[LP CYOA] 傳

[Zero Credibility]

There's an important distinction here; the inner strength boost does not make Jing inherently tougher. It only makes him stronger, faster and tougher, so long as his neigong is active. The problem is, if we have to cultivate our chaotic qi beyond the point where our body can handle it, we will seriously hurt ourselves. This is why the +1 stat boost is so pivotal here. With more END, we can cultivate our chaotic qi more often while mitigating the negative effects by having a far hardier constitution. These two boosts are far more crucial and provide a far better foundation for us than the qi absorption improvement.

With the package that Baltika and I have put together, we can get all this done in a year and a half, to boot.

My problem is not about not wanting stat boost. It's that barely increasing one of our average stats is not worth 5 months of time. Hell, if we are increasing stats, why not increase strength or agility to 9 instead, that's a much better deal for the same time spent. And you are giving away training in our unique potential for that, our qi. Nah, I'm with Nevil on this:

13, 15, 22, 25, 26, 34.

Qi leeching instead of END that anyone can have, +2 Swords to utilize Sword Saint's tech, and developing our own neiggong.

5+1+6+3 = 15 months.

No thrown weapons. No spears. No sabers. No traps or any other stuff. Specialization and focus.

 

[Tribute]

The fact that our END is much lower than our STR and AGI and therefore we may be able to raise it elsewhere is a decent point I suppose.

 

[Baltika9]

There's an important distinction here; the inner strength boost does not make Jing inherently tougher. It only makes him stronger, faster and tougher, so long as his neigong is active. The problem is, if we have to cultivate our chaotic qi beyond the point where our body can handle it, we will seriously hurt ourselves. This is why the +1 stat boost is so pivotal here. With more END, we can cultivate our chaotic qi more often while mitigating the negative effects by having a far hardier constitution. These two boosts are far more crucial and provide a far better foundation for us than the qi absorption improvement.

With the package that Baltika and I have put together, we can get all this done in a year and a half, to boot.

My problem is not about not wanting stat boost. It's that barely increasing one of our average stats is not worth 5 months of time. Hell, if we are increasing stats, why not increase strength or agility to 9 instead, that's a much better deal for the same time spent. And you are giving away training in our unique potential for that, our qi. Nah, I'm with Nevil on this:

Because if we start exploding with our improved neiggong and don't get tougher to be able to handle it, it will damage us and cause injuries. A five-month investment is a great way to offset that, qi leeching doesn't make us physically tougher at all.

 

[Rex Feral]

Also I would advise you to go with synergies and only things we could have used or needed recently. Think about it guys. What would give us an edge against Bai Jiutan.

 

[Esquilax]

Ugh, I'm almost tempted to voting for a Clevian package, incorporating a stat boost to everyone of our stats. 10/10/10/10/10/10 should one day be ours.

treave, could we devote ourselves to training INT so single-mindedly to the point where it we lose CHA points? We gain INT +2 at the expense of CHA -1 in five months because we seclude ourselves in Yinhu Island, reading up on Neanderthals and tapping into the lost knowledge of our mighty ancestors. Cleve would be proud.

Ugh, I'm almost tempted to voting for a Clevian package, incorporating a stat boost to everyone of our stats. 10/10/10/10/10/10 should one day be ours.

treave, could we devote ourselves to training INT so single-mindedly to the point where it we lose CHA points? We gain INT +2 at the expense of CHA -1 in five months because we seclude ourselves in Yinhu Island, reading up on Neanderthals and tapping into the lost knowledge of our mighty ancestors. Cleve would be proud.

Esquilax's package: if he adds in Artistic Skill it might make for a decent alternative. I'd rather do the saber boost and the Minamoto tech than throwing and Yunchang tech because they synergize better, but I certainly don't mind the Yunchang tech..

I can sympathize with wanting to go for Artistic Skill; I was really pushing for it when we had the chance to raise it last time. I am reluctant to go past my 18 month limit, but what about this:

Esquilaxian Package 2.0

6. Practice art with Zhang Jue. (Artistic Skill +2, 2 months)
13. Intensive sword training with Zhang Jue (Sword +1, 2 months)
20. Train to create a new self-taught sword technique based off the Yuchang Sword. (+1 Sword, 3 months)
22. Further improve your mastery of Reikan by training with Yoriwaka. (+1 Reikan PER, 1 month)
25. Undergo strenuous neigong training to unlock your potential (Neigong +2, 6 months, Yuanshi Hundun now gives +2 to STR, AGI and END)
30. Intensive endurance training. (+1 END, 5 months)

It's very similar, only I swapped out Thrown Weapons for art classes with Zhang Jue. I think it's a good trade-off, and the only difference is one month, so 19 months overall. Thoughts?

