Mythica HQ talks about CRPGs and role-playing

[Vault Dweller]

<a href=http://www.mythicahq.com>Mithica HQ</a> posted this <a href=http://www.mythicahq.com/features/staff/2004/01/roleplaying.shtml>editorial thingy</a> aimed to prove that CRPGs have nothing to do with role-playing and hype Mythica the MMORPG that is obviously loaded with role-playing and stuff. Well, hype aside, the article does deal with some non-MMORPG related issues and offers plenty to discuss.

<blockquote>Computer RPGs (more often than not) do their best to create the illusion of openness. They give you places to go, problems to solve, and choices to make, but everything has constraints. Your dialogue is chosen from a list of responses, you can't solve the puzzle the way you'd really like to, even though it makes perfect sense, or it seems like you can go anywhere, but head the wrong direction and you're quickly overwhelmed by the opposition you were never intended to face just yet. When playing a cRPG, it is as if the GM's job is handled by the designers...they guess what you might try to do, but they aren't there to handle the other myriad possibilities, so you are forced to make choices within the narrow constraints they established when the game was created.

This is all well and good, but the manner in which you choose to portray your character will have precisely the same impact on the plot as yelling at the movie screen when that cute co-ed is trying to decide whether she should walk out to the woodshed alone at midnight in Freddy vs Jason XVII: The Really Final New Nightmare Continues. If roleplay has no impact on the game world (not just interactons with other characters, but the game itself) except in specifically pre-determined, pre-programmed ways, then it is merely a social activity (or perhaps a method to amuse/challenge onesself), and while it may enhance the atmosphere of the game, it isn't part of the game itself. The game may facilitate or give you a reason to roleplay, but is not truly a roleplaying game.</blockquote>
While it's true that choices and possibilities in CRPGs are always predefined by developers, and thus limited by default sometimes creating stupid situations (the wire fence in FO2 that your character can't cross to get the car part), there are games like Arcanum and Fallout that did a great job capturing that feeling of freedom to do almost anything you can think of.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

Your dialogue is chosen from a list of responses,

And as such, can be governed by skills, a Charisma score, Intelligence score, and so forth, which is something you can't do in an MMORPG. Anything you type goes to the screen. You can't influence, via a skill or attribute of your character, another player on the MMORPG regardless of their stats because it's ultimately up to the other player to decide what to do.

you can't solve the puzzle the way you'd really like to, even though it makes perfect sense,

Another thing you can't do in an MMORPG either, assuming there even ARE puzzles. There's not too much point in crafting any puzzles because of the nature of an MMORPG either. Once the secret is out, it can spread like wildfire through everyone connected to the thing.

or it seems like you can go anywhere, but head the wrong direction and you're quickly overwhelmed by the opposition you were never intended to face just yet.

Which also will happen in an MMORPG. Not every location in an MMORPG is custom suited for level 1s, so there's bound to be areas where a lower level character can blunder in to in one and enjoy a quick, sloppy death.

When playing a cRPG, it is as if the GM's job is handled by the designers...they guess what you might try to do, but they aren't there to handle the other myriad possibilities,

This is also the case of an MMORPG, so what the hell? How many GMs would it take to babysit 1000+ players on a server to make sure that everything they think of will happen in real time? Even if you did have 1 GM per player, the real time problem will crop up. If not the real time problem, then the lack of a decent interface that will allow a GM to do every single little possibility is there.

This is all well and good, but the manner in which you choose to portray your character will have precisely the same impact on the plot as yelling at the movie screen when that cute co-ed is trying to decide whether she should walk out to the woodshed alone at midnight in Freddy vs Jason XVII: The Really Final New Nightmare Continues. If roleplay has no impact on the game world (not just interactons with other characters, but the game itself) except in specifically pre-determined, pre-programmed ways, then it is merely a social activity (or perhaps a method to amuse/challenge onesself), and while it may enhance the atmosphere of the game, it isn't part of the game itself. The game may facilitate or give you a reason to roleplay, but is not truly a roleplaying game.

Blah blah blah blah.. Level treadmilling with an integrated IRC client is about all an MMORPG offers. A CRPG can at least offer multiple solutions and outcomes to any single event given the designers' desires to impliment them. You just can't offer that in an MMORPG.

 

[Voss]

Wow, there are limits in CRPGs? Aren't they clever for working this out on their own.

If roleplay has no impact on the game world (not just interactons with other characters, but the game itself) except in specifically pre-determined, pre-programmed ways, then it is merely a social activity (or perhaps a method to amuse/challenge onesself), and while it may enhance the atmosphere of the game, it isn't part of the game itself

Just for the record, its the amuse/challenge one. You know, entertainment.
The BS social activity is more the grounds of MMOGs. As is roleplay that has no impact on the game world.
Thanks for trying to justify MMOGs, but still, no thanks. If I want meaningless levels ups and killing things, I'll solo Diablo II. And I won't have to deal with the annoying little feces- throwing monkeys that pass for players on a MMOG, either. Bonus!

 

[Sol Invictus]

The only mass multiplayer games worth playing are those that require skills and team-work, such as Planetside and BF1942. I don't think MMORPGS offer very much in terms of gameplay, aside from player-to-player interaction, which as some would argue has its own merits.

It all depends on how much you enjoy playing dolly dress up.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

The BS social activity is more the grounds of MMOGs. As is roleplay that has no impact on the game world.

It's kind of funny he even mentions not having much impact on the world in a CRPG in order to defend MMORPGs when most CRPGs have the "Save the World" theme which is something you can't do in an MMORPG because it'd be a daily routine. It'd go from a once in a lifetime, the only one who can do it feeling you get in a CRPG to a It's 5AM, time to get a shower, make breakfast, and save the world again today feeling.

 

[Volourn]

Haha.

 

[Sol Invictus]

Reminds me of an episode of Xena.

 

[Anonymous]

Not too big of a fan of MMORPGs, but I do play one, and it's alright. Certainly cant top CRPGs, but i'm not going to argue for them. Dark Age of Camelot is what I play, I like it because the idea of the game works well, since MMORPGs are like you said 'day to day' things. It's basically just a wargame, heh. You level your guy all over and go into war zones and kill the enemy players, and oddly, something that simple is far ahead of most MMORPGs.