Incline The Great Best Adventures Thread

[Great Deceiver]

Yeah, it wasn't a single factor but many. I'd actually put the popularization of the Internet and how easy it is to look everything up in under a minute now as the most important one.

Also by nature it's a much more contemplative type of game, it simply can't cater to ADHD mongoloids who "play" things alt tabbed 99% of the time and need to constantly click something.

 

[Rincewind]

Also by nature it's a much more contemplative type of game, it simply can't cater to ADHD mongoloids who "play" things alt tabbed 99% of the time and need to constantly click something.

I see that shit sometimes when commuting on the train. Dude playing some crap game, chatting, watching a video, all at the "same" time. It's seriously retarded and makes me feel really worried about the next "iPad generation".

 

[Rincewind]

Doom becoming a massive success, and starting the FPS craze.

I still can't get it. What's so good about FPS games? They're basically primitive shoot'em up games where you can... well, shoot things to progress the game, and that's it. No thinking involved, and just shooting things as a means of "conflict resolution" gets old fast, I'd assume... but apparently not for many? I just don't get the mass appeal at all. If it was a niche genre only favoured by a bunch of weirdos, yeah, whatever. But how can it be one of the most popular genres? I don't get it.

 

[Great Deceiver]

Also by nature it's a much more contemplative type of game, it simply can't cater to ADHD mongoloids who "play" things alt tabbed 99% of the time and need to constantly click something.

I see that shit sometimes when commuting on the train. Dude playing some crap game, chatting, watching a video, all at the "same" time. It's seriously retarded and makes me feel really worried about the next "iPad generation".

I've come to realize that games are now pretty much all designed with that audience in mind. Not just mobile games, either - all games. They're designed from the ground up for 1-minute attention spans and take into consideration the fact that their target audience is more likely to be looking at something else while "playing".

It's the whole rationale behind the instant gratification in battle royale games, for example. Rounds rarely last more than a couple of minutes, just enough to provide a dopamine hit and leave enough room for the "player" to alt tab through his Twitch chat or whatever.

Very depressing.

 

[Great Deceiver]

Doom becoming a massive success, and starting the FPS craze.

I still can't get it. What's so good about FPS games? They're basically primitive shoot'em up games where you can... well, shoot things to progress the game, and that's it. No thinking involved, and just shooting things as a means of "conflict resolution" gets old fast, I'd assume... but apparently not for many? I just don't get the mass appeal at all. If it was a niche genre only favoured by a bunch of weirdos, yeah, whatever. But how can it be one of the most popular genres? I don't get it.

Older (and good) FPSs were as much about the atmosphere and spatial navigation (some with very elaborate labyrinths for levels) than the actual shooting. I remember much more about the levels themselves of Hexen 2, Quake or Doom, for example, than enemy placement, so to speak - although there was also an art to clever enemy placement, especially given the constraints of the time. Blood is especially excellent in this regard.

"Modern" (well, for the past 20 years really) FPS design has completely flattened the levels, destroyed any semblance of careful design, and has come to rely on endless waves of enemies overwhelming the player in a cramped, closed arena. Instant gratification.

 

[Rincewind]

"Modern" (well, for the past 20 years really) FPS design has completely flattened the levels, destroyed any semblance of careful design, and has come to rely on endless waves of enemies overwhelming the player in a cramped, closed arena. Instant gratification.

Uh, that sounds familiar from the linear dungeon "design" of many more recent action RPGs...

 

[Great Deceiver]

"Modern" (well, for the past 20 years really) FPS design has completely flattened the levels, destroyed any semblance of careful design, and has come to rely on endless waves of enemies overwhelming the player in a cramped, closed arena. Instant gratification.

Uh, that sounds familiar from the linear dungeon "design" of many more recent action RPGs...

Yeah, it's basically the same thing. They even have skill trees and drops and shit in FPSs now. All about the instant dopamine hits and pavlovian response.

