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Let's play ToEE!

Think fast

  • Earthshaker

    Votes: 1 33.3%
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  • Total voters
    3

Pussycat669

Liturgist
Joined
Jun 13, 2006
Messages
667
Location
In a fine suit
Mamon said:
Does this game have lots of bugs?

Hard to say. I'm one of those lucky folks that are seldom confronted with any serious or game stopping bugs. There are some annoying occasions when an attack is not properly executed and such things but nothing severe from my experience. The only big bug that I encountered recently is the looting bug that seems to be caused by the new DirectX 9.0c or so I heard. The official patch 3 should take care of that but the game won't start for me anymore when I install it so I used the next best unofficial patch that I could find to fix the problem.


Dunno really. A while back I would have suggested the second official patch but that doesn't fly anymore because of the mentioned looting bug.

Does it have a lot of sidequests?

The two town areas got a bunch and there're even some opportunities within the Tempel of Elemental Evil if you're evil (or semi evil) but otherwise ToEE remains a dungeon crawler at heart so if you're more interested in a rich amount of quests with multiple solutions and if you like them to rise above the level of 'go there kill that' quality you should probably reconsider.
 
Self-Ejected

Wilco

Self-Ejected
Joined
Nov 29, 2007
Messages
384
Location
The land of multi-headed phallus
Mamon said:
Does this game have lots of bugs? Do you recommend a patch?

At release yes it does, you should get the offical patches and the community patch at http://www.co8.org/ site.

Does it have a lot of sidequests?

It has a small amount of sidequests, a moderate between Icewind Dale and Baldur's Gate for example. It really is mainly a dungeon romp though, your focus will be on the Temple.
 

Pussycat669

Liturgist
Joined
Jun 13, 2006
Messages
667
Location
In a fine suit
Everything good must come to an end but before I carry Hommlet's half-dead body to its grave let me add a quick side comment first. I've increased the brightness of many of the screenshots (including the old ones), hopefully without catching the bloom, so you should now be able to actually see some of the action.


Visiting Hommlet: A snake pit survival guide (Chapter 3)

‘There are only two kinds of holy places: The ones that spawn angry spirits and loot, they’ll add a little to your fortune, and those that are inhabited by priests. These will cost you all of your fortune.’ Lord Grey, About Gods and the Unholy

Johnny bursts into the halls of the church of St. Cuthbert, ready to slaughter wave after wave of mindless zealots who are all ready to die defending the house of their lord. He’s quiet disappointed to find out that the ground floor is only occupied by one single cleric who doesn’t seem to be interested in a confrontation at all.

We meet Calmert, a man dedicated to St. Cuthbert, money, gluttony and alcohol.

55_Calmert.jpg



He pretends that he doesn’t know where to find Terjon until Screamer makes him loosen his tongue with a little donation of 10 gold pieces. The coward is hiding somewhere in his studies upstairs (you won't find him as long as you haven't asked Calmert beforehand). Before we can go get 'em however we also promise this pretentious priest to do some dirty work for him. One of the brewer's apprentices is long overdue with his next donation. He still needs to learn that no one can mess with the church. In case that Calmert doesn't turn hostile once we're done with Terjon we shall consider this job proposal.

Our group doesn't hesitate to speak to 'the man' in person. It is love on first sight.

56_Terjon.jpg



Since you should never lie to a priest, Screamer decides to be bluntly honest to him.

57_Terjon2.jpg



During the third turn in battle it dawns to the survivors that pissing off the bishop may have not been the best idea. (Tutorial: You can disband dead party members by clicking on the red question mark on their portrait)

58_Terjon_Death.jpg



No, no good idea at all.

59_Terjon_Death2.jpg



Ok, time for a great rewind. At least we get our first and foremost meta-gaming goal for the party: to train long and hard so they might become strong enough to defeat Terjon with one mighty Kamehameha! Until then we play along nice and learn that, in order to let the carpenter and his brother convert to the Old Faith (you do remember the farmers quest way back, right?), he wants more followers to brainwash, namely the only leatherworker in town. There is also a lost artifact of arguably small value that must be recovered from the Fields of Emridy Meadows. We will attend to the artifact later once we make peace with ourselves and the town, if possible.

