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CKII is released.

Joined
Feb 11, 2007
Messages
2,951
Anyway, reading that last dev diary did get my interest up again. How would you consider the state of the vanilla game by now?
An incoherent mess, like it was for a while now. And every DLC ads more to the pile.

I'm also wondering if they fixed the gameworld ever moving forward.
Not really. Some things are a bit different if you start form later dates (like Constantinople county losing half of holdings after the 4th Crusade), and generally counties start more developed later on, but that's as far as it goes.

Can provinces get hefty negative modifiers?
They can get some, but they are very temporary and most often just ignorable unless you are is such a situation that every gold piece and soldier counts.

Can buildings be destroyed? Can settlements be diminished?
By raiding or pillaging (if you re nomad) only. And even then it can take decades to completely destroy a single developed holding.

Is there a possibility that traveling by sea ends in disaster?
Nope.

Last but not least, how are the mayor mods now? Any that are truly worthwhile? Geheimnisnacht and GOT look like fun but I do wonder if there are any good ones that work with the basic CK2 formula.
HIP and CK2+ are the big ones in that department. You should try one of them instead of vanilla, they add a shit ton of stuff and fix some vanilla shit as well.
 

Turrul

Augur
Joined
Aug 16, 2014
Messages
212
Last but not least, how are the mayor mods now? Any that are truly worthwhile? Geheimnisnacht and GOT look like fun but I do wonder if there are any good ones that work with the basic CK2 formula.

Warhammer mod looks pretty fun, too bad my computer is kinda ancient and runs it like shit.

AGOT is still the same in terms of style, you either hate it or love it. It has a petty kingdoms sub-mod that makes the mod pretty fun, at least for me.

There's a Silmarillion mod coming soon and their moddb page looks promising. Elder Kings is nice too, even tho it's still somewhat WIP.

Birthright 2 is my favorite atm even though it's eastern half of the map is kinda dull. It's also pretty good in terms of performance, kinda like poor man's Geheimnisnacht :D.
 
Joined
Feb 11, 2007
Messages
2,951
Dammit, didn't notice a new version of HIP was out.Some big changes regarding decay of empires and heresies. My two favourite things, but I'm not sure I want to restart the game now. It seems to me that differences between HIP and CK2+ are reduced with each new version.

Imperial decay is now a thing, similar to old muslim decadence, and can significantly weaken large blobs if unchecked. Goes up with succession, ruler traits, corruption, lost wars, and down with won wars, coronations and ruler traits.

Heresies got a lot of flavour to them, finally, and there are more of them now. But I'm not so sure about some changes there. Cathars in particular got hit with so many fertility penalties chances of kids are really close to zero. Now, I'm sure cathars had a lot of silly ideas historically (though there is propaganda mixed somewhere in there as well), but where this loses me is in the assumption that everyone would follow them even remotely like this if it ever went mainstream.
 
Joined
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Weren't the Cathar like Buddhists where you had the people who were doing that whole spiritual journey crap but most people weren't
 

Barbarian

Arcane
Joined
Jun 7, 2015
Messages
7,348
Heresies got a lot of flavour to them, finally, and there are more of them now. But I'm not so sure about some changes there. Cathars in particular got hit with so many fertility penalties chances of kids are really close to zero. Now, I'm sure cathars had a lot of silly ideas historically (though there is propaganda mixed somewhere in there as well), but where this loses me is in the assumption that everyone would follow them even remotely like this if it ever went mainstream.

They believed procreation was one the worst sins(condemning a soul to live in the corrupt creation of the demiurge), and that is why they encouraged anal sex and oral for those who could not remain celibate and also accepted homossexuality. Yeah, I think harsh fertility penalties are pretty accurate. Do they get mechanics involving suicide and euthanasia? They approved and practiced those as well.

There are many historians who assume the Church overblew a great deal of the information that survived about the Cathars, but I personally don't buy it. Gnostics have always been looney tunes, I don't think the Cathars would have been any different. And their strange social reforms described in the chronicles do fit entirely with their beliefs(and there is no question about the veracity of the chronicles on the matter of their beliefs).
 
Joined
Feb 11, 2007
Messages
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Oh, I don't doubt they were a kooky cult with weird ideas. My problem is that it remains the same kooky cult in the game when they go mainstream and start converting entire kingdoms, even driving catholicism into extinction. I believe that any sect or cult that manages to take and hold any significant measure of power would need to abandon (or at least ignore really hard) those parts of its dogma that would severely damage or destroy its own society - and by extension itself. Especially if they run counter to human nature or common sense (and "thou shalt not fuck and have kids" is a bit of a whopper in that regard).

In the game with the base fertility penalty and other changes I'd estimate that cathar parents would have only a quarter number of kids of normal parents. This is beyond silly - society in the medieval era is not possible with those birthrates, it's just not happening. There'd be nobody left to work the fields within a generation. Me, I'd just give a chaste trait to zealos cathars and a small piety cost to marriage. Sure, it's less dramatic and interesting, but I feel it would be closer to what an actually working cathar society could be like (if it ever managed to exist that is) than what we got here.
 