Another variation of this would be including sabers and swapping out the Yuchang technique for the Kenjutsu, but that'd be 20 months and I'd rather not be in a situation where I repeatedly push back the constraint that I've put together for my package.

With the package that Baltika and I have put together, we can get all this done in a year and a half, to boot.

My problem is not about not wanting stat boost. It's that barely increasing one of our average stats is not worth 5 months of time. Hell, if we are increasing stats, why not increase strength or agility to 9 instead, that's a much better deal for the same time spent. And you are giving away training in our unique potential for that, our qi.[/quote]

Improving our END enhances our ability to use or qi, it doesn't throw it away at all. Given how often Jing pushes himself to his limit and the strain that cultivating his chaotic qi causes him, improving our physical hardiness is a huge benefit. Yes, qi leeching is pretty cool,

The fact that our END is much lower than our STR and AGI and therefore we may be able to raise it elsewhere is a decent point I suppose.

This is the first chance that we've had to raise stats in a very long time. I could just as easily say that we could learn how to leech qi some other time as well, and it would be a pretty silly argument there too. My idea here is to focus on what's important - and to me, that means improving our neigong and our END so that we can cultivate it more easily without straining ourselves, and it means taking advantage of the Sword Saint's lessons by finally improving our swordsmanship.

As I've said before, improving END gives us a better foundation for using or qi, while the qi leeching technique does nothing to make ourselves physically hardier, more resilient, and therefore, better able to utilize our qi. It seems like it's putting the cart before the horse, to me.

 

[Zero Credibility]

Because if we start exploding with our improved neiggong and don't get tougher to be able to handle it, it will damage us and cause injuries. A five-month investment is a great way to offset that, qi leeching doesn't make us physically tougher at all.

We haven't exploded so far and I really doubt that increasing our average endurance to slightly above average endurance is going to make that much of a difference if it comes to exploding. Qi training on the other hand gives us more staying power and at the same time it weakens our opponents. Our qi is our one unique characteristic, so improving it in some way is a must. This would be a perfect counter to all those tough bastards with mountains of qi. Steal their power and use it against them. But first we have to improve it to actually be useful as such.

 

[Nevill]

We need to worry about the ability to win any given battle more than about consequences of going overboard with our qi. If you lose, you won't live to see the consequences. So staying up and running with the qi leeching technique is to me a better alternative than a simple stat gain.

You just don't run into the opponents that can make you go overboard that often.

So far, we only did it once with 100 men. Not even the GoM pushed us that hard since then.

 

[Esquilax]

We haven't exploded so far and I really doubt that increasing our average endurance to slightly above average endurance is going to make that much of a difference if it comes to exploding. Qi training on the other hand gives us more staying power and at the same time it weakens our opponents. Our qi is our one unique characteristic, so improving it in some way is a must. This would be a perfect counter to all those tough bastards with mountains of qi. Steal their power and use it against them. But first we have to improve it to actually be useful as such.

We need to worry about the ability to win any given battle more than about consequences of going overboard with our qi. If you lose, you won't live to see the consequences. So staying up and running with the qi leeching technique is to me a better alternative than a simple stat gain.

You just don't run into the opponents that can make you go overboard that often.

So far, we only did it once with 100 men. Not even the GoM pushed us that hard.

The fight against Xsaora Vairya and the fight against Yunzi in the tournament too:

By going nuts I mean like when you explode your qi (e.g. second Yunzi fight, 100 man battle) or other similar over the limit moves that harm yourself.

With our YOLOTIGERing ways, we go overboard pretty fucking often.

 

[Absinthe]

You know what, fuck it.

SINGLE YEAR CLEVIAN:
22 (Reikan, +1 perception)
25 (Neigong, +1 all physical)
32 (+1 Int, faster learning)

12 months

Fuck skills and techniques. Get stats, and we will adventure to learn the rest. We seem to make the most progress while adventuring anyway.

Smashing Axe, are you on board with this?

Guys, lets do this. We can learn more from adventuring than training anyhow.

