Completed Vikings in Space! (Kerbal Space Programme)

[Ulminati]

Once more, with mods!

Recent breakthrough in Komputar Kalkulations have allowed VSP to devise new and amazing instruments. The first of which is the MAPSAT plugin, that allows us to map the surface of planets we orbit. Due to highly extravagent spendings in the past, our current budget is somewhat limited. To this end, we'll be scaling back to small, light vehicles with a minimum of waste and a maximum of reusability whenever deemed feasible.

To make the launch as cheap as possible, the 1-kerbalton Mapsat satellite is mounted on a Mjölnir using duct tape space-age bonding materials.

Launch was pretty uneventful, although Stereotypical Villain complained the drag of the satellite made the Mjölnir tend towards pointing its nose upwards. Continual counter steering during ascent was necessary.

Once the Mjölnir reached a stable orbit, the Mapsat is ejected.

The satellite is christened Mapsat I and left to drift for now.

Because Mission Control needed to pay attention to SV, who had performed his deorbitation burn and told them something Awesome™ was about to happen.

He deliberately overshot the Kerbal Spaceport and deployed his parachute over water to make a handbrake turn towards the Sekrat Landing Strip™

He had also completely forgotten to transfer fuel back to the jet tanks and reopen the ramjet intakes. Fortunately he remembered at the last second and managed to nail a beautiful landing.

Back to mapsat one, a higly sophisticated FIEAKSNATAWT™ (Fuck-Ion-Engines-And-Ksp-Not-Allowing-Time-Acceleration-While-Thrusting) maneuver was performed during 6 consecutive orbits in the daylight side to bring the satellite to a 45 degree inclination.

Mid-maneuver, Mapsat found its first unregistered anomaly! a few flickering pixels in the camera reveal something in a small valley, far below. What could this mysterious place be? a secret Koviet nuclear silo? It will, for now, remain a mystary!

 

[Hellraiser]

anomaly

It's probably the desert temple.

 

[Ulminati]

Maybe. I've avoided all spoilers to the anomalies so far. I'm pretty excited I managed to find one on my own. I'm thinking about refuelling SVs Mjölnir and letting him cruise to it.

 

[Ulminati]

I left the satellite in 50x time acceleration while making dinner and watching TV. Data returned is looking good. The 100km orbit results in a very, very narrow beam hitting Kerbin. The map is going to take quite a while to render. It's possible to go as high as 500km, but resolution is going to suffer. It'll get everything in the +/- 46 degree band eventually thanks to Kerbins rotation. Ideally I should've gone into a polar orbit (and I bet I'm missing out on a secret Nazi submarine or something as a result ), but my ion thruster design proved insufficient to the task. If I had changed the launch profile at liftoff, this would easily have been remedied. Live and learn.

A raw output of Lenmark Mapsat data on Kerbin extracted via the command line:

Just a basic height map so far. It's more interesting in-game, where it will hilight anomalies you've passed over. Needless to say, next image is HUGE SPOILARZ if you wanted to find them yourself.

Spoiler

Well, SV has plenty of places to visit now. The 3 blops near the equator is the Kerbal Spaceport, the "Secret" airstrip just off the coast and a thid easter egg I haven't actually gotten around to visiting yet. The other blops are anomalies (mün archs, münoliths, hidden spaceports etc) you could go visit.

I'm also considering a Münmapping expedition with 2-4 probes to send into different altitudes and inclinations. Plugins breated a lot of life back into the game just as my interest was beginning to decrease slightly. (Can you imagine, I wasted a whole afternoon on King's bounty when I could've been playing KSP?) I heard rumors that there's a plugin that simulates distances for radio signals when launching unmanned missions. You'll have to build up satellite relays to communicate with deep space probes and account for delays when issuing commands.

 

[Hellraiser]

The Jakanese Suzuki Munar Prospector gets lucky!