 

[Rincewind]

"Modern" (well, for the past 20 years really) FPS design has completely flattened the levels, destroyed any semblance of careful design, and has come to rely on endless waves of enemies overwhelming the player in a cramped, closed arena. Instant gratification.

Uh, that sounds familiar from the linear dungeon "design" of many more recent action RPGs...

Yeah, it's basically the same thing. They even have skill trees and drops and shit in FPSs now. All about the instant dopamine hits and pavlovian response.

I heard some of them employ psychologists to "optimise" these games for maximum addiction. Absolutely disgusting.

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

I don't really think it was just 3D that led to the downfall of adventure games, although the newness of technology and the money people always going after the new and flashy thing definitely didn't help. A lot of things were happening during that mid-late 90s era:

• Doom becoming a massive success, and starting the FPS craze.
• Windows 95 being released, which made using computers easier (so more idiots had computers).
• Sierra being sold, with the new owners not knowing what to do about games (and also engaging in fraud).
• RPGs with stories growing in prominence (e.g. Baldur's Gate/Fallout), which would have consumed more of the nerd budget.
• Myst's success leading to a bunch of companies making less successful copycats.

And that's just off the top of my head. That era was very impactful on gaming, and a lot of things led to adventure gaming falling from the spotlight and losing their way.

Two more affecting the "mid-late 90s era":

• The FMV fad that arose following the commercial success of The 7th Guest (1993) ruined a lot of games while expanding budgets.
• Dune II (1992) prompted the RTS craze, similar to the FPS craze, which eventually managed to cause decline even in RPGs.

 

[Maxie]

I don't really think it was just 3D that led to the downfall of adventure games, although the newness of technology and the money people always going after the new and flashy thing definitely didn't help. A lot of things were happening during that mid-late 90s era:

• Doom becoming a massive success, and starting the FPS craze.
• Windows 95 being released, which made using computers easier (so more idiots had computers).
• Sierra being sold, with the new owners not knowing what to do about games (and also engaging in fraud).
• RPGs with stories growing in prominence (e.g. Baldur's Gate/Fallout), which would have consumed more of the nerd budget.
• Myst's success leading to a bunch of companies making less successful copycats.

And that's just off the top of my head. That era was very impactful on gaming, and a lot of things led to adventure gaming falling from the spotlight and losing their way.

Two more affecting the "mid-late 90s era":

• The FMV fad that arose following the commercial success of The 7th Guest (1993) ruined a lot of games while expanding budgets.
• Dune II (1992) prompted the RTS craze, similar to the FPS craze, which eventually managed to cause decline even in RPGs.

Gabriel Knight is a fine case study for first getting balls in into FMV, then into early 3D. Oof.
I enjoyed GK2, though.

 

[Rincewind]

The FMV fad that arose following the commercial success of The 7th Guest (1993) ruined a lot of games while expanding budgets.

I was really disgusted by the FMV games back in the day, they very much felt like decline. Still, now I'm quite enjoying them as a sort of "guilty pleasure", the way some would enjoy B movies. Then there are a few that are arguably great, like the Tex Murphy games.

 

[Modron]

I was really disgusted by the FMV games back in the day, they very much felt like decline. Still, now I'm quite enjoying them as a sort of "guilty pleasure", the way some would enjoy B movies. Then there are a few that are arguably great, like the Tex Murphy games.

Mission based games like flight/space/mech sims, racing games, rts games, the odd action game with FMVs like The Horde or Crusader series, et cetera with FMV interludes now that is where the good shit was. Same format with CGI movies aren't bad either of course. Now full FMV games? Yeah, they were usually lacking.

 

[Maxie]

I was really disgusted by the FMV games back in the day, they very much felt like decline. Still, now I'm quite enjoying them as a sort of "guilty pleasure", the way some would enjoy B movies. Then there are a few that are arguably great, like the Tex Murphy games.

