Tacticular Cancer: We'll have your balls

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Underrail: The Incline Awakens

Discussion in 'Underrail' started by Blaine, Dec 18, 2015.

  1. ArchAngelgender: ⚧ Magister

    ArchAngel
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    Lot more is doable if use mines and grenades. I was level 7, close to lvl 8 when I went into Depot A. Came out half way to lvl 10.
     
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  2. maruxgender: ⚧ Educated

    marux
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    mine did just fine once i was able to survive the first round (i got traps though)
     
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  3. circgender: ⚧ Arcane

    circ
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    Did you do quests for BOTH factions? Scrappers and Black Eels? Scrappers gives about 3k total, Eels about 2k. Eels is overall easier unless you can put down the damage because you gotta one round one guy for Scrappers unless you have high sneak and pickpocket. Also always kill people before doing level gaining quests as you get less xp for NPC's the higher you are. Did you deliver papers to embassy in Junkyard? Did you get the Lucky Knife for that one hobo outside embassy? Did you kill the clowns stopping you before embassy? Also some fisherman has a fishing quest there but I've never done it, doubt it's huge xp. There's also another fishing quest there for the food place owner - not done that either. Oddity system is ass, I just kill everything.
     
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  4. maruxgender: ⚧ Educated

    marux
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    I suppose it's ok. Why should it show up on character sheet, when it's just against critters? (not all units)
     
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  5. Makagulfazelgender: ⚧ Educated

    Makagulfazel
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    Wearing the Rathound Regalia pacifies rathounds. I repeat, the Rathound Regalia pacifies rathounds.

    [​IMG]
     
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  6. Gordgender: ⚧ Arcane

    Gord
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    Oddity here...
     
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  7. Lhynngender: ⚧ Arcane

    Lhynn
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    Do quests for scrappers and black heels, do lucky knife quest, and im guessing youve done all extra objectives from quests that came before. you can find 1 x2 oddity killing a couple hoppers.
     
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  8. Fenixgender: ⚧ Arbiter

    Fenix
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    That's one of the reason I spit on classic exp...

    You mean, um, hoppers and the like?
    If yes I see.

    Also I can definitely say that before you get TNT, you can get 10-11 lvl depending on oddity drop from siphoners, dogs, and hogs.
     
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  9. batigender: ⚧ Learned

    bati
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    Did anyone else notice a reduction in oddity droprate from critters, at least early into the game? I've ran a few characters up to Junkyard and haven't found a single psi beetle or cavehopper (killed about 40) oddity. My latest character is about to enter Junkyard and I'm at 0/3 rat oddities :M
     
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  10. maruxgender: ⚧ Educated

    marux
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  11. Make America Great Again Jack Dandygender: ⚧ Arcane

    Jack Dandy
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    I just started exploring Core city.
    This is interesting! I am being drawn in like you wouldn't believe. I like chatting around with all the weird people there. And the entire Chort storyline seems very interesting. I can already guess he'll be the final boss or something? No spoilers!

    Show Spoiler

    It also makes camp Hathor shoot you on sight. :P
     
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  12. Fenixgender: ⚧ Arbiter

    Fenix
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    Didn't look carefully (avoiding spoilers), but at first sight list is big enough to say that Hunter is good feat.
    And for free! Freebie!
     
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  13. SniperHFgender: ⚧ Prophet

    SniperHF
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    Defending Coretech warehouse fight was fun. Those snipers cut right through my shield.

    :incline:

    Though your friendly AIs are kinda retarded, they kept walking into my caltrops :lol:
     
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  14. circgender: ⚧ Arcane

    circ
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    I've been wondering about this since I played a little bit of xbow gai. What's the point of silent weapons (for quiet wars) exactly? Or do all NPC's in Underrail have an extra set of eyes in their assholes? Examples tested on live subjects: crossbow - shoot somebody, sneaking, their buddies with their backs turned, five feet away - errybody gets alerted and combat starts for realbz. Did testsubject A have a particularly loud death sigh? Were they really heavy so there was a loud thump? Sniper rifle - same thing, same result. You gotta have the other NPC's about half a screen away for them not to notice anything, and weapon choice doesn't matter at all. I know stealth games where you can take down people next to each other - realistic, depending on how they were positioned. But in dis? I don't get it. Is there a psi link that requires 10 feet of distance not to go off? Why is stealth broken the instant combat starts when they don't even have a clue where the shot came from?
     