Much Kethane, also known as Potato Gas in the eastern block, has been found on the Mun. While scientists have predicted that Kethane may not be native to Kerbin and can be found elsewhere in space, it wasn't until now that any nation has developed the technology to locate deposits on other celestial bodies. But the engineers of Jakan has once again shown why they are among the best in the world, the Suzuki probe named after a fish that is considered a lucky charm in Jakan, has been equipped with Kethane detectors that can spot underground deposits from orbit. Development of mining vehicles and refining units which may convert it into oxidizer, rocket fuel or monopropelant is expected to begin soon.

Deposits are randomly generated per persistence file, they're in the 6 digit range and kethane is roughly converted with 95% efficiency to rocket fuel. I think one detector per probe is enough, they work during time warp but skip spots if its too fast (probably the same issue with ISA mapsat as I think the Kethane mod uses its plugin). They use a bit of energy so better stock up on batteries for the planet's shadow. Either way I hear communist spies will steal this technology from Jakan.

 

[Ulminati]

Hellraiser

Good god, that plugin looks tempting. It'd certainly make a Munar refuelling station a lot less time consuming to maintain. Maybe I'll send up a NERVA orbital tug and a couple of probes to dock with Kraftworld Kodexia to hunt potato gas myself!

 

[Hellraiser]

Yes, it got finally properly updated to 0.18 over Christmas. Parts use electricity for drilling (so moar drills need moar power) and it gives you more reasons to land in different locations, construct surface bases, rovers and landers. Not to mention reasons for new missions.

 

[Ulminati]

God damn it. I went to kerbal spaceport to track down the potato gas mod, and now I found all kinds of awesome!
http://kerbalspaceport.com/crew-transfer-life-support/ <--- Moar realism! New ways for Kerbals to die!
http://kerbalspaceport.com/0-18-2-kas-kerbal-attachment-system-v0-1/ <--- Moar EVA
http://kerbalspaceport.com/quantum-strut/ <--- Anti-wobble system for docked vehicles!
http://kerbalspaceport.com/cleverbobcat-0-18/ <-- Rovers. You probably already got this
http://kerbalspaceport.com/remotetech-3/ <-- Moar realism! I can't be the only one who gets a nerd-on contemplating an interstellar communications relay network.
http://kerbalspaceport.com/payloader/ <-- Amazing program. Allows you to take two vehicles you've already designed (say, a payload and a universal lifting stage) and glue their .craft files together. No more rebuilding things from scratch!
http://kerbalspaceport.com/0-18-1-kw-rocketry-overhauled/ <-- I kinda want this. The engines and fairings look really pretty. But it also feels a bit like cheating since the engines seem to have better thrust and ISP than stock parts.
http://kerbalspaceport.com/mission-pack/ <-- A rudementary campaign/scenario generator. I'm thinking we could have fun with this one



But I haven't been able to find the potato gas miner Hellraiser uses

 

[Hellraiser]

Ulminati you could have just googled Kethane mod for Kerbal or something:

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com...e-it-burn-it-Another-new-tank-and-a-few-fixes

The dudes making it have some awesome things in the making, like different kinds of scanners.

Not sure about the Bobcat rover mod as it doesn't use energy yet IIRC, and I kind of like my Ion Engine stock rovers. Although new wheels would be nice.

 

[Ulminati]

I didn't know if Kethane was their name or yours

I'm going to wait on the Kethane thing until they get a few more versions in. It sounds pretty awesome, but my game is already turning into a frankensteinian monster with extra mods. I think I'll scale back to just Mechjeb, Mapsat and Quantum Struts for now. (Because Quantum Struts are awesome).

If they add a way to mine Jool in, I'm SO going to get it and work out a way to build Bespin though.

 

[Ulminati]

Seperatrons
Stops ridiculously large stages from colliding with each other.

Mechjeb auto-ascent
When I get 3fps because I'm launching a 700-ton monstrosity

Something borked up horribly in KSP and I couldn't fix it.
It'd crash every 15 minutes or so. Nuking and reinstalling fix'd it, but I lost my .craft files and savegames. Ah well, no biggie. But I decided I couldn't be arsed to dock since it was getting late, so I just launced a all-in-one space station as a single, 50-ton payload.

