Deus Ex Deus Ex: Mankind Divided Pre-Release Thread

[Infinitron]

I didn't even know a "Deud Ex boss fight" was a thing.

I view at as a kind of Torment: Tides of Numenera combat vs Planescape: Torment combat thing. Ie, it's not like how the old game was like, but it's a reasonable interpretation of what it could have been like.

Deus Ex did have climactic confrontations with boss-like NPCs like Anna and Gunther, after all, and these were pivotal moments in the game's storyline, but ultimately they weren't incredibly interesting in terms of using the full range of your character's skills.

If you're unhappy with that interpretation, it looks like Arkane and Dishonored still retain a more organic, less artificial type of "boss" encounter. Dishonored frames your interaction with those boss NPCs in a rather different, less narratively scripted way than even the original Deus Ex did, so it makes more sense there.

 

[Sykar]

Sounds like Man Codexkind is divided by this game

/fixed

 

[Carrion]

I view at as a kind of Torment: Tides of Numenera combat vs Planescape: Torment combat thing. Ie, it's not like how the old game was like, but it's a reasonable interpretation of what it could have been like.

I'd say it's more like missing the point completely.

Human Revolution failed on three different fronts when it came to bosses:

1) Story. Gunther, Anna and Simons are all major characters who you get to interact with during the course of the game, so when you find yourself in a situation where you might have to kill these people, it carries some weight. In Human Revolution you could replace the bosses with nameless mooks and it wouldn't change a single thing about the story, because the boss fights are the only reason the characters even exist.

2) Gameplay and rules. The bosses in Deus Ex play with approximately the same rules as everything else in the game (probably with a slight HP boost compared to JC at least on the Realistic difficulty level, CyberP can probably tell more), meaning that a single rocket or grenade will blow them into tiny pieces of meat. Human Revolution's bosses of course throw these kinds of rules out of the window.

3) Flexibility. There are multiple points in the game where you might encounter Anna, Gunther and Simons, and only Anna needs to be killed (although there's a glitch that lets you to avoid doing even that), which can be done in three different places and in very different ways ranging from a single line of dialogue to cold-blooded murder. In Human Revolution you've got closed arenas where you fight to the death, no exceptions.

Actually the least interesting thing about the bosses of Deus Ex was the "boss fight" part, mainly because they were never designed as some special set-pieces to begin with but simply stripped-down encounters that were exciting because of the role the characters played in the game world.

That being said, the Missing Link boss fight was a huge improvement to the main game in all three areas, even if it was very different from Deus Ex, and I wouldn't really mind if they went the same route in the sequel.

 

[Infinitron]

I'm not talking about Human Revolution. I'm talking about what they have planned for Mankind Divided, which is probably something like The Missing Link.

 

[Goral]

Not sure where to put it (or whether anyone's interested at all) but one of the Retro Gamer's editors has written a piece about Deus Ex series:

Spoiler

 

[Infinitron]

And a new thing: http://www.gameinformer.com/b/featu.../rembrandt-helped-design-mankind-divided.aspx

One of the first things players notice about the Deus Ex revival are the distinctive black and gold hues that glow throughout the dystopian landscape, along with the clear roots of Elizabethan and Renaissance era culture.

In this video the executive art director at Eidos Montreal Jonathan Jacques-Bellette reveals the wealth of historical artists that had a dramatic influence on Deus Ex: Mankind Divided.

 

[WhiteGuts]

Show, don't tell you fucking cunts.

 

[Alfons]

When are they going to explain why the world is so yellow?

 

[Modron]

When are they going to explain why the world is so yellow?

Hell you can see the guy's shades in the youtube still frame image above...

 

[CyberP]

BREAKING NEWS: Eidos Montreal DO care strongly about simulation design and logical consistency.

One of the first things players notice about the Deus Ex revival are the distinctive black and gold hues that glow throughout EVERYTHING, along with the clear roots of Elizabethan and Renaissance era culture.

Oh, never mind.

 

[Alfons]

When are they going to explain why the world is so yellow?

Hell you can see the guy's shades in the youtube still frame image above...

Good point.

 

[tuluse]

When are they going to explain why the world is so yellow?

I thought it was pretty obvious that was a result of massive pollution.

 

[Zombra]

It's to boost graphics settings. Fewer colors = higher framerate.

 

[CyberP]

When are they going to explain why the world is so yellow?

I thought it was pretty obvious that was a result of massive pollution.

