Review my Post-Apoc Setting!!!

[Phelot]

The other thread was a good idea... so...

OK, I was thinking this setting could work both as an RPG and especially as a strategy game. The strategy part is obvious, it'd be a war game, but the RPG would probably have to focus on the PC effecting the different factions depending on his actions. I'm thinking the PC would be doing a lot of survival and a lot of sneaking around bigger players waiting for the smoke to clear to see what they can loot...

Anyways, here it is:

The setting takes place in northern New Jersey sometime in the very early 21st century. In 1965 nuclear war breaks out between America, China, and Russia with no clear victors. In this setting, New York City, Philadelphia, and Boston (as well as most other major cities) are nuked along with a number of Nike Missile silos located in New Jersey (Swdesboro, South Plainfield, Mahwah). The capital is nuked and due to some confusion and lack of warning, the entire federal government is incapacitated to the point were no clear government body exists anymore. New Jersey is left to fend for itself as armies of refugees collapse the infrastructure. Power is intermittent along with clean drinking water.

Fast forward a few decades and the state government has collapsed due to a devastating war caused when the acting governor of NJ attempted to gain more control over the northern counties which were being run locally by county reps. and in some cases individual "mayors." These northern counties banded together. After the war, the state found itself with an obliterated capital city, no state government, and the further fracturing of the state into rival counties and cities.

After this war, the two imminent powers in the north clashed over the relatively intact city of Newark in Essex County. That's the focus of this setting, the conflict there.

The main players are:

Morris-Union Military Jointure Commission: The two counties formed a military pact for mutual protection and to counter some of their more powerful neighbors. They are primarily at war with the Hudson-Bergen-South Passaic Commonwealth and North Passaic.

Hudson-Bergen-South Passaic Commonwealth (HBSPC): Haven't designed this that much yet. South Passaic was conquered from the original Passaic county essentially splitting the county into a free northern partition and an occupied south.

North Passaic: Concerned only with regaining it's full county. Not interested in the war for Newark. Very weak.

Essex County: Militarily they were allied with the other counties during the war with the state, but bailed out to fight a civil war when a local strongman took control of Newark.

Free City of Newark: Heavily fortified, Newark is in the fight for it's life with two much larger forces colliding into it's borders and in some areas city streets.

NOTE: Not sure if anymore would be needed. I wanted this to be a local conflict, nothing too grand.

Besides civilian vehicles pressed into military service, the counties use a collection of repaired or leftover national guard equipment as well as a limited ability to produce new vehicles. These include mostly 1960's era weapons such as:

M41 Walker Bulldog, M24 Chaffee, M4 Sherman, M46 Patton, and M26 Pershing. As well as any number of APCs, jeeps, etc etc.

Firearms would be those found around that time, M14s, M3A1s, etc. As well as various civilian firearms.

So, this is actually the first time I've written about this though I think about it when I'm driving through boring areas for extended periods of time. I know it's kind of a mess, but when I used to live in that part of the US, I always thought it was such an interesting urban area and oddly enough, what kind of tactics would be used should a war be fought there.

So what do you think?

 

[MasterSmithFandango]

Is the setting going to be complete with girls wearing a ton of hairspray and make-up and guys wearing track suits and gold chains?

 

[Phelot]

Is the setting going to be complete with girls wearing a ton of hairspray and make-up and guys wearing track suits and gold chains?

Actually, I did think having an organized crime element would be believable though the modern day guido does not yet exist (though the guido would of course)

One other thing I forgot to mention. This wouldn't be Fallout. No deserts, no mutants, no zombies or other shit.

What there would be though is an underlying population crisis: due to radiation most adults do not live past their 40. Cancer is very common and a large portion of the population is not able to reproduce. Those children that are born typically have bad birth defects or die at an early age.

This obviously makes fighting a war a difficult task.

So the solution is a war that's a lot of bang with little blood. Both sides are afraid to commit to large battles, so the war thus far has consisted of firing from defensive positions, small skirmishes, and hit and run tactics. A lot of indirect fire.

 

[MasterSmithFandango]

So more raiding than Total War. It makes sense, as in post-apoc settings it is likely we'd revert to more tribal mentalities, and tribal societies rarely, if ever resort to total war.