Full orange tank - Check
Nearly full large Monopropellant tank - Check
6 large solar panels, 24 tiny solar panels - Check
Large battery x4 - Check
Habitation pod - Check
RCS - Check
ASAS - Check
Radio cummunications dish x4 - Check
A set of measuring apparatus - Check
5-port docking nexus - Check
Illuminatiors on all docking ports - Check
External ladders between all docking ports to ease EVA - Check
Quantum Struts™ pointed at every docking entrance to stop the whole thing from wobbling when things dock - Check!

It took a few (ok, a LOT) of lifting stage redesigns before I got this damn thing in orbit. It uses 4 LV-45s on a double orange tank in the orbit stage, 6 mainsails on double orange tanks, feeding into the orbit stage, as the ascent stage and 12 large SRBs for liftoff. Also a bajillion seperatrons on everything to make sure the stages don't collide during seperation.

It wasn't pretty, it wasn't neat, it wasn't cheap and it wasn't smart. But it was interesting to get a 702 ton rocket to orbit. I basically just stuck MOAR ROCKET onto it until success. Polant rocket design philosophy.

 

[Burning Bridges]

Kethan is a mod right? It's actually a very good idea, resource detection and mining should become offiical one day.

Currently I am not using mods, achievements are worthless with them, and I lost much progress in the past. Of course sometimes Mechjeb / Rover etc, when features are missing in the game.

 

[Ulminati]

Kethane is a mod, yes. But it is a very tempting one to get. Since I've already gotten full fuel tanks into orbit and NERVA interplanetary tugs, it's not like I couldn't just pre-seed planets with fuel in orbit anyway. I kind of like the idea of landing and mining instead.

Until they make a permanent docking port that's more rigid than the ones currently in the game, I also strongly recommend quantum struts if you are into orbital assembly. They have the same range, strength and weight as regular struts plus they consume a little power. It seems a reasonable price for reducing the dreaded wobble.

 

[Hellraiser]

Depends on the mod really, most modded part are indeed overpowered. The Kethane mod though cuts down the fuel supply line length if you plan a refueling mission. Sure, it may make some return missions easier but I only plan on using it for refueling fuel depots and the Cruisier when it is in Kerbin Orbit back from a mission. Also some small vessels I leave in other planetary systems. First landings and journeys need to be made without refueling for prestige , unless it is an Eve lander mission. But I digress.

Anyway the biggest monster of a rocket I ever launched is what I dubbed the 9-pack:

Here used to get the Cruisier into orbit. That's as many "pure" asparagus double-jumbo mainsail rockets as you can fit on the launch pad with boosters. You can only go up from there. It turned out to be overkill for the crusier and even with the lander it didn't ditch the core 9-pack stage (a 4 LV engine double-jumbo) until 90% into the Duna transfer burn. And the tank was maybe 35% full when it entered parking orbit. At least I know the thing can probably make it to Jool and back with a full double-jumbo tank module docked.

 

[Ulminati]

I'm actually sort-of considering to re-import parts of the KW rocketry pack and just edit the engines to match the weight/drag/thrust/isp/etc of the stock engines because the new models look prettier.

I also think this thread may have served its purpose. My writing has been sort-of weak and I've done all the "basic" stuff (orbiting, rendezvous, docking, landing, return missions, SSTO spaceplane, space station). I'm thinking of having the LP marked as completed and start a new, better-written space agency to do an interplanetary, narrative mission to string everything together. Possibly using Kethane to build a refuelling station at Minmus, possibly not. I'm open to suggestions for the agency and destination/scope of the mission/narrative approach.

 

[Radech]

how about doing an ironman challenge like it was done with the fallouts ages ago, see how many planets one can get a single kerbal to and back from - without him blowing to pieces or drifiting off in space

 

[Burning Bridges]

I don't think the game is stable enough for that kind of thing. It would probably end because of "Ooops" window or something stupid.

Another problem is that, no matter how great inronman sounds in theory, it could eventually lead to all kinds of situations in which you spend ridiculous amounts of time waiting for something. For example your solar panels point in the wrong direction but you might get them back if you wait half a year of game time. Some people will not mind, but a lot of time could go by trying and trying and trying ..

