Alien Breed: Impact

[piydek]

Hm, TBH, i have no idea why Steam is so repulsive to some people.
Besides that, isn't physx for this game run entirely by CPU? I'm quite certain it is.

Steam = lending games, simple as that. When it all goes to hell, we see if you will be still able to play any of games. Anyway if Team 17 wants so really stick to digital distribution, why they don't take the same way as Frictional Games or put game on Direct2Drive? somehow other Indie groups didn't bankrupt from that.
I'm not sure but so far I didn't see a game that runs Nvidia PsychX by it's own, without demanding card that is able to support it.

I'd like to hear an explanation why it's dumbed-down AB, really would. I played and finished first (not that crappy 92' edition, the original one) and second ("the horror continues") AB and played but haven't finished tower assault, all on the Amiga back in the days.

In original games, (especially in the first ones) you really need to save keys, otherwise you could get stuck, same with ammo. In this game from what I head you don't need really worry about any of that in reality. Not many upgrades comparing to previous ones (in fact one per gun). My personal disappointment is that games stick to linear formula - they could really expand the awesome Tower Assault concept of free-play.

Really, if not the Steam and PsychX requirement I would already buy the game and give a proper, detailed report about the game.

Just how is Steam lending games? It's a legal contract between Steam and the user that you have bought the game, legal copy, but only digital (not on a physical medium), which doesn't change a thing regarding ownership. If Valve somehow one-sidedly decided to "pull the plug" (impossible, since they know what that would mean) they'd get sued to hell and back and I'd get 10x of money's worth than i've spent on games via Steam.

I'm 99% sure you don't have to have a physx GPU to run the game. It'd be a completely retarded move to put out a game that requires that.

Regarding saving keys - yes, there's no keys here, no need to save for them and that changes the gameplay, but it's by no means "dumbing-down" or even "streamlining" - it's just a different design approach. "No keys" works well within this game.

With ammo, that's not true at all that you don't have to save ammo - quite the contrary - you totally need to conserve the ammo in SP on the difficulty on which it's meant to be played (elite) (T17 have said numerous times that that is the "right" difficulty for playing the game). In coop there's no selectable difficulty and you need to conserve ammo maybe even more than in SP....even with very intelligent ammo spending and efficiency, you often end up with no ammo and the shitty pistol on which you can defend yourself for a minute or two maybe or significantly less if you end up facing some more serious alien types.

Health goes down quick as fuck as well when an alien has a successful attack.

Upgrades are few, yes, but that was implemented in the last minute, between the xbox version and the PC/ps3 version. With the time they've had, they've done ok. I'm quite sure there's going to be more and specific upgrades in episodes 2 and 3.

The game is linear, i agree, and it would be better if it was in the vein of tower assault. But if you've had actually played this new AB, you'd see how much more refined it is than any of the old ABs - in numerous ways. To make a game that's like this new AB and of the scope and open-endedness of tower assault - well, that'd certainly be a major 40€ game and not a 10€one. In fact, I'm quite sure T17 couldn't even fund making of a game like that.

 

[piydek]

Fuck me, Tails, you're right regarding Steam. Luckily, I have very few and very cheap purchases via Steam. I've just read the legal documents of Valve and (and I'm really fucking surprised about this) you indeed do not buy OWNERSHIP when you buy a game via Steam. You buy a license. Fuck me, that's fucked up.

Nevertheless, that's off-topic but thanks for the heads-up.

I'd still buy AB though

 

[Tails]

Just how is Steam lending games? It's a legal contract between Steam and the user that you have bought the game, legal copy, but only digital (not on a physical medium), which doesn't change a thing regarding ownership. If Valve somehow one-sidedly decided to "pull the plug" (impossible, since they know what that would mean) they'd get sued to hell and back and I'd get 10x of money's worth than i've spent on games via Steam.

They can't do much when they bankrupt, but really, this has been discussed to death so it's rather pointless to start this again, so in short - I like to own game, without depending from third party software or company and Steam is opposite of that, so no deal. If they release a Direct2Drive or Retail version of game(s) then I consider purchase :elitist:

I'm 99% sure you don't have to have a physx GPU to run the game. It'd be a completely retarded move to put out a game that requires that.

When from curiosity I tried to run Metro 2033, to see if it runs on lowest detail, I got a message that suggested that PsychX is not installed. I check Nvidia drivers and my card didn't support that, thought they did at this to the previous versions. Weird stuff but typical for Nvidia - considering how less and less options you can set in newer version of drives, soon user will be only able install driver .