Quest compass alert: There is another small thing our heroes get done before coming back to the important stuff. The priests got an old cook trapped in the basement who is in dire need of flour. The miller is a member of the Old Faith and in this regards a big naysayer to every- and anything that has to do with St. Cuthbert. We go to Jeroo, Screamer says 'balance in all things', we talk to miller. Done.
Step two: we talk to miller's apprentice and find out that he wants to join the church, we talk to miller, Screamer says 'balance in all things'. Done.


Next stop: Hommlet's famous brewery. It is one of the largest buildings in town. Thanks to the previous experience with young boys hiding in dark corners, it doesn't take long until Screamer finds the apprentice we're looking for.

60_Brewery.jpg



They get into a little chat after which the boy promises for his dear life that he'll collect the money until tomorrow. It later turns out that he tries to steal the needed sum from his master but is caught. The brewer, as every lawful good person, does the only reasonable thing: he beats the crap out of the boy and throws him out of the door. One thing leads to another leads to this:

61_Beggar_Maker.jpg


62_Beggar.jpg


Disclaimer: You could theoretically make the poor sod join now. Question is if you really want a worthless bum in your party though.

Seeing the chap in his misery of crushed dreams and alcoholism reminds Punkaid that they've still not attended to the pub's drinking contest. Johnny is about to correct that error.

63_Drinkingcontest.jpg



Every pint of ale deals 1-6 nonlethal damage. Nonlethal damage is shown in a special blue bar beneath the regular red bar as it can be seen in Johnny's case. Once the blue bar surpasses the red one your character will fall unconscious. Not this time however since Johnny is able to drink everyone under the table and not without a reward:

64_Drinkingcontestwinner.jpg



Fun Facts: There is one unofficial reward to be made. Since more than half of the pub lies unconsciously on the floor it certainly comes to no ones surprise that some of their possessions may go missing during the time. Don't worry, no one will mind. You're everyone’s hero now! Kobort's armor fits Johnny just nicely. The rest goes to Brother Smyth as always. Oh, and there is the thing that any paladin in your party will become a fallen one if you should anticipate in the drinking contest. That's what you get from drinking when you're underage, kids!

Let’s visit the leatherworker now so this silly farmer quest can finally be over and done with.

65_JackBurton.jpg



The good thing that can be said about him is that he doesn't send us to yet another NPC but he also wants something in return. His son has some strange illness that makes him numb so the leatherworker demands a miracle from St. Cuthbert himself before he considers switching sides. His wife gives the clue that Terjon already tried to heal her son but failed sensationally. There might be something hidden in his studies that could be of use, like a magical scroll or book. We return to Terjon and take a closer look around.

66_Bookshelf.jpg



Aha! Tons of Scrolls. All unidentified. We leave Magedude at the Pub and let his magic do the work for us.

Fun Facts: It turns out that identifying an item will always cost you 100 gold in ToEE no matter if its done by your people or a trader. I realize this too late as the 'Not enough money' message pops up. My party is almost broke now.


Magedude finds the scroll that will put this whole affair to an end and we therefore rush to the leatherworker's son as quickly as possible. It’s time for a miracle Magedude!

67_Bing.jpg



'Just doing my job M'am.'

It's all backtracking from here. We go to Terjon who now agrees that the carpenter may convert, then we go to the carpenter. While making our way back to Mathilde, we encounter our first interesting bug of an almost impenetrably invisible wall near Jeroo’s hut.

68_MapError.jpg



From Mathilde we go to Filliken who the party has learned to hate with a passion already without even knowing him. They don't take any pictures as an act of revenge so that his face shall be forgotten in the eternal stream of time. Soon, everything is again nice and dandy in Hommlet. There is that one guy, a desperate poor farmer who steals from Filliken so he can get his son through the harsh winter but Johnny takes care of him in a permanent matter before he can do any more harm.

There are also two more ‘marryable’ people in town for us to discover next to poor dead Fruella. The one that is most interesting for us is Filliken’s daughter. She’s a wannabe druid and a pretty poor NPC but she comes with granddaddy’s big badass sword of smashing holiness. We let Johnny yet again step forth to court the ladies. Although the results are rather disappointing, they are still way too hilarious to be not shown in public.

