Review Victoria II with A House Divided and Heart of Darkness gets a Tacticular Cancer Review

[Trash]

Tags: A House Divided; Heart of Darkness; Paradox Interactive; Victoria II

We put new staff member Absalom in the shoes of a budding capitalist and let him loose to see what he would do. Turns out he went on a railroad building spree and forgot all about importing coal. Yes, indeed, it was about time we paid some attention to Paradox Interactive's industrialisation sim Victoria II. Especially now that it's all patched up and has recieved two mayor DLC expansions with A House Divided and Heart of Darkness. Check out his comprehensive review.

For in Victoria II the primary force is Industrialization. Railroads are needed to transport goods. Factories are needed to produce on a scale heretofore unknown to man. The people need to be educated in order to best use these new goods and to participate productively in government. Not only are the methods different, so are the means. While you can construct individual rail roads and factories, it is much better to foster Capitalists to develop the land themselves. You don't simply hire more clergy, you make it a focus of the nation to recruit more clergy from X province. Tabs portraying your Nation in diplomacy, trade, military, production, population and the various ways you manipulate the Nation are the primary means of interacting with the game. Thus, you control your nation, less a Absolute Monarch as in previous Paradox titles and more a national zeitgeist.​

Read the full article: Victoria II with A House Divided and Heart of Darkness gets a Tacticular Cancer Review

 

[Konjad]

Tags: Paradox Interactive

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Read the full article: Victoria II with A House Divided and Heart of Darkness gets a Tacticular Cancer Review

placeholder? what the fuck?

 

[Whisky]

Pretty much sums up my opinion. Vicky 2 is very enjoyable, but my god does it have flaws. Unfortunately, POP Demand is still a near mandatory mod.

 

[Trash]

Paradox always* has those games that just need a bit more polish to really shine. Thankfully there usually are mods to apply the last bit of spit and shine. Still...


*okay, not always. Sometimes they stop polishing 'em when they're still turds. Yeah, I'm still butthurt about EU:Rome.

 

[Grinolf]

Who are ever allowed this guy write a review?

1. It is not even "Victoria II with A House Divided and Heart of Darkness Review", but Victoria II review with small A House Divided and Heart of Darkness overview.
2. A House Divided and Heart of Darkness - not DLC. They are expansion packs. You forget, that such thing existed once in the past? In Paradox proper only CK II currently use DLC model. Victoria II DLC purely cosmetic.
3. AHD and HOD first and foremost major overhaul in economic model, which is most important aspect in the game. Vanilla (after AHD) and AHD (after HOD) becomes almost unplayble after some time with new version, because of that. Other "features" are there mostly because improvements in economic not good as main marketing focus.
4. HOD also made major overhaul in military (both land and naval) system. Not a single word about that.
5. Crisis system need some tweeks there and here, but pretty solid and working in most cases as intended. Review given it same amount of attention as to cosmetic newspapers, which may be ignored. Not a single word about new colonisation mechanic (already fixed in the patch) and westernisation mechanic introduced in AHD.
6. Also not a single word about constant improvements in moddability of the game. Espessialy after CK II is not very impressive in that field.

That article is pretty canon example of laziness and poor understending of subject, which in modern world called "game journalism"

And yes, my English sucks. Sorry about that.

 

[Space Satan]

What bugs me about POP demand is that number of factories. So much more new factories annoy me to no end.

 

[Absalom]

*snip*

1. I played the whole bundle first, so it's hard to get an idea what "content" the dlc added.

2-4

The DLC's feel more like glorified patches than genuine expansions, as most of their content consists of updated features.

5. I mentioned more about the westernization mechanic in an earlier draft. I don't remember why it didn't survive the drafting process, but yeah, you're right I didn't mention that.

6. I don't look at "moddability" when I look at a game, nor do I expect most people to. And the whole "Paradox games need a certain amount of mods to be playable" thing doesn't really belong in a review.

Also, my review apparently pissed you off enough into registering and posting. Guess I'm doing something right!

 

[Grinolf]

1. I played the whole bundle first, so it's hard to get an idea what "content" the dlc added.
2-4
5. I mentioned more about the westernization mechanic in an earlier draft. I don't remember why it didn't survive the drafting process, but yeah, you're right I didn't mention that.

1. It's not DLC. For the forum, where DLC often considered worst thing, that happened in game industry in the last few years, it is pretty serious mistake.
2. Most gruesome in your review is the fact, that you label two expansions, which tweaked, fixed and improved every (except military in case of AHD) aspect of the game, as glorified patches and DLC, only because you too lazy in looking what they changed outside declared features, like newspapers and american civil war. And don't forget, that on top of that, you gaining one in AHD (westernization) and two in HOD (crisis and colonizations) solid mechanics.
I, personaly, don't remember any recent "patches and DLC", which did that much to the games. In fact, I almost cried, when i read changelog to HOD. If only it was playable at realize...

