus Ex greatness incarnate? Yes.
Is it flawless? Fuckno.

Semantics? I agree. Deus Ex is GREAT? Agree too. Is there a flawless game? I dont know, maybe Tetris? Which is more revolutionary? Maybe both equally.

Well, I'd rather have a good game than a flawless one.
A game can do nothing wrong without doing anything terribly right.

Bad use of UE1 graphics

What do you mean by that?

Same engine, different games:

Maybe WoT iis more beautiful, but imo this engine gave us most beautiful and greatest games which hold on good to this moment.

Indeed, that's why DX1 looks are all the more grating. UE1 could absolutely gorgeous in the right hands and most of the time it did, starting from the first Unreal, but DX1 was just fugly.

Poor use of lighting, poor use of novel features like procedurally animated textures, barely any effort to extend architecture and decoration beyond basic textured cubes - you can't even argue that boring utilitarian cyberpunk architecture is always going to lose out to all sorts of cathedrals and shit, because when you do get a cathedral in DX1 it looks like this:

About the only thing that looked good in DX1 was post explosion smoke.
Maybe also burning people running around after application of WP rocket, when viewed from a distance.

 

[Tito Anic]

Poor use of lighting, poor use of novel features like procedurally animated textures, barely any effort to extend architecture and decoration beyond basic textured cubes - you can't even argue that boring utilitarian cyberpunk architecture is always going to lose out to all sorts of cathedrals

Maybe, maybe. Never analysed separate engine functions but allways was overwhelmed by harmony between all the parts of Deus Ex: how music, art, story, gameplay formed flawless great product

 

[Beowulf]

Just browsing through steam:

http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197979626196/recommended/232050/

 

[Serus]

The only interesting thing I saw in this thread is the question which games could we consider flawless. Jools :
1. Grim Fandango
2. Thief: The Dark Project
3. Patrician III
4. Sid Meier's Colonization - not really, the reliance on micromanagement without any help from the interface is a major flaw in my book. Very good game otherwise.

And adding:
5. Master of Orion 1 - this one is a really flawless one imo - elegant design, great replayability, AI that can (almost) play the game. The sequel did some things better but also had significant flaws.


Some others, which while not flawless, come pretty near:
1. The Longest Journey
2. Thief: The Metal Age
3. Half-Life
4. Corsairs (by Microids)
5. Sid Meier's Pirates! (2005 remake) - is this a joke ? If so, then a stupid one.
6. Hitman 2: Silent Assassin
7. Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory
8. 7 Kingdoms (1998)
9. Homeworld

Funny, but not a single RPG. Not on purpose, I just can't think of such an RPG.

I can:

10. Jagged Alliance 2 - voila a "not flawless but comes pretty near" crpg.

 

[SquidLord]

The only interesting thing I saw in this thread is the question which games could we consider flawless. Jools :
1. Grim Fandango
2. Thief: The Dark Project
3. Patrician III
4. Sid Meier's Colonization - not really, the reliance on micromanagement without any help from the interface is a major flaw in my book. Very good game otherwise.

And adding:
5. Master of Orion 1 - this one is a really flawless one imo - elegant design, great replayability, AI that can (almost) play the game. The sequel did some things better but also had significant flaws.


Some others, which while not flawless, come pretty near:
1. The Longest Journey
2. Thief: The Metal Age
3. Half-Life
4. Corsairs (by Microids)
5. Sid Meier's Pirates! (2005 remake) - is this a joke ? If so, then a stupid one.
6. Hitman 2: Silent Assassin
7. Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory
8. 7 Kingdoms (1998)
9. Homeworld

Funny, but not a single RPG. Not on purpose, I just can't think of such an RPG.

I can:

10. Jagged Alliance 2 - voila a "not flawless but comes pretty near" crpg.

JA2, not an rpg.

 

[SquidLord]

Thinking about it in a way RPGs are almost inherently to complex to be perfect.

 

[typical user]

Yes, if I spend 100 hours on a game that is designed to waste my time on repetetive tasks and has no depth into it I consider it to suck. The most prominent examples are The Elder Scrolls series which could take 8 hours to show story but has such huge yet uninteresting map and story I get bored within first hours. Skyrim has many mediocre elements that barely holds my attention because after 20 hours it is hard to drop it when you think what character you have developed, when you are looking at his equipment, journal, skills, etc.

Or Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning. That game is MMO-style single-player game. Every quest tells you to go to some sort of cave or kill groups of mobs scattared around the map, the main story pretty much tells you to go to A, then B, then C then D and E because you have two objectives, then after you beat half of it you are constantly presented with barriers on your way to the end boss, and maps just start shaping into large corridors. Still the story was motivating me to see the ending but it took so long to get there especially since I am completionist with OCD.

If there is a game that has content for 8 hours but is honest about it and has solid price for those 8 hours then I won't say it sucks. If a game has a content spread out to 500 hours which offer around 5 hours of meanigful stuff then it sucks plain and simple. If a game has 15 hour long story but has replayability then I won't say it sucks.

