Age of Decadence Released

[Perkel]

So today there were two updates 1.0.0.0050 and 1.0.0.0084.

What are changes to 1.0.0.0084 ?

 

[Vault Dweller]

The first update fixed a very rare start-up issue. We weren't sure if should release the second update right away or keep it on the test branch for a few days. We tested it, didn't see any problems, decided to release.

http://steamcommunity.com/games/aod/announcements/detail/79170231967440200

 

[Anthedon]

Finished my Mercenary/Imperial Guard combat playthrough. Next up is some high Int/Lore/Crafting character to use and see all the stuff my fighter was too dumb for (which was pretty much everything). I'll write a short Steam review later in the day to help the cause.

 

[Infinitron]

Something Awful on AoD, with a guest appearance from Admiral Jimbob: http://forums.somethingawful.com/sh...473537&pagenumber=90&perpage=40#post451429920

The unrest continues: http://forums.somethingawful.com/sh...erid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=91#post451617027

Age of Decadence is to Fallout what Bloodlust Shadowhunter is to Bloodlines.

Actually no Bloodlust Shadowhunter was ambitious and hilarious whereas Age of Decadence is just this mound of dumb bullshit full of forgettable, boring dickheads that teleport you around and unequip all your weapons for no reason.

I don't think writing flat, dull, forgettable characters that feel like they've all been written by one boring asshole is a thing it ~*wants*~ to bring to the table.

I would've preferred it if AoD was bad in the way that Raven's Cry or Bloodlust Shadowhunter was bad, with godawful voice acting and weirdass bugs because that's funny and entertaining. AoD is just sort of there. It hasn't really bugged out or anything it's just kind of boring and poorly thought out. I would probably enjoy it if it wasn't just so fucking self-satisfied. Stuff like sparing a dude and demanding something being a one way street which you can't back out on if you don't want anything they can give you. It's just dumb stuff that probably got caught in development but it's just so fucking proud of being "hardcore" that reason just goes out the window. Although there's really no fucking excuse for the characters being so goddamn boring. I know it's an edgy post apocalypse but everyone's either grumpy, violent or both. The only guy I remember was some jerk who I asked to teach me about fighting and he just told me that killing dudes makes you better at killing dudes. Thanks guy.

Well, AoD’s existence seems to be making people hilariously mad. I really need to buy it soon.

Admiral Rimjob POOBUM wtf

Anyway, who's going to buy Vault Dweller an SA account so he can join the fun?

 

[Crooked Bee]

The fun is pretty much already over, though. After the initial division over AoD, SA is back into its comfortable anti-grognard mode.

If VD had joined earlier, that could've been fun, yeah.

 

[AwesomeButton]

The fun is pretty much already over, though. After the initial division over AoD, SA is back into its comfortable anti-grognard mode.

If VD had joined earlier, that could've been fun, yeah.

How do you get into an argument with those people anyway. "You suck, my game is good!" ?

 

[Vault Dweller]

I wouldn't have time for it anyway.

 

[ZagorTeNej]

The fun is pretty much already over, though. After the initial division over AoD, SA is back into its comfortable anti-grognard mode.

If VD had joined earlier, that could've been fun, yeah.

You mean back into their comfortable dumbfuck mode? Can't see how a game which offers you so many ways to avoid combat is particularly grognardy anyway (as far as I understand the term). Unless anti-grognard means casual gamer or something, in that case yeah, they should stick to developers that specifically cater to them (cannot fail/no bad chars/see everything in a single run modern philosophy of gaming design) and avoid any game that doesn't treat them like a special snowflake.

 

[Infinitron]

Can't see how a game which offers you so many ways to avoid combat is particularly grognardy anyway (as far as I understand the term).

Ah, you've inadvertently stumbled upon the central contradiction of Vault Dwellerism. He jettisons some grognardy CRPG tropes (such as the combat focus based on learning systems through repetition) but religiously clings to others (such as trap builds and having to restart the game until you find a build that works). The result is something that many people find weird.

 

[Crooked Bee]

You mean back into their comfortable dumbfuck mode? Can't see how a game which offers you so many ways to avoid combat is particularly grognardy anyway (as far as I understand the term). Unless anti-grognard means casual gamer or something, in that case yeah, they should stick to developers that specifically cater to them (cannot fail/no bad chars/see everything in a single run modern philosophy of gaming design) and avoid any game that doesn't treat them like a special snowflake.

Man, your post is like the mirror image of theirs.

Thing is, initially that thread was sort of split about AoD, with some people enjoying it, some disliking it, and some on the fence. Then the anti-grog brigade arrived, and since being anti-grog is SA's street creed thing, people who had previously been undecided started to err on the side of the h8rs. If that sounds familiar, then it's because that's the way it works everywhere.

 

[Zorba the Hutt]

Age of Decadence vs Something Awful - which is weirder and why?

 

[Vault Dweller]

If literally any build will do just fine (PoE), why put any thought into character creation and development?

 

[Infinitron]

If literally any build will do just fine (PoE), why put any thought into character creation and development?

Because you want to play a character who does certain stuff or plays in a certain way that you find inherently enjoyable.

I mean, come on man, you know if this was a real argument there wouldn't be tons of build guides out there for all those easy RPGs where every build is just fine. Yet there they are.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Because you want to play a character who does certain stuff or plays in a certain way that you find inherently enjoyable.