And before you ask, yes, you must know what they changed, before you write about them. You not mandatory must play earlier version or Victoria I, but atleast read forums and people, who knows about subject. 5 seconds in google give you this and this. And there is also good old dev. diaries.

6. I don't look at "moddability" when I look at a game, nor do I expect most people to. And the whole "Paradox games need a certain amount of mods to be playable" thing doesn't really belong in a review.

It doesn't matter, what you think about mods. Moddability traditionaly been on of the strongest points in the Paradox games. And they definitely earn some points for creation such giants, as Magna Mundi and POP demand. AHD and HOD not only improving the vanilla game, but give more tools to modders, which improved mods also. Why this belongs to review? Because people, who will be reading about this might, suprisingly, don't share your opinion and might be intresting in mods. If you want write only about subject, that you intrested in, write that on the forums or in personal blog.

Also, my review apparently pissed you off enough into registering and posting. Guess I'm doing something right!

"Joined: Mar 6, 2013".
And I don't remember, why i decide register there after been content for a long time with status of guest. But you partially right. After such goodness, as this review, I think, this site have some standarts in that field. That is why I, despite been very uncomfortable with speaking english, decided to post there in hope, that you do not write a sort of smart ass answer, but use that as guide to improve your writing ability. Or, atleas, quit it altogether. But, as you can see, I was wrong.

 

[Whisky]

What bugs me about POP demand is that number of factories. So much more new factories annoy me to no end.

Many of them produce the same thing, just with different required materials. Canneries and Bakeries both produce Canned Food (Canned bread? Okay...) just one requires fish and one requires bread.

Granted, there are a few truly new additions, but on the whole, I didn't find them that bad after a few games.

 

[Absalom]

*snip*

Actually I have noted some things you have said to improve my writing ability. This is my first review and first professional writing since College, so it's a bit of a learning experience.

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

Many of them produce the same thing, just with different required materials. Canneries and Bakeries both produce Canned Food (Canned bread? Okay...) just one requires fish and one requires bread.

The French army needs food too.

Anyway, pretty much the only thing that felt of for me in APD was the absurd amount of demand for paper due to Finance industries.

 

[Grinolf]

Actually I have noted some things you have said to improve my writing ability. This is my first review and first professional writing since College, so it's a bit of a learning experience.

Well, I didn't see any hint about that in your previous answer. And am I mistaken, or that answer been slightly different in the begining? I was ready put one of my eyes on that, but I didn't see any sign of editing.
But ok, it don't realy matter. Well, exept one cool sentence, which i prepeared for posting, but find out, that it no longer valid for the post.

What bugs me about POP demand is that number of factories. So much more new factories annoy me to no end.

Many of them produce the same thing, just with different required materials. Canneries and Bakeries both produce Canned Food (Canned bread? Okay...) just one requires fish and one requires bread.

Yes. That is not very comfortable and well integrated feature, but it realy helps with avoiding stupid game limitation on lack alternative input goods. So you now can built solid cloth industry, when you have plenty of wool, but lack cotton.

 

[curry]

Many of them produce the same thing, just with different required materials. Canneries and Bakeries both produce Canned Food (Canned bread? Okay...) just one requires fish and one requires bread.

The French army needs food too.

Anyway, pretty much the only thing that felt of for me in APD was the absurd amount of demand for paper due to Finance industries.

Here's some other canned tasty treats

 

[Whisky]

Actually I have noted some things you have said to improve my writing ability. This is my first review and first professional writing since College, so it's a bit of a learning experience.

Well, I didn't see any hint about that in your previous answer. And am I mistaken, or that answer been slightly different in the begining? I was ready put one of my eyes on that, but I didn't see any sign of editing.
But ok, it don't realy matter. Well, exept one cool sentence, which i prepeared for posting, but find out, that it no longer valid for the post.

What bugs me about POP demand is that number of factories. So much more new factories annoy me to no end.

Many of them produce the same thing, just with different required materials. Canneries and Bakeries both produce Canned Food (Canned bread? Okay...) just one requires fish and one requires bread.

Yes. That is not very comfortable and well integrated feature, but it realy helps with avoiding stupid game limitation on lack alternative input goods. So you now can built solid cloth industry, when you have plenty of wool, but lack cotton.

Yes, holy shit. The inability to make cloth out of wool pisses me off in Vanilla. It makes no fucking sense.

 

[Grinolf]

Yes, holy shit. The inability to make cloth out of wool pisses me off in Vanilla. It makes no fucking sense.

Well, it definitely belongs to top 3 most annoying things in Vic II economy. At least from those, which they can fix without need to creating comletely new economic system.
But HoD fix hundreds of thousand chinese artisans POP, which can't possibly not to starve and crushing world economy under its weight, and hundreds of thousand your farmers and labouers, which can't possibly been employed back, after chinese artisan crushed world economy, which i consider the other two entry in that list. So maybe they look at that in the next expansion. It is not always pay off been optimistic about Paradox, but they can deliver when they try.