I think making it a requirement to get back from every mission would be hard enough. Another could be to limit the weight of the parts allowed so that you cannot simply use monster rockets.

 

[Ulminati]

I think making it a requirement to get back from every mission would be hard enough. Another could be to limit the weight of the parts allowed so that you cannot simply use monster rockets.

It could be pretty interesting to do an interplanetary expedition where all payloads must exit the atmosphere using a predefined lifting rocket. (Say, a mainsail, two SRBs and a LV45). I could then discard the mainsail (but keep the fuel tank), ship it to Mün and refill it using Potato Gas if I go with that mod. That opens up the door for assembling a Müttership somewhere around Kerbin and then launching a multipurpose interplanetary expedition with orbital/surface probes, a manned lander etc. Duna or the moons of Jool would be likely destinations.

I'm thinking possibly awarding myself with higher tonnage rockets/payloads as milestones are met. Say:
10 ton max - Start
20 ton max - Scan Kerbin for Potato Gas
30 ton max - Scan Mun/Minmus for Potato Gas
50 ton max - Land a Potato Gas Drill on Mun/Minmus
75 ton max - Return Munar Potato Gas sample to Kerbin
100 ton max - Construction of manned Munar/Minmus mining site/refuelling depot.
150 ton max? - Interplanatary mothership!

Once off-kerbin refuelling is possible, I could assemble a "Mothership" with transfer/return stages, orbital/surface probes, science bay, landing module etc. Ship the parts into orbit for assembly and refuelling and send kerbals to prepare colonization of another world. I'm thinking either Duna to keep things simple, or the moons of Jool if feeling ambitious. If the lander is capable of re-ascending, I could then bring a potato gas drill out there (assuming potato gas exists on other planets) and build a colony.

Thoughts/suggestions for mission milestones and payload limits? I'm fairly confident that I can get an ultra-lightweight probe in Kerbin orbit within 10 tons and around mun/minmus within 15-20 tons. Once the manned stuff starts, I may have to start refuelling in orbit and going interplanetary will definately require sending up multiple 100-150t stages to assemble things in orbit.

 

[Radech]

The Holodisk of Shame
---------------------
  Name          Game      Gifted        Cause of Death
 
1. Hunter        F1        Yes          Killed by Ian in Vault 15... intentionally
2. Hanoverf      F1        Yes          Devoured by the Rats outside Vault 13
3. Toxic Waste Boy  F2      No            Punched to Death in the Temple of Trials!  muahahaha!  muahahaha!  muahahaha!
4. Birdman        F2        No            Failed to hep protect moo-moos

well it wasn't intended to be easy - basically hoping to laugh at some "OH NOES!"-screens of peoples beautiful motherships crashing into min-mus - but yeah most game overs would be anticlimatic out of fuel/eletricity or a tipped lander, so a weight restriction would probably be better

 

[Ulminati]

well it wasn't intended to be easy - basically hoping to laugh at some "OH NOES!"-screens of peoples beautiful motherships crashing into min-mus - but yeah most game overs would be anticlimatic out of fuel/eletricity or a tipped lander, so a weight restriction would probably be better

The "problem" is that once you get somewhat proficient at launching rockets, the only real potential for spectacular failure is during takeoff and reentry. (And even reentry is kind of meh since most planets either have very low gravity or an atmosphere to deploy a parachute in). And most of the time, spectacular failure is either due to a: not using enough struts, so you wobble. Or b: messing up your fuel linkage so fuel is drained in an assymetrical pattern, causing the rocket to spin out of control. The far more common failure is running out of fuel during ascent, running out of fuel during an injection, running out of power on the dark side of a planet or tipping over after landing on a slope. None of it is paticularily exhilarating. There's also a signifigant risk of being "devoured by space cthulhu". That is, the physics engine spazzing out, your ship suddenly wobbling all over the place, then tearin gitself apart. It's somewhat fixed by generous application of (quantum) struts. And again, not terribly exciting to watch, as it's basically coasting along in a straight line, then suddenly exploding for no reason.

