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Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity [BETA RELEASED, GO TO THE NEW THREAD]

Frusciante

Cipher
Joined
Aug 24, 2012
Messages
716
Project: Eternity
Beta usually means (or should mean) full feature, but untested. Char creation and some half assed combat should usually be a tech demo. Given Obsidian's track record... they'll probably release the beta :)

Of course its just going to be char creation with combat and some simple quests. They dont want to spoil anything
 

Kem0sabe

Arcane
Joined
Mar 7, 2011
Messages
13,093
Location
Azores Islands
Btw guys, I'm playing through BG2 for the first time since 2007, and on Josh Sawyers "Athkatla is too content dense" I have to disagree. Athkatla is not too content dense, in fact it's probably just slightly under the content density that I'd like.

As a city, it's massive because of the amount of districts. Most districts in Athkatla only have a handful of quests in them though. Some more than others. What they do have is some nice location overlapping. You can get a quest in one district (or another part of the game map entirely) and it takes you to sometimes multiple locations.

Most of the quests aren't that complex though, so combined with some more modern quest complexity, it might be a bit better.

What would have been a bit nicer is more location re-use like what the Umar Hills quest designers did with the Ranger Stronghold stuff. You go in and clear the ruins right, but then that Ruins area is re-used for a couple of seperate Ranger Stronghold quests. It would have been nice to see more of that in Athkatla.

I replayed BG1 recently too and BG1 and BG2 probably have around about the same number of quests that start in the same area (slightly more for BG2 due to Strongholds). BG1's quests are reallly simple though, most have literally one step with almost zero complexity. BG2's quests have more steps, and they take you to multiple locations. That's why it feels like there's more stuff in each area.

BG2 also has a lot of scripted content. That's stuff that can happen in any area such as that dude coming after Edwin, or the Shadow Thief and Vampire encounters. That also helps to add to the feeling of a full city.

Athkatla is really poorly designed tho, the amount of backtracking in quests is absurd.
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
Sawyerite
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Messages
35,824
Hey, everybody. I just wanted to announce that we have decided on a release date for the Backer Beta: August 18th.

Remember when Roguey said we were only three updates away from a video? :) What a Cassandra.
 

Sensuki

Arcane
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Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
Athkatla is really poorly designed tho, the amount of backtracking in quests is absurd.

Which ones are you referring to specifically?

The layout of the areas could be better certainly.

Remember when Roguey said we were only three updates away from a video? :) What a Cassandra.

I said August for a video as well as Brandon said "a couple of months" in that PE thread mid-june, but I thought the beta would be at least September. Not necessarily anything to be proud of :P
 

Kem0sabe

Arcane
Joined
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Messages
13,093
Location
Azores Islands
Which ones are you referring to specifically?

The layout of the areas could be better certainly.



I said August for a video as well as Brandon said "a couple of months" in that PE thread mid-june, but I thought the beta would be at least September. Not necessarily anything to be proud of :P

Having to return to the thieves guild repeatedly i remember (last played BG2 a long time ago), navigating the docks district with the only exits are at the top of the map for example.
 

Sensuki

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Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
PE will feature a docks area as well, but I think they've put more thought into the layout of city areas.

The only thing that I find annoying is having to return to your guildhall to pay your due to Renal Bloodscalp. This is obviously a limitation of the engine, though.
 

Athelas

Arcane
Joined
Jun 24, 2013
Messages
4,502
http://www.dsogaming.com/news/pilla...at-gamescom-paradox-to-unveil-secret-projects

Paradox Interactive today announced the catalog of games that would be on display – and playable by attendees – at the Gamescom trade show in Cologne, Germany on August 13-17, 2014. Featuring recently announced titles and impending releases such as Runemaster and Obsidian Entertainment’s Pillars of Eternity, Paradox will be demonstrating and sharing their biggest games with Gamescom visitors, as well as announcing a few never-before-seen titles at the show.
 

TheLostOne

Savant
Joined
Sep 5, 2007
Messages
770
Location
Limbo
I have read most of the backer updates but haven't been scrutinizing this games development too much, and I was hoping someone might have some insight on this.

In the DOS thread some back and forth began about PoE being bland and sterile and it got me thinking.

I'm a little worried about PoE being bland, myself. It has nothing to do with realistic proportions and functional armor. I'm actually more concerned with the combat mechanics being dull. For some reason, the more I hear about it the more I feel like everything is too calculated.

Maybe it's just the way it's been presented or how I've processed it, but nothing I've seen jumps out at me as really unique or cool.

The weapons and armor systems sound very gamey, and talking about weapon buffs being scaled to weapon speed makes me cringe. I'm afraid there's so much focus on balance that there won't be much left in the way of fun. This kind of thinking is what gives us boring weapon enchants where you get a static +damage bonus and fire is no different than ice except when it comes to resistances. When you're afraid to break balance, you can't add things that are just cool.

There are some spells and options in games like BG and DOS which are over the top and not really balanced. Teleporting a bad guy onto a mine or turning them into a squirrel are powerful, fun options, but can't really be balanced against your basic damage or buff spells.

Now, I'm not saying that PoE is going to be like this, but for some reason I've got that impression and it's really sapping my excitement for the game.

I'm hoping some of you know of some things that can provide some evidence to the contrary.
 