I will say this, though. And this is probably because I've played FO, and while you acknowledged it wouldn't be wastelandish, I think going out of your way for period post apoc may draw comparisons with the 50s future that FO did. I mean, it's obviously different, especially in a lot of the details, but the link may be made, especially if you go out of your way to put a lot of era culture references in it.

 

[Phelot]

So more raiding than Total War. It makes sense, as in post-apoc settings it is likely we'd revert to more tribal mentalities, and tribal societies rarely, if ever resort to total war.

Maybe not so much "tribal" nor too much survival. I wanted a setting were human beings are in decline and yet are only making the situation worse. Most of NJ is relatively intact, though most of the buildings and the equipment inside them are useless since the global economy and indeed the nations economy is collapsed. I wouldn't say people are starving to death nor are they lacking in basic needs though things like power and water ARE intermittent. The main concern is the lack of children and the continued infertility.

I'm thinking a slow collapse and deterioration of society rather then a quick dramatic "death blow" like in FO.

I will say this, though. And this is probably because I've played FO, and while you acknowledged it wouldn't be wastelandish, I think going out of your way for period post apoc may draw comparisons with the 50s future that FO did. I mean, it's obviously different, especially in a lot of the details, but the link may be made, especially if you go out of your way to put a lot of era culture references in it.

I was thinking the culture would be based more on which county people are from, that is people from Morris county and Essex county would, in a sense be the equivilent of people from France and Germany. The state is that fractured and people have considerable pride in were they are from as well as whatever symbols such as:

So what I'm getting at, is that the super patriotism that was shown (mostly) in FO3 would be transformed into a clan like love of whatever county or city the individual is from.

I think the style of dress, the glasses, the music could still reflect the 1960's. I was thinking of also showcasing racial tensions between whites and blacks.

 

[Brotherman Bill]

What there would be though is an underlying population crisis: due to radiation most adults do not live past their 40. Cancer is very common and a large portion of the population is not able to reproduce. Those children that are born typically have bad birth defects or die at an early age.

Perhaps you could make babies into currency



No, but seriously. If live children are so rare, it could make sense to kidnap or barter neighboring children and adopt them into your tribe just so that the tribe would live on. Stranger things have happened.

 

[Phelot]

What there would be though is an underlying population crisis: due to radiation most adults do not live past their 40. Cancer is very common and a large portion of the population is not able to reproduce. Those children that are born typically have bad birth defects or die at an early age.

Perhaps you could make babies into currency



No, but seriously. If live children are so rare, it could make sense to kidnap or barter neighboring children and adopt them into your tribe just so that the tribe would live on. Stranger things have happened.

I was thinking the local governments would be trying to come up with solutions mostly so they can eventually establish stable military numbers.

I guess it'd be sort of like Children of Men, or maybe not.

Anyways, I want to point out that the populations of these areas are actually rather high still since it was a populous area to begin with and because most surrounding areas are much more devasted so a lot of refugees are moving in.

 

[soggie]

Is there a central theme to this setting?

 

[sportforredneck]

A Guido zombie future would be cool. But this idea is probably better. I figure to make it interesting you would try to capture the culture of Jersey, yes? I mean I understand that things have changed due to nuclear disaster, but since people care about where they are from, I'd assume you'd incorporate how people in each part of Jersey are different?

 

[Phelot]

Is there a central theme to this setting?

Yes, I'd say it's that humanity will always war with each other, even when it isn't worthwhile to do so. The idea here is that these northern counties united to destroy the state government only to then take aim at trying to run the state themselves, of course through war, political intrigue, and propaganda.

If it were an RPG, I'd like the player to either experience the rather depressing world by doing quests between the different factions. Essentially the PC would find out just how manipulative and politically driven the leaders are. All in all, should the PC attempt to bring peace or order to the game world, I'd like to see them denied this and to show that, although they may have made differences for individuals, the political system is not fixed and perhaps cannot be. Very cynical and a nice denial of a players expectation of success.

A Guido zombie future would be cool. But this idea is probably better. I figure to make it interesting you would try to capture the culture of Jersey, yes? I mean I understand that things have changed due to nuclear disaster, but since people care about where they are from, I'd assume you'd incorporate how people in each part of Jersey are different?

