KickStarter Ancient Domains of Mystery (ADOM) - now available on Steam and GOG

[Awor Szurkrarz]

What's the deal with these graphics? Who thought it was a good idea?

He did a kickstarter for going back and finishing ADOM a while back. Graphics were one of the goals. So... all the people who donated? Unless they all wanted whatever was a goal AFTER the graphics. But I get the feeling it's the other way around, with graphics whores funding the additional races, classes, artifacts and quests.

I mean, these specific graphics, not graphics in general. They kill the mood. Everything became so indie and cute and ironic.

I think that Infra Arcana style graphics would be much better.

 

[Renegen]

Such a waste. Ascii graphics are hundred times more practical, as in most roguelike-games.

I wouldn't mind tiles so much if not for the fact that they generally cut screen size down to like 1/2 your vision radius, which is just suicidal.

Don't worry, he's heard your complaints and next version will be significantly easier.

 

[non]

What's the deal with these graphics? Who thought it was a good idea?

He did a kickstarter for going back and finishing ADOM a while back. Graphics were one of the goals. So... all the people who donated? Unless they all wanted whatever was a goal AFTER the graphics. But I get the feeling it's the other way around, with graphics whores funding the additional races, classes, artifacts and quests.

I mean, these specific graphics, not graphics in general. They kill the mood. Everything became so indie and cute and ironic.

I think that Infra Arcana style graphics would be much better.

I, too, think IA style graphics would be better.

 

[Awor Szurkrarz]

What's the deal with these graphics? Who thought it was a good idea?

He did a kickstarter for going back and finishing ADOM a while back. Graphics were one of the goals. So... all the people who donated? Unless they all wanted whatever was a goal AFTER the graphics. But I get the feeling it's the other way around, with graphics whores funding the additional races, classes, artifacts and quests.

I mean, these specific graphics, not graphics in general. They kill the mood. Everything became so indie and cute and ironic.

I think that Infra Arcana style graphics would be much better.

I, too, think IA style graphics would be better.

At least one roguelike developer has a sense of style .

 

[Elwro]

I tried two duelist characters today. A fun new class, if you can manage yourself properly so you're not encumbered and you can stomach not using a shield.

Also, I talked to Yggaz and it seems his wife left him. I've never read this line and I think this has to refer to something new. The new Ice Queen or whatever dungeon?

It's great to see new things added to the game!

 

[Deuce Traveler]

So I've been playing the 1.2.0 Prerelease version 23 of ADOM, and of course because this is a rogue-like game I've been doing plenty of dying but also having plenty of fun. I was a bit worried about playing the more modern version of ADOM, since I used to play the DOS version up until about last year. This is because I have seen how completely different the old DOS version TOME has been compared to the new modern version and thought I'd be missing something in the transition. Instead I was happy to see everything I enjoyed in the previous DOS version, but with more content and better graphics. I still haven't gotten past the dungeon with the dwarven city inside, but this is a game where death still comes easy.

The biggest draw with this game so far is the diverse possibilities allowed through character creation. Your character can be born under different celestial symbols, making him or her a natural melee fighter, skilled jack-of-all-trades, magic caster, or healer. Every character and character class has extreme advantages and vulnerabilities. I've had a orc barbarian who had no fear of starvation or physical combat, but who died after triggering a fire trap. I then played a human rogue who easily discovered traps but was killed in melee, followed by an elven mage who went too far into the depths and couldn't return to town soon enough to avoid starvation. Also, at one time I tried a troll healer who just couldn't be beaten in melee combat, but an undead spirit aged him to death. For kicks I tried right after a troll monk for the martial artist abilities, and that character didn't last long at all but I still loved the mental image of a troll-like Bruce Lee.

I've read that archers and wizards have the most success in this game, but the character combination I've enjoyed the most has been the gnome elementalist. I like that he starts with burning hands and a ranged frost attack, though his inability to carry many items without being overburdened has been a pain. So although I've gotten five gnome elementalists killed so far I think I'll keep at it until I beat the game with one.