 

[Beastro]

You can't shit on a game without playing it for 100 hours first. On a serious note, whoever played DA:I for 100 hours has to have brain damage.

picture

You can accomplish that in only a few hours.

This issue comes down to the similar situation like getting a bag of candy and polishing off all your favorite flavors. Eventually you're left with the ones you don't like and the ones you hate, but you've got nothing sweet left around the house so you slowly work the unliked ones down and then try some of the ones you hate if only to remind you why you hated them in the first place.

The Dragon Age Inquisitions and Fallout 4s are the disliked candies that, while you're not eager to have them and the taste is a trail to go through, they're something around that has enough of something you don't hate for you to draw out some enjoyment from playing. Actual games that most people hate, those candies you'll throw in the trash rather than slowly work down over time even if they're all you have, are usually downright broken games with nothing of value to enjoy on top of that.

The problem today is people like hyperbole, and while those games aren't good, they're outright demonized and that produces a dissonance that is comical when you realize that same person foaming at the mouth on this forum about what FO4 has done to that franchise has been playing it in all their free time.

 

[Lhynn]

Nonsense, DA:I is the worst game that has the gall to call itself an RPG that i have ever played. Its not awful, its much much worse, and i consider anyone that has played it and liked it a prime shitposter and someone i can safely ignore or look down on. I am not exagerating or trying to be funny. That game is everything thats bad about the current generation of game development in a tight package.

It makes me physically ill to even talk about it, and my experience with it doesnt extend past the first 2 or 3 hours.

 

[Beastro]

Nonsense, DA:I is the worst game that has the gall to call itself an RPG that i have ever played. Its not awful, its much much worse, and i consider anyone that has played it and liked it a prime shitposter and someone i can safely ignore or look down on. I am not exagerating or trying to be funny. That game is everything thats bad about the current generation of game development in a tight package.

It makes me physically ill to even talk about it, and my experience with it doesnt extend past the first 2 or 3 hours.

And how many hours do you have in it?

I personally don't own either it or FO4 and for much the reason reason in your spiel.

 

[Serus]

The only interesting thing I saw in this thread is the question which games could we consider flawless. Jools :
1. Grim Fandango
2. Thief: The Dark Project
3. Patrician III
4. Sid Meier's Colonization - not really, the reliance on micromanagement without any help from the interface is a major flaw in my book. Very good game otherwise.

And adding:
5. Master of Orion 1 - this one is a really flawless one imo - elegant design, great replayability, AI that can (almost) play the game. The sequel did some things better but also had significant flaws.


Some others, which while not flawless, come pretty near:
1. The Longest Journey
2. Thief: The Metal Age
3. Half-Life
4. Corsairs (by Microids)
5. Sid Meier's Pirates! (2005 remake) - is this a joke ? If so, then a stupid one.
6. Hitman 2: Silent Assassin
7. Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory
8. 7 Kingdoms (1998)
9. Homeworld

Funny, but not a single RPG. Not on purpose, I just can't think of such an RPG.

I can:

10. Jagged Alliance 2 - voila a "not flawless but comes pretty near" crpg.

JA2, not an rpg.

And so is your mom.
Seriosuly, i already answered this nonsense more than one time in the past so i won't bother to explain the why again. In short - not only it is a crpg, it is more of a crpg than many games discussed in general rpg discussion section and if JA2 is not a crpg then not a single crpg made before ~mid 1990s is a crpg (well, except perhaps an ultima game or two). Nonsense.

 

[SquidLord]

The only interesting thing I saw in this thread is the question which games could we consider flawless. Jools :
1. Grim Fandango
2. Thief: The Dark Project
3. Patrician III
4. Sid Meier's Colonization - not really, the reliance on micromanagement without any help from the interface is a major flaw in my book. Very good game otherwise.

And adding:
5. Master of Orion 1 - this one is a really flawless one imo - elegant design, great replayability, AI that can (almost) play the game. The sequel did some things better but also had significant flaws.


Some others, which while not flawless, come pretty near:
1. The Longest Journey
2. Thief: The Metal Age
3. Half-Life
4. Corsairs (by Microids)
5. Sid Meier's Pirates! (2005 remake) - is this a joke ? If so, then a stupid one.
6. Hitman 2: Silent Assassin
7. Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory
8. 7 Kingdoms (1998)
9. Homeworld

Funny, but not a single RPG. Not on purpose, I just can't think of such an RPG.

I can:

10. Jagged Alliance 2 - voila a "not flawless but comes pretty near" crpg.

JA2, not an rpg.

And so is your mom.
Seriosuly, i already answered this nonsense more than one time in the past so i won't bother to explain the why again. In short - not only it is a crpg, it is more of a crpg than many games discussed in general rpg discussion section and if JA2 is not a crpg then not a single crpg made before ~mid 1990s is a crpg (well, except perhaps an ultima game or two). Nonsense.

Is Fallout Tactics an RPG? Heros of Might and Magic? Warcarft 3?