Awesome crpg

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I've just played the demo for some hours of fun, some humoristic with mushrooms and wild killing, and i felt the freedom of the game, really big!
Of course after that i've followed the story, pretty good the npc interaction.

Saw on the installation screen some inaccessible language options.
The full version have Italian text? (cause i'm italian )

Do you plan to do a follow up or a huge (huge in the work too) re-edition with enhanched graphics? I suggest to use Half-Life 2 engine, damn pretty good and it adds more to the freedom and fun factor with the fisic engine (thought of a real shield and parry interaction, you choose when to parry and when and where to strike with your weapon, gibs, limbs and heads flying everywhere , more gore, new way to explore the surrounding, new throwing experience and....and so on.....).
Lol i'm not from valve or whatever, but I have always dreamed of being able to play a similar game, unfortunately I don't have the abilities to program something of that sort.
Someone must do....following the morrowind guys (sin for the too many loadings in it).

Woah! I have forgotten to talk about the mounts too (with hl2), caravans and other thing you can imagine.

Itsn't only for the shine, it adds to the gameplay, huge quantity of gameplay.
No one sayed to buy the engine itself, you only need to buy the game and make a total conversion, less cost (50-60€) and great support from the developer (sdk, patch etc..).
It requires you to have the hl2 game has a prerequisite (and an entry level pc), but who's not going to buy it? The real question is if they can legally release a mod and make people pay for it....

The Torque engine seems to be a great one (Tribes1-2 rock), Saint i'll support your critic, for only 100$ they can buy it, have a great support online and not online.
Plus with one license you can do many games has you want and so on.
Links for Teudogar guys http://www.garagegames.com/ you really need to download the engine demo here, have info and walkthrough http://www.garagegames.com/pg/demo.php?id=1
It's not a light engine but the maps are really huge, take a direction in-game and you never find the end of the map :shock:

Teudogar team has already a great plot, story, a gameplay based on freedom, with skills hidden (hidden values adds to the immersion), what they really need is a good, flexible engine and the game will totally own.

(sorry if i not register)
http://www.insidemacgames.com/news/stor ... cleID=7185
Price of the engine increased for non-indie developer to 10k$, probably garagegames wants to support the indie side developers or hire them has i read on the website.

You surely realize that they can't sell mods

Then why waste time learning and doing the fancy engine when they could be working on Teudogar and the Roma Rule?

It already owns, don't fix what aint broken. :wink: The fancy stuff always comes with a price tag. Morrowind was pretty but empty. What good is immersion if the world is boring?

Morrowind was based to be a bestseller, commercial, from passionate devs sure but commercial anyway.
It was empty (in some way) due to the inappropriate use of freedom, if you kill a key-npc the game can't go on, npc were static without a real game-life and poor AI and the chat was boring. Devs must reason on what they do.
All thing that Teudogar do have and Morrowind only lack due to his commercial way (consoles...).
I'll say it again, Teudogar only needs a new fresh engine to make it more cool (cause it's near the perfection it's only a little "tender" hehe), i'm not criticizing nothing anyway i love Teudogar the way it is, just want that game to be known everywhere, it's the rpg of the 2003 if not of the 2004!
3d engine = poor game it's a legend, the restriction of commerce and the need (???) to release an unfinished product makes bad, or at least non-crpg, games.
Look at BG2...it's not that innovation in the gaming world, it's 2d....and toee? A fun hack'n slash not so much more, Gothic2 it's well done for 3d side, the only good and new 2d game that comes to my mind is Fallout2 and Teudogar of course.

Registered

Since when commercial=crappy? Daggerfall was commercial as well but it was a much better game

Innapropriate use of freedom? There is no such thing, but there is a bad design, i.e. freedom to do ... nothing. :? Here is a relevant thread http://www.rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=1123

I was talking about crpgs as they are more complicated then Quake to design.

I haven't played Gothic2, but I played the first one and it was very simplistic. Sure it was fun to pick a side and explore but after you joined a camp, it became extremely linear and boring. Is Gothic 2 different?