 

[Nevill]

The fight against Xsaora Vairya and the fight against Yunzi in the tournament too:

Those didn't result in any lasting injuries, and in Vairya fight we did go for an all-out, hold-nothing-back battle. Nothing happened to us.

 

[Zero Credibility]

If we need to go all out, would 6 endurance really help us that much more than 5 endurance? It would help a little, sure, but don't kid yourself, we are still very much the same glass cannon. And if that's what we are I would prefer that our one shot really does take out the opposition that was worthy of it.

 

[Nevill]

I guess I'll be putting down an express package.

Nevill's Express training package - only basic necessities

This package is meant for specialization. Maximum focus on neigong and swordsmanship.

22 Reikan - 1 month (because it's cheap, and it develops what we already have)
13, 15 +2 Swords (anything will do, really) - 5 months (because we need to beat Wuxung, and the Sword Saint, the one who know the man, says we neglected the training far too long) Can be swapped for 13, 20.
26 Neigong - 6 months (because it is our weapon)

Total: 1 year

The rest we can learn much faster on our own. Again, I will bring up this list of what is possible in 6 months:

What we achieved in 6 months time

Skills:
+1 Swords
+2 Unarmed
+1 Artistic
+2-3 Herbalism (don't remember)
+2-3 Pressure Points (don't remember)
+4 Sleight of Hand
+2 Scholarly Knowledge
+1 Neigong (+10 cap)

Techs:
Reikan (though we lost an eye)
Kagemi
Spider Silken Ropes
No-Effort Sword Song
Wuying Leipo Kick (our most powerful yet)
Xianglong Eighteen Palms level up
Shouwang Mad Claws level up
Self-Taught Style level up
Yuanshi Hundun level up + qi leeching
Potential poison immunity

Misc:
Found and saved Cao'er and Yao
Found Qilin again and almost married her
Found Yunzi and helped her get rid of GFF
Foun Yu again and made him the Advisor
BROed it up with Guo Fu and Yandi
Made a name for ourselves
Created a Man Tiger Pig Persona
Met the Masters (and lost most of them )
Got connections with the Pirates, the Wudu Cult and the Fire Cult
Fucked Japan hard
Crowned Shun the Emperor, with Operation: Immortal, no less
Met Yang Xue
Met the Sword Saint
Had a fight with the Guardian of METAL

And God knows what else

We have to pick and choose what is importan, and what is not. The rest is fluff.

 

[Baltika9]

If we need to go all out, would 6 endurance really help us that much more than 5 endurance? It would help a little, sure, but don't kid yourself, we are still very much the same glass cannon. And if that's what we are I would prefer that our one shot really does take out the opposition that was worthy of it.

Six is above average and it toughens us up internally, while also giving us natural staying power. For all of it's benefits, qi leeching doesn't give any hard bonuses except "you leech moar." treave also said that filling up our neiggong that way will take an extremely long time unless someone voulteers to feed us, it just won't drain them fast enough.

 

[Azira]

It's been mentioned before, but I really think this choice would benefit from us first agreeing upon how much time to spend on this, and then voting on what options to actually comprise that time.

treave, is that acceptable? To split up the vote into something akin to this:
A, Jing trains for no more than 6 months.
B, Jing trains for 7 to12 months.
C, Jing trains for 13 to 18 months.
D, Jing trains for 19 to 24 months.
E, Jing trains for 25 to 30 months.
F, Jing trains for 31 to 36 months
G, Jing trains for more than 36 months.

Once people agree on a timeframe, it'd make more sense picking what training options to choose from.

 

[Rex Feral]

Fine I'll put my own packages later. I'll think of some that make us the best in one specific area and consist of techniques we can only learn here.

 

[Elfberserker]

Anabanana's and Tribute's package look solid to me.

I am fine with spending 24 or little more in Zhang Jue training montage. Sure we could be adventuring in the world, but not all techniques are equal and we have Lord Zhang as our instructor.

As for leeching vs natural endurance +1.

To me naturally raising endurance is more reliable staying power than leeching, not to mention we already have experienced what happens when you go over a little with your qi.

 

[Absinthe]

treave, what exactly will "Learn how to absorb qi from other people at a faster rate" do for us?

 

[Nevill]

But your natural endurance wears off, while qi leeching does not. And your endurance does nothing to your enemies.

