Review Bloodlines excites the loins of ActionTrip

[dojoteef]

Well getting back to what the review said. I agree with this review a lot more than I do the other ones. They mention the high points of the game and the detractors very well. For example they mention a lack of polish, just as I did. I never mentioned the bounding box problem before, but I've experienced several times now where I've had to wait between 30 seconds and a minute before I could move just because some person was blocking me despite there being plenty of room for the model to be able to move.

I also think they make a great point about the use of the Source engine. It does seem like they are using a much earlier, less refined build of the source engine since HL2 doesn't seem to have a lot of the graphical problems people seem to be experiencing such as speed issues, texture corruption, etc. It could very well be that in order to keep the price of licensing down, that Activision decided to get the engine in an 'as is' form and have Troika work on it to get it up to snuff. If that's the case, then it seems Troika had too much on it's plate creating all the RPG content to worry about refining and optimizing the engine like HL2 did. I guess as a fan of Troika I am trying to find reasons why the game might not have shipped in what I would call a polished form.

I like the way that Action Trip says this:

"Programming-wise this game feels very unpolished to say the least, so if you're the type of gamer that's looking for whiz-bang graphics to impress him while he plays, 'Vampire' might not be the right game for you."

Had I read a review like this before getting my copy of Bloodlines I would not have been as shocked regarding the problems the game has. Things like Exitium's "I take it back BLOODLINES RULES!" while he ignores any issues the game might have are very one-sided. I really do hate one-sidedness. It's as if people feel if they give the whole truth instead of a partial truth they will be convincing people to avoid the game. At least for me it's quite the contrary. I don't mind hearing about the detractors in a game. I haven't played HL2, but I'm sure it has it's share of problems as well and I'd love to hear what they are. For example if none of the gaming sites mentioned the fact that HL2 required Steam, I'd be in a position where I would be trying to return the game because I am unable to use Steam. For my current situation it's a BIG problem. I like making informed decisions regarding what I buy; who knows maybe that's just me.

On a lighter note I do hope Action Trip updates their review and gives it as much mention as they did for the original review if/when Troika puts out a patch. I always find it to be very annoying when a company fixes the problems that have lowered a game's score and the review doesn't reflect that change.

 

[Sol Invictus]

What are you talking about? I actually like the combat in Bloodlines.

 

[dojoteef]

What are you talking about? I actually like the combat in Bloodlines.

Uh, no one mentioned the combat in Bloodlines in this forum, so why are you defending it here? Is someone a little touchy? Sorry Ex, but everyone can see your acting like a fanboy about Bloodlines except you.

 

[Sol Invictus]

I will not take your personal insults lightly, dojoteef. If you want to state a point, state it and be done with it instead of meandering on about what a great big fanboy I'm behaving like, and saying 'sorry' when you don't mean to be only adds vinegar to your mockful words.

Most certainly, I behave like a fanboy on occasion, especially in my first post in the "I take it all back" thread but that gives you no reason to ignore the rest of the poinst which I have made about the game, valid as they are. It seems your reactionary comments untoward me differ little from the spew uttered by Volourn, though his idiotic ramblings lack the eloquency of an educated individual like yourself.

Point being, the subject of the combat in Bloodlines is usually the subject of issue when it comes to Bloodlines' faults, aside from the bugs, which is the reason I brought it up. Anyone who's been following the other Bloodlines topics would clearly see that unless they choose to obfuscate the topic by feigning ignorance.

 

[dojoteef]

When I say sorry, I do mean it. If it seemed otherwise it was not my intention. What I am trying to say is that on other threads it's been mentioned that you would likely not be a good candidate for a balanced review of Bloodlines given your comments on the game.

The thing about the combat is, not even the Action Trip reivew of the game mentions the combat. In fact here's what the review states about the combat:

"You will be able to explore the world at your own pace, complete side quests or decide to follow the main story. The combat itself is in real-time and it's an interesting mix of FPS/third-person action gameplay and classic RPG combat. In other words, you'll still aim and shoot the gun in real-time, but the amount of damage you cause or take will not only be decided by how well you aim, or how well you dodge, but also by your range weapons skill, defense skill, etc."

So either your comment was just way off topic and out of the blue, or you feel touchy about the subject that other people are not as satisfied with the combat as you are. That's the point I was trying to get across.

 

[Sol Invictus]

That "Anonymous Troika guy" sounds like some fake comment Nupraptor came up with. Before posting the supposed Troika quote he stated "Here's a direct quote from one of the developers, who posts on another forum I go to:"

How convenient that it's 'another forum'.

