Which is the best attribute in Fallout New Vegas?

[Gozma]

The legion is so malformed it's hard to enumerate specific points on which it sucks.

A big one is that it has no texture or characters. Nearly every Legion member you interact with has an exactly identical personality and behavior. They have no personal interests, tics, history, natures, anything. That's why I think expanding Legion content wouldn't fix anything, because they're supposed to be perfectly monolithic anyway so met one Legion guy, met 'em all. The Legion as an institution (besides the "free agent" guys like Vulpes and Lonesome Road guy that do whatever the plot needs an independent person to do) has near zero internal structure; no cliques, no feuding sub-forces, no factions, no disputes, no budding oligarchs, no specialists, nothing. If you read Sawyer's shit about them it seems like that was really his intent, not that there's just not enough content-mass to do that stuff. A related problem is that Oblivion facegen and atrocious Bethesda voice casting/direction makes everyone look like a 40 year old nerd when this is obviously "supposed" to be an army of child/teen soldiers that could theoretically be this callow and uniform.

So, basically, they fail to be interesting on the level of a simulated force. There's nothing there and nothing to interact with.

But then they also don't work as a comic book mythic force of evil for plot purposes either, mostly because it's impossible in an engine that can barely have five guys waddle around visible before performance falls apart, so a vast slave army is a pretty serious non-starter. Even just in narrative terms, Obsidian wrote them to have been beaten in the backstory for some reason and never write in a particular reason to make it seem like they wouldn't lose again. They end up being sad mooks and it kills the second half of the game's narrative. The perfect microcosm of the problem is in the town where you rescue the crucified NCR soldiers literally by shooting two dogs and one legion guy - the legion "boss" character in the area is stuck inside a different cell and can't even come out to interact with you while you do this - and then the NCR characters fall all over themselves with dialog about what an amazing badass you are for rescuing these unsavable guys.

 

[DragoFireheart]

Why bother with durability when you can just shoot everything on the eye for massive damage before they even reach for their weapon?

Because you don't have to sacrifice anything worthwhile for that endurance.

 

[DalekFlay]

The Legion as an institution (besides the "free agent" guys like Vulpes and Lonesome Road guy that do whatever the plot needs an independent person to do) has near zero internal structure; no cliques, no feuding sub-forces, no factions, no disputes, no budding oligarchs, no specialists, nothing. If you read Sawyer's shit about them it seems like that was really his intent, not that there's just not enough content-mass to do that stuff. A related problem is that Oblivion facegen and atrocious Bethesda voice casting/direction makes everyone look like a 40 year old nerd when this is obviously "supposed" to be an army of child/teen soldiers that could theoretically be this callow and uniform.

This isn't a flaw, it's the whole point of the faction. Complete obedience through discipline, worship of the leader and tribal roots molded through violent takeover. The benefits of that in their territory are numerous, but you give up your individuality and freedom to acquire it. That's the whole point.

Also I thought the faces were fine, they solved that whole issue after Oblivion with that engine (on PC anyway).

 

[Gozma]

I know it's the point; I said it was Sawyer's intent. It makes for a boring faction that doesn't work effectively in the engine of the game, with their art assets, or as narrative. The legion doesn't actually exist - they can change stuff about the fantasy to make it work in their game as they see fit. It sucks to join, to fight, and to interact with in any way, and not in a boo-hiss bad guy way, but in a "this is crap" way.

It's like the currency stuff - it's a big sim idea they implemented as 3 completely interchangeable weightless currencies with absolute prices that have zero gameplay effect and do nothing but clutter up the already choked NV inventory system. The ideas were completely incompatible with the engine and where they were willing to go with gameplay. Because it ends up being a minor issue it's no big deal, but they should have either gotten control of fiction their game can't pay off or make their game pay it off.

 

[aweigh]

most evil act in NV that i remember was the two Westside/Freeside citizens who work out of a pawnshop and slave-trade to the fiends in Vault 3. reading their slaving journal was ebil to teh core. so much so i always just shoot them immediately on playthroughs afterwards, hah.

in second place would be the NCR captain in the Aerotech Office Park "village" who just murders that dude he asks you to go investigate. once you come back with your findings he just walks over and shoots him in cold blood. turns out there was a history there involving some woman.

 

[Metro]

The Legion as an institution (besides the "free agent" guys like Vulpes and Lonesome Road guy that do whatever the plot needs an independent person to do) has near zero internal structure; no cliques, no feuding sub-forces, no factions, no disputes, no budding oligarchs, no specialists, nothing. If you read Sawyer's shit about them it seems like that was really his intent, not that there's just not enough content-mass to do that stuff. A related problem is that Oblivion facegen and atrocious Bethesda voice casting/direction makes everyone look like a 40 year old nerd when this is obviously "supposed" to be an army of child/teen soldiers that could theoretically be this callow and uniform.

This isn't a flaw, it's the whole point of the faction. Complete obedience through discipline, worship of the leader and tribal roots molded through violent takeover. The benefits of that in their territory are numerous, but you give up your individuality and freedom to acquire it. That's the whole point.

Also I thought the faces were fine, they solved that whole issue after Oblivion with that engine (on PC anyway).

Even ancient Rome had factions/cliques/infighting. We can dance around whether it was intentional or not but the end result is the Legion tuns out to be uninteresting and generic. Pretty much on par with Bethesderp's writing of the Enclave but at least that had campy Malcom McDowell with his FDR-like speeches.

 

[Jick Magger]

To be fair, the Fallout 2 Enclave weren't that well written either.

 

[Perkel]

This thread reminds me i need to do FNV ceasar play-trough with being max dick i can to everybody.

 

[deuxhero]

I don't know if anyone knew about this, but the back of the (PC) ultimate edition box says this

Whether you're a seassoned explorer of the Mojave or playing the game for the first time, you will find there are more friend, and enemeies, to make and more consequences to be responsible for and more opportunities to live in glory, of infamy, throughout the Wasteland. The choices you make will be as influential as ever.

 

[Abu Antar]

Being a dick to everybody and not killing anyone is great. Just make sure you have perks and skills that help in dialog. You also should invest in sneak, just in case. Then, do not wear anyarmor at all and have no weapons in your inventory.