C&C 3 is fun...

[Zhuangzi]

Yeah, I know it's not a REAL strategy game, but then the C&C/Red Alert games never were. You can't say it isn't true to the series. And yeah, I get that it is totally derivative of earlier C&C games too, even though it is IMO a massive improvement on the last actual C&C game, Tiberian Sun.

So why the hate for this game? My policy is to wait 2 years after release for low priority games (which this admittedly is) to reach the bargain bin. So I picked it up the other day for $12, patched up to 1.09 and off I go.

From a single player perspective, there is a lot to enjoy. I think there are something like 38 SP missions. The GDI campaign is varied and sometimes amusing, and the cutscenes are even enlivened by the Lando Calrissian actor. He's a walking self-parody - appalling actor.

Anyhow, I just wanted to know if anyone else got any joy out of this. It's seems like a pretty amusing 'strategy lite' romp without brains but with lots of things to blow up. Thoughts?

 

[zerotol]

What do you mean not a real RTS? I absolutely have no fucking clue where you get that from.
And yes its a good game, played the GDI campaign and had a lot of fun.

 

[Eldritch]

What do you mean not a real RTS?

Well, he didn't exactly say "Real Time" strategy and I think was p. much initializing the "hurr durr RTS is no real strategy I sodomize myself with my 4x/TBS discs" internet faggotry mode there...

There ARE real time strategy games that require considerably more neurons to activate than a lot of TBS games too y'know. Try playing Warhammer:Dark Omen and you'll see what I mean.

I might have misunderstood what you meant there though, if so, my apologies.

 

[ScottishMartialArts]

It's a fun, if uninspired game. My only complaint with the new Command and Conquer games is that post-Red Alert 2 they don't really feel like the old ones. I don't know if it was the jump to 3D or something else, but there is just some intangible thing that isn't the same as in the games that got me hooked on PC gaming to begin with. At any rate, I enjoyed it enough to play through the single-player campaign two times.

 

[made]

Pretty boring iirc, though not as bad as RA3.

 

[Shannow]

There ARE real time strategy games that require considerably more neurons to activate than a lot of TBS games too y'know. Try playing Warhammer:Dark Omen and you'll see what I mean.

Dark Omen? That awesome Real Time Tactics game?

 

[Eldritch]

What's the difference between tactics and strategy? XD XD XD XD L0L0LL0L0L0L0L0L0L0L0L0LLIPOP

"Strategy without tactics is the slowest route to victory. Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat." - Sun Tzu

Seriously though, we were talking computer game genres here so there's no need to be such a semantics faggot, is there?

Also, there *is* strategy in Dark Omen. Strategy is perspective, that is, your future picture and direction. Strategy involves the "big picture" - the overall plan, and how those plans will achieve your goals and objectives. It involves deciding what the important stakes are, and which of them will be the recipients of your long term plan, or the targets of your activities.

For example, you can choose to go with a plan that includes skipping most of the optional missions and give up on their gifts while not spending a lot of gold on armor, only on replenishing the cheap lightly armored regiments casualties. Saving your gold for the later more crucial missions with the fully armored regiments granted by your savings and take on the crucial battles in the story which will be relatively easier for your small but impregnably armored force because you arrived there quickly and the opposition will be much weaker.

Or you can plan the exact opposite.

Or you decide on a more mediocre approach.

You definitely have to plan your long term strategy in Dark Omen.

 

[Zhuangzi]

I mean there's no real strategy in terms of strategic thinking or planning in C&C3. At least not much. My GDI 'strategy' largely consists of building a shitload of railgun Mammoth tanks and overwhelming the enemy. I guess I use rigs as support, so that's a strategy of sorts. But my point is that despite this lack of deep thinking required, C&C 3 is actually a fun game to play.

IMO the game has a feel very similar to Tiberian Dawn way back in 1995. For me it was Tiberian Sun (1999) that felt incongruous, with its stupid little mechs and I forget what else.

 

[MetalCraze]

What do you mean not a real RTS? I absolutely have no fucking clue where you get that from.
And yes its a good game, played the GDI campaign and had a lot of fun.

Yes enjoy your fucking slow tanks and that it literally takes them 10 minutes to reach the other end of the map because if they moved faster poor console kiddies wouldn't select them with the gamepad in time.
Enjoy the incredibly low difficulty and dumb AI that just sends his small suicide squads at you while it even doesn't try to build defences.
Also enjoy the retarded balance with superunits - spam mammoth thanks - wait a hour while they reach an enemy base and voila you're a winner because they kill everything.

This game sure is fun

 

[Destroid]

Play Dark Reign instead.

 

[Zhuangzi]

Skyway, it doesn't take 10 minutes for the Mammoths to cross the map. Yeah, they are slow, but the maps are very small.