Joined
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. I believe that any sect or cult that manages to take and hold any significant measure of power would need to abandon (or at least ignore really hard) those parts of its dogma that would severely damage or destroy its own society - and by extension itself. Especially if they run counter to human nature or common sense (and "thou shalt not fuck and have kids" is a bit of a whopper in that regard).
like modern china?
 

Barbarian

Arcane
Joined
Jun 7, 2015
Messages
7,348
I don't know, I personally think that Catharism woud be a dead end to any society. Those people weren't having kids and were killing themselves off in significant numbers. They would just die off eventually. The Church gets a lot of flak to this day for pulling a full EXTERMINATUS on the Cathars, but do you honestly think Europe would have survived the cancer if it had spread? And it was spreading, that is why the albingensian crusades happened in the first place. It wasn't just a whacky cult consisting of a few dozen diehards, it was a fullblown fanatical sect that set foot on a large part of southern France and managed to seduce even a considerable amount of ruling nobles(as unbelievable as it may sound).
 
Joined
Feb 11, 2007
Messages
2,951
Well yes, that's kind of my point. Catharism with those dogmas enforced is simply unworkable. Either they would need to be abandoned / reworked or the entire society would fall apart fast. But since it can be made to work in the game (as in, there is no population implosion in cathar realms), it makes no sense for those fertility penalties to be there.
 

Zeriel

Arcane
Joined
Jun 17, 2012
Messages
13,471
Dear god, I recently reinstalled this and tried to get back into it, and it's a fucking mess. Actually, no exaggeration, unplayable with the latest patches and DLC. I tried turning off DLC and removing India with mods, but it doesn't help, the simulation is just too bogged down. I don't know how they managed to fuck up a game that looks 10 years old, but trying to set the game to max speed makes it run at the speed of a glacier. Meanwhile EU4 (and ofc their earlier games like EU3) runs just fine. I guess it's period-accurate that steppe people and indians ruined the game, but I wasn't expecting them to fuck up their code just to make a metaphor.
 
Joined
Aug 21, 2010
Messages
272
Hyperbole much? The game runs fine even with gigantic map mods on a rather old machine.

For the first 200 years, anyway.

After that it does become syrupy, but it's hardly as unplayable as you make it sound.
 

Beastro

Arcane
Joined
May 11, 2015
Messages
8,103
Hyperbole much? The game runs fine even with gigantic map mods on a rather old machine.

For the first 200 years, anyway.

After that it does become syrupy, but it's hardly as unplayable as you make it sound.

My current game's into the 1200s and it's slow and stuttery, but no where near as bad as I expected (I've usually quit after the end of the 11th Century do to lack of interest/broken games).
 

Turrul

Augur
Joined
Aug 16, 2014
Messages
212
Meanwhile EU4 (and ofc their earlier games like EU3) runs just fine. I guess it's period-accurate that steppe people and indians ruined the game, but I wasn't expecting them to fuck up their code just to make a metaphor.

Even though Nomad mechanics are demanding (seriously just run shattered realms with all single country nomads and witness the huge slowdown), there aren't many nomad realms in the map so it's not a huge slowdown issue. In terms of code, the worst expansion is actually the Republic, lots of wonky shit happens if you try to mod them (like adding enatic succession) and devs still don't touch it even with a ten foot pole because it's such a mess.

Also, after a few centuries the performance drop curve gets a lot better since the world population stabilizes itself.
 

Zeriel

Arcane
Joined
Jun 17, 2012
Messages
13,471
Hyperbole much? The game runs fine even with gigantic map mods on a rather old machine.

For the first 200 years, anyway.

After that it does become syrupy, but it's hardly as unplayable as you make it sound.

It's like 4-5x slower than EU3/EU4 for me. And that's not a case of potato hardware, since earlier versions of the game run much better (besides which EU4 is on the same engine... not to mention Stellaris). It's all on the simulation side of things, so changing graphic settings, removing trees, terrain mode, etc, all the common things you will see plebs suggest, none of those will do a damn thing. It's just on Paradox for not caring about their game going to shit.

I have heard some weird rumblings about how some people with really top-end rigs have this problem while others do not, so perhaps it isn't as cut and dry as "performance is ruined for everyone". If you get good performance with the current version of the game, count yourself lucky.

It's definitely something they did since the last time I played the game, though. I played mods with huge maps on earlier versions of the game without performance ever being impacted, but now the vanilla game is slow-as-fuck from the beginning. Dunno what changed, but hoo boy...
 
Joined
Aug 21, 2010
Messages
272
The game is definitely poorly written/optimized; I'm not arguing with that. I don't at all agree with your characterization of it as unplayable, though.

If you're experiencing major slowdowns from the beginning, there's something weird going on that most people don't experience.
 