Well, yes and no. Yes in the sense that I'd like the people to have a clear affiliation with whatever county they are a part of, but no in that they aren't terribly different morally or culturally. I don't want one side to be good and one to be evil. The two main sides have this ideal that they need to try and "rebuild" the state, starting with the largest intact city in NJ that being Newark.

I'm also somewhat influenced by the soldier's friendship that developed in WW1 or the American Civil War. In this setting, the soldiers know they're not fighting for freedom or for safety and they know that their supposed enemy is a lot like themselves and yet they still fight.

 

[soggie]

Is there a central theme to this setting?

Yes, I'd say it's that humanity will always war with each other, even when it isn't worthwhile to do so. The idea here is that these northern counties united to destroy the state government only to then take aim at trying to run the state themselves, of course through war, political intrigue, and propaganda.

If it were an RPG, I'd like the player to either experience the rather depressing world by doing quests between the different factions. Essentially the PC would find out just how manipulative and politically driven the leaders are. All in all, should the PC attempt to bring peace or order to the game world, I'd like to see them denied this and to show that, although they may have made differences for individuals, the political system is not fixed and perhaps cannot be. Very cynical and a nice denial of a players expectation of success.

Lemme get this straight - you're basically trying to create a setting that's engulfed in senseless wars, with a firm grip on modern reality in the sense that there are no zombies, mutants, robots, and other sci-fi-ish stuff?

If you want to build an RPG around such a theme, you shouldn't pussy out. I agree that you need to go all the way in the hardcore theme - punish the players, make them feel insignificant. Make them wonder by the end of the game is there a point to playing in the first place. And then make them think of the true purpose of the game.

I don't see a hardcore RPG going anywhere without strong philosophical elements, and written in an excellent manner. You're throwing down a challenge for your players, and they can't expect a reward from you. But they HAVE to get something, right? So what are you going to give them?

 

[rpgcodexusername]

the OP wasnt a huge wall of text, thanks.

needs more definition of gameplay tho

 

[Phelot]

Lemme get this straight - you're basically trying to create a setting that's engulfed in senseless wars, with a firm grip on modern reality in the sense that there are no zombies, mutants, robots, and other sci-fi-ish stuff?

Yep.

If you want to build an RPG around such a theme, you shouldn't pussy out. I agree that you need to go all the way in the hardcore theme - punish the players, make them feel insignificant. Make them wonder by the end of the game is there a point to playing in the first place. And then make them think of the true purpose of the game.

I don't see a hardcore RPG going anywhere without strong philosophical elements, and written in an excellent manner. You're throwing down a challenge for your players, and they can't expect a reward from you. But they HAVE to get something, right? So what are you going to give them?

Well, I'd like to reward them if they are looking after themselves. I'm not saying there should be options between killing a bunch of kids or getting money. That's hamfisted and not very realistic. Instead, I'd like the player to have to screw over one of their comrades in order to get ahead or to do things that might be considered unethical, but not illegal.

As well as what I had mentioned earlier that any attempts by the player to fix the system will fail, perhaps they'll learn or be rewarded a bit, but in the end it will fail. There are cogs bigger then them.

Though I see no reason why they can't help individuals, perhaps setting up just one person is enough of a reward. Of course helping others may be at the cost of the PC himself.

the OP wasnt a huge wall of text, thanks.

needs more definition of gameplay tho

Thanks!

I haven't really gotten into the actual gameplay yet. Hell, I'm still not sure if this would work best as an RPG or even just a strategy game as it's sort of set up like.

I think it'd be cool to have a Close Combat style game except in a setting like this.

But from an RPG perspective, I'm attracted to the idea of the player living in a world with things going on that are bigger then him, that he cannot effect, that he'll never make a difference in. In this case, a pretty major war that he'd have to avoid or side with a faction. I'm a bit tired of games were the setting revolves around the player.

 

[sportforredneck]

Well I didn't think that culture would affect morality. It's just that people speak and do things differently in different places. Hence culture and such.

 

[Awor Szurkrarz]

Sounds good. I'd love to play a cRPG set in such a setting.

I think it'd be cool to have a Close Combat style game except in a setting like this.

Maybe a mod for Close Combat, then?