69_Dumb1.jpg


70_Dumb2.jpg


71_Dumb3.jpg



Alternatively, there's a local herder for the women in the group but he comes packed together with an eight year old son trapped in the body of a man who's causing trouble. Screamer makes him a simple offer: either he takes those 5 chopper pieces and beat it or she'll take said chopper pieces and stuff them down his dog's throat he seems so fond of.
He refuses and we kill the dog in cold blood. Neither the kid nor his father gives a damn. Slightly spooked out by this behavior, the group returns to the pub. They lock themselves in their room and make plans to escape this accursed place before Jeroo can order his people to sacrifice them to his heathen gods or Terjon goes all inquisitor on them. Going to the Meadows on a field trip seems to be a good excuse to escape without raising any suspicion. Yet preparations have to be made. There are worse things in the D&D world than snakes hidden under human skin.

Thus ends the tale in which the heroes uncover Hommlet's dark secrets before fleeing in terror.

Stay tuned for the next episode in which our brave heroes face lots of the undead, recreate the great battle of Emridy Meadows and face one mean zoophile hill giant!

Now, if you'll excuse me, I have to whip myself for the rest of the weekend in hopes that it shall cleanse my soul.
 

peak

Scholar
Joined
Apr 29, 2006
Messages
134
Location
Meshuggah City
A non-pro tip for identifying: As far as I can tell, the Read Magic cantrip costs no money to use and can identify scrolls and potions.

Otherwise, great stuff so far.
 

RK47

collides like two planets pulled by gravity
Patron
Joined
Feb 23, 2006
Messages
28,396
Location
Not Here
Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
Haha I'm enjoying my replay a bit. Although the town quests still suck bad, I decided to go in with a 3 man party with Elmo as the main tank. Cleric, Wiz and Rogue are my only generated PCs. Just hit lvl 3 and took Brew Potions feat on the cleric for easier healing in combat. Game's challenging, but plays fair so I don't find it too frustrating although the Emery Meadows area are a bit bullshit challenge without crowd control spells.
 

Pussycat669

Liturgist
Joined
Jun 13, 2006
Messages
667
Location
In a fine suit
Demicore said:
You somehow manage to make Hommlet interesting :salute:

Thank you! Thank you! :single tear running down the cheek:

And thanks to peak too. Your advice worked out as intended. I dunno if the spell is supposed to identify an item or if it is some kind of bug but the hell with that! It’s for free and Johnny loves his shinny.
 

RK47

collides like two planets pulled by gravity
Patron
Joined
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Messages
28,396
Location
Not Here
Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
Question about rogues, I managed to get one to Lvl 4 taking some ranged attack feats like Point Blank Shots and Precise Shot but realized that they're kinda pointless really.
What I'm thinking is that I should instead equip a Longspear and have him poke right behind the main tank.

He can even sneak attack and sometimes flank without even having to Tumble. Is this worth more than ranged attacks? Arrows seem to miss 66% of the time even against trash mobs, although I still give Heavy Cross bow to my wizard as filler attack when he runs out of spells (wiz can't wield spears unfortunately)

Oh, found 2 quite cheesy items as well Boots and Cloak of Elvenkind. Should your rogue get these, do not even invest too many points on Hide / Walk silently skills on level up, I've got 14 on both skills with the boots & robe on at lvl 4. I could sneak, disable trap and lockpick in the room filled with 9 ghouls and 3 ghasts (LOL) loot the chest filled with 1x Protection from Undead potion. Toss the pot on Elmo and let him tank everything.

And apparently raise dead knock down the XP to 1000 below current level. I had 2 out of 3 PC raised and they were knocked back to 2000 out of 3000 at Lvl 3. But as a result of their death my Wizard got bumped to lvl 5 quite fast....Fire ball . Mwahahahha.
 

Shoelip

Arbiter
Joined
Sep 27, 2006
Messages
1,814
Though you fail miserably at 3.5 D&D rules, great LP thread. It's hilarious.
 

