Disco Elysium Pre-Release Thread [GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Mustawd]

Kasparov , I take back all the bad stuff I said about your game. Good luck. Art is gorgeous man. That person deserves a raise.

 

[Kasparov]

That person is a team of seven. And Rostov as AD is a delight. Thanks, man.

 

[Prime Junta]

That person is a team of seven. And Rostov as AD is a delight. Thanks, man.

You seem to be a very peculiar art collective. Where the primadonnas at?

 

[Kasparov]

That person is a team of seven. And Rostov as AD is a delight. Thanks, man.

You seem to be a very peculiar art collective. Where the primadonnas at?

Well...

EDIT: Man this thread moves so fast we’re almost catching up with the pace the MCA thread is going at. Talking about UI layouts and shit....

Lest we forget:

COMBAT IN DISCO ELYSIUM
ROBERT KURVITZ
Game Designer

Now that we have a flashy screenshot to illustrate it, let’s talk about combat in Disco Elysium.


1. There are only a handful of instances of it. These are half-scripted, pseudo turn-based, set piece combat encounters. They are not cheap to animate and program. They come along as the pace and style of your investigation dictates. When you get cocky. When you push a violent angle. When you don’t move fast enough. When you’re in the wrong place at the wrong time. This is the narrative logic of a cop thriller, or a hardboiled novel, not a war game.

But they will come along (although only one of the encounters is entirely unavoidable).

2. There are tactical choices to be made. Let’s take the screenshot as an example. The entire scene is one nerve-racking tumble of choices. These bad dudes are trying to get to what’s behind you. (Spoiler territory – not shown in the screenshot). Do you try to talk them down, try a peaceful angle? Or shoot first? As you deplete topics, the conversation will return you to this hub. Taking the shot may have gotten easier if you lulled them into a sense of security – or harder if you’ve been tricked. Your skills will advise you, guide you. But are they right? Maybe they’re just scared?

And that’s only the foreplay. When you do decide to shoot, you do so by clicking on that Hand/Eye Coordination red check. (If it’s your attack of choice of course – what’s available depends on your weapons: more on that later).

What follows is what we writers call a whirl. Think of it as a pseudo-turn. First you either hit or miss with that Villiers 9mm. The resulting havoc will play out in cool and insanely budget-consuming animations. The opposing force will then try to retaliate. At that point the screen will freeze into a time-stop. During this time-stop you take in your immediate surroundings and consult your skills. This is the titular whirl, since you’re constantly directed back to a hub of choices. You may gain tactical information from your surroundings. See what your partner is doing. All the while you’re confronted with a Reaction Speed red check to dodge the incoming enemy fire. That active check becomes harder or easier depending on your skills guidance via passive checks: Visual Calculus has drawn your attention to the angle of attack, Half Light has gotten scared and wants you to run!

Once you click on that red check, you either get shot or dodge the bullet, and enter another whirl.

Using these whirls we can (painstakingly) build any custom combat encounter, and give it the detail and skill-focused storytelling we’re going for.

3. As demonstrated, there are dice rolls, with percentages. A ton of them. We use active dice rolls of the red check variant, where both the negative and positive outcomes are played out. The stars of the show here are: Hand / Eye Coordination, Physical Instrument, and Reaction Speed, but others feature too. And as always, you can buff these rolls with the Electrochemistry system, by carrying a bottle and a ciggie into combat, bad cop style.

4. Your items decide what you can do. No gun – no shooty, etc. They also provide old fashioned bonuses and penalties to the active checks you’re rolling. Wearing a heavy armour makes dodging that shot harder. Having a better gun makes hitting that shot easier. A sports visor keeps the sun from your eye and makes you more likely to get that Visual Calculus tip during the second whirl.

And not only that – thoughts in your thought cabinet may also contribute. These mercenaries are wearing a strange new type of ceramic armour. Research it – for weaknesses! – and that Hand/Eye Coordination gets one of those massive bonuses game devs like to talk about.

5. It’s not all number crunching, it’s also about style. You’re going to want to have a high Pain Threshold character for a combat encounter, just to get painfully immersive information about your body breaking down, in exquisite, spleen rupturing detail. It’s like Nabokov said: dying is fun. (Only it’s really not). Or max out on Shivers and see what this muzzle flash looks like from the perspective of the wind; hear it echo down the street. And you can still use Rhetoric, Drama, Authority etc too — you don’t have to stop talking the opponents down, or taunting them, or relaying information to your squadmate, because the “battle grid” came out. Dialogue options can be part of the whirls.

Okay, so to recap: each whirl begins with all actors moving in a totally unique way, animated by Eduardo Rubio, our animation lead — one hell of an animator, that guy. We use time-stops at the end of each whirl. Then there are options to consult your senses, where skills jive in. And each whirl is exited by rolling another red check that begins another animation, etc. Until the situation is resolved, or you’re dead.

