Fallout 1's and 2'd character creation screen is the best.

[PorkaMorka]

The the layout of the screen is nice, considering the time period and the resolution they had to work with.

But as for the underlying mechanics... well they were developed in two weeks (after they lost the GURPS license) and you can definitely tell.

 

[sea]

I love it too. Tons of information (relatively) but it's laid out very clearly and precise (and entertaining) explanations are given for everything there. Unfortunately Fallout is horrendously balanced early on so it doesn't help with actually learning the game much, but it sure is nice to use. That said, it's not really a success unique to Fallout. A lot of modern games have great UIs, but they're also undone by the lack of stats, attributes, etc. and console limitations requiring huge fonts, list menus, etc. for everything. Just think about what Fallout's UI would be like if it came out today for Xbox and PS3, and cringe. :D

 

[circ]

Fixed your img tag.
Not the best OP but it'll have to do.

What I really like about it is that it's actually the character sheet. The same you use to check your limb damage, spend leveling points, etc.

I really like having a ragdoll I can dress up though.

 

[Roguey]

C&C, bitch

It's a freaking wasteland, obviously you won't find energy weapons easily.

Is it so obvious? You can find energy weapons right at the start of Fallout 3 and New Vegas. There's nothing indicating "this skill is only used in the endgame if you're not metagaming" because you have no idea how powerful energy weapons are in comparison to the others because they don't actually exist (unlike the small guns/big guns comparison).

Half the fun of Fallout was discovering which build was effective and what skills could be used where.

Making uninformed choices is never fun.

 

[Bruma Hobo]

Yes, it was obvious to me at least, a plasma gun should be much rarer than a stick or a desert eagle, if you don't want that kind of problems you can always tag unarmed or melee.

 

[zeitgeist]

Making uninformed choices is never fun.

Yet with complete knowledge of the consequences, choice ceases to exist.

 

[Excidium]

All you need is small guns and speech anyway.

 

[SCO]

The most accessible interface i ever saw in a complex game was in Knights of the Chalice.

It even spanks ToEE one, and that's not easy at all.

 

[PorkaMorka]

Making uninformed choices is never fun.

Yet with complete knowledge of the consequences, choice ceases to exist.

With complete knowledge, maybe. But that is getting into the wildly theoretical.

Choosing between STR, CON and DEX in D&D is an informed choice. You know exactly what the mechanical effects will be, although you don't know what type of character the game will favor. You have a rational basis to choose what stat you need to build the type of character you want to play.

But in games without transparent mechanics, you're just guessing whether or not it is better for a fighter to have a high STR, CON or DEX. We can all think of many examples where the mechanics were counter intuitive and poorly explained in the documentation. You have an extremely slim basis upon which to make a choice in these games. It's hard to even call it a choice, the proper term is "guess".

 

[Renegen]

I agree with Xor somewhat, having tons of skills and not knowing what their limits are was part of the fun in Fallout. How many people got the Kama Sutra Perk in Fallout 2 for example? You had no idea what it did except enhance your sexual performance. Would the game be as fun if it said +2 endurance check during sex? (or whatever it does, I still don't know)

The idea of being an outdoorsman, or being a science guy, or a sex master was great from a role playing point of view, you didn't pick from Skill A and Skill B, you picked from skills and perks that all conjured something in your head. And that's how they worked in practice too, science could be used on computers or during conversations, it wasn't just a skill, but a resume of who you were. In a way, they were informed choices, because you knew the direction you'd want to take your character in, but you didn't know the full consequences. It's the mystery part in the roleplaying that's so interesting.

And really many games have some elements of this, it's probably why Fallout had some skills, perks or choice here and there that made sense in-character but weren't fully explained, it's just deeply engrained into PnP. For example you play as an half-orc or Elf in Arcanum, some people could hate you. But the game doesn't say at character creation -10 relations with humans, it's sort of hinted that there might be racial tensions and with the setting you're in. By playing, you discover your half-orc is hated and looked down upon and that shapes up the type of character you become.

 

[skyst]

Making uninformed choices is never fun.

God forbid everything not be 100% viable and equally powerful, start to finish.

Oh, and Renegen, I always take Kama Sutra Master and then go give it proper to Bishop's wife and daughter.

 

[Wyrmlord]

All you need is small guns and speech anyway.

All the skills are indispensably useful. Even Doctor, since it's the only way to cure eye damage.

 

[Roguey]

Making uninformed choices is never fun.

God forbid everything not be 100% viable and equally powerful, start to finish.

I never said this at all and I resent your implication that I did. What I said was pretty much "the text description for energy weapons and outdoorsman are needlessly vague compared to the descriptions of other skills." Then I get swarmed by "But I like guesswork!"

But yes every skill should be viable. Not balanced against each other (that would be dumb), but have frequent opportunities for use. I'm also not fond of skills that are only useful in specially scripted parts since that requires putting way too much faith in the designer-up-in-sky who will always inevitably let you down in some way.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Making uninformed choices is never fun.

Yet with complete knowledge of the consequences, choice ceases to exist.

Not true, choice "disappears" only if one of the options is clearly much superior, and then we'd have a game balance problem which wouldn't be fixed by making the descriptions less obscure, anyway.