When somebody asked him where he got the Troika statement from he had this to say:

"I'm not sure he'd like me disclosing that. I know some people won't believe it's genuine, which is fine, but I just posted it in hopes that it will convince some others to e-mail Activision and pester them for a patch. " Sounds like he was just looking to stir up a response from the community. Clever, I suppose.

If it's for real, I'm betting it's at SomethingAwful. Developers and the people who work at those companies seem to enjoy shooting their mouths off over there. I've googled it and come up with nothing, though.

He posted this later: "Activision is currently in talks with Troika for making a patch. Nothing solid yet, but I'd say there's a good chance there'll be a patch within a week or so."

Maybe the e-mail campaign worked out after all. If it's true, Activision really deserves a pat on the back for this. Atari didn't seem to care regardless of the complaints.

 

[Nupraptor]

Some anonymous Troika guy said, http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33791231&page=6&pp=30 :

"At this time, Activision has not contacted us at all about making a patch. This game does not seem to be very high on their priority list. Many of the bugs and typos we knew about, and many we had already fixed, or had fixes for. But these didn't make it into the game for various reasons, which I will not announce publicly, becuase I don't want to be sued by a certain publisher for slander. Needless to say, it makes me very frustrated. Maybe you should email Activision or something and ask them for a patch."

I'd just like to clear something up: I'm the one who originally posted this over at Rage3d. I didn't think it'd drift all the way over here. What I posted was actually not a quote from a Troika employee but, rather, a friend of an employee who was talking out of his... well, you get the picture.

I posted what I did because I hoped it would motivate people into e-mailing Activision and requesting a patch. I didn't think it'd be lifted and taken somewhat out of context, but I'm sorry about that.

 

[Elwro]

Plz don't lie next time kthx. I know it's small, but generally posting such things may perhaps worsen the relationship between Troika and Activision.

 

[Nupraptor]

It was a misunderstanding on my part. I'm sorry, and I realize my mistake, that's why I posted this here.

 

[suibhne]

You show class, 'fessing up like that. Next time, try showing class and journalistic integrity. :wink:

This review is the first I've read which really gets at my biggest pet peeve about the game: the NPCs. The lack of variety in the models is at least as bad as KotOR's, and their meanderings through the world are probably even stupider; they routinely run into one another, get briefly caught on cardboard boxes, stand in groups in the rain or in totally unlikely spots, and even congregate with several other NPCs with the same exact model. Yuck. Sure, it's a cosmetic complaint, but it was stupid in KotOR and even stupider in Bloodlines - not least because KotOR made this problem so obvious that it really should never have happened again. I thought part of the point of using a 3D engine was to ease the design of new models?

 

[LeonX]

" I thought part of the point of using a 3D engine was to ease the design of new models?"

We could have loaded the streets with 50 different models (though no matter what the engine can do, it still takes someone to model and texture these things, and that = time and money) - however, the more different models/textures you are displaying, the slower the game will be. This has more to do with the computer it's running on than the engine, but it still equals weaker performance, something the hubs could definitely not afford.

If you're smart like Valve, you have a great excuse built into your game as to why everyone in a city is wearing the same clothes, and then you just have to have different heads on them. I guess we're not that smart. Of course, if we take this argument to its logical conclusion, you don't make a game with over 130 unique characters and try to compete visually with a game that has much, much less than that (with a longer dev cycle). The more time you take on a model/texture, the better it will look, obviously.

leon

 

[Spazmo]

And in any case, KOTOR's problem was that most of the people you talked to had the same faces. In Bloodlines, there's generally a new face for everyone who has a name.

 

[suibhne]

Fair enough, Leon. Honestly, I wasn't even thinking about the performance impact; I guess that's why you get paid for this and I just sit around and whine. Still, it's disappointing, and certainly something to fix when technology allows it (i.e., when the average consumer's tech will run it).

How about NPC behavior, though? Can anything be done to make them appear more natural in the hub areas? I know, again, we're talking about spending extra cycles, in this case on AI, but I'm guessing there are some fairly simple algorithms that could improve things a bit.

I guess it signals my enjoyment of the game that, at the moment, these are my primary complaints. I've been spared any real performance problems, other than pretty bad slowdown in the plaguebearer quest.

 

[z3r'0']

Yup, if I had to pick out something that's pretty decent in the game, it would be the dialogue.

YAY!!!