Pussycat669

Liturgist
Joined
Jun 13, 2006
Messages
667
Location
In a fine suit
Shoelip said:
Though you fail miserably at 3.5 D&D rules

That reminds me, if any of you guys should ever see me writing bull please feel free to correct me. I wouldn't want to be the one spreading false rumors.

Anyways, cleansing is complete. Let's bring it on!



On Emridy Meadows: Walking with the undead

'It is still unknown why our deceased often tend to rise again to cause us harm. Sure you can say that, in a world filled with magic and mystery, everything is possible but as a man of science I never thought of this answer to be particularly satisfying. I therefore collected many theories over the course of my studies ranging from local myths to insane babbling. [...]The most interesting theory I came across was that the undead are in reality nothing but empty husks reanimated by the spirits of dead heroes and great adventurers who still lust for the experience to kill. Of course, the first time I heard it, I dismissed it as a wild presumption. Now that I'm more familiar with this branch of trade I must admit that I'm not so sure anymore.' Lord Grey, About Gods and the Unholy

(This chapter could also be called 'How I learned to love the 5-steps move' or 'The time I realized that undead are more annoying than animated pop up ads')

We rejoin Screamer and her companions as they make preparations for their trip to Emridy Meadows. The place where good kicked the arse of evil yet again. From what they could gather from the locals, many of the warriors who died there were also buried on the same ground (wink wink). We're up against the walking dead then. They are especially troublesome since they show great resistance towards ranged weapons like crossbows and bows (like the one we bought for Tumblefingers from Brother Smyth). Considering that three out of five members in the party use ranged weapons, an alternative must be found. While Screamer goes out to buy some holy water from the temple, Magedude and Punkaid attend to the pub and prepare proper spells. We open the spell menu for the very first time:

1_Spells.jpg



Phew, Punkaid got quiet a lot of spells. Unlike Magedude, he doesn't learn about two spells per level up or copies them from scrolls but they are granted to him from his deity (lazy bastard - M). Every spellcaster only got a limited amount of spells he can memorize/use. You chose the ones you want from the left, place them in one of the empty boxes to the right, wait for 8 hours and your guy is ready for action. We choose some protection spells for Punkaid and a lot of 'Disrupt Undead' spells for Magedude. They only make 1d6 damage (for the rare case that you're a RPG virgin: 1d6 means one six-sided dice like 3d16 would mean three 16-sided dices and so forth). It's not much but better than the 0-1 damage Magedude's crossbow would deal to a skeleton + the ammo that would be wasted. We also reorganize the party formation and place Johnny and Punkaid in front by dragging their portraits to the proper positions. Screamer isn't too happy when she finds out but then again that greedy wench has only bought three bottles of holy water one for herself, Magedude and Tumblefingers. They too deal around 1d6 damage to any undead or demons plus 1 splash damage in a range of 5 feet. That's pretty much all our level 2 party can do at the moment. Magedude gets the world map from his backpack and they plan a good route to the fields.

2_WorldMap.jpg



Safe bet that they arrive in the darkness of the night and surely it doesn't take long before the first skeleton suddenly bursts out of the ground and catches our heroes by surprise.

3_FirstRising.jpg



Magedude thinks fast and runs behind the fiend, his fingers tightly clutched around the big bottle he's holding. 'Burn baby burn!' comes over his lips as he throws the liquid into its back. Of course, he's also the first to realize that this statement doesn't make any sense in context but the damage is already done either ways.

4_BurnBaby.jpg



Fun Facts: Not sure if it is a bug but a bottle actually doesn't disappear from the game once thrown. If you hit an enemy, the bottle will land in his inventory and can be looted from his corpse. If you miss, the bottle will just lie right next to the target so you can pick it up and throw again. Although this might be considered an exploit it saves some money (around 36 gold per bottle) and more importantly room in the inventory.

Another undead pops up and tries to penetrate Magedude with his spear.

5_SecondRising.jpg



Magedude makes a 5-Step move to stay out of harms way when he starts to cast spells. As you can see 5-Steps aren't that much of a distance.