Pollution so intense and complex that it surrounds interactive objects but not static ones? (Not that there should be much of the latter in a Deus Ex game at all, ideally none static in the far future). That it extends to Jensen's HUD and UI? That it covers every corner of top secret underground bases?
What it is is an overbearing "artistic" theme that sucks visual variety out of a game whose predecessor is known for an exceptional amount of variety. It naturally makes no fucking sense and once you get over the uniqueness of it you realize how shallow it really is, much like HR in whole. Style over substance summarizes HR perfectly. In many ways antithetical to what Deus Ex was/is and most certainly not subtle.

Just to be clear I'm not ridiculing artistic themes as a concept, only Eidos Montreal's use of them.

If I am not mistaken, this image originated on the Codex:

Spoiler

Obviously it is somewhat of an exaggeration, but sometimes I question whether Eidos Montreal even have the potential to make a flawed interactive masterpiece akin to DX1 (if given free reign) or they just simply are not capable of true greatness as a result of what defines them as people, as designers, artists, intellectuals. To make my point clear, THIS really cannot be repeated enough.

 

[Alfons]

When are they going to explain why the world is so yellow?

I thought it was pretty obvious that was a result of massive pollution.

I guess I didn't realize pollution affected the color of light bulbs.

 

[T. Reich]

When are they going to explain why the world is so yellow?

I thought it was pretty obvious that was a result of massive pollution.

I guess I didn't realize pollution affected the color of light bulbs.

Y'know, all that dust and particles in the air.

 

[J_C]

When are they going to explain why the world is so yellow?

I thought it was pretty obvious that was a result of massive pollution.

I guess I didn't realize pollution affected the color of light bulbs.

They don't have to explain anything. This is the visual style of the game, which looks good IMO and that's it. The devs really have to explain why are they not making a photorealistic game, and using some stylised graphics.

 

[Gerrard]

Have they explained why everyone has tiny heads though?

 

[CyberP]

Style over substance. Artistic style so straight-forward and overbearing it pervades throughout nearly every aspect of the game even when logically it should not. Artistic style that conflicts with Deus Ex's design in that we should be able to interact with the world on a grand scale, but detailed visual clutter is instead considered a priority. Style that if used in moderation and diversified a bit could perhaps do some good, but I guess JJB is a one-trick pony.

"Have they explained why everyone has tiny heads though?"

In Human Revolution fashion is inspired by the Elizabethan era, only an EM modeller misinterpreted JJB's design notes and thought HR's depiction of the future was to have "head corsets".
Here are some of these "head corsets" in a retracted state, which were implemented to patch up this mistake of the modeller:

Spoiler

Spoiler

I'm trolling of course.

 

[Alfons]

Y'know, all that dust and particles in the air.

That's some dense fucking dust. So dense it completely covers every light except for the 3 blue ones.

They don't have to explain anything. This is the visual style of the game, which looks good IMO and that's it. The devs really have to explain why are they not making a photorealistic game, and using some stylised graphics.

It was a tongue and cheek comment. I understand it's a stylistic choice that makes the game look fucking ugly, and I'm sure the devs have a hundred reasons to explain their infatuation with the color of piss.

 

[CyberP]

If that light structure is static/unbreakable I'm going to be pissed. The first thing I am going to in-game when I come across this piece of "art" is attempt to smash the shit out of it. "but, but it is sooo deep. Look, it symbolizes Jensen becoming Icarus from that specific angle". No, it is pseudo-intellectual garbage and I'm going to smash your shit up...but I highly doubt that will be possible to do because Eidos Montreal's design principles are mostly antithetical to Deus Ex and the Immersive Sim, hence I demand the name 'Deus Ex'' should be removed from the title.

 

[toro]

If that light structure is static/unbreakable I'm going to be pissed. The first thing I am going to in-game when I come across this piece of "art" is attempt to smash the shit out of it. "but, but it is sooo deep. Look, it symbolizes Jensen becoming Icarus from that specific angle". No, it is pseudo-intellectual garbage and I'm going to smash your shit up...but I highly doubt that will be possible to do because Eidos Montreal's design principles are mostly antithetical to Deus Ex.

What do you think?

Edit. Of course it will be static.

 

[CyberP]

Absolutely.

 

[tuluse]

[screenshot of a trailer for a game that isn't human revolution]

That's not Human Revolution nor a screenshot of a game

 

[CyberP]

[screenshot of a trailer for a game that isn't human revolution]

That's not Human Revolution nor a screenshot of a game

Whilst technically correct, it has been confirmed that the themes continue to persist in Mankind Divided, and that specific light structure has been shown in concept art for MD too, so it is very likely to be in the game.