My biggest gripe with the game is that food is so costly and heavy, which feels like it penalizes weaker humanoids with lower strength scores that aren't able to eat a large variety of corpses. Except dead orcs... everyone can eat orc corpses (they taste like pork), which turns them from frightening opponents to a walking source of nutrition. This is further felt due to the long travel times between dungeons and towns.

Also, it seems to me that the monsters aren't as diverse as in other rogue-like games like the Angband and Zangband variants, but I still have to go further before I can make that judgement.

And yes, I plan to do a Codex review if I can complete the game.

 

[felipepepe]

And yes, I plan to do a Codex review if I can complete the game.

Isn't ADOM the game that even the creator never beated?

 

[Bester]

I remember playing it in the early 00's and the controls were a huge wall (of pain... in your ass) you had to break through by bashing your head against it. Then you could start having fun.
Tried the new GUI version and still couldn't figure out many basic actions.

Maybe it'd be easier to jump right into it if you could start with a... a... tutorial... maybe voiced by David Warner... while eating a giant burger with fries and coke, you know... and while getting a gentle and not too distracting balls caressing by Lindsay Geektron... and also while getting a manly pat on the back by Brian Fargo and Ryan Gosling.... Yeah, that'd make things easier.

 

[Suiboon]

The controls are indeed annoyingly complex. I suggest rebinding some of the keys to whatever you find more intuitive and maybe even printing out your control scheme because you will have to double and triple check at times.

I've only ever played the graphical version of the game and it's quite nice actually, speaking as a person who didn't want to give this game a chance earlier due to the ASCII graphics. There is a highish learning curve (and the controls don't really help with that) but once you get into it it's quite addicting.

And yes high strength in order to carry more stuff such as food is important, but luckily that is one of the easier stats to train in the game and there are other ways of easing the burden such as items and spells. Don't wander around uselessly and try to avoid playing a high food consumption character such as a troll (unless you pair it with some traits that will help).

This is one of those games that are not balanced at all and that's what makes the character creation system and leveling up so fun. I've had the most success with wizards, particularly dwarven wizards since they are quite sturdy and thus won't die as easily. Choosing a randomized character and ending up with a farmer or chaos knight etc. will make for a much more challenging and most likely short experience.

 

[Monstrous Bat]

Ah, ADOM. That certainly brings back memories. I beat the game once, in 1.1.1 version, with an orcish barbarian. It was fun while it lasted, but I don't think I'll ever go back to it again. The game can be really tedious at times (hello farming piety to get yourself crowned). Besides, given how the 1.2.0 version jacked the difficulty up even further I'll probably have an even harder time beating the game if I tried.

Deuce Traveler , are you trying to beat the game unspoiled? If you do manage to pull that off, make sure to brag about it on the official forums (and just about everywhere else). I'm pretty sure you'd set a Guinness Record by doing that. I once saw some dude on the official forums say that he has been playing unspoiled for 10 years and just got to the eternal guardian and everyone was going "HOLY SHIT MANG HOW THE F DID YOU GET THROUGH TOEF WITHOUT SPOILERS????!!!!111"

Hint: if you're having trouble carrying food, look around the arena level in the Caverns of Chaos. The merchants there sell something that will solve your food problem...

 

[Johannes]

And yes, I plan to do a Codex review if I can complete the game.

Isn't ADOM the game that even the creator never beated?

No idea if he has, but beating ADOM consistently is easy if you're good at the game.

I've read that archers and wizards have the most success in this game, but the character combination I've enjoyed the most has been the gnome elementalist. I like that he starts with burning hands and a ranged frost attack, though his inability to carry many items without being overburdened has been a pain. So although I've gotten five gnome elementalists killed so far I think I'll keep at it until I beat the game with one.

I don't recommend that, elementalist's pretty much inferior to other spellcasters in the long run. It might seem like a good class early on but they have a harder time learning non-elemental spells and have much worse class benefits overall. The innate spell learning only helps very early on compared to other spellcasters.

 

[Deuce Traveler]

@felipepe , I don't know about that. It seems easier than other rogue-like games, especially the original Rogue. On this one other thread, fans of the genre think that Stone Crawl Soup may be the hardest. https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=1586

That said, there are still moments where I have a character above level 5 take a single step and suddenly die from something off screen. My graveyard is embarrassingly large.