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  15. Tigranesgender: ⚧ Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Tigranes
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    I've been able to sniper rifle people with great results for staying silent, though I haven't tried my silent pistol yet. If you kill them in 1 turn, or if you stun them so they don't make any sound themselves, then it seems to be fine as long as the other allies are out of immediate earshot.

    If you mean the buddies are literally five feet, I mean, surely that's too close?
     
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  16. Make America Great Again Eyestabbergender: ⚧ Arcane Patron

    Eyestabber
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    I'm glad you asked. The way I see things AR = burst fire. Every single AR feat is related to burst fire, so it stands to reason that synergy with burst fire will be the main criteria for choosing your AR. Unlike pistols, caliber isn't the only thing that determines your Assault Rifle's damage output and AP cost. Your choice of frame and the rapid reloader upgrade (RR) will also impact the AP cost for firing your weapon. It should also be noted that adrenaline shots give you 20 extra AP, for a total of 70. And since adrenaline shots in Underrail are more common than STDs in Africa, it makes perfect sense to plan your build around those 70 AP, not the vanilla 50. When you consider all these things plus the fact that burst fire costs three times the AP needed for a regular shot, we reach the numbers in this table I made and was just waiting for an opportunity to share with the bros ITT:

    [​IMG]

    Highlighted in blue are the combinations that allow for double burst firing. There is little doubt that being able to burst fire twice without relying on Gun Rush procs trumps whatever advantage the alternative might offer. So our choices boil down to:

    7.62 Marauder with the rapid reloader upgrade: since Hornet Frames are rare as hell, you'll probably end up crafting one of these at some point. Compared to the Hornet frame, the Marauder lacks the 10% bonus to burst fire accuracy but makes up for it with 10% extra critical damage.

    7.62 Hornet with the rapid reloader upgrade: the lowest you can go in terms of AR AP costs. Burst firing this weapon twice will cost you 54 AP, which is 4 AP too much for a non-buffed character. Frankly, if you wanna go 7.62 Hornet, use the upgrade slot for something else. Rapid reloader is a bit of a waste in this case.

    7.62 Hornet without the rapid reloader upgrade: I never tested this combination. This might be THE optimal AR, since it can burst fire twice by default, allowing you to use a SMART module AND an anatomically-aware scope for maximum DPT.

    8.6 Hornet with rapid reloader upgrade: this is the combination my AR guy is using right now. The higher damage of the 8.6 caliber combined with that juicy 10% bonus to burst fire accuracy AND the oh-so-indispensable SMART module resulted in a weapon that allowed me to effortlessly send Carnifex to hell. For those of you who might be interested, here is a picture of my AR:

    [​IMG]
    It was assembled with the following components:

    • Hornet Frame - 112 quality
    • 8.6 Barrel
    • SMART module - 111 quality
    • Rapid reloader
    The crafting requirements are 97 Mechanics and 81 Electronics. It should be noted that SMART is the only reason why we need that much electronics but the investment is well worth it. As I said many times before ITT, SMART is mandatory for ranged characters, since both burst fire and aimed shot are considered "special attacks". My SMART module is literally boosting my damage by 50%. You can't compare that with either 50% extra critical damage or 10% extra critical chance.
    Choosing SMART is simply...smarter! :happytrollboy:

    ALSO, I'm 99% certain that the bonus provided by SMART modules from guns stacks with the bonus provided by SMART lenses from goggles. But since goggles give a much smaller bonus than modules, I'm thinking seeker lens might be superior DPT-wise, depending on what else is affecting your criticals. But then again, SMART bonus is guaranteed, whereas criticals are less reliable.

    Final thoughts:

    • Huszar frames are crap. Requiring 7 STR instead of 6 is a disadvantage though usually a moot point since you're going for the Full Auto feat anyway. What breaks the deal is the fact that the Huszar frame has a 5% PENALTY to burst fire accuracy. Looking at the table above, we also realise that not a single combination involving the Huszar frame is capable of burst firing twice. All things considered, the Huszar is IMO the worst AR frame in the game.
    • Although Chimera frames are also incapable of burst firing twice, they have higher critical damage bonus (130%) and slightly reduced base critical chance (5% instead of the usual 7%). I believe a burst-critical build around this particular frame is very much possible.
    • No combination of frame and barrel results in 9mm burst firing twice. That's a shame because 9mm special bullets are better IMO than their 7.62 and 8.6 counterparts. Upfront damage is always better since we wanna dispatch everyone with a single burst.
    • Focus Stim has amazing synergy with AR burst fire since the 15% increase applies to the entire burst, thus resulting in a pretty noticeable DPT increase. With my rifle you can pop Focus Stim and burst fire twice for exactly 70 AP. See you in hell, Carnifex. :martini:
    • As an AR commando you should be buying all the ammo that the store has in stock. Preferably you should buy all the ammo for all three AR calibers AND their special bullets. Trust me, burst firing everyone and his dog (literally, since there are guard dogs in this game :D) is a VERY ammo intensive business.
    • Speaking of ammo, you might wanna vary your choice of AR caliber from time to time. That's the reason why I chose the 8.6 Hornet instead of 7.62 on the screenshot above. By the time I finally found a high-quality Hornet frame my stock of 7.62 bullets was completely depleted by the 7.62 Rapid Smart Marauder rifle I was using before. Heck, if you're not constantly visiting weapon stores you might end up depleting your reserves of BOTH calibers, forcing you to use a 9mm rifle. In that case, Chimera is the best choice because of the extra damage on criticals.
    Well, that's it, guys. I hope the info was useful! :P
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2016
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  17. Excidium IIgender: ⚧ Self-Ejected

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    Do crafted energy/chem weapons use those modules too?
     
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  18. Make America Great Again Eyestabbergender: ⚧ Arcane Patron

    Eyestabber
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    Yes, they can. Although it's not very accurate to say "energy/chem WEAPONS" since AFAIK there are only energy/chem PISTOLS. If your build is not a pistol build (AKA high dexterity), it might be best to stay away from these weapons.
     
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  19. Excidium IIgender: ⚧ Self-Ejected

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    Oh I'm going with a pistol build. Was in fact bummed that gunslinger only applies to firearms.
     
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  20. Make America Great Again Eyestabbergender: ⚧ Arcane Patron

    Eyestabber
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    Then don't be bummed because:

    http://www.underrail.com/wiki/index.php?title=Dexterity

    Energy weapons are very much affected by the Gunslinger feat! AP values in this table are dated tho, IIRC.
     
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  21. Excidium IIgender: ⚧ Self-Ejected

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    I guess I'll test it when I get it but it says only firearms in the tooltip of the feat.

    EDIT: from patch changelog:

    Dexterity page was last edited months before that change so it isn't up to date.
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2016
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  22. Make America Great Again Ellefgender: ⚧ Deplorable

    Ellef
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  23. Make America Great Again Eyestabbergender: ⚧ Arcane Patron

    Eyestabber
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    Oh shit, you might be right. The Dexterity page is completely outdated AND the gunslinger page has this "0.2.0.1 - AP reduction changed to 2 (down from 3) and only applies to firearms now."

    Gotta ask epeli about this.
     
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  24. Excidium IIgender: ⚧ Self-Ejected

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    Yeah, I checked and edited my post seconds before you replied. :M

    They oughta open the wiki so people can edit.
     
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  25. Tigranesgender: ⚧ Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Tigranes
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    Eyestabber and others, I went with a mostly Sniper Rifle build in the early stages, but how should I be working out my second weapon?

    In other words, I began with a 5/7/7/3/10/3/5, boosted DEX and INT, and I've been focusing on stealth/sniping - but when battle starts you want to be able to switch to another weapon for versatility. I've experimented with whatever pistols, SMGs and ARs (rathound regalia = 6STR) I can find, all to decent-ish effort, and I've just crafted an electroshock pistol that I've toyed around with. It's hard to know what to plan for because I'm not sure what kind of chemical/energy weapons I can get (and I didn't even know at the start those are pistol only). I also haven't been getting any burst-oriented feats.

    Is it worthwhile to continue bumping electricity and/or chem and develop energy/chem pistols, or is it better to latch on to SMGs and/or ARs for bursting when shit hits the fan?

    Currently level ~13 in Core City, Dragunov if I want 2 sniper shots per turn but I also have a high damage sniper and high crit chance sniper to rotate. I have ~75 mechanics, ~50 elec/tailoring, ~25 chem/bio, but it's hard to know which ones to jack up. Hell, focus stim requires 50 bio right? I've never even seen one.
     
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