Oh and:

6. If someone gets killed during all this – someone important to you or the case – they stay dead. There is no disconnection between story and combat in Disco Elysium. The results of each decision you make – or fail to make, because you were trying to be diplomatic – is played out. People die, people have their bodies broken. They remember that you tried to punch them and fell over, because you were drunk. This stuff stays with you. You sustain a wound and people say: hey, you don’t look so good officer, stop bleeding in my fishing village.

If this sounds like a lot to produce, then that’s because it is. Do not expect an encounter to await behind every corner. But I thoroughly believe this approach is, if not the future of RPGs, then an early warning of that future. Consider the possibilities: fisticuffs in a burning building, a direct artillery hit on your Station, an exchange of fire during a car crash. These are all action scenes we’ve told in the pen and paper version of the Elysium role playing system. It’s our brand of pen and paper action scene – and this set piece centred combat system is our way of getting it to you, in a video game.

The beauty of the system is — we can just as well put you in a squad based combat situation, as we can have you jumping over a chasm to get into the harbour. It’s a one-size-fits-all solution for action scenes, comprising both combat, and acrobatics / environment interactions. Both use whirls and time-stops.

It is powered by Metric, our downright vitruvian character customization that represents the human mind and body in a realistic manner, and was made possible with some pretty complicated animation programming.

Next time we’ll talk about those Motoric skills that are crucial to surviving a situation like this:

 

[luinthoron]

I can no longer unsee the other merc's weapon lagging behind the movement of the body...

 

[Cael]

I can no longer unsee the other merc's weapon lagging behind the movement of the body...

The other merc's female, and the weapon was... bouncy :D

 

[Haba]

ELECTROCHEMISTRY [Critical: Success] - Let's dance, baby!

1. Put it in.
2. Put it in.
3. Put it in.
4. Put it in.
5. Put it in.
6. Put it in.
7. PUT IT IN!​

 

[Kasparov]

ELECTROCHEMISTRY [Critical: Success] - Let's dance, baby!

1. Put it in.
2. Put it in.
3. Put it in.
4. Put it in.
5. Put it in.
6. Put it in.
7. PUT IT IN!​

Amateur hour... fixed it.

 

[Prime Junta]

Some of us are shitposting from work.

 

[Kasparov]

This is what I do with my lunch breaks. Rostov does spitpaints, I troll on our own thread.




If I keep this up I’ll have to re-post the combat news piece a third time. Sure would be nice to have it as a news post

 

[Marat Sar]

how many can you max in a playthrough?

Balancing is still very much in process so I can't say precisely -- but the main choice that encourages many playthroughs is how much you put into the four attributes at character creation (beginning of the game). The starting bonus is also the learning cap, see. So if you roll a 6 INT and 4 FYS character, you can put 6 points into all INT skills and 4 into all FYS skills. At the same time your PSY (Psyche) and MOT (motorics) are gonna have to be pretty low for that, so those skills are all stunted. There are ways to raise the learning caps, by completing Thoughts, but that's a little thing; only effects one or two skills under an attribute. You still won't get the higher level PSY and MOT skills doing their thing. And even that 4 in FYS means you won't get everything under that. So I'd say... 4 playthroughs is what I would do. Each with one stat at 6 and one at 2 or 1 to also see how being really weak at something affects me too. (You want to do only one playthrough, roll a 4-3-3-4 character. Boring master of none.)

As to how much XP you'll have to fill in those caps -- get those skills to max? If we balance well you would have just about enough to max out everything to your natural cap, given you're a thorough lawnmower with the quests. There's one "but": you also need XP to open new slots in your Thought Cabinet, which will lead to researching new thoughts and getting interesting effects from them, like you would from Perks in fallout. So you may also want to do another, really Thought Cabinet heavy playthrough, where you sacrifice some of that skill upgrading XP to see what secrets the Cabinet holds.

One complaint we will get is that the game was too short. People will not be thorough, and will miss areas and cases, but even if they do all of it, the game won't be bethesda-long. At the same time, there is so much content hidden away in the skills and different character builds -- and in the choices you make too, closing off some things. It's really meant to be played at least two more times if you liked the first playthrough. Unlike most RPGs which, let's be honest, are not. They're meant to be played once, and then once again 3 years later. If you want to be a mega-completionist with Disco Elysium it's gonna take 4 to 5 times to get almost everything.

If we get to do an expansion I'd like to add content to the skills and the map, raising that number to 7, sort of turn Disco Elysium into a deci-roguelike. But that's the dream end goal.

Are we gonna get over-the-top death animations y/n?

Not ribcage blowing stuff, more realistic, but there are some death animations and I dig them.

 

[Zombra]

One complaint we will get is that the game was too short.

Does this mean you have a ballpark idea of how many hours a "typical" playthrough will be?
I won't ask you how many hours that is because I'm sure you'd hate to commit before the game is released.

Instead, I will ask a totally unrelated question: what's your top record at a hot dog eating contest? 20? 5-8? Less than 4? An estimate would be appreciated.

 

[Cael]

Not ribcage blowing stuff, more realistic, but there are some death animations and I dig them.