Mission based games like flight/space/mech sims, racing games, rts games, the odd action game with FMVs like The Horde or Crusader series, et cetera with FMV interludes now that is where the good shit was. Same format with CGI movies aren't bad either of course. Now full FMV games? Yeah, they were usually lacking.

We did have something of the sort going by the name of Spycraft, can't recall if it was any good though.

 

[Alex]

Zork needs no introduction:

Yes, great crpg that one.

 

[Darkozric]

machinarium - has zero dialog, nor any kind of text (absolutely no descriptions at all), but still speaks volumes

Machinarium was such a charming game with a memorable OST.

Now that I think of it, it's the complete opposite of the The Longest Journey - They never stop speaking until your ears are bleeding.

Often I wanted to smash my speakers with their endless blabbering.

 

[Darkozric]

I was really disgusted by the FMV games back in the day, they very much felt like decline

You're disgusted by FMVs, but you're not disgusted by your vanishing of ethan carter and gemini rue picks.

What kind of drugs are you on?

 

[Maxie]

I was really disgusted by the FMV games back in the day, they very much felt like decline

You're disgusted by FMVs, but you're not disgusted by your vanishing of ethan carter and gemini rue picks.

What kind of drugs are you on?

Hey this thread is about appreciating stuff you like not about bashing stuff other people like

 

[Grauken]

I think it's a bit of a blindspot of pc gaming history, but people don't seem to realize how big point and click adventures were even in the 90s. Going back to the magazines I had, most of the pages were dedicated to either rts games or point and click adventure games. The fact that most of the times the logic of these games was obtuse as all hells combined with the internet not being a thing yet made it so you could carry your magazine with a dedicated section for adventure walkthroughs. In my own experience, I remember playing a lot of first person adventures like the Necronomicon one and other FMV titles, the kind that would come in like 8 CDs or so. I remember that Versailles game where you could walk around the palace as well. The first "real" point and click adventure game I ever played was Sanitarium, which was an excellent game even if it all falls apart at the end of it. Grim Fandango was the highlight of the genre for me as a kid. That's one of the most beautiful games ever made. You can tell that was a labor of love from beginning to end.

I'm not sure calling it a blindspot is correct, it's more like gaming as a hobby has a very bad long-term memory as there's a lot of churn from players going out of the hobby. Adventure games in the 90ies and especially Lucas Art adventures were pretty much the equivalent of AAA games these days and everybody who had a computer talked and played them.

Like I said before, I'm not an adventure gamer but Indiana Jones and the Fate of Atlantis, Day of the Tentacle and Sam & Max made me appreciate the genre and check out some other titles though the genre never stuck with me due to its turn toward 3d and then the wave of endless FMV titles I found just awful. The Myst copy-cats didn't help much as well.

FMV titles, Grim Fandango, these weren't the games from the peak (1990-1995) anymore (though Grim was great itself), this was the tail end of a dying genre that didn't know it was delegated to forever languish far away from the heights it once reached

 

[Darkozric]

Hey this thread is about appreciating stuff you like not about bashing stuff other people like

I could say the same thing, If someone doesnt like FMVs they don't have to post negative shit on this thread. Since like you said, it's an appreciation thread.

 

[Blutwurstritter]

Doom becoming a massive success, and starting the FPS craze.

I still can't get it. What's so good about FPS games? They're basically primitive shoot'em up games where you can... well, shoot things to progress the game, and that's it. No thinking involved, and just shooting things as a means of "conflict resolution" gets old fast, I'd assume... but apparently not for many? I just don't get the mass appeal at all. If it was a niche genre only favoured by a bunch of weirdos, yeah, whatever. But how can it be one of the most popular genres? I don't get it.

