I missed this back then: What's up with Mark Morgan stealing music for Fallout?

[Bruma Hobo]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8tlYs_j-DM#t=83

 

[Jezal_k23]

I can understand being inspired by other artists. That is fine. That's how music works really, every musician is inspired by other artists.

However most of what I heard so far can't be called inspiration. Upon comparison most tracks end up being too similar to each other to say that Mark Morgan was merely inspired by them.

 

[J_C]

Isn't it possible that...gasp....maybe one artist allowed the other to use his score in the game?

 

[Starwars]

I can't help but think what this thread would look like if it had been, say, Jeremy Soule, instead of Mark Morgan who was guilty of this.

I love Morgan's stuff, and it's completely fine being inspired by something. And I dare say that every artist out there is guilty of stealing a part or two from something else. But there is a point where it comes a bit too obvious.

 

[Harold]

I just reinstalled New Vegas and found a patch to run the original Fallout 1/2 music over it.

New Vegas already has FO 1&2 tracks by default. The only ones not present are, I think, the Arroyo and SanFran ones, and that's ok, cuz those tracks were retarded anyway. Oh, and the New Reno one, but that doesn't really fit anywhere in NV.

 

[Surf Solar]

Kinda funny to read so many misinformed people or apologists

There is being inspired by something as an artist, liking a certain way in which someones mies their tracks, production sounds etc. and then there is theft, just copying a song, note for note, whole arrangments, like it happened with some of Morgans Tracks copied from Aphex Twin or Brian Eno. The Fallout soundtrack is good, but it dilluted the enjoyment for me when I grew older and discovered the 'source' material morgan used. It became even worse when I grew as a musician myself, seeing some of your work stolen somewhere is just a huge disrespect to the person who created the original.

 

[Stokowski]

"Lesser artists borrow, great artists steal." -- Igor Stravinsky.

(NB: Stravinsky was a dry-witted bastard.)

At the risk of provoking a lynch squad, I always though Fallout's music was fairly tepid shit anyway. Aphex Twin? 'Splains a lot.

 

[Infinitron]

The best argument in favor of Morgan is that he's talented enough that he didn't NEED to plagiarize:

 

[Gnidrologist]

Watched that comparison youtube. The Stand track is obviously copy pasted one to one, but most of the ambient tracks including aphex twins are quite far fetchingly put there. Ambient music is quite redundant to begin with. If you're being anal you would fine hundreds and thousands of tracks this similar. He even lists cases with borrowing samples, which is ridiculous. Electronic music is full of overused ''standard'' samples that come from huge sample libraries that can be used by everyone, who bought them. The other thing is - Morgan's version are ALWAYS the better ones, right to the production value.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

Don't forget Nordrom's Theme from PS:T "borrowing" a little from Kraftwerk.

 

[Stainless Veteran]

Well, it reminds me of countless metal drama with stolen solos and such. Heh.

Seriously though, I don't care if he stole some songs, I care that he managed to create an awesome atmosphere for both Fallout and Planescape. Making even a good compilation requires both work and taste, so I would be fine with ir even if he really borrowed all his tracks, but that's doesn't seem to be the case. Ambient is a tricky genre, samples tend to overlap and resemble each other in songs made by different authors, and that's normal. I've listened to that vid that StaticSpine have posted, and honestly while I hear similar samples and structure, to say that it's a blatant plagiarism would be a huge exaggeration.

 

[J_C]

Why do some of you care at all if he stole some tracks? It is not a nice thing to do, but let the artists and lawyers deal with this. I will enjoy the music whether it is Morgan's own, or not. Quite hypocritical to talk about stealing other people's intellectual property, when every second person on the codex pirates games and plays them without playing.

 

[Surf Solar]

Why do some of you care at all if he stole some tracks? It is not a nice thing to do, but let the artists and lawyers deal with this. I will enjoy the music whether it is Morgan's own, or not. Quite hypocritical to talk about stealing other people's intellectual property, when every second person on the codex pirates games and plays them without playing.

I care because I know the original sources the songs were stolen from as well and I like the music. What is so hard to comprehend there?

 

[J_C]

Why do some of you care at all if he stole some tracks? It is not a nice thing to do, but let the artists and lawyers deal with this. I will enjoy the music whether it is Morgan's own, or not. Quite hypocritical to talk about stealing other people's intellectual property, when every second person on the codex pirates games and plays them without playing.

I care because I know the original sources the songs were stolen from as well and I like the music. What is so hard to comprehend there?