I mean, come on man, you know if this was a real argument there wouldn't be tons of build guides out there for all those easy RPGs where every build is just fine. Yet there they are.

I'm having a very interesting discussion with Kevin Saunders about character systems and illusion (instead of the real deal) they often provide. This is one of those things. Witcher 3 character system was entirely optional (see the Codex review), yet there are also build guides and such.

 

[Infinitron]

I'm having a very interesting discussion with Kevin Saunders about character systems and illusion (instead of the real deal) they often provide. This is one of those things. Witcher 3 character system was entirely optional (see the Codex review), yet there are also build guides and such.

Cool, I hope you can publish it at some point. (ksaun, any comments?)

As for them being an illusion, it depends on what you value. I say, any sufficiently complex system of character building will allow players to optimize their choices towards certain ends. In grognardy systems like yours, you have to optimize for sheer viability. In more forgiving systems, you optimize for gameplay variety, for roleplaying, or for "fun". Some might say that the "means" are of more importance than the "end". In all cases, you're doing a fun systems optimization mental exercise. It doesn't matter what you're doing it for, the intellectual challenge is the same. And judging by all those guides, I guess people do want to participate in that.

 

[ZagorTeNej]

Ah, you've inadvertently stumbled upon the central contradiction of Vault Dwellerism. He jettisons some grognardy CRPG tropes (such the combat focus based on learning systems through repetition) but religiously clings to others (such as trap builds and having to restart the game until you find a build that works). The result is something that many people find weird.

Sure but even such grognard tropes like trap builds are far less pronounced because of AoD's near filler free nature, small scope/length and fast travel/teleportation (all of which makes it easy to just pick up and play in short bursts). It's certainly not the same as finding your build sucks after 20h playtime or something. Not to mention that even non-talky builds can walk away from many fights or rely on allies (use nets which are plentiful and always hit for example).

Many alternative paths to straight-out fighting and fully developed pacifist playthrough (instead of sort of a gimmicky playing style like it was in Fallout 1/2) just doesn't seem grognardy to me at all, quite the opposite.

I wouldn't say it's weird but just that AoD is essentially its own thing, a game that tries something new in the genre. Obviously some will like it and others won't but I don't see it as a flagship title for grognards.

 

[Infinitron]

Sure but even such grognard tropes like trap builds are far less pronounced because of AoD's near filler free nature, small scope/length and fast travel/teleportation (all of which makes it easy to just pick up and play in short bursts). It's certainly not the same as finding your build sucks after 20h playtime or something.

I guess so. In an ideal classic RPG with lots of combat, though, you'd probably find that your build sucks at combat a lot earlier than that, while AoD with its more unpredictable skill checks makes that kind of learning more difficult.

Ironically, the "find that my build sucks after 20 hours" situation actually happens when classic RPGs try to be more easy. The beginning is easy enough that even a bad build can work, so it only becomes non-viable later.

 

[Nael]

Ironically, the "find that my build sucks after 20 hours" situation actually happens when classic RPGs try to be more easy. The beginning is easy enough that even a bad build can work, but so it only becomes non-viable later.

You ever play NWN2: Mysteries of Westgate? Holy shit that module was fucking terrible about that. 99% of the module is face-roll-on-keyboard easy then you get to the last boss and DERP! Fuck, that made me so mad.

 

[Infinitron]

You ever play NWN2: Mysteries of Westgate? Holy shit that module was fucking terrible about that. 99% of the module is face-roll-on-keyboard easy then you get to the last boss and DERP! Fuck, that made me so mad.

I don't remember that from MoW, but the Storm of Zehir final battle is famous for this.

 

[AwesomeButton]

BTW, I'm 15-18 hours in, and I'm pretty sure my build sucks. <whine> :D

 

[Nael]

I don't remember that from MoW, but the Storm of Zehir final battle is famous for this.

Yeah, that one too. Maybe I missed something on the final boss of MoW that would've made it easier. Anyways, sorry to get off topic.



Here's to AoD that at least keeps expectations consistent...

 

[VentilatorOfDoom]

final boss of MoW

what was the final boss? The banshee?

 

[Lurker King]

As for them being an illusion, it depends on what you value. I say, any sufficiently complex system of character building will allow players to optimize their choices towards certain ends. In grognardy intelligent systems like yours, you have to optimize for sheer viability. In more forgiving popamole systems, you optimize for ego stroking gameplay variety, for roleplaying, or for "fun".

Fixed for accuracy.

You have a lot of nerve to complain about lack of gameplay variety and roleplaying in AoD.

 

[Lurker King]

I wouldn't say it's weird but just that AoD is essentially its own thing, a game that tries something new in the genre. Obviously some will like it and others won't but I don't see it as a flagship title for grognards.

Grognardy is just a term do describe oldschool stuff. AoD represent some of the oldschool games in the complexity of combat system and the unforgiving learning curve, which is a good thing, but innovates with mature writing and lack of filler quests.

 

[Mozg]

One reason I like having to "optimize for viability" in an RPG like this is because it cuts down on that "I dunno what I even wanna do in this game" feeling. When a lot of options will seemingly end the game, suddenly the game has immediate goals - find the paths out of this trap, basically. A sign saying "YOU CAN'T GO HERE" is a good way to make me want to go there. I realize this is strange ludic alchemy, but it's true.