Dota 2 Discussion (~Boston Majors & Road to TI7~)

[Ninjerk]

Seriously. Bone7 could have won them the game if he had landed that Deafening Blast on Lion or had hit BB and Medusa (if possible). He chickened out, though.

 

[you know what time it is]

As someone who's played a ton of both HoN and Dota, I'd say Dota MM is noticeably better. It's not perfect, but it's about as good as you can do for a game like this. Valve has been fairly transparent, perhaps not totally so, but if they were then you'd have people abusing the system even worse than they did with those Zues shenanigans from last year. As far as consistency and fairness, how is the MM not either of those? And don't whine about getting stuck with shit teammates, I rose to near 6k just playing support in solo queue...

My experience was completely opposite. In HoN slowly but steadily i rose up to 2k~, there were some terrible games obviously, but overall it was a fairly pleasant run, full of close games, win or lose. In dota however, it is always a stomp. Sometimes you get two people with 40 hours played who are completely clueless (understandable), or just a bunch of retards that got that rating either by sheer luck or abuse of some kind. No map awareness, no game sense, can't last hit properly, never carry a tp, dumb picks (last pick brood into shaker/axe/whatever).

And yeah, which server ? US feels much better than EU, alas ping's too high.

 

[Greatness]

My experience was completely opposite. In HoN slowly but steadily i rose up to 2k~, there were some terrible games obviously, but overall it was a fairly pleasant run, full of close games, win or lose. In dota however, it is always a stomp. Sometimes you get two people with 40 hours played who are completely clueless (understandable), or just a bunch of retards that got that rating either by sheer luck or abuse of some kind. No map awareness, no game sense, can't last hit properly, never carry a tp, dumb picks (last pick brood into shaker/axe/whatever).

And yeah, which server ? US feels much better than EU, alas ping's too high.

Like 70-80% of HoN games (I was ~2k+ as well) were over at 15 minutes thanks to the concede options. I couldn't count how many games devolved into throwing and spamming forfeit just after a first blood. I'd say both games probably have equally one-sided games, but since in dota you're forced to endure them it seems more noticeable.

HoN also felt even more toxic than dota. Every game since people could see each others MMR there would be flaming right away even before the picks came out. People expecting the roles to be based on MMR or raging if someone with slightly lower rating picked mid or carry when they expected to get it, people stalking each others profiles and flaming them because they had worse kdr, etc.

I play on US server, but IMO EU is much better. US is really lacking players in the high MMR range compared to EU/SEA so you get some questionable games. There's not really any legitmate way to avoid that though.

 

[curry]

Indeed every solo queue match feels like one team is considerably better than the other. My advice is that you keep adding all the players you have fun playing with and play in a stack as much as possible.

 

[Orma]

Lets do codex games then

 

[polo]

Shall we exchange id's? Tho i have some lag in US servers, i can get used to it.

 

[Orma]

I'm not even kwan bro, ill pm steam id

 

[Luckra]

Secret and Vici just destroyed the opposition (2-0 stomp). I'm excited for the match tonight/tomorrow/whatever-timezone.

All the unported heroes are annoying anyway, I would not mind if they never ported Zet. Techies is disgusting enough.

Yes but Pitlord! It will be fun to play and watch. Believe me.

 

[Great Deceiver]

Winter Wyvern is actually pretty fun from what little I played of him in Dota 1. I am also curious about his model in Dota 2.

Pitlord is an oldschool hero which is way overdue for a port, but I wouldn't call him fun to play or watch. Rat dota is one of the most annoying styles to play against.

Re: Techies, I honestly think the game would be better without him. Like, literally better. I don't feel that way about any other hero, even super annoying ones like Brood.

In Techies games, the only person who could possibly have any fun is the Techies player.

 

[Orma]

Winter Wyvern is actually pretty fun from what little I played of him in Dota 1. I am also curious about his model in Dota 2.

Pitlord is an oldschool hero which is way overdue for a port, but I wouldn't call him fun to play or watch. Rat dota is one of the most annoying styles to play against.

Re: Techies, I honestly think the game would be better without him. Like, literally better. I don't feel that way about any other hero, even super annoying ones like Brood.

In Techies games, the only person who could possibly have any fun is the Techies player.

Having techies in your team in ranked games(can say the same about pudge) is like instant loss, so the hero existing doesn't matter too much imo.