 

[Hellraiser]

We'll you're not going to find potato gas on Kerbin IIRC. Either way mining for it there would be pointless. But it is present on all non-Kerbin celestial bodies (with more or less equal distribution for now, they plan on changing that). Also I just found out that drills have to be connected to a Kethane tank or else they don't mine jack. Thought the crossfeed of structural girders would work with them. Oh well, at least the old KePeEn Kethane Combine now serves as a beacon marking the deposit.

Oh and be sure to place a mechjeb on the drill rig, it's "land at site - select site on map" function of the autopilot allows you to see coordinates by hovering the cursor over the moon's/planet's surface. And you don't really need to use the autopilot to see those, so it does not prevent you from landing manually like a true space gentleman

Why that functionality is not in the game proper yet is beyond me, but whatever.

The mod's models are going to be changed soon apparently, they've got a new guy doing them after the old guy left and he's way better. I mean just look at this:

Compared to the current drill this one is

 

[Burning Bridges]

Well I thought about weight classes myself, because I am more of a builder.

Most are pretty arbitrary. I thought about using powers of 2, because it's most logical

1t ? how far can it go ?
2t I think it's possible to go into orbit with a 2 ton ship
4t an interesting size for super small launch systems
8t absolutely sufficient for small rockets
16t
32t
64t
128t this is what I consider a "normal" rocket
256t ... a large rocket
512t ... a super size rocket

an alternative would be to start with 2.5 tons

2.5t
5t
10t
20t
40t
80t
160t
320t
640t

 

[Ulminati]

Well, I think I've settled on a narrative and some mission milestones and restrictions. But reading over the Kethane mod thread, it looks like I should wait a wee bit since they're redoing the scanners soon™ and the new models look wonderful.

 

[Ulminati]

Testing various "default" rockets sans payloads. (Just a probe body, a battery and a small solar panel atop the lifting stage). The "Gaider Popamolar" weighs in at 4.8 tons and can (barely) get to a Munar orbit.

8t absolutely sufficient for small rockets

The Schafer Kickstarter weighs in at 9.4 tons and the final stage is currently in a 10km orbit around minmus with 81 fuel units left. I'm gonna try landing it without RCS or landing struts and see if I can make a return to kerbin.


The fuel budgets are still going to be tight once I add payloads to them. But things are looking promising for the "Stoic" 15t Light incliner, the "Aetherdux" 25t Medium incliner, the "inXile" 50t Heavy Incliner and the "Obsidian" 100t Popamole Eradicator.

[edit]

Ok. Everything lined up beautifully. I had *plenty* of fuel left after landing on Minmus. So I decided I wanted to go back to Kerbin. As luck would have it, my return trajectory put me on an encounter with Mün. and I had plenty of fuel left...

Long story short: 9.4 ton rocket with barebones probe.
Ascent from Kerbin to 100 km parking orbit
Injection burn to Minmus
Adjustment burn to bring minmus orbit to 10km
Land on Minmus
Ascent from Minmus to 20km parking orbit
Injection burn to Mün
Adjustment burn to bring Mun orbit to 10km
Land on Mun
Ascent from Mun
Slingshot burn to launch vessel back to Kerbin
Crash into mountainside, because I never expected the Schafer Kickstarter to meet this many stretch goals and didn't think to bring a parachute along

This is all based on the STFU™ hybrid engine design the viking space program showcased a few days ago in Hellraisers thread. The deltaV calculations are a bit off, because Mechjeb doesn't know how to handle a pair of engines stacked onto one another. I have ~2000 deltaV left in the ascent stage once the jet flames out and I'm out of the thickest part of the atmo.

The 2 hidden stage engines are both LV 909's. Jettison first stage engine when jet flames out. The large main tank will take the LV909+medium tank into 100km orbit with 98% fuel remaining. From there on, it can go pretty much anywhere. Heck, if I were scott manley, I could probably land it on Gilly

 

[Burning Bridges]

Looks like an erect penis of quite impressive length. Well done!!