 

[Absalom]

You sure they fixed that? When I played as China, I made thousands of pounds per day from tariffs (Before I westernized).

 

[Space Satan]

HoD fixed it by implementing "Polulation" malus to influence. So most populated provinces with most valuable resources - tea and silk have something like -29000% to infuence points. The main reason for sudden recessions, when most factories gone ankrupt was some GP sphering china and ass raping industry for all their sphere.
As for POP Demand - I liked the idea of cloth from wool and other alternative resources, but there's too much of factories. So much that they have graphicsissues because there's no place for good icons.

If only they could fix permanently broken Planned Economy...

 

[Grinolf]

You sure they fixed that? When I played as China, I made thousands of pounds per day from tariffs (Before I westernized).

Well, you can rely on tariff as China to finance your waste clergy, bureaucracy and military. Before HoD it was viable strategy. Not without drawbacks, but viable.
But now artisan are much stronger and mass endless circle of poverty are gone, so I don't recommend it. For your economy it is much better have artisans, who pay you taxes, than artisan who can't pay no taxes, no tarrifs.
In fact, I try to run China with 0% tariff and was very satisfied with result.
Of course it also means, that industrialization are now slower and i don't think you can eliminate artisans before 20th centure and i also don't think you have time to elimenate artisan playing as China, but I need have complete China game to make sure about that. But it all now much more resemble game mechanic, of which you must take care, than that nonsensical mess in earlier versions.

HoD fixed it by implementing "Polulation" malus to influence. So most populated provinces with most valuable resources - tea and silk have something like -29000% to infuence points. The main reason for sudden recessions, when most factories gone ankrupt was some GP sphering china and ass raping industry for all their sphere.

There is possibility to sphere China via war, but I don't see AI doing it. And player suppose to know what he is doing.

 

[Absalom]

*snip*

Yeah, I was trying to westernize as fast as possible. NF Clergy, etc. Russian keep coming to claim chunks of the Chinese heartland so I had get equal weaponry ASAP.

 

[Grinolf]

*snip*

Yeah, I was trying to westernize as fast as possible. NF Clergy, etc. Russian keep coming to claim chunks of the Chinese heartland so I had get equal weaponry ASAP.

NFing Clergy outright usually not most efficient way doing things. Unless there is large % of non accepted POP, much better promote bureaucrats before clergy.
I.e. bureaucrats in most populous state -> clergy in most populous -> bureaucrats in second populous and so go on. It helps you and with acquiring clergy and with money to pay them.

And your situation is very strange, as Russia usually very passive in the game. They even not always conquer Central Asia by the end. Keeping relation at maximum must guarantee safe borders. British prefer go for the Siam and Burma. So there are only two possible problem as China before westernization: crisis, if you go on conquest spree, and unwise allianses. Both can be avoided.
This region in vanilla almost always pretty boring and static. PDM have some major improvements in China-British and China-Russia relations, but I don't play any recent games there and can't say how much it working.

 

[Absalom]

I had 180+ relations with Russia. They just randomly started invading me. As for NF, you only have 1 NF before westernization, and as I recall, I had plenty of bureaucrats especially with state funding from tariffs. I needed the research points to get more military techs that gave research bonuses from conquest so I could westernize as quickly as possible

 

[Grinolf]

I had 180+ relations with Russia. They just randomly started invading me. As for NF, you only have 1 NF before westernization, and as I recall, I had plenty of bureaucrats especially with state funding from tariffs. I needed the research points to get more military techs that gave research bonuses from conquest so I could westernize as quickly as possible

Bureaucrats very easy raise to cap in 100% accepted culture state. And % of your bureaucrats impact your country admin. efficiency. Country admin. efficiency less than 100% give you penalty for promotion rate.
But maybe it my preference in long term over short tem.

By accident, wasn't russian wargoal that one province state in mongolia? If yes, it woud be much better to give it them.
1. That state practicaly isn't yours before your westernization.
2. It's almost useless, because, well, that one province state with low population. It definitely not worth constant war with Russia, until you ready war with them, and AI is very stubborn about it's cores.
3. Latter, when you ready, you can get back not only that province, but all state for free, because of one stupid game mechanic, changing in which been constantly proposed on Paradox forum without any result.

 

[Absalom]

Actually they wanted one of my cores, I forgot which one but it was on the middle eastern coast. Inner Xia something. I think it was my most populous province. Later on they came for Mongolia with GB accepting their call to arms and then I gave it to them no hassle

 

[Sranchammer]

Trash can you review the My Little Ponies mod? Are the Griffins OP?

 

[oscar]

Started up a game as Serbia. A few decades in and 1/3 of the Balkans is Turkish.

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

Started up a game as Serbia. A few decades in and 1/3 of the Balkans is Turkish.

That's actually mostly due to Turkish immigrants from more populated provinces. The locals will not assimilate in their own cores.