About gameplay, I just said my impressions from what I've seen and I stick to them until I will have occasion to play the game (probably not at all). Everything you say sounds sweet and cool overall, but I prefer to see myself. I don't say the game is bad (in fact I sure I will enjoy it much) but seems to be dumbed-down then previous games, that's all.

 

[Boyarpunk]

'Cuse my ignorance, but how does it compare to Alien Swarm?

 

[Metro]

Hm, TBH, i have no idea why Steam is so repulsive to some people.

It's trendy to hate Steam. That or people are seriously concerned the $10 or so they spend on a game will be ill-allocated if by some extremely small chance Valve collapses in the next decade. I can just picture people ten years from now clutching their retail boxes of software that costs less than a movie ticket and screaming: "I told you Steam-tards!"

As far as the game itself goes it looks nice but I didn't bother paying $3ish for the Shadowgrounds pack so I don't see myself buying this unless it has a patina of RPG elements a la leveling, quests, upgrades and such... which apparently it does not.

 

[piydek]

Tails, I'd like to get the AB version with all 3 parts on a physical medium in a nice old-school box...I'm that way too, but it probably won't happen. Regarding physx, I don't really know much about that technology, but there's this thread on AB steam forum:

http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1322930

I have no clue about the correctness of that information though. I'm quite sure I've seen people with ATI cards playing AB, so...I don't know. I think that the game did install some physx software though.

Boyarpunk - I haven't played alien swarm, so i have no clue, sorry.

Metro - you have a good point in what you're saying. Theoretically, it is shocking to me that Valve/Steam is selling license for the game and not ownership of the game (haven't found anywhere under which terms Valve can/can't one-sidedly decide to annul your license), but it's both unlikely - that Valve is going to kill such a huge money-making cow that's certainly going to stay a money-making cow, that Valve will go bankrupt, or that they'll fuck with licenses people have paid. They're not that stupid not to know what that'd do for their business.

Metro - no, if you're not a game-player that liked older action games on platforms like Amiga, AB, just as well as Shadowgorunds likely won't be what you're looking for. There's no RPG elements in those games and i say it's good for them. Just not that kind of games. What amused me though is that there's a few of FPS next-gen fucktards on Steam boards which bitch and moan about isometric and lack of popamole mouse turning/shooting controls in AB:Impact

 

[yaster]

I may be wrong but as far as I know the licence is the very thing you get when you buy retail, it's just the way software is sold.

 

[piydek]

I may be wrong but as far as I know the licence is the very thing you get when you buy retail, it's just the way software is sold.

It'd be cool to actually hear how it legally is regarding this issue. Maybe it is the way you say.

So "license" would actually mean "unlimited license to use", whereas "ownership" would mean that you own the program and may use it in whichever way you see fit (therefore, not just playing a game but modifying it, re-selling it etc.)?

If that was the case then really the only argument against Steam is "if Valve goes bankrupt..." - which is really not that serious.

 

[Tails]

'Cuse my ignorance, but how does it compare to Alien Swarm?

Better monster AI for sure, also "dark atmosphere", from what I've seen on videos & read.

It's trendy to hate Steam.

You shouldn't use words that you don't understand. Somehow when long time ago I pointed out my issues about Steam none of you lovers didn't take the challenge. Thought I'm not surprised, since there is no excuse for the things Steam does. Either you like it for what it is or dislike.

Tails, I'd like to get the AB version with all 3 parts on a physical medium in a nice old-school box...I'm that way too, but it probably won't happen. Regarding physx, I don't really know much about that technology, but there's this thread on AB steam forum:

http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1322930

I have no clue about the correctness of that information though. I'm quite sure I've seen people with ATI cards playing AB, so...I don't know. I think that the game did install some physx software though.

I don't mind digital copy (I have already few games purchased that way, ex. Penumbra games) only if it don't have activate trough internet or other pointless crap like Steam. Thanks piydek for the info about this PsychX stuff btw. maybe there is hope it will run on my laptop on very low settings.

 

[piydek]

Tails - do you have a comment about my last post prior to this one? I'd like to know how it is regarding this. Also, do you have a link on that thread where you say you've had lengthy discussions about Steam? I'm interested primarily in this legal stuff regarding nature of ownership/license and its relation to retail copy ownership/license, possibility of "shutting down" Steam willfully and legal (im)possibilities of annulling your bought games willfully, without going bankrupt and similar problems or "problems".