And btw, welcome, Paolo

Thanks
Well i haven't played the first, Gothic2 has a good chat system and day-night life for npc, some are blessed from gods and will continue to forge weapons till death anyway hehehe.
Lack the shields and weapons variety. You need a nasa pc (like Morrowind) to play it at a good frame speed.

Well there was one way, but it involved killing Vivec for the Wraitguard, then talking to the last (half)Dwemer on Vvanferdel in the Corpusarium, and have him identify it. If i recall correctly, this "new" WG was usable in the opposite wrist.

Welcome! :wink:

It's not really necessary a NASA-like PC, methinks. I think the inability for some people to play it correctly was bad coding present on the game. There were numerous reports of people setting up two rigs the same way (equal RAM, graphics card, system, etc.), and it still didn't run well enough on one of them.

... Yeah hey yeah! But the half life, tribes... bwah, I think that its... Its better with the eagle eye view and such, not a 1st person view but a behind 3rd person view, that would so majorly own like a beach that... yeah! Heh, and some people dont have good ass computers, mine is OK I can run Soul Reaver 2 on full graphic power and only JUST unreal tourny 2004, omg has to be on minimum graphics... But wow unreal tourny has the best engine ever made i wreckin. But graphics such as diablo 2, Now that would be a good play!!

I'm not sure if anyone in this thread mentioned this yet but, valve are planning on letting people sell their mods (though it wouldn't be in stores or anything of cource) most likely through their program "Steam". I think it's a great idea if they can get it done. They can only profit from it since you would need HL2 to play these mods. Not to mention I would guess valve would get some kind of portion of the sale money.

So if this guy does manage to make a great CRPG out of it (and with the drought of quality titles since arcanum or fallout, I'm guessing plenty of hardcore gamers would flock to it like spiderweb stuff), and valve manage to get their mod-selling system operational, I'm guessing he would get more of an audience/payment with HL2. This is of cource if he makes quality work and valve doesn't take too much in royalties.

The fancy stuff always comes with a price tag SO FAR. And I don't see any other fancy CRPG other than morrowind anyways, or that's the only one that comes to mind. So let's wait until vampire: bloodlines.

Well, let's suppose I stick with this (my own) Teudogar-engine (because owning the source code gives me great freedom in game design), and the basic stock of graphics that I've got (due to budgetary constraints).

I've improved it a bit (e.g. there's now a large, continuous game world, no longer just single locations); I've added a lot more magic, exploration, combat and booty; I've increased the graphics resolution to 800x600 (this widens the field you can view, and makes everything look a bit less rough-edged, i.e. there are no longer any single pixels discernable (Screenshot)); I'll make the inventory a bit more convenient (more like the bartering tables, with identical objects displayed in a single field); and I'll charge only about EUR 9.90 (about $11.80) (plus shipping) for the Full Version. (All of this does not relate to Teudogar, but to Darghul, a Fantasy RPG I'm currently working on.)

What other kinds of improvements would be most important to you? What do you consider the weakest points of Teudogar and its engine, and are there any specific improvements you'd suggest to ameliorate these (e.g. concerning graphics, gameplay, combat, game world)? Your feedback would help me a lot. Thanks in advance!

Hey vaultdweller,

I'm pretty much with you on morrowind, it's immersive for the first few hours. After that, you realise a "random" pattern, and it becomes boring because it's the same game everywhere...
It's a really dead world....no matter how "free" it is. And not to mention the game balance was horrific...i mean...absolutely horrific.

Gothic 2 on the other hand...(Night of the raven expansion) is probably the ONLY rpg i've played this year which was good. It's a really excellent game with very rich quests, balanced gameplay, humor, excellent storyline, memorable npcs with attitudes...overall, just a superb game. Sure, it doesn't have turn based fighting, but it's acceptable because the monsters aren't like morrowind...they actually have a pattern that you have to break to kill them. (whereby morrowind you just move back and forth. Zzzz)

Yes, you do still pick sides and stuff. However, this time there really are totally involved and different quests involved when you pick sides. (unlike the first one)

Well, sounds good then. I've never played Night of the Raven, so how does it compare to Gothic 1 and 2. What are the improvements?