I don't see how someone can like the idea of choosing near-useless skills because they didn't know what the skill does. That's not a choice or a challenge, it's just a coin toss.

I agree with Xor somewhat, having tons of skills and not knowing what their limits are was part of the fun in Fallout. How many people got the Kama Sutra Perk in Fallout 2 for example? You had no idea what it did except enhance your sexual performance. Would the game be as fun if it said +2 endurance check during sex? (or whatever it does, I still don't know)

It would be nice to know something. You have to assume it does...good stuff when you have sex. Why would I pick this over Toughness or Awareness, which give clear benefits? LARPing?

I did pick it up the first time I played because I wasn't hurting for power at the time so why the hell not, and I always assumed it just let me pass the check to convince Bishop's slutdaughter and slutwife to open up, and maybe do better at the porn shoots.

By the way, this is what it does.

-You can have sex and unlock all dialogue option with any sex-specific characters regardless of your stats
-Add +2 points in the porn audition at the Golden Globes

 

[Roguey]

"You can have sex and unlock all dialogue option with any sex-specific characters regardless of your stats" is bugged by the way, I tried it with a low-charisma girl and still didn't get the option for certain characters until I raised it. It does improve your performance rating though but you can get that same boost from having sex ten times so it's pretty much a complete waste of a perk.

 

[Awor Szurkrarz]

Making uninformed choices is never fun.

God forbid everything not be 100% viable and equally powerful, start to finish.

I never said this at all and I resent your implication that I did. What I said was pretty much "the text description for energy weapons and outdoorsman are needlessly vague compared to the descriptions of other skills." Then I get swarmed by "But I like guesswork!"

I think that there could be a simple information that these weapons aren't available in the Vault's armoury.

But yes every skill should be viable. Not balanced against each other (that would be dumb), but have frequent opportunities for use. I'm also not fond of skills that are only useful in specially scripted parts since that requires putting way too much faith in the designer-up-in-sky who will always inevitably let you down in some way.

They especially fucked up with outdoorsman, which should be a seriously powerful skill. Just think about it. Just getting from town to town takes up about a week. It should provide a plenty opportunities to use that skill - like hunting, scavenging, searching for water, etc.

 

[Jasede]

Well, out of all the games I have played it does have the nicest statistics/level up/char gen screen. Though I personally like the RoA one a lot too, but it can't be denied it's not as user-friendly.

Fallout had it all: informative, humorous, easy to easy, detailed, comprehensive. Even Arcanum, a game I like better, doesn't have it quite as well due to the need to use tabs to cycle spells and skills and schematics.

 

[Gord]

They especially fucked up with outdoorsman, which should be a seriously powerful skill. Just think about it. Just getting from town to town takes up about a week. It should provide a plenty opportunities to use that skill - like hunting, scavenging, searching for water, etc.

Yeah, the survival aspect was cut short a bit. I'm not talking about tedious stuff like having to eat/drink/take a dump in regular intervals, but it would have been nice, if, e.g. you need some food and water rations to travel for extended periods in the wastes, but with enough points in outdoorsman you would be able to find that stuff on the go, freeing up inventory space or just conserving caps (assuming both things would matter enough).

 

[Awor Szurkrarz]

I suspect that food would be quite expensive in the post-apo world.

 

[Master]

C&C, bitch

It's a freaking wasteland, obviously you won't find energy weapons easily.

Is it so obvious? You can find energy weapons right at the start of Fallout 3 and New Vegas. There's nothing indicating "this skill is only used in the endgame if you're not metagaming" because you have no idea how powerful energy weapons are in comparison to the others because they don't actually exist (unlike the small guns/big guns comparison).

Half the fun of Fallout was discovering which build was effective and what skills could be used where.

Making uninformed choices is never fun.

Its just a case of a build being different. And its not like you have no clue whatsoever were to get what. An NPC in one of the starting towns (probably Hub) tells you about BoS and how they have energy guns there. Im pretty sure someone also mentions Gunrunneres too. So why not just go there? You can take a caravan. You can even get there by accident as the map isnt that big. Really its not a problem. Having everything available to everyone at the start (like in F3 and NV) just makes everything samey.
Besides if you want a story justification, Vault 13 doesnt have extensive knowledge of the outside world. So how are they supposed to know? Also dont you in the new patched version get a blaster at the start if you tagged energy weapons? Then the problem is just getting the ammo.

 

[Xor]

How the fuck do you even find a 5 year old thread to reply to without intentionally looking for one?

 

[Master]

I was looking for some "character creation" threads.

 

[Cael]

How the fuck do you even find a 5 year old thread to reply to without intentionally looking for one?

Nothing gets lost in the Internet. Nothing. Your words are in black and white for eternity, waiting for someone to brag them out of the sewers of Hell *spooky music plays*

I said spooky music, not X-Files theme! Someone shoot the music director!

 

[PorkBarrellGuy]

Necropost, necropost
the kind of post that we love the most
Bumps old threads to the front page
Sends the posters into a rage
LOOK OUT! Here comes a necropost

 

[The Brazilian Slaughter]

Any RPG that can't contain your character sheet in a single screen has a shitty interface.