 

[SuicideBunny]

I may be wrong but as far as I know the licence is the very thing you get when you buy retail, it's just the way software is sold.

It'd be cool to actually hear how it legally is regarding this issue. Maybe it is the way you say.

So "license" would actually mean "unlimited license to use", whereas "ownership" would mean that you own the program and may use it in whichever way you see fit (therefore, not just playing a game but modifying it, re-selling it etc.)?

as far as germany goes, software licenses are worth crap if you buil an actual retail copy with a disk. eulas are worth nothing because you cannot view them before purchase of the software, and they also directly contradict most consumer rights here. digital distribution on the other hand is an entirely different beast.
when it comes to dd, you still have a crapload of differences. on the one hand you have steam, that will ban you if you do something they don't like, and in the case of steam the ban means a loss of everything you have purchased on that account, on the other you have gamersgate, who outright state that every game you buy from them is yours, and you can do whatever you want with it, and while gg is fucking slow in terms of replying, they actually mean what they say. you can resell gg games or have them moved to a friends acc if you are done with it, and so on. heck, before they split from paradox, you could even get them to bypass the shitty censorship laws of some countries *coughcough*.

If that was the case then really the only argument against Steam is "if Valve goes bankrupt..." - which is really not that serious.

it's not just valve goes bankrupt, it's also valve bans your acc because your steam social network avatar was deemed inapropriate, or you got drunk and your friend though it was funny to spam racial slurs in some valve game.

and never mind that steam enforces patches, which includes retroactive censoring of uncensored games, sudden switches to completely different versions, like valve's introduction of the steam cloud, and mod incompatibility.

 

[Mangoose]

So... if anything happens to the games I bought off Steam I'll just remove from inventory without any moral qualms. Problem solved!

Or you can always play in Offline mode.

 

[Metro]

So the Steam debate aside I finally played the demo after watching a few videos and yep, it is basically Shadowgrounds/Alien Shooter with prettier graphics. Granted these folks might have been first in the genre with the original but still, not worth the $15 asking price given the competitive nature of sale pricing on Steam. Now if they had different 'classes,' leveling, talent trees, weapon/armor drops, etc. Then you'd have something a bit more interesting. As it is there's at least half a dozen isometric shooters to fill the bill for less.

 

[piydek]

Metro, i've posted reply to your post at Steam boards (my username there is the same as here, just as yours, so you'll know who i am). I disagree with what you say.

First - Shadowgrounds and AB:I play very differently. Alien shooter plays differently as well. AB is absolutely not AS or Shadowgrounds with prettier graphics. If you finished any of the final game's levels in their entirety on a proper difficulty (elite), you'd see that clearly. The comment about RPG elements is being discussed with some guy on T17's forum and i think it's a bad idea to mix these concepts. AB:I sticks to the roots regarding this and i think that's great. It's just right for the game. The strength of AB - even this new one - is in its gameplay and atmosphere. Lame progressions, skills, talents, object drops and other pseudo-RPG elements and/or gimmicks would just dilute its gameplay and concept which is simple, neat, well-designed and it works good.

Now, it can clearly be seen that glory days for this kind of games are way past, because in "tha day" stuff like Alien shooter, Alien breed and Shadowgrounds would be seen as quite different - which they are, gameplay-wise (AS and Shadowgrounds are more similar to each other than any of them to AB). But today there's not a single forum thread where these games don't get compared and judged one on the merits of the other. Which is inappropriate.

 

[Metro]

I'm certainly willing to accept I'm wrong as I've only played the demo but how are they different? Difficulty? Enemy variety? Is more strategy involved in AB? I do admit it is visually and atmospherically impressive and it was certainly fun to play.

Of course you might address all of that on the Steam forums so I'll scuttle over there eventually~

 

[piydek]

Metro - i think actually that the demo for this game is not very good at all. It's way too easy, has too many cut-scenes and the design of that mini-map is nowhere near the design of any of the game's 5 levels.

Enemy variety, tactics involved in successfully dealing them and difficulty actually pretty much shoot up from level to level of AB, where the first level is quite easy, but the demo is even WAY easier (I'm comparing all of them on "elite" difficulty, since that's "the" difficulty to play - that's what T17 always said as well).

Also, the demo is just not long enough for the player to feel the lack of ammo and health that's always very real and present in the game....especially so in the last three levels. This adds very much to how intense the game feels and builds up into a very fine "gunning survivor" feel. Also, the demo has absolutely no difficult encounters (I'm not talking about those lame "boss" fights, i'm talking about actually challenging groups of aliens).

