On the shoulders of giants: a new multiple choices LP!

[ScubaV]

Plant Research

Food: Right now we have zebra and sheep meat, milk, fish, and scavenged plants. Plant research can lead to primitive agriculture, giving us another, cheaper, reliable food source. (Don't forget, in terms of resource expenditure, meat is much more expensive than grains/vegetables). This will have a twofold effect: allowing us the food surplus for population growth (remember how the hunger of the bears proved a burden) and balancing our diet for health and longevity gains.

Medicine: Primitive herbal medicine will go a long way toward helping our population grow and maybe save a few hunters/warriors from dying to simple scrapes and cuts.

Population: See food and medicine. Safety in numbers right? That's partly why we chose militia over professional fighters. Not to mention more people gives us more manpower to do all the other things the tribe needs. Also, more people combined with more food equals more opportunity for labor specialization.

Culture: We're pretty barbaric, which is fine at this early stage. But plant research might lead to simple reed instruments, basket-weaving, or dyes.

Warfare: This would be a little farther out, but there are potential applications in poisons or reed/cane armor. Maybe even anesthetics to aid in the taming efforts of the bear nutjobs.


I do like the idea of getting better tools, but I think this is even more important. Why build granaries before we have grain to store in them? Why build fortifications and watchtowers when we don't have dedicated soldiers to man them? Why tech-rush (even if it makes in-game sense) when we can't support a large number of specialists? Let's not put the cart before the horse here.

 

[Vernydar]

Well it seems like most people do indeed want to do some plant research. Just bear in mind that curufinwe is probably only going to give us some of all those things you listed.
I don't really think he'll give us food medicine baskets ropes and poisons in one update

That said I stand by my previous affirmation, it's true that we can use some veggies, but I think we do have quite some food already. And our tribesmen do not know that veggies are good for health.... Still it could prove useful in case we happen to suffer from some serious setback.

 

[ScubaV]

Well it seems like most people do indeed want to do some plant research. Just bear in mind that curufinwe is probably only going to give us some of all those things you listed.
I don't really think he'll give us food medicine baskets ropes and poisons in one update :p

That said I stand by my previous affirmation, it's true that we can use some veggies, but I think we do have quite some food already. And our tribesmen do not know that veggies are good for health.... Still it could prove useful in case we happen to suffer from some serious setback.

Agreed. We won't get everything right away, nor should we, but this is a necessary first step to unlocking all those things as options.

And I think it makes sense from an RP perspective. A lot of our goals recently have been expanding our knowledge of our immediate surroundings: the wild beasts, the mountain we live next to, etc. This is a natural extension of that. As a tribesman I see that we scavenge some plants everyday, but there are a lot more out there that don't make use of. Why not experiment with them? It's just another form of exploration.

 

[TOME]

I vote for better tools. They allow building better houses and fortifications and make taming the mountain easier in the future. I think there is plenty of food at the moment so no need to go for plants just yet.

 

[Cassidy]

I'll be surprised if the choices taken itt lead to a existing but too expensive form of "bear cavalry"

 

[Kipeci]

Don't forget, in terms of resource expenditure, meat is much more expensive than grains/vegetables

That may be true, but it'd only really be relevent if our animals were eating the same sorts of things that we could eat. When we get useful zebra meat from them grazing on blades of grass that are worthless except as a filler in times of famine, that's a gain for us.

 

[Multiple Sarcasm]

Aren't we already eating some fruits/veggies that scavengers bring? Human monkeys were omnivores since before they could stand upright.
More importantly, if we develop agriculture, where are we going to store the surplus that's going to spoil and become pest-ridden very, very quickly?
Weaving sounds nice, but animal sinew works pretty well for similar purposes, as well.
The main reason for going with plant research would be herbal medicine, but it is more of a luxury, right now, than a necessity. Their bodies weren't as degenerate as that of a modern man: anything herbal medicine could help with they can deal with just fine. Trauma medicine, on the other hand, is something far beyond what we could come up with through plant research, and even then, the best way to treat an open wound would still be fire, the universal antiseptic and coagulant.
It's useful and should be researched eventually, no doubt about it, but I think...

Clay is something of a prerequisite. At least, for pottery, in which we could actually store our food and water, including future crops. We could also use a building material that wouldn't fold under a stiff wind and insulation that could withstand the elements better than the dirt we were likely using, if that. And the cultural benefit is pretty obvious, as well, I think. So that's my vote. Then we can meditate on plants.

 

[m4davis]

I think your overestimating prehistoric man on there ability to survive wounds the main danger would actually be with infection.

 

[Curufinwe]

Alright! Update time!


Plants it is. Treehuggers and animal friends.

The scavengers finally had their due. The council decided to dedicate the tribe's energy to the study of the vegetation growing next to the river and on the nearby slopes of the mountains.

A first result was obtained by carefully observing the habits of sick animals in the herds. When they had problems with their digestion, they ate certain plants. When they felt weak, they ate others. Some of the scavengers took to themselves to test the same remedies, with varied degreed of success. As time passed and mistakes were corrected we managed to gain a small arsenal of medicinal plants. They couldn't heal injury or great illness, but they did help in making us feel better.

The second result was much more mundane, and obtained by the same means. The observations that brought us medicinal herbs had much more immediate results: many edible roots and plants were found. Most relevant, a strange, orange root that proved to be tasty and filling, which we decided to call carrot. We learned to find it and harvest its roots, to complement our diet.

Some winters had passed, when a scouting party ranging on the lower slopes of the mountain came back dragging with them a man. He was naked, dirty, ill and evidently crazed. He was brought in front of the council to decide his fate.