I am finding the game mostly too easy on Medium difficulty, and occasionally quite difficult on Hard. That's reasonable, I think.

In terms of the actual strategic content of this game (i.e. none) I have no argument. But it is fun to play nonetheless. It's not the decline of anything if the game series never had any more strategic complexity than it does now.

 

[MetalCraze]

Tiberian Sun was considerably better.
There was no superunits, campaign was non-linear and quite a number of missions had multiple ways to complete them. And AI was much much much more better. It tried to -defend- itself at least.
C&C3 is a generic dumbed down console rts-lite. Out of dumbed down RTS'es WiC and GC2 are fun enough to play - C&C3 is just a game like tons of other mediocre RTS-wannabes.

 

[Zhuangzi]

Well, shit, we're going to have to agree to disagree. I thought Tiberium Sun was easily the worst instalment in the series (inc Red Alerts). IMO C&C 1 and C&C 3 are quite similar. It's almost like a direct remake with new graphix and bullshit aliens.

 

[MetalCraze]

IMO C&C 1 and C&C 3 are quite similar. It's almost like a direct remake with new graphix and bullshit aliens.

Fucking hell.

 

[Carlos' Bitch1]

Tiberian Sun was a much more difficult game when playing against the AI. Many people seemed turned off by the fact that they were not really a "character" in it, but rather an observer of others whom they were supposed to be.

Normally, you would get Stalin, or some other type directly addressing you as "Commander". TS does not have any direct monologue with the player. It makes the kids feel less like the futuristic super Generals they know themselves to be.

I myself didn't really give a hoot. TS wins the battle. Some of the videos in CC3 were quite amusing though.

 

[MetalCraze]

TS was difficult than other C&Cs mostly because tank rushes aren't possible.
GDI f.e. doesn't have even a single type of units with which you can rush the Nod base effectively.

Bunch of sonic tanks will faster rape themselves and friendly units than enemies and you can have only a single Mammoth at max and it can only fire at the ground targets with a ray that isn't really powerful - so the only thing you can build en masse is basic units which will be then raped en masse by Nod's catapults with their deadly precision (though they are easily destroyed by air units - which in turn are easily raped by SAMs).
TS simply had better balance and was more about point strikes than anything else where you first try to punch a hole in defences and then try to get some of your units inside.

TS also had a rather nice design touch such as a living world. If you remember all those mutants on the map - like that mouth growing from the ground - devouring tanks while the only way to kill it is either with infantry (which is raped by mutant's gas) or with air units.
Or the worm-like creature that infects your infantry turning it into more worm-like creatures. Thus maps felt much better and atmospheric.
Heh even the ability to set enemy infantry on fire by burning nearby trees was a nice little feature.

 

[kingcomrade]

skyway thinks world in conflict is a good game

 

[MetalCraze]

No I don't. But compared to C&C3 it is a fun game.

 

[kingcomrade]

 

[zerotol]

Skyway's banter is useless. Every mp RTS is meh compared to Starcraft.

 

[MetalCraze]

BTW here is another proof why C&C3 is such a pussy compared to C&C2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1S9ptM2L ... re=related

 

[Talonfire]

C&C was the first "real" modern RTS game (Well Dune II was, but C&C improved upon that game in every way) so I don't see how C&C 3 isn't a "real" RTS. It's more of an RTS than, say, Dawn of War II.

As for the quality of Tiberium Wars, it's okay. It's certainly better than that Red Alert 3 bullshit that EA shoved down our throats last year, but there was never supposed to be more than one Red Alert anyway. Then EA bought Westwood. I think that Tiberium Wars would have been better if it played more like Tiberian Sun, instead it felt like a Red Alert spam fest with a Tiberium skin.

 

[Wyrmlord]

C&C was the first "real" modern RTS game (Well Dune II was, but C&C improved upon that game in every way) so I don't see how C&C 3 isn't a "real" RTS. It's more of an RTS than, say, Dawn of War II.

As for the quality of Tiberium Wars, it's okay. It's certainly better than that Red Alert 3 bullshit that EA shoved down our throats last year, but there was never supposed to be more than one Red Alert anyway. Then EA bought Westwood. I think that Tiberium Wars would have been better if it played more like Tiberian Sun, instead it felt like a Red Alert spam fest with a Tiberium skin.

He said "strategy" not "real-time strategy". In the opinion of niche strategy fans, anything real-time is too twitchy, and hence without strategy.

It might have some merit, because RTSes are meant for audiences like me, who are intimidated by uber complex strategy games, but like the explosive action movie thrill that RTSes bring, and not the strategy in them.

 

[Talonfire]

The earlier C&Cs definitely required strategy. The series became a spam fest that required no strategy starting with Red Alert 2.

 

[zerotol]

ZzZ in mp on a serious level all the games require strategy. The strongpoint for the C&C games for me is the xp