 

[Tails]

Metro, Team 17 was making Alien Breed series for a long time on Amiga.

piydek, the only "discussion" I had was in this topic and so far no one show me how wrong are my points.

Anyway I had ocassion to play a bit (on mate PC, most of introduction level )of this new Alien Breed and I must say, it's not bad game but has many things that are irritating like quest compass, way too big zone of item view (you can basically see what locker you can search from behind the wall) and bad controls on PC mainly turning around with Q/E key. Other then that it has decent Alien AI (different behaviors), bit of destructible environment and yeah, Elite level makes you really think twice about using ammo. If I get one day a decent PC and thee will be non-Steam release (which I doubt, since the game has pointless achievement system) I would buy it.

 

[piydek]

Metro, Team 17 was making Alien Breed series for a long time on Amiga.

piydek, the only "discussion" I had was in this topic and so far no one show me how wrong are my points.

Anyway I had ocassion to play a bit (on mate PC, most of introduction level )of this new Alien Breed and I must say, it's not bad game but has many things that are irritating like quest compass, way too big zone of item view (you can basically see what locker you can search from behind the wall) and bad controls on PC mainly turning around with Q/E key. Other then that it has decent Alien AI (different behaviors), bit of destructible environment and yeah, Elite level makes you really think twice about using ammo. If I get one day a decent PC and thee will be non-Steam release (which I doubt, since the game has pointless achievement system) I would buy it.

Thanks for the link. In the meantime, I've used the "search" function on Codex quite a bit and read quite a few topics that are marginally discussing Steam.

Regarding AB:I, yeah the quest compass is irritating, i wish there wasn't one. Zone of item view i didn't mind since items and their locations are obvious and should be obvious anyway. I also like controls, but i do think the game feels much better when played on a nice analog dual-stick controller than when played on M+K. With gamepad, the controls are perfect for me.

Now, I've never had a console of any kind, have always been a computer game player since i played my first games on my uncle's C64 when i was about 6 years old and since a bit later i got my own C64. The only kind of game input devices I've used besides M+K were stuff like this:

So, I've never felt close to consoles, but in case of AB:I i do like the achievement system and especially leaderboards and i really feel the xbox360 controller for windows i have works very well with this game. I repeat, I have no affinity towards consoles and never had it.

It's just that T17's achievements for AB:I are not that good IMO. They could have done much more with them. What i like about leaderboards and achievements in case of a game like AB:I is the fact that they could reintroduce old-time arcade classic stuff such as high-scores and maybe some recognition of extra player skill. The main gripe i have with the whole thing in this case is that the game difficulty and these particular achievements are just not hardcore enough. Leaderboards do have a hardcore element since i compete with other players and there are quite a few of very good guys playing it. So that aspect is really cool.

The game's not perfect, there's a few more important things about the game that you haven't mentioned that i'm not nuts about, but all in all it's the most fun i've had with a game for a long fucking time.

 

[Tails]

[Regarding AB:I, yeah the quest compass is irritating, i wish there wasn't one.

Yeah, they could add an option in menu to turn it off. Such stuff just doesn't feel right.

I also like controls, but i do think the game feels much better when played on a nice analog dual-stick controller than when played on M+K. With gamepad, the controls are perfect for me.

Yeah I as thinking that AB:I is probably more enjoyable on Gamepad, thought buddy don't have any so I had no ocassion to test it. Strangely he likes controls "for what they are".

Now, I've never had a console of any kind, have always been a computer game player since i played my first games on my uncle's C64 when i was about 6 years old and since a bit later i got my own C64. The only kind of game input devices I've used besides M+K were stuff like this:

Quickshot, right? I had few shitty ones and one decent one looking like that. I still got it somewhere I think. I also had awesome wireless gamepads, I think it was made by the same company. Amiga rulez

 

[piydek]

Yeah, that's quickshot. I've crashed so many of them that I've passed on to much cheaper "Sigma" joysticks i used to buy in Austria. They were easier to destroy, but were quite cheap so i bought 3 of them at once and just went through them . The only thing that managed to survive my Sensible soccer obsession for a bit longer time was this:

Amiga certainly does rule .

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

Alien Breed 2: Sloppy Seconds is out. Anyone looked at it yet?
http://store.steampowered.com/app/22650/
$10 price tag as opposed to $15 for the first one. Less content or just going for a cheaper price now?