6_5-StepChicken.jpg



No matter, fire away Magedude!

7_FirstDeaddead.jpg



As Johnny and Punkaid are about to deal with the remaining undead in Magedude's back another skeleton, this time with a crossbow, attacks the group. Punkaid becomes careless and charges in while Johnny is still occupied with the spear wielder. Soon, Punkaid finds himself in real trouble.

8_PunkaidInTrouble.jpg



Is this the already the end of poor young Punkaid? Will Johnny be in time to save the day? Do dead clerics taste good? Find out in the ne.. I mean now.
It is time to remember that there is a special bond between priests and the undead. While the jolly good priest gets the rather boring opportunity to turn undead and therefore destroy them forever, Punkaid, as the evil bastard he is, can try to rebuke them and therefore convert them to our cause (there are a few exceptions for evil clerics depending on their deity. Look in the help menu for further references).
Better try it now than never.

9_Converter.jpg



Wow, full strike! Punkaid got them all in one run! Even the one that is still hiding beneath the earth yield before his awesome powers! (I still got no idea what those powers could be. They definitely couldn't mean his stats that is for sure)

We have made our first step to build our army of ultimate evil. A group photo therefore seems to be in order. Those boneheads won't follow our commands during combat but at least they will make good decoys and damage absorbers.

10_ItBegins.jpg



With more firepower watching our back, we walk a little cross-country. Another encounter with an undead crossbowman that follows again evolves into something rather serious and it becomes complicated to tell friend and enemy apart.

11_TheGreatBattle.jpg



It’s about time for a song to wash all the troubles away. Screamer steadies her lute to inspire a little more courage that will increase attacks and defenses of her allies. Curiously enough it also works for our undead friends.

12_TheGreatBattleBard.jpg



Magedude wants to seize the opportunity to yet again outflank the enemies so that he can place a burning hand spell into their back. We press and hold alt to plan his route.

13_AttackOfOpportunity.jpg



I promised to explain attacks of opportunity and this appears to be a good moment for it. See those yellow circles underneath the combatants? That is their current melee range. It can vary mostly depending on the type of weapon that is used and the size of the attacker. If someone stumbles into this circle who is not a friend there is the possibility that he can trigger an attack of opportunity (as it is indicated here with the red sword symbol) in case that the passerby doesn't make a successful tumble roll. There are other occasions that may provoke such an attack, like casting a spell at leisure or drinking a potion while still in fighting range. Some foes get more than one attack of opportunity so running past them can be really painful. You should always try to keep out of range whenever possible. We redirect Magedude therefore by setting waypoints around the dangerous areas with the finger still remaining on the alt key.

14_Outmanouver.jpg



That seems reasonable enough. We confirm with a left click on the last waypoint (alternatively right click to start planning anew), Magedude yells 'Jawohl Herr Kaleun!' and is set on his way (Silent Hunter 3 fans may catch the reference). This time, they'll burn for real.

15_BurnBaby2.jpg



Well, that wasn't that bad but then again the undead apparently can't stop harassing Magedude with polearms.

16_MoreTrouble.jpg



No big drama though. Magedude retreats back north while successfully avoiding an attack by a skeleton on his way. Johnny, Punkaid and the other boneheads make quick work of the remaining enemies. The second great battle of Emridy Meadows comes to an end without any casualties on our side and the group is awarded by fireworks and a level up.

17_Victory.jpg



Having enough excitement for the night, our valiant heroes return to the pub before continuing on their adventure in the morning. They are just examining the southern parts of the fields as the ground suddenly starts shaking. Suspicious and a wee bit terrified they send sneaky Tumblefingers alone to scout ahead.

18_BearSpotted.jpg



A bear? Probably dangerous sure but he doesn't look big enough to cause such trembling. The next fellow who comes in sight does however.

19_GiantSpotted.jpg



It's a god damn Hill Giant! Knowing that they only got dim chances against a creature of such raw powers in a direct confrontation, Magedude decides that a more subtle approach is in order. Tumblefingers waits until the giant walks away a bit, starts to sneak attack the bear (one arrow, 12 hitpoints damage, up your arse!) and makes a run for it back to the others who are in hiding. Johnny is buffed with pretty much anything that was at our disposal (which really isn't that much) when the bear reaches him.