Wolfenstein/Doom put shooters on the map and made them a staple genre, but another point that give's fps an edge is multiplayer. The second big surge that pushed shooters far ahead of other genres came with Counter-Strike(Half-Life), Unreal Tournament, Battlefield and Quake 3. Later on Call of Duty became really popular especially on consoles and nowadays we also have those battle royal and moba shooter things.
I played lots of shooters in local area network in the late nineties and early 2000's and they were by far the most popular games. I've never touched Steam nor played online but I guess that helped to popularize the genre further since its even more convenient. Organizing lan parties and lugging your crt around wasn't something you'd do everyday. Playing against another human is much more satisfying and winning was indeed a question of skill. The matches in shooters are usually short and easy to get in while hard to master. Its much more accessible than real time strategy for example, explaining is popularity and staying power in multiplayer.

But shooters are also much more convenient to jump in for a quick session when it comes to single player. The linear structure means that you can play with long pauses in between without having to scratch your head when you return to them. And you can also play many of them in parallel without problem. The mechanics in shooters are also typically very similar so you won't have to spend much time to get into them, you can just start playing.
And I have to say as someone who played shooters before rpgs, that I can't play blobbers or more generally most first-person rpgs. The abstraction/indirect controls combined with the "fps" view are insufferable, and I'd wish that blobbers offered an option to switch to isometric view or some other format except first person. When I play in first-person I want direct control over aim and direct feedback for the actions of my character that is a single entity, as I know it from shooters. I have zero problems with isometric party-basd rpgs but it feels 100% wrong to me when it is in blobber format. I can't stand even more action oriented first person rpgs like Morrowind since the attacks are still chance based to a degree and not 100% under my control. If this was a third person game I wouldn't mind but as mentioned before, when its first person format I need crisp controls and cause-and-effect that relies solely on my input. That is also something that is good about fps games. I also have zero nausea when playing even the fastest shooters for hours and would think that this has a large effect on the personal enjoyment of shooters.

I am curious, have you ever tried playing Alien vs Predator 1999 as Alien? I don't think any other genre than fps could give an experience like that. Just watch 1 min or so to get an idea how level design and movement opens up gameplay that is impossible otherwise,

 

[Keshik]

Funnily enough, Normality is a game that I have an affection for. Wouldn't say it's the greatest one I've ever played but the setting was pretty unique and I had a good time playing it with my sister way back in the day. Shame the voice acting we got in Canada was way worse than the UK release.

 

[Atrachasis]

When I replay stuff now it's mostly Legend Entertainment adventures, they have really stood the test of time for me like few others. The writing is generally very good, the puzzles are difficult without being incredibly obtuse and the best games are very memorable (Gateway being my favourite). Their parsers are a lot more sophisticated than Sierra's and it's a kind of nice middle ground between graphic and text adventures.

I'd like to give a shout-out to some of Interplay's early forays into the adventure genre, which probably invented the mixed graphics/text interface that Legend later adopted. Perhaps more for their sentimental value, but I think they also have some historical significance in the transition from text-based to graphics-based adventures. I mostly remember "Tass Times in Tone Town" and "Borrowed Time"; I think there were a few others.

Yes, I remember that screen quite vividly.

 

[Grauken]

To contradict my own statement from before, there was actually a sort of FMV game that I absolutely adored, Bad Mojo. Its kinda disgusting but in a great way. You play a cockroach. Need I say more? Okay, within the limits of what you can do (you're a cockroach after all, can't carry stuff with you), it had quite solid puzzles that felt like a good fit for the game. But it's really the environments that sell the game. You start out not really believing someone went there (a game about a cockroach WTF) and as you go along with your little roach, you start to feel protective, and seeing the world from the roach's perspective is truly imaginative. Size does make a difference

 

[Cat Headed Eagle]

To contradict my own statement from before, there was actually a sort of FMV game that I absolutely adored, Bad Mojo. Its kinda disgusting but in a great way. You play a cockroach. Need I say more? Okay, within the limits of what you can do (you're a cockroach after all, can't carry stuff with you), it had quite solid puzzles that felt like a good fit for the game. But it's really the environments that sell the game. You start out not really believing someone went there (a game about a cockroach WTF) and as you go along with your little roach, you start to feel protective, and seeing the world from the roach's perspective is truly imaginative. Size does make a difference