I just don't understand what's the big fuss about it. Not even the original creator cared, at least I didn't hear any butthurt from him. As I said, I don't support it, and it is not a professional thing to do as an artist. But I don't get why would this dillute the enjoyment of the original Fallouts, to use your words. I love the Metal Gear Series, and the music done by Harry Gregson Williems, even though many people accused him of stealing the main theme from a russian composer. The creators will sort it out if they want, but my enjoyment won't lessen because of it.

 

[Gerrard]

No matter what crimes Eminem has committed in his past, he can always go to his bathroom, look at himself in the mirror, and say "At least I'm not Inon Zur".

What did Zur do? Except for shitty music to Fallout 3 that is.

 

[Roguey]

I prefer artists to have integrity and people of integrity cite their sources.

 

[dunno lah]

J_C

I love the Metal Gear Series, and the music done by Harry Gregson Williems, even though many people accused him of stealing the main theme from a russian composer.

And you call yourself a Metal Gear fan...

For shame!

 

[J_C]

J_C

I love the Metal Gear Series, and the music done by Harry Gregson Williems, even though many people accused him of stealing the main theme from a russian composer.

And you call yourself a Metal Gear fan...

For shame!

What's the problem? The typo in Willams' name, or that I admitted that some people think he plagarized? But I'm still a Metal Gear fan, despite this.

 

[dunno lah]

J_C

I love the Metal Gear Series, and the music done by Harry Gregson Williems, even though many people accused him of stealing the main theme from a russian composer.

And you call yourself a Metal Gear fan...

For shame!

What's the problem? The typo in Willams' name, or that I admitted that some people think he plagarized? But I'm still a Metal Gear fan, despite this.

Sorry. Should've bolded "main theme"...
BTW, have you heard the TAPPY Theme?

 

[J_C]

J_C

I love the Metal Gear Series, and the music done by Harry Gregson Williems, even though many people accused him of stealing the main theme from a russian composer.

And you call yourself a Metal Gear fan...

For shame!

What's the problem? The typo in Willams' name, or that I admitted that some people think he plagarized? But I'm still a Metal Gear fan, despite this.

Sorry. Should've bolded "main theme"...
BTW, have you heard the TAPPY Theme?

Oh, I mixed this up. Actually not Williams was accused of plagarism, but Tappy, who made the score for MGS1. Williams just continued to use Tappy's music in the later entries. Yeah, I heared the theme, it is cool. But I found a video, that compares that theme to the original russian score. It is not a 1:1 copy like others in this thread, it remains in the boundaires of "inspiration". (It uses the MGS2 theme for the comparison, but that is based upon Tappy's theme).

 

[Necroscope]

I think a lot of older videogame soundtracks were made very very close to the ref material.

 

[J_C]

In that day and age, businesses took the copyright infringments rather lightly it seems.

 

[CSM]

Good thing Mark Morgan "stole" that music, it made for two fantastic soundtracks.

 

[Necroscope]

In that day and age, businesses took the copyright infringments rather lightly it seems.

I wouldn't go as far as to call it infringement, merely the main riff is similar. In fact, a lot of Castlevania music is inspired by classical and neoclassical artists - especially Michiru Yamane stuff.

 

[Gragt]

There's a difference between plagiarism and inspiration, as others have noted, and artists have been doing the latter for centuries. It's perfectly fine: if it's great it might as well be used again, just add your own touch to it to make it your own. Plagiarism even has its own sets of rules under most laws to be recognised as such, and I wonder if some people here seriously believe that Morgan and the people at Interplay were stupid enough to risk a plagiarism lawsuit considering how costly it can be, and not just for money but also reputation. Since this whole affair has been over the Net before, I would say it is safe to assume that the pieces do not fall under plagiarism or that permission was obtained one way or another.

Besides a good piece of music is a good piece of music, regardless of the debt its creator owes. If your enjoyment of it is dimished when you discover that inspiration from it came from someone else—and you're settting yourself up for severe disapointment your whole life there, bud—that's just your bias.

I prefer artists to have integrity and people of integrity cite their sources.

Screw that. 1) This is art and not academia, so there is no need to cite sources, 2) art is its own best explaination and everything else is superfluous, including the artist, and 3) some great artists were rotten people with little integrity, e.g. Truman Capote was one of the last great wordsmith yet he was a manipulative backstabbing bastard; Reiner Maria Rilke wrote some great poems about parenthood and family despite being an adulterer and absentee father.