20_BearAmbushed1.jpg



To make a long story short, the bear goes down eventually. Saying that it was a close call would be a drastic understatement however.

21_BearAmbushed2.jpg



Second visit at the pub. When the group returns it is after nightfall again so we try to rest for a few hours until the sun goes up. The game differs between four kinds of areas when it comes to resting. The rest button (yellow tent symbol here) will change either in color or symbol depending where you are. Green tent means safe, yellow that there is a chance for a random encounter, red is a no go and if the icon should ever change to a pocket watch then your party is only able to pass time and stand around harassing people but not to rest. The wild is a yellow zone, naturally, so the following doesn't come as a surprise.

22_CampAmbush.jpg



Punkaid tries to rebuke the gnolls but is too low in level to do anything other than to terrify them. At least they don't defend themselves while we beat them to powder. No fun. We make two more resting attempts since it is very unlikely that there will be more random encounters in such a short frequency.

23_CampEnd.jpg



Aw, screw that! Back to the pub then.

Fun Facts: The dead guys in the pile are actually pirates. No ninjas spotted so far.

We have one last confrontation with the undead before taking care of the giant.

24_GreatBattle2_1.jpg


25_GreatBattle2_2.jpg



Punkaid makes them again cowering in fear. It's time to fire it up Magedude!

26_GreatBattle2_3.jpg


27_GreatBattle2_4.jpg



Oh for crying out loud! How many god forsaken people died on this field? (well, probably thousands so I better don't ask aloud)

Once they're finally all dealt with Tumblefingers and Screamer realize that their bottles of holy water have gone missing. Pressing the tab key makes them quickly find their belongings.

28_ItemSearch.jpg



It is time for the great (meaning big in size) finale of this episode. Magedude has prepared a web spell that will, hopefully, immobilize the giant so our spells and arrows can take care of him. Either that or we’ll be squished to death. It's your pick. Surprisingly enough that plan seems to actually work.

29_GiantBattle1.jpg



Damn, look at the attack range of that thing! To think that this guy has the cleave feat as well, meaning that he gets a free attack if his first attack should kill someone (what happens often), makes us glad that it is to our skeleton minions to be brutally crushed instead of Johnny and Punkaid. Open fire!

30_GiantBattle2.jpg



We can hurt him. That's quiet a relief.

31_GiantBattle3.jpg



Getting somewhere (we're so dead if he should break free)

32_GiantBattle4.jpg



Oh for the love of- Johnny just can't take it no more and rams that fat bastard. End of story.

33_GiantDeath.jpg



Level 4 is in grasp now plus all the juicy loot we get. Some jewelry, an elven cloack for Tumblefingers that will help her when she's trying to hide and some nifty elven armor for Punkaid (good protection, low chance of spell failure).

Wait, weren't our heroes supposed to do something here? Screamer swaps through her secret diary and finds the part about Terjon wanting an artifact hidden somewhere under a rock. Like this one?

34_RockTreasure.jpg



We find what he's been looking for. It's a trinket and really as worthless as mentioned. Giving it back to him will grant us a discount for every service of the temple so there is no real argument against it. We also discover a strange figurine from which Terjon warns us that it possesses some kind of evil magic and that we should get rid of it. We keep it of course and let Burne identify it.

36_Figurine.jpg



What is a Fungi? Maybe we will find out next episode when our people explore the not so deep depths of the moathouse and finally get the main quest running. (Actually no, we won't find out but I thought it would be a nice cliffhanger nonetheless)
 

Thrasher

Erudite
Joined
Jan 17, 2008
Messages
1,407
Nice demonstration of the 5-step maneuver and waypoint movement to avoid attacks of oppoortunity.

Keep it coming!

This is making me want to play this again. :)
 

Black

Arcane
Joined
May 8, 2007
Messages
1,872,665
You lvl'd up and kept how did you spent the levels to yourself?!
Very angry surprised face!

Lvl'ing up is the best part of every good rpg!
 