As for Zhang being our instructor, nothing on this list from 6 months timeframe can compare to our own achievements.

 

[Zero Credibility]

If we need to go all out, would 6 endurance really help us that much more than 5 endurance? It would help a little, sure, but don't kid yourself, we are still very much the same glass cannon. And if that's what we are I would prefer that our one shot really does take out the opposition that was worthy of it.

Six is above average and it toughens us up internally, while also giving us natural staying power. For all of it's benefits, qi leeching doesn't give any hard bonuses except "you leech moar." treave also said that filling up our neiggong that way will take an extremely long time unless someone voulteers to feed us, it just won't drain them fast enough.

All endurance 6 does is make us slightly tougher than average. We can also get more staying power by either activating inner strength or leaching qi from opponents. And while we won't be able to drain them dry in combat, by upgrading it we can get even more durability in combat while weakening them, otherwise what would be the point of the entire technique. Now that our inner strength is no longer capped by endurance raising it to 6 from 5 really doesn't give enough bang for the buck for me.

 

[Tribute]

As far as timeframes go, I'd prefer D or E. For once in our life we've got nothing immediately pressing or hanging over our heads, let's make use of it for some proper training.

 

[Baltika9]

Except that leeching their qi gives us more stamina, but not durability, and so does our neiggong. It won't protect us from itself.

 

[Absinthe]

Zero Credibility, are you on board with 1 year Clevian? We just get all the stat boosts (hardest things to boost anyway) and learn on the road (+1 per, +1 int)? Nevill, what about you?

 

[Elfberserker]

Leeching won't work, if we can't activate our neigon like after 100 man battle. Natural +1 endurance works without or with our neigong.

 

[Nevill]

For once in our life we've got nothing immediately pressing or hanging over our heads

What did hang over your head when Zhang released you from the island? The challenge?

It is only once you got out you've learned that Yao is captured and is about to be executed, that Li Shun is tasked with genociding the Wudu Cult, and that Yunzi is a bride to the Flaming Faggot.

That you don't know about it does not mean that there are no time-sensitive events.

Leeching won't work, if we can't activate our neigon like after 100 man battle. Natural +1 endurance works without or with our neigong.

If we can't, we are crippled. END 6 won't do you good with STR 5 and AGI 5.
What leeching can do is help you preserve enough strength so you could have defeated the masters without exploding.

 

[Esquilax]

If we need to go all out, would 6 endurance really help us that much more than 5 endurance? It would help a little, sure, but don't kid yourself, we are still very much the same glass cannon. And if that's what we are I would prefer that our one shot really does take out the opposition that was worthy of it.

It definitely would make a big difference. Guo Fu is probably at STR 9, but look how much that affected how the battle played out. Likewise, Yunzi is an AGI 9, and we found it nearly impossible to track what she was doing when we fought her. That might be a difference of one stat point, but it's definitely significant. I mean, hell, look at our lost eye. Yes, I'm aware that we lost two PER rather than one, but the effect on how we use our skills and what we have potential to improve in is rather drastic.

You aren't going to be able to one-shot everybody, either. Qi leeching is nice, but our opponent isn't going to sit there and let us leech their qi, particularly if they're a freakishly strong mountain of inner strength like Guo Fu. Having an improved END stat means that we have a far more reliable way to cultivate our qi and is a far better foundation for it.

All endurance 6 does is make us slightly tougher than average. We can also get more staying power by either activating inner strength or leaching qi from opponents. And while we won't be able to drain them dry in combat, by upgrading it we can get even more durability in combat while weakening them, otherwise what would be the point of the entire technique. Now that our inner strength is no longer capped by endurance raising it to 6 from 5 really doesn't give enough bang for the buck for me.

The problem here again is that there's no foundation. By that I mean that it does nothing to improve our ability to cultivate our chaotic qi; yes, leeching helps us last longer in a fight, but the problems with overexerting ourselves will be just as serious as they are now. If we are going to really commit ourselves to harnessing more of the chaotic qi within us, then END training is pretty much mandatory for the synergy that it provides.

Considering how often we strain our internal energies, and how often we will continue to do so in the future now that the Douchebag Generation is in charge of the Eight Sects, the END boost will be a huge aid to our neigong training and it provides a far better foundation for improving our ability there than qi leeching does, which is helpful, but ultimately sort of gimmicky in the sense that it does nothing to improve our ability to cultivate our chaotic inner strength.