Infinitron

I post news
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
97,490
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I have read most of the backer updates but haven't been scrutinizing this games development too much, and I was hoping someone might have some insight on this.

In the DOS thread some back and forth began about PoE being bland and sterile and it got me thinking.

I'm a little worried about PoE being bland, myself. It has nothing to do with realistic proportions and functional armor. I'm actually more concerned with the combat mechanics being dull. For some reason, the more I hear about it the more I feel like everything is too calculated.

Maybe it's just the way it's been presented or how I've processed it, but nothing I've seen jumps out at me as really unique or cool.

The weapons and armor systems sound very gamey, and talking about weapon buffs being scaled to weapon speed makes me cringe. I'm afraid there's so much focus on balance that there won't be much left in the way of fun. This kind of thinking is what gives us boring weapon enchants where you get a static +damage bonus and fire is no different than ice except when it comes to resistances. When you're afraid to break balance, you can't add things that are just cool.

There are some spells and options in games like BG and DOS which are over the top and not really balanced. Teleporting a bad guy onto a mine or turning them into a squirrel are powerful, fun options, but can't really be balanced against your basic damage or buff spells.

Now, I'm not saying that PoE is going to be like this, but for some reason I've got that impression and it's really sapping my excitement for the game.

I'm hoping some of you know of some things that can provide some evidence to the contrary.

There aren't going to be LOL HAX-type abilities in PoE, but I've read Sawyer's descriptions of combat encounters and they don't sound boring (YMMV). You'll certainly have far more abilities to play with across all classes than in the AD&D-based Infinity Engine games.
 

TheLostOne

Savant
Joined
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Limbo
There aren't going to be LOL HAX-type abilities in PoE, but I've read Sawyer's descriptions of combat encounters and they don't sound boring (YMMV). You'll certainly have far more abilities to play with across all classes than in the AD&D-based Infinity Engine games.

Well that's something, but quantity doesn't mean much. If you look at something like South Park, there were boatloads of weapon mods and effects, but there was very little functional difference between them and most of the abilities felt very similar. The companions had some unique stuff, but your own character's abilities were all some variation of damage heal or stun. Now, of course PoE is not South Park, but that's a recent example of an Obsidian game touted as having lots of combat options.

Do you have a link for any of those descriptions you mention?
 

Infinitron

I post news
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
97,490
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Well that's something, but quantity doesn't mean much. If you look at something like South Park, there were boatloads of weapon mods and effects, but there was very little functional difference between them and most of the abilities felt very similar. The companions had some unique stuff, but your own character's abilities were all some variation of damage heal or stun. Now, of course PoE is not South Park, but that's a recent example of an Obsidian game touted as having lots of combat options.

Do you have a link for any of those descriptions you mention?

Ask Sensuki or Roguey.
 

TheLostOne

Savant
Joined
Sep 5, 2007
Messages
770
Location
Limbo
TheLostOne

PE is a spiritual successor to the IE games. Did you find that the IE games (excluding PS:T) combat was boring ?

The IE games were based on a P&P game which was designed with spells that let you do all sorts of interesting things.

PE's system is being designed from scratch. Most of the posts from Sawyer that I've seen seem overly concerned with balance. The spells I've seen/heard of are magic missile, fireball and some AOE buffs similar to bless.

I understand what their aiming for, but a glance at the Pillars forum should show that people have differing ideas about what a spiritual successor to IE means.

I'm not naysaying, I'd just like some examples of interesting combat options. Infinitron's mention of Sawyer describing interesting combat would be a good one if someone had a link to it or knew more specifically what he was talking about.
 

Abu Antar

Turn-based Poster
Patron
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
13,581
Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Josh says:
For people who are concerned about spoilers, the Backer Beta will feature a number of areas near the middle of the game that do not have strong connections (if any) to the critical path. In addition to the characters you create, we are also likely to feature a roster of pre-made characters who are not companions. We don't have any interest in using the Backer Beta to give out story info. We'd much rather have people play it and throttle the mechanics, UI, etc. so we can make fixes and adjustments.
 

Sensuki

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New North Korea
Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
Also: You'll get to make Adventurer's Hall characters.

You will be able to go through character creation for your main character and any character you choose to make through the adventurer creator. They will all act as adventurers, not companions (meaning they don't have story content).
 

Sensuki

Arcane
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Messages
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Location
New North Korea
Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
TheLostOne

PE is a low level adventure, more representative of BG1 and IWD1, whereas BG2 was a mid-level to higher level game.

http://pillarsofeternity.gamepedia.com/Pillars_of_Eternity_Wiki

Here is the wiki, feel free to look at the class breakdowns (a lot of info that is not in the Backer Updates). There's quite a few Wizard spells listed and most of them are pretty much D&D 2E or 3E spells renamed. Cone of Cold, Cloudkill, Stinking Cloud, Minor Spell Deflection, Mirror Image, Mislead, Shocking Grasp, Burning Hands, Haste, a couple of other different ones as well.

The class design looks fine to me, all classes have lots of stuff to do. The rest of the combat mechanics sound fine to me as well (armor system, action speed system etc). It sounds like it will be fun, we'll see next month won't we.
 

Space Satan

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ruKcyoA.gif
 

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