 

[Great Deceiver]

I honestly don't know why something like Ranked All Pick even exists tbh.

 

[Orma]

One can wonder why dota exists, it's fucking horrible and I feel bad for every hour i waste playing it.

 

[Greatness]

I firmly believe dota is the best multiplayer game ever made. And yeah I hate it too. The amount of hours I've wasted in it are not a good thing.

Anyways regarding DAC. Apparently C9 set a new world first. Biggest throw in the history of dota2. Harsh. I hope we'll get a BLOGBOYS post from EE after the tournament.

 

[Orma]

Gratz EE

C9 died when sing left

 

[Pope Amole II]

One can wonder why dota exists, it's fucking horrible and I feel bad for every hour i waste playing it.

That's less about dota and more about people, man. Theoretically speaking, to have fun with dota you must play 5x5 always and only. With teammates and opponents of your level, of course. Practically, that is impossible, of course. And way too much pub games (mmr or unranked - hardly matters) are either a roflstomp for your team or a total hopelessnes which has very little to do with fun. And, of course, the common opinion here is that if you don't like your pubs, you should pick some imba, train & grind on it until you "git gud", climb up the mmr ladder and then the fun begins. But, seeing how pro and semi-pro players stream are nothing but a constant ragefest, I doubt this is truly the solution (not to mention that grinding some imba-shit over and over again can hardly be called fun).

I dunno, periodically, I have the same feelings too, but then, I don't really play dota to win or to get good at it. What helps me, I guess, is that I'm more interested in it as a huge rpg system that you can tinker with (to a certain extent). So instead of doing all this "wooo, let's monkey up the pros" stuff, I just explore whatever aspect of the game that seems interesting to me. A couple of weeks ago, for example, I've discovered a perfect way of jungling Luna, which (given it'll go unganked & stuff) has a really good xp and gold gain for a jungler. On par with the best of them. Really neat strat against certain line-ups, I think. In pub, that is.

Of course, lots of people play dota and so it's hard (or even impossible) to invent something fresh - I googled it and, obviously, found the 2012 dated video describing the same method I've used. But who gives a fuck? I know I've solved this riddle without outside help and that's all I care. And there are lots of such stuff to discover. For example, understanding that Tiny can totally pull the near-mid hard camp on the radiant side- yeah, the timing needs to be precise and support Tiny is shit, but it was still pleasing to see exactly the same move performed in a pro game (even if it was just one game out of thousands).

Last month, for example, I was fussing around with the heavily-jungling Ench (instead of ganking, that are rather pointless with the unranked pub teammates, you just farm midas at 5-6 min, then you farm Armlet of Mordiggan - I've tried different setups and liked fast Armlet the best - and then you go fight), STR-pumped hardlane Morph (farming Morph - I think that STR-build shouldn't be a support but more like a solo-hard in the lane where it is very hard to farm; it's just that such morph has very little use for items apart from cheap stuff like Urn & stick but benefits from the fast levels greatly) and using the fast rushed Helm of the Dominator to gank (especially with the non-standard creeps - that 500 hp bonus allows you to use some small ones rather efficiently).

I know that such experimenting is heavily frowned in the community, but I don't care that much and, from my observation, main reason for it is the somewhat unhealthy attitude of experimenters. It's one thing to try the unusual stuff and the other is to shout proudly "ha-ha, fuckers, I've invented this shit, it's IMBA, I'll shake the pro-scene, I'll fuck with the best" and so on. Not to mention that very few experimenters can actually admit that they're trying this stuff either for fun or for show, not because it's more effective than usual builds (because it is, occasionally, but only in very special situations).

But I digressed, I guess. What I meant to say is that it's saner to stop caring about winning in this game and think more about squeezing fun for yourself or smth like that.

 

[Greatness]

Yeah DOTA's huge tactical/strategic depth is what makes it so great. I don't think there's any other game out there like it. I've been playing it for ~10 years and still regularly get my mind blown when I discover new stuff.

I usually end up playing it in on/off sprees though. I'll nolife really hard for a month or two then get burnt out and take a couple months break. I always end up coming back because after DOTA there really is nothing else equivalent as far as depth of mechanics and potential skill ceiling.