Suiboon , I've actually grown accustomed to the keys for the most part, although I admit that I still have to bring up the online manual often. The keys are non-intuitive and deviate sharply from the standards of other rogue-likes. I've made random characters and classes like the farmer add a complexity to the game I'm not ready to explore. I just didn't find collecting and planting seeds to be enjoyable.

On the other hand, for non-wizard and non-archer/ranger classes, the healer seems pretty damn durable, but is a pretty dull class compared to many of the others.

Monstrous Bat , I already blew that goal. I've gotten pretty good at solving the little dog quest and the druid and elder quests at the start of the game. I haven't figured out the sheriff's quest yet, but no big deal. Anyway, after I was told to go west I lost three characters to starvation and random dungeons past the river before getting frustrated and looking at a spoiler to find out where to go next. Sorry, but I do want to finish this game in a couple months, not in more than 10 years.

Johannes , Awww... I know my gnome elementalists haven't lasted very long since they are pretty fragile, but I really like the idea of a garden gnome firing off eldritch blasts. I even called him Gnomeo and everything.

 

[Damned Registrations]

ADOM is a game that demands encylopedic knowledge of it to be beaten. If you don't know every last game mechanic, the stats on every fucking enemy, and every bullshit instadeath gimmick the game will throw at you, you will get fucked. Also, you're expected to scum the infinite dungeons low levels for loot (and training skills), because that's totally reasonable and not at all a horrible horrible addition to the game that shouldn't exist. Unlike pickpocketing for loot, which is unreasonable farming behaviour and must be crushed.

 

[felipepepe]

BTW, since a lot of experts have gathered here, I still need a review for ADOM...

 

[Clockwork Knight]

"Doesn't even have graphics, one star out of five"

 

[felipepepe]

Cool, now just make it 5400 characters long.

 

[Gozma]

In 1.1.1 or whatever the version was that was the final one for a decade or so you don't actually have to farm anything, including herbs, piety or spellbooks. It's a good idea to sacrifice to the super lucky status and eventually get crowned but most of the precrowning artifacts are crap, and they'll never be the difference between a winning/losing game.

The big things you had to know were:
1) Summoned enemies are a huge problem because of the way enemy scaling works. Every time you kill a summoned enemy like a jackal (via werejackal), every new jackal spawned for the rest of the game gets a little tougher. This can get completely out of control with various commonly summoned enemies, so you have to do stuff like completely abandon floors just to avoid fighting a bunch of e.g. spider summons.
2) Enemies can go berserk, which gives them like double speed and damage or something along those lines for a turn before they die. Powerful enemies can instagib you from full to dead almost no matter what this way. So, basically, never try to kill anything really tough in melee unless you have super offense that can kill strong shit from like more than 50% HP to dead in one turn.
3) Polearm and tower shield skill levels give you crazy defense, so use polearms + tower shield unless you got some great artifact.

Spoiler

4) Read at least one blessed scroll of peace at the start of DL:50 to cut the background corruption enormously.
5) Read the herb spoilers. Even if you don't ever set out to truly farm herbs you'll get a fair number of them.

 

[garren]

I'm no expert, but I think the tower of eternal flames on the main map is the biggest roadblock mid-game.

Spoiler

-You pretty much need fire resistance, or immunity if you are lucky enough to get it (thankfully it's one of the easier resistances you can get).
-You need at least one fireproof blanket in your inventory so that your equipment won't turn to ash while traversing the place (you should have found at least one by now, unless you're really unlucky). However, those won't protect the equipment you have on you.
-Unless you wear only artifacts (which are indestructable), you need a ring of ice (two are even better!), that protect the equipment you're wearing from the flames. Do NOT wear any equipment in the tower unless it's an artifact or you are protected by ring(s) of ice.

I haven't played the newer versions of ADOM so this issue could have been alleviated somehow, but getting rings of ice was a big pain in the butt imo, not always have you found even one before needing to go to the tower. There's a new domain of the ice queen location in the newer versions, so maybe that is a place where you can find one more easily?