 

[Parabalus]

Combat looks like what T:ToN was promising, hope you can nail it much better than them (which isn't too hard).

 

[Background Character]

If you want to be a mega-completionist with Disco Elysium it's gonna take 4 to 5 times to get almost everything.

I'm gonna do it I want to be the Disco Elysium master

roll a 4-3-3-4 character. Boring master of none.)

Yes this is just like real life for me

 

[Big Wrangle]

I don't think I'll mind the lenght as long as it's well executed. After all, Planescape: Torment wasn't like super long either.

 

[Marat Sar]

what's your top record at a hot dog eating contest? 20? 5-8? Less than 4? An estimate would be appreciated.

When I'm insanely, thoroughly hungry I can get 40 of those bad boys in me. But that's just hot dogs, not hours of playtime in an open world RPG, which is impossible to predict atm.

When I'm just blowing through a regular weekend eating hot dogs, I can get like 25-30 of them in me, yeah. I mean hot dogs of course -- only a suicidal idiot would predict playtime for his unpolished and still in production RPG, then broadcast it on rpg codex.

And when I'm not really in competition at all, just want a hot dog -- only eating the sausages and some of the mustard to quench my inexplicable love for bunless hot dog sausages -- I can eat 15 or so hot dogs. That's when I'm speed-eating hot dogs, not speedrunning an open world RPG, or making claims about one that may later be quoted back to me in an unsatisfied customer review.

 

[frajaq]

How much police work accounting is gonna be in the game? Do we have to report back to the precinct constantly and deal with the consequences with upper ranks or is the interaction mostly only with other low-level cops?

 

[Marat Sar]

How much police work accounting is gonna be in the game? Do we have to report back to the precinct constantly and deal with the consequences with upper ranks or is the interaction mostly only with other low-level cops?

The answer would go too deep into spoilerland I'm afraid, but it's there. Precinct 41 is there and there is accountability and protocol.

 

[Tacheul]

Do the skills / facets of your personality intervene more often if their score is high? Conversely do the despised skills interact little or nothing with the character?
Or is it only the nature of their interventions that changes according to their score?
I'm obsessed with this game and I need my daily new information about it to survive until release.

 

[Marat Sar]

Do the skills / facets of your personality intervene more often if their score is high? Conversely do the despised skills interact little or nothing with the character?
Or is it only the nature of their interventions that changes according to their score?
I'm obsessed with this game and I need my daily new information about it to survive until release.

:D LOL.

It's my two days off, so I'm here to google my own game and give an un-rockstarsmanlike amount of information on it.

Passive skills (the famous talking skills) are gates. You need to have INT+Logic+bonuses from Thought Cabinet and drugs => 10 for a Normal difficulty Logic to "fire" as we say. When it does a skill talks to you. There are indeed occasions where you failed to pass a high Endurance gate, and a medium Endurance version of that skill will speak now. Failing that, an even lower one. The content of those interjections gets worse and worse. The lower Endurance tells you you're having chest pain again, for example. One of our writers, the illustrious Märten Rattasepp, is sometimes fond of building these little passive ladders. And then there are what we call anti-passives, that just check if you have very little of something. Both anti-passives and ladders are exceptions though, as a rule passives checks are of the "you have to be at least this tall to ride the rollercoaster" type. Their content is something they at least "think" might be useful to you.

To get skills to give you totally rotten, insane ideas you have to fail an active check. If passives are just slills firing off on their own, actives are you calling upon them: c'mon, help me out Authority, I'm in trouble. Warning! If you click on an active skill you will summon it, whether you succeeded or not. If you fail, you just summon a failed version of it. More often than not the skill does not know it's failing, and thus -- neither does the character you're playing. Just you, the player, left to watch some pretty intense meltdowns.

Reminder to self -- the player should have option to tell the skill: "Hey man, you sure? This feels like another meltdown..." and the skill replies: "This isn't a meltdown, this is a melt-through! You're melting through the problem!"
(This Kanye type of guy seems like either Voliton or Conceptualization to me...)

 

[AwesomeButton]

Excellent. The game exploiting the player's confidence in his meta knowledge, and actually testing the player's reasoning as opposed to just stat checks. This is the way of Avellone and AoD.

 

[Joined on the 4th of July]

Now I get what you're saying about turning your neck maybe being more work than looking up and down, but you're also essentially talking about just not using most of the screen.

One good way to solve this head-turning problem is to place all the important information closer to the center of the screen.

 

[ArchAngel]

Kasparov , I take back all the bad stuff I said about your game. Good luck. Art is gorgeous man. That person deserves a raise.

OMG. Does this mean.. are you going to.. admit.. DE is.. a RPG afterall?

 

[AwesomeButton]

Now I get what you're saying about turning your neck maybe being more work than looking up and down, but you're also essentially talking about just not using most of the screen.

One good way to solve this head-turning problem is to place all the important information closer to the center of the screen.

No HuD. So immersive!