King Crispy

Too bad I have no queen.
Patron
Staff Member
Joined
Feb 16, 2008
Messages
1,876,703
Location
Future Wasteland
Strap Yourselves In
Some quick tips for you which you may or may not already know about:

- Don't use missle weapons while within melee range of enemies. That will provoke AoO's.

- Blunt weapons like hammers and maces work well (or better) against skeletons.

- Always wash your hands after using the bathroom.
 

Nightjed

Liturgist
Joined
Jan 27, 2004
Messages
675
Location
Wasteland
Pussycat669 said:
I'm not sure what's the purpose of the 5 Foot Step thing. The only time that move is useful is if you find yourself in a large group of enemies. The premise is that you can walk a very short distance without provoking an attack of opportunity and still be able to attack afterwards.

the 5 foot step is one of the most useful actions of the game, you get one 5fs every round doesnt matter what you do (even if you execute a full round attack), it does not provoke an aoo making it vital to position your fighters as new enemies keep coming (specially useful against enemies with wide threat area of aoo)

also you forgot something about charge, it does not provoke aoo making it perfect for the first approach+attack
 

Thrasher

Erudite
Joined
Jan 17, 2008
Messages
1,407
5 foot step is nice -

You can attack then take a 5f step, to force your attacker to spend part of his turn to move towards you, depriving him of a full round attack.
 

Pussycat669

Liturgist
Joined
Jun 13, 2006
Messages
667
Location
In a fine suit
Black said:
You lvl'd up and kept how did you spent the levels to yourself?!

Truth to be told it's more like I've forgot what exactly I did in this particular level up. I think Screamer got lightning reflexes (she desperately needed that one), combat casting for both Magedude and Punkaid (always useful), point blank shot for Tumblefingers and power attack for Johnny. As for skills, well, skill points aren't really that much to spend outside the character's profession (except in Magedude's case perhaps) so there isn't much to add there.


Crispy said:
Don't use missle weapons while within melee range of enemies. That will provoke AoO's.

This is also true for unarmed attacks as I forgot to mention. Meh, but that's nitpicking. :P

Crispy said:
Blunt weapons like hammers and maces work well (or better) against skeletons.

Sure thing but Screamer and Magedude aren’t that much good for a one-o-one. Maybe Tumblefingers but that would have been out of character and evil meta-gaming.

Crispy said:
Always wash your hands after using the bathroom.

What? You mean, like, every time? Who got time for that?


Nightjed said:
5 foot step

Yeah, I've only recently started to realize its benefits. I guess the issue here is that I normally played ToEE with a melee focused group with maybe one spellcaster thrown in for the special effects. I therefore seldom needed to use complex maneuvers to deal with any situation because I always had a tank at hand to keep anyone at bay.

Nightjed said:
also you forgot something about charge, it does not provoke aoo making it perfect for the first approach+attack

Thanks, I didn't know that. Normally everyone is still flat footed when I charge in so I wouldn't have noticed.
 

Shoelip

Arbiter
Joined
Sep 27, 2006
Messages
1,814
BTW, Bard's spell casting isn't effected by light armor and Cleric's isn't effected by any armor.

You could also try slings for a ranged attack against skelies. And don't forget that slashing weapons work better against the fleshy undead.

Oh yes, and healing spells do damage to undead.

Oh yes, and inflict spells heal undead.

And your evil cleric can "Spontaneously cast" inflict spells by sacrificing any other spell of the same level.

Also, you don't get an AoO from moving into a threatened area, just moving out of it. Or in the case of characters with a long reach, moving closer.

Also, combat rounds are technically six second increments, though that doesn't really matter at all.

Anyway, keep going. It's great! I hope some of this helps.
 

