Saint_Proverbius
Servant Mind
Joined: 16 Jun 2002
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 Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2003 1:30 pm Post subject: GameSpot's Games That Should Be Remade |
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GameSpot, probably being nostalgic and/or bored, has posted up their Games That Should Be Remade article, which includes things like Bard's Tale, Ultima V, and Syndicate. Yeah, I know, Syndicate isn't a CRPG, but I loved that game. Anyway, here's a bit on Bard's Tale:
How is that a good thing, you ask? One thing The Bard's Tale did quite well was emphasize the huge difference between low-level and high-level characters. At the beginning of the game, you'd be terrified when "the sound of battle brings your party to a screeching halt" in the face of a dozen hobbits. Toward the end of the game, you'd have a ridiculously powerful party full of archmages accompanied by a summoned fire-breathing demon lord with an armor class of "LO" who would make short work of wave after wave of 99 berserkers, 99 berserkers, 99 berserkers, and 99 berserkers. In these days of carefully designed, meticulously balanced games, a remake of The Bard's Tale might very well seem like a breath of fresh air, and with today's powerful graphics and sound technology, the now-primitive-looking presentation of the original game could be redone with truly impressive production values to complement the insane hack-and-slash carnage that made the original such a hoot.
Well, we all know that Brian Fargo's new company, inXile has aquired the rights to Bard's Tale, so maybe...
Spotted this at HomeLAN Fed. |
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Deathy
Lurker King
Joined: 15 Jun 2002
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2003 1:57 pm Post subject: |
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Funny that you mention Syndicate though, since, by todays standards of what constitutes a CRPG to the marketing folks (Deus Ex, Diablo), Syndicate is really up there.
I still want my GBA port of Syndicate, and I will continue mentioning this whenever the GBA or Syndicate is brought up as a topic. |
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Azael
Joined: 06 Dec 2002
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Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2003 2:17 pm Post subject: |
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For once I'm pretty impressed with GameSpot's list: Bard's Tale, X-Com, Syndicate, Ultima V, Another World, all good titles.
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EEVIAC
Joined: 30 Mar 2003
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2003 2:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Saint_Proverbius wrote: | | Yeah, I know, Syndicate isn't a CRPG, but I loved that game. |
Syndicate cast you as a kind of coporate fascist dictator, that alone made it unique - you weren't charged with saving the world but ruling it. Its probably the only game I've ever heard tell of you admiting to liking a game with RT ranged combat Saint  (it was RT wasn't it?).
| Azael wrote: | | For once I'm pretty impressed with GameSpot's list: Bard's Tale, X-Com, Syndicate, Ultima V, Another World, all good titles. |
I'm not certain how Another World would work in a modern game. I remember showing off the opening sequence (the car, the particle accelerator) to anyone I could. It was more of a graphical showcase than a fine game.
Bards Tale III was the first RPG I ever played, on the C64. I never did finish it but I can still recall going through the manual with my brother talking about which spells we wanted. The dungeons had weird warp squares which always confused me. I'd still prefer a full blown Wasteland remake (or the other post-appocalyptic game with cars) though.
Even though I've mentioned it at least a dozen times already, I still think a Covert Action remake would be awesome. For those that don't know about the game, here's a brief precis :
You recieve some piece of intelligence about a terrorist organization. If its encoded (simple substitution cypher) you can decode it and find out information about where a local cell is located or who a key figure is (sometimes this information is given to you flat out - Stassi agent Bruubaker is active in Washington, etc.) You can phone tap the headquarters of the individual or group, tail suspects to find new headquarters, and raid said buildings in a top-down shooter, then rifle through their filing cabinets and desks looking for unshreded memos.
There was a time limit of sorts and if you were good/lucky enough, you could catch ringleaders and not just active members (it was dynamic too, if you put too much heat on an organization, key people would go into hiding, and the cell would cease to function.) You gained rank as well but that was merely cosmetic.
With the option of playing for a government organization or a terrorist cell, or even as a double agent, the gameplay could be massive. Considering Firaxis is doing a Pirates! sequel and have stated they have the rights to Sid's other Microprose games, we can only hope. Or perhaps I can only hope.