The last time I played (several months ago) I took on a drastically different approach. Sort of my own solo MMR experiment, inspired by Aui's videos. I basically played pub psychology, focusing heavily on communication and being positive toward my teammates. Every game I would play support and talk non-stop, doing my best to direct everything that happened and coach my team through all phases of the game. I'd compliment my teammates and always try to keep motivation strong even when games looked hopeless. I would play exclusively support and pay attention to whom on my team were receptive to my advices, then I'd focus on making sure they had a good game. I wouldn't just sit in a lane "babysitting" like most players think supports are suppose to do, instead I'd constantly be all over the map winning lanes for my teammates with good ganks/counterganks.

I would even use some shady psychology in the picking phases. Since the majority of the time everyone wants to pick a core and playing solo support by yourself is terrible, I'd sort of "trick" my teammates into picking a second support. As soon as the game loaded and the planning phase began I would highlight Axe or something similar and set it at the jungle. The team being the pubs they are would instantly try and take all the core roles, and then (usually) that poor guy who wasn't fast enough would soul crushingly take the support role. After that I'd just pick another support with him and viola now I have two supports and probably made that other support players day when he realized he might not have the miserable game he was expecting. He's happy, I'm happy, the other guys got to play their favorite farm role and everyone's in a decent mood so there's less rage, thus less feeding and more winning.

In the end it all worked out extremely well. I tested it for exactly 1 month and rose like 1500 MMR and made it onto the top 100 leaderboards. Even got offered jobs at 3 different websites to do coaching after I posted about it on r/dota2 (no thanks). At the end of the day the matchmaking will on average make teams relatively even, you just have to make sure that what you provide to your team is more than what any individual on the other side is providing to his. Sure picking a snowball mid and dominating your lane is one way, but I'd say that unless you are actually just better than your MMR shows that won't be enough. Having a good leader is something that almost no pub team will have though. Even if your players aren't the best, as long as you are constantly communicating you can make up for their lack of awareness or decision-making and really carry them up to a higher level of play.

 

[Great Deceiver]

Or you can always call them niggers every game and get permanently stuck on low priority and muted for 2 weeks at a time.

Communication is highly overrated in pubshit Dota. It's literally a shitsmear. If you get distressed at not winning at this game, you're going to have a very bad time, no matter what. You either make your own fun while still learning the game, or you become a jaded old cunt whose soul withers a little more every time you play a match.

 

[Zed]

My account was muted for being disruptive last week.
I could still use chatwheel tho so the games looked like this:

*fucking moron feeds first blood trying to grab bounty from 3 opponents*
>Nice!
>Nice!
>Nice!

*I get a double kill*
>Nice!
>Nice!
>Nice!

It works for everything and it takes way less effort than writing something. So that's all I communicate with now even after the mute has lifted. I've gone up in MMR!

 

[polo]

My account was muted for being disruptive last week.
I could still use chatwheel tho so the games looked like this:

*fucking moron feeds first blood trying to grab bounty from 3 opponents*
>Nice!
>Nice!
>Nice!

*I get a double kill*
>Nice!
>Nice!
>Nice!

It works for everything and it takes way less effort than writing something. So that's all I communicate with now even after the mute has lifted. I've gone up in MMR!

Yeah, i use the "Good job!" for everything.

 

[Great Deceiver]

I honestly think in-game communication (chat) should be limited to the chat wheel. No voice chat. No general text chat. In private lobbies they could be enabled, but for regular solo matchmaking, the chat wheel is all anyone could ever need. And limit it to like 3 emotes every x minutes.

Again, "communication" is grossly overrated in Dota. People just shittalk and play worse because they're typing or raging or whatever.

 

[Greatness]

I have a feeling if you removed the ability to communicate then those same players whom rage in text/voice chat would instead resort to ingame griefing even more often than they already do. The ability to mute is enough IMO.

Honestly those games where I was talkative and directed my team were probably some of the most fun solo games I had in dota. What's the point in playing a multiplayer game if you can't communicate with the other players?

 

[Ninjerk]

RTZ Tony is WORTHLESS this game against VG. Everytime I turn around he's walking away from a fight covered in bukkake goo.

 

[Greatness]

I think Kuro needs to use relocates better. Just short range relocates to disengage/heal/rengage for RTZ would change these fights so much. S4 is a badass as usual though.

The Requeim/AnchorSmash damage reduction really is smart vs Tiny/Wisp though.

 

[Ninjerk]

AHAHAHA SecR[A]T

 

[SerratedBiz]

Tiny is love, Tiny is life.