One of the elders, seeing the man, narrowed his eyes for a few seconds and suddenly gave a great cry. He ran to the man and grabbed his shoulders, looking at him more closely.
He suddenly said: 'My son! You're back! I thought you lost, but you're back to us! - he turned to the rest of the council – This man is my son! He was part of the scouting group we sent so long ago to the caves and thought lost due to beasts or an accident!'

The crazed man suddenly pushed his father away and collapsed on the ground, convulsing and screaming: 'Lost! All lost forever in the darkness! Never to find our way back to the light of the sun! They are lost! Lost with the great masters! Always watching, always scheming!'
He then arched his back, giving a great cry. A sharp crack was heard, then he was still.

The councilmen were silent for a long time, stunned by the scene. Only the faint sobs of the father of the dead man could be heard.

A. Then one of the keepers of fire spoke: 'This is a very bad omen. Long have we suspected the presence of ill spirits in our land and this confirms our greatest fears. His body should be cleansed by the holy fire, and great flames should be built to protect us from his fate using the black stone.'
B. The father of the man rose up: 'Ill spirit or not, my son must have seen something. We should send another, larger party in the caves to find out what it was.'
C. Other elders shook their heads: 'Whatever happened in the caves should stay in the caves. We must declare them as a forbidden zone, guard them but never enter them. We should focus on our life here and forget this ever happened.'

 

[Vernydar]

B

I told you guys that the caverns were dangerous, but you did not listen. XD You need to read better between the lines, curufinwe is clearly a bastard :p
I say we go and look who's there. C is madness. Staying here and pretending there's nothing wrong is completely foolish. Nothing stops whatever is in the caverns to come out.
A makes us more superstitious, and more religious, but I do not see how it could save us should whatever is in there decide to come out.

Also note, go to the cavers was a choice quite a bit of time ago :p

EDIT: well, A could make us more fanatics if that's the way people want to go...

 

[Urist McLurker]

Whatever is in the caves will not come after us, for it has not done so yet, has it? Sending a large party would only work if it is of our best, but when we still have more dire and closer threats to handle, can we risk losing our best on a needless quest? Guarding them would be just as much of a waste of manpower and we ought not forget it, the darkness, the man said it himself, the darkness is what they were lost in, the darkness is where the evil lives, we have the flame spirits! The best weapon against the darkness is the light of our mighty flames. Whatever threats live in the darkness we can beat them back with great flames! Having a constant protection against the caves that does not use up too much of our manpower and time is not only better, but the protection itself is better than man and might; it is spirit and flames! The ill spirits feed on the darkness, so we shall force them out of the darkness. And by doing so, we not only find protection, but please the flame spirits at the same time!

A! I say, A! The fire spirits have looked after us this long have they not? They shall not fail us now, and then we can push into the caves, using their mighty light as a holy torch to guide our cause when we need to and are ready to! Not rush forward recklessly just because of one brave but lost man returning.

 

[TOME]

Let's not throw logic out of the window just yet. Only viable option is B. No point wasting manpower guarding something that might or might not be there. And if it is a spirit, how can the guards stop it if it decided to attack us? And if fire can protect us like is suggested in A, then why not go offensive and arm scout party with fire and black stone? Worst enemy is the unknown enemy.

So B.

 

[Kz3r0]

C.

 

[m4davis]

A for pretty much the same reasons that Urist McLurker brought up.

 

[Stygian Lurker]

I'll vote B this time, because I want to know what is in the caves.

 

[Multiple Sarcasm]

B. The Minmax tribe does not cower like old women! We don our hearing aids and ride our war wheelchairs to face the enemy!

I hope this won't be simply a 'bigger scouting party', but a more organized, better armed and wielding fire. Figuring out how to mark the way back to the exit would also be key.

 

[TOME]

Only the faint sobs of the father of the dead man could be heard.

I had figured that this was some sort prehistoric tribe with no concept of monogamy or family. So how did that man know it was his son?

 

[Kipeci]

B for the above reasons.

 

[oscar]

B. Though would A give us the possibility of charcoal again?

Now, I say we start thinking about tribe names. But what style of name? Native American? Brythonic? Something to do with bears?

 

[Kz3r0]

Berserkers, Zebra People, Fire's Children.

 

[Jick Magger]

B
Of all the mountains we could've picked, we had to take the fucking Mountains of Madness.

 

[oscar]

Stone Bear, Zebra Clan, Sons of the Flame?

 

[Hirato]

B

If they've been lost to the darkness and forsaken their duties to the great fire spirit, we must purge them!

 

[TOME]

Now, I say we start thinking about tribe names. But what style of name?

The Minmax tribe

 

[Urist McLurker]

Fellow kinsmen, if I am assured that we shall be using our holy flames on the front line against this evil darkness, I shall change my vote to B. While I am still in favour of going all out to please the fire spirits, a head on attack upon their foes could indeed do just that, but only if our holy flames are used as much as possible.

Of course the wood burners keepers of flame such as myself ought to lead such an assault and take all the glory for we are the most experienced of darkness fighters. Naturally we would be backed up by our fittest (wielding the flames given by us).

But only if I am assured a lot of fire shall be used shall I go B, for we must fight this evil both physically and spiritually, for this we must..KILL IT WITH FIRE! Until then I remain in favour of option A despite the reasons given thus far for option B.

As for our name, if we must decide upon one now, it should be People of Fire, People of the Flame, Clan of Fire, along these lines! We must not be so blind to forget the women of our tribe, nor should we believe we are the children of fire, we are not: We are its people; not its offspring.