Zeriel

Arcane
Joined
Jun 17, 2012
Messages
13,471
The game is definitely poorly written/optimized; I'm not arguing with that. I don't at all agree with your characterization of it as unplayable, though.

If you're experiencing major slowdowns from the beginning, there's something weird going on that most people don't experience.

Yeah, I dunno what to say. The simulation is slow from the start of the game. Didn't used to be that way for me, and it doesn't happen to me with their other games in the Clausewitz engine.
 

Brinko

Arcane
Joined
May 7, 2012
Messages
884
Nice to see torture finally make it in, though it sucks that it's random.

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...2-dev-diary-16-mans-inhumanity-to-man.956080/
Hello and welcome back to another DD about The Reaper's Due! Ha! I can finally use the name! If all is going to plan you should be reading this while I am on my third, and sadly final, week of vacation, so I may or may not show up to answer questions. For this DD we are getting back to the core values of The Reaper's Due: Death and Suffering!

Being a prisoner is never a fun experience, and frankly, with The Reaper's Due it only gets worse. We have added several fairly unpleasant ways to interact with your captives:

  • Humiliate. The prisoner is degraded in some fashion; such as being tarred and feathered, or forced to do a “walk of shame”. This also causes them to lose prestige and be generally looked down on.
  • Torture. The prisoner is caused a certain amount of pain; such as being whipped, or stretched on the rack. May cause them to become Stressed or even Depressed, and can cause you to lose the Kind trait.
  • Mutilate. Only available to rulers with certain traits, such as Cruel or Impaler, this causes the permanent loss of a body part. May lead to you becoming Cruel if you are not already, and can cause them to gain Stressed or even Lunatic.
  • Bad poetry. Rulers with the Poet trait may deploy their very worst poems against a prisoner. While a comparatively mild punishment, it nonetheless has a slight chance to drive them mad.
  • Consume. Rulers who are either Possessed or Lunatic and also have the Cannibal modifier may simply eat their prisoners. If you haven’t disabled fantasy content, this may lead to you “gaining the power” of your victim.

All of these options, besides Consume, release the victim afterwards as they are considered to be their punishment, and while you choose the category you do not choose the exact method. Needless to say, your former prisoner will not think kindly of you after any of these punishments, and in the more extreme cases their close family may also be outraged.

Of course, sometimes a mere punishment is not enough and you simply have to Execute your prisoner. Well, we have added content for this eventuality too! You still simply press the Execute button, as before, but the actual execution method employed is chosen from a list based on your location/culture/religion/traits as well as the imprison reason you have on your prisoner, their religion/gender/traits, and things. Different execution methods come with different death reasons, and as you may have heard in an earlier DD, different death sounds. We have 31 execution methods, including Hanging, Crushing, Sawing, and Bear. It’s all in an easily moddable file too, just in case modders think we have been insufficiently creative.
index.php


I should also mention that with the 2.6 patch it is no longer possible to escape from House arrest unless someone with the Intrigue focus breaks you out, so if for some reason you want to be nice to your prisoners they are no longer virtually guaranteed to escape.

Since Death is a big theme for The Reaper's Due, we have also added several reactions events to the death of your lovers, friends, and rivals. For the first two, these can result in things like you turning to drink, finding a new friend, taking comfort in the arms of another, or finding a keepsake of them. For the latter, you may miss having a rival and start a new feud, resolve to become a better person, or if you are a particular type of person you might sneak out and desecrate their corpse. We don’t judge!
index.php

index.php

index.php


That’s all for now. Next week I’ll be back at work and writing these “live” again, so I’ll decide the topic closer to the time. It's quite possible the subject will be cats though.
 
Joined
Jan 7, 2012
Messages
14,289
It's the patch that will let players turn off shattered retreat and infamy. Something has to be added to keep the balance.

Oh well, off to pillage europe and gather strong genius concubines so that I can start my own rape baby farm and feed my ubermensch dynasty.
 

Beastro

Arcane
Joined
May 11, 2015
Messages
8,103
Consume. Rulers who are either Possessed or Lunatic and also have the Cannibal modifier may simply eat their prisoners. If you haven’t disabled fantasy content, this may lead to you “gaining the power” of your victim.

Gain the glutton trait if you chain consume prisoners?

Punishment by crushing.

Was typically reserved for those who refused to speak during their trial in Britain: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peine_forte_et_dure
 

Vaarna_Aarne

Notorious Internet Vandal
Joined
Jun 1, 2008
Messages
34,585
Location
Cell S-004
MCA Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
Okay, maybe I was being a little too obscure in my reference.

I was not so much referring to various actual methods of execution and tortures involving crushing, but the copyright blurb screen at the start of the Borat DVD, which ends with the phrase "selling piratings of this videodisc result in punishment by crushing."
 

Turisas

Arch Devil
Patron
Joined
May 25, 2009
Messages
9,927
index.php


I always wanted to become a FOOKIN' LEGEND. Wonder if that stacks if you have an entire pile, maybe enough to build your skull throne even?
 

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