I really, really, really like the atmosphere of this game. You have the Ultima 7 look and feel down to a fine art

Seeing I've only played the demo, perhaps some of this is implemented in the full game already? FWIW I'm not sure how realistic it is to introduce these elements into a game that is already fully coded - certainly it would make a lot of extra work for you. But what the heck - you don't know till you don't ask ;-)

(1) Weather effects - rain, snow and fog. Apart from being nice eye candy, you could have it affect gameplay. Ie: trudging around in the snow without proper equipment (ie: cloak, boots) would lower health much more quickly. Catching fish would be easier during rain (fish seem nutty about rain - go figure). Fog makes travel take longer / increase chances of being robbed.

(2) In general I'd love to see the hunting aspect of things expanded a little. For example - the ability to set traps to catch wild game. (Which would mean introducing rabbits, foxes, etc)

(2b) I would love, love, *love* to see a bit of "medieval Macguyver-ism". Eg: How can I catch a rabbit? Sure I can hunt it with my spear. But how about combining X + Y to create a trap? Player must work out what X and Y are (let's say branch + twine). This would means introducing more items for the player to find in the wilderness, plus another "magic" skill to learn.

(2c) If you're going to do traps, you must have the ability to lure animals into them. Certain animals prefer certain lures. Finally a use for that 2 day old rotting fish?

(2d) On the topic of rotting fish - the ability to salt / cook / dry wild game for longer shelf life.

(3) Plant identification. It's all well and good turning psychotic after eating the mushrooms, but how about being able to gain skills in herb lore etc? Thus being able to identify curative herbs, food preservative herbs, psychoactive herbs (+ to attack skill, - to defense), poison herbs (add curare to weapons for quicker kill), casting skill etc.

(4) Finally - making the wilderness / gameworld more interactive in general. Being able to camp in the wilderness, hunt for game, combine items to create new items (rock + twine + stick = stone axe) etc.

Just some (impossible to implement?) ideas.

Hi "guest", thank you for your detailed list of suggestions! 1) Weather: "rain" is already on my To-Do-list. Snow would require a huge amount of additional graphics, so I'll put that off for the time being. Fog'll be a bit difficult, too, but would be nice to have. 2) Hunting/traps: I'll implement this. 2d) You'll be able to dry (smoke) fish in DARGHUL. 3) In the Full Version of Teudogar, the witch in the woods south of Heremod's Hall teaches you how to use herbs to poison food; besides you get to know the use of all herbs and potions (though currently, most herbs have no real use except to provide some pleasant intoxication). In DARGHUL, you can use herbs to brew magic potions. 4) Interactivity: I'll generally try to make every object usable. Since Teudogar version 1.01 you can already weave cloth, repair armor etc; I intend to add creating simple weapons, baking bread, basic pottery, and the like.

With some of the details, I'll have to see how easy or difficult implementation would be. I'll first focus on finishing DARGHUL's main game world; then I'll add whatever I can do with reasonable efford; and things that'd require a really great deal of work I'll add lateron or in future versions. Again, thank you! Regards - Wolf

BTW, so far almost all suggestions I've received via email, feedback form, or this forum deal with gameplay issues. Does anyone have any wishes/comments/suggestions regarding the user interface?

E.g., would you prefer a more table-like, field-oriented inventory (instead of the current "drop things whereever you want")? Would you want to have a "mark-several-items,-then-move-them-all-at-once"-feature? Or would you perhaps prefer a "left-mouse-button-only" interface (mouse-over: look, left mouse button pressed/clicked on distant things: walk, left click on people/items nearby: talk/use/get), instead of the current, more flexible, but also more complicated left/right/click/drag&drop/double-click system? Thanks for your feedback!

>Does anyone have any
>wishes/comments/suggestions >regarding the user
>interface?