Norfleet

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RK47 said:
Oh, found 2 quite cheesy items as well Boots and Cloak of Elvenkind. Should your rogue get these, do not even invest too many points on Hide / Walk silently skills on level up, I've got 14 on both skills with the boots & robe on at lvl 4. I could sneak, disable trap and lockpick in the room filled with 9 ghouls and 3 ghasts (LOL) loot the chest filled with 1x Protection from Undead potion. Toss the pot on Elmo and let him tank everything.
The power of those items is not in giving them to your rogue, but in giving them to characters who are utterly devoid of hiding and sneaking skills. Equipping the worst sneakers in your party this way will enable full-party stealth, allowing you to sneak practically the ENTIRE PARTY into perfect formation for an alpha strike. Once the entire party is in position, reposition all their initiative orders so that you move as a contiguous unit: Even if you wait until after a monster moves, they will do nothing because they don't realize they're in a fight yet, so you can have your entire party positioned initiatively in a we-go-you-go order rather than a chaotic mess of people moving at random. This means that with full-party stealth, your entire party moves as an organized crack commando unit, rather than a chaotic mass of rabble, and also, you get first strike, meaning you can eviscerate the entire opposing leadership and all their casters before they can move, cast, or even raise shields while laying down a nice fiery bombardment of fireballs right on top of the rogues (who are practically immune this treatment anyway), before perforating the kidneys of all who survive the flaming holocaust.

In short, giving those items to your rogue is a waste: he's already pretty invisible as-is. Making your ENTIRE PARTY invisible is the way to go. Remember the saying: Invisible, Insane. A swift and decisive alpha strike will not only wipe out most of the strongest enemy opposition, but the fact that your party operates as an ordered unit means that you can actually maintain a line of battle without dissolving into a chaotic, disorganized mess like you see above.
 

Pussycat669

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Shoelip said:
Cleric's isn't effected by any armor.

What!? You're telling me that now, after I finished up to five games with the 3.5 rule set already (which are probably going to be the last now that edition 4 seems to be around the corner)? I didn't find anything about this in the in-game wiki but then again it's probably a divine caster thing right? I always wondered why the spells of my heavily armored paladin never fizzled. Oh well, live and learn I guess. As for bards I must admit that I'm uncertain in Screamers case because of her poor weight tolerance. Now that I'm working my way down the temple I will reconsider buying her leather armor or something when time seems right or in case I find a light weight alternative. She's never using her rapier anyways.

Shoelip said:
Oh yes, and healing spells do damage to undead.

That japs talk! On a more serious note though has anyone actually ever used that option? It always sounded to me like a last straw approach to waste healing spells on critters and I normally try to avoid such situations.

All in all some true words of wisdom gramps! I appreciate it :wink:


One more thing I'm curious about, does the game actually handle line of sight and cover when evaluating a ranged attack? I know there are some occasions, for example when someone is trapped in a web, that he is considered (half?)covered but how is it with mobile (enemies, PCs) and static (tables, rocks) cover? I always got the impression that my archer hits way more often when he gets a free line of fire or am I overestimating the game here?
 

RK47

collides like two planets pulled by gravity
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Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
u haven't met their mom yet. It seems we have different mob encounters in Emridy Meadows, I got in trouble when looting the rainbow rock on my rogue. It just spawned a slew of undead as well as a skeleton priest that has a huge debuff aura and casts Sound Bursts.

Oh side tip: Next time you're going in with a rogue, take anything that isn't nailed down while sneaking (I did this at the hill giant's). At least you can check if the prize is worth the encounter. TOEE has a weird feature like naming the chest after its guardians. So a Mexican chest will most likely be guarded by Mexicans (If you don't see them, they'll probably spawn on top of you the moment you are spotted), while hidden, pick the lock, loot and decide if you want the encounter's XP and possible loot.
 

Norfleet

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Pussycat669 said:
That japs talk! On a more serious note though has anyone actually ever used that option? It always sounded to me like a last straw approach to waste healing spells on critters and I normally try to avoid such situations.
It does tend to be a waste, until you get to spells like "Heal", which does mega-damage. Otherwise you tend to be better off healing a fighter, where the extra hitpoints that you buy will gain you far more damage in the end. Still, the option is there should you choose to use it, as infrequently as it may be. If you encounter any heavily armored undead, this may be an option to consider with the higher-level heals (low level heals do like 1d8 damage, which simply does not sufficiently beat out the simple mace-in-the-face approach), as heal/inflict are touch attacks and ignore armor. For the most part, though, the common rank and file undead is unarmored and you don't really encounter any better undead in the game.
 

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