Also I think one general good tip for everyone is that you need to learn how to dig sooner of later (many ways to do that) if you want to beat the game.

 

[Ziem]

Also, you're expected to scum the infinite dungeons low levels for loot (and training skills), because that's totally reasonable and not at all a horrible horrible addition to the game that shouldn't exist. Unlike pickpocketing for loot, which is unreasonable farming behaviour and must be crushed.

Most of these Degenerate Tactics™, like stairscumming and gremlin bombing, were removed from the game - items don't spawn on the ground in the infinite dungeon so you can't just stairhop to generate items (most notably spellbooks..), and spawned gremlins don't drop anything and can't be pickpocketed so you can't exploit that either.

 

[haraw]

Is there still different endings, like ultra ending? Did that and regular playthroughs severel years back and yeah, game was still somewhat easy even without exploits like ID/gremling scumming if you played a wizard and if you had some understanding of the game.

 

[Awor Szurkrarz]

And yes, I plan to do a Codex review if I can complete the game.

You're going to have fun next half-a-decade. I envy you .

 

[Monstrous Bat]

@felipepe , I don't know about that. It seems easier than other rogue-like games, especially the original Rogue. On this one other thread, fans of the genre think that Stone Crawl Soup may be the hardest. https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=1586

I think ADOM is about as hard as Crawl (with spoilers of course, ADOM without spoilers would be hell). Then again, Crawl seems to be getting a bit harder literally every version, so it probably won't be long before it surpasses ADOM in difficulty.

I'm no expert, but I think the tower of eternal flames on the main map is the biggest roadblock mid-game.

Ahh, the Tower of Eternal Flames. One of the most frustrating and fascinating dungeon I have ever seen in a roguelike. I wish there were more dungeons like that in CRPGs.

Spoiler

I'm fairly sure you're guaranteed to get a fireproof blanket from Thrundarr. Getting a ring of ice is harder, at least in 1.1.1. Not sure how it's like in 1.2.0.

 

[Johannes]

I'm no expert, but I think the tower of eternal flames on the main map is the biggest roadblock mid-game.

Spoiler

-You pretty much need fire resistance, or immunity if you are lucky enough to get it (thankfully it's one of the easier resistances you can get).
-You need at least one fireproof blanket in your inventory so that your equipment won't turn to ash while traversing the place (you should have found at least one by now, unless you're really unlucky). However, those won't protect the equipment you have on you.
-Unless you wear only artifacts (which are indestructable), you need a ring of ice (two are even better!), that protect the equipment you're wearing from the flames. Do NOT wear any equipment in the tower unless it's an artifact or you are protected by ring(s) of ice.

I haven't played the newer versions of ADOM so this issue could have been alleviated somehow, but getting rings of ice was a big pain in the butt imo, not always have you found even one before needing to go to the tower. There's a new domain of the ice queen location in the newer versions, so maybe that is a place where you can find one more easily?

Also I think one general good tip for everyone is that you need to learn how to dig sooner of later (many ways to do that) if you want to beat the game.

You don't need Ring of Ice. A lot of equipment is totally safe, stuff made of good-quality metals won't burn.

Also sources of fire resistance stack. IIRC 4 of them will eliminate the background damage completely, also the Immune to Pain feat counts as one here. (each source reduces the damage taken per turn by one)

 

[Zetor]

I remember doing the tower of eternal flame with a warrior-type using an artifact 1h axe to kill everything (he did have a blanket for the inventory items + enough personal fire resist to not get incinerated...) while the rest of his equipment slowly melted off as I progressed through the tower. Number of fucks given was 0.

e: this was in 0.9.9 gamma 12 or something

 

[Johannes]

I've done the tower without a blanket too. Just drop most things and only take what you need with you in. On that run I did bring a lot of spenseweed (healing herb), even if most of it burned away, but it was necessary to stay alive due to taking constant damage even with Fire Immunity, since I was a drakeling (drakelings gain extra speed in the tower, but start to lose hp, for it eventually - since they're cold-blooded).