User interface is excellent as is. Some of the fonts are occasionally a little difficult to see. Perhaps some higher visability colours on the font too? (lite green seems a easy to see colour)

> Would you want to have a
> mark-several-items,-then-
> move-them-all-at-once"-

That might be nice, but not a big deal in my book.

I always thought the fonts were fine and I wear specs. The game engine / interface is really quite nice - I'm sure many of us appreciate the little touches (fluttering flags on map screen etc).

IMHO the mechanics are solid - I can't fault it for a single thing.

Do you envisage including the ability for players to create their own mods / scenarios in any of the future versions of Teudogar / Darghul, akin to Dink Smallwood?

Hello to both guests, and thank you for your feedback.

Font colors: This probably varies on different systems depending on your screen settings. I'll set up an option for extra-bright font colors; you could then activate these via the options menu.

Creating own mods/scenarios: I may do this; but it'd be a lot of work to add a more convenient user interface to the game world editor. Before I do that, I'll have to find out how much demand there would be for such a feature.

User interface, in general: Well, so I guess the lack of comments on this means that most people are content with it. I'll improve the inventory a bit (better sorting, easier moving/dealing with large numbers of small objects), but otherwise I'll leave the User Interface as it is.

However, any additional suggestions concerning this and other aspects are very welcome: Any of you reading this, please do post if you have a comment! (You can simply post via the quick-reply field below, without registering/loggin in.)

I dig the bartering system and the user interface. In the full version, can you enhance your ability to successfuly barter via training?

Probably everyone here is adding their favourite experiences from other games. My favourites are ones like Elite, Pirates! Ragnarok, ADOM, UnReal world.

One think I'd like to see is more random events when travelling. Sure - you get attacked. But maybe some other things could happen? You stumble across an injured animal, or you find something. Fun side quests. As it stands, it feels like the game is on rails - you have a main quest to persue and not many other rewarding options. Or maybe it's just the demo.

I think this might be a little silly, but I'd love to see more statistics on how I generally stand in the community. Kind of like in Elite. Maybe introduce some kind of "feats of strength" anual festival where my character can competive in to raise his social standing / gain skills?

I like the idea of 'herb lore' / survivalism mentioned above. If you expanded these areas (interactivity with environment) to match the likes of UnReal world, I think I would by 10 copies of your game ;-)

Hello Guest, thanks for your suggestions! Bartering: This is currently determined by your Charisma-skill. This skill improves over the course of the game (in the Demo version, too, of course), mainly when you're successful in whatever you try to do, but also when you practice wizardry, and, also, bartering. So there already is a kind of training effect with bartering, but not restricted to this specific action. I'm not sure but I think this approach is realistic, since success in bartering is probably more a question of your overall charisma and personality than of specific technical knowledge/practice (or practice only in so far as you get better at convincing/charming your trading partner).

Random events: In Teudogar, there are random generated caves in the forest where you get held up by robbers. I've greatly extended this feature in DARGHUL, where you can now come across monsters or booty or different things almost everywhere. Besides, DARGHUL will offer much more exploration, sub-plots etc than Teudogar (far easier for me to realize with a fantasy game, of course, than with a historically accurate and painstakingly-researched one like Teudogar).

Social standing: I like this idea; I'll take a closer look at what data I could gather and what statistics I could display; perhaps a general reputation like mighty-warrior/fails-in-everything/true-to-his-word/thief/coward/criminal etc depending on things you've done (witnessed by others?) (or told others about?). Since you're usually acting on your own, not with a group of others, I may not give you an absolute overall reputation (this and your self-esteem are already dealt with by your Charisma and Experience of Life skills), but instead local reputations (e.g. people in Heruwood may consider you a brave and honorable warrior, while people in Heremod's hall think you're a thief and good-for-nothing). This ought to have implications for dialogues and bartering, too ... but well, that may follow in later versions; I'll keep it simple at first and extend it if it works well.

To all who read this, any additional suggestions regarding anything about the game are very welcome. Please do post if you have a comment! (You can simply post via the quick-reply field below, without registering/loggin in.)