Another game I'd like to see remade is Space 1889. Lots of different skills (including "fisticuffs") and lots of exploration and historical characters. Similar to Worlds Of Ultima - Martian Dreams if that helps explain the gameworld any better. |
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Zetor
Joined: 09 Jan 2003
Posts: 312
Location: Budapest, Hungary
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2003 3:43 pm Post subject: |
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Yep, that's a pretty good list... though I'd say X-Com brought about quite a few knockoffs / clones over the years. (Breach series, Incubation, Jagged Alliance series, etc etc etc) Sure, most of those games were pure tactical combat games (exception: JA), but that was X-Com's and Laser Squad's #1 strength IMNSHHO. About Another World, EEVIAC said it better than I... I'll just say that interactive movies make me want to stab people in the face. 
BTW, Freedom Force plays a -lot- like Syndicate (and it was originally going to have a similar semi-nonlinear mission structure as well), though it has a *thunderclap* pausable realtime system. OTOH, it does have fully deformable / destroyable levels...
-- Z.
FF fanboi #587931
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Spazmo
Fights like a dairy farmer
Joined: 09 Nov 2002
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Location: Monkey Island
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2003 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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Mmm... Freedom Force. I'd say that game has easily some of the best villains ever. Too bad about the linear mission structure, though.
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POOPERSCOOPER
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Joined: 06 Mar 2003
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Location: California
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2003 7:03 pm Post subject: hey |
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I hear about how good syndicate is by alot of people, but getting that game to run on an NT based system is near impossible.
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EEVIAC
Joined: 30 Mar 2003
Posts: 1212
Location: Bumfuck, Nowhere
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2003 2:21 am Post subject: |
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| Spazmo wrote: | | Mmm... Freedom Force. I'd say that game has easily some of the best villains ever. Too bad about the linear mission structure, though. |
That would definately be high on my wish list in a sequel, freedom of choice in where to send tiger teams. My biggest problem with Freedom Force was that my custom character had little impact in the game, and none whatsoever in story.
This is slightly off topic but it occured to me that Irrational is sitting on three very much loved licenses - Tribes (which they are definately making,) System Shock and Freedom Force. I might have this wrong but at E3 they were showing a game privately. The brouhaha with Crave over FF rights made me think FF2 immeadiately. I'm wondering which game Rx'rs would rather see made. |
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huh
Joined: 09 Dec 2002
Posts: 86
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2003 2:40 am Post subject: |
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| didn't see Crusader games from the old EA mentioned. even though it was pure action, it could spank the heck out of Diablo with its amazing gameplay. so, someone remake that. X-Com? definitely. Ultimas? certainly. syndacate? agreed. all those Microprose games. Monkey island. blah, too many to mention. how come every game that came out back then was an original gem. now it's just a bunch of turds and you have to sift through it. kinda ironic, how nowdays they have to go back in time for inspiration. dam I rant too much. oh, yeah and another System Shock would do nicely too. |
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triCritical
Joined: 08 Jan 2003
Posts: 1329
Location: Colorado Springs
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2003 2:52 am Post subject: |
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| Spazmo wrote: | | Mmm... Freedom Force. I'd say that game has easily some of the best villains ever. Too bad about the linear mission structure, though. |
That is what kept me from playing it. I just can stand any mission based tactical or strategy game. I think HoMM and Tactics were the latest exceptions. I think JA2 is the strategy to follow. |
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Psilon
Joined: 15 Feb 2003
Posts: 2023
Location: Codex retirement
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2003 3:31 am Post subject: |
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| huh wrote: | | didn't see Crusader games from the old EA mentioned. even though it was pure action, it could spank the heck out of Diablo with its amazing gameplay. so, someone remake that. |
It doesn't even have to be a full remake. 640x480 can still look pretty good, and the cutscenes were gloriously cheesy. Anyone remember Weasel? Just port the damn thing over to SDL or DirectX so I can play it again.
It's too bad Origin ditched all its franchises. I would have liked to see Wing Commander: The One After Secret Ops or Crusader: No Mercy. |
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Zetor
Joined: 09 Jan 2003
Posts: 312
Location: Budapest, Hungary
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2003 6:03 am Post subject: |
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@EEVIAC:
Can you guess? FF2, obviously. However, after losing their publisher [who might or might not own part of the IP], this'll likely be delayed until 2005. The Lost doesn't look bad either, but Crave was going to publish that too and losing your publisher mid-development is a Very Bad Thing.
@all the naysayers:
Pfff, just try the demo. C'mon, it's fun! 
Of course you shouldn't expect something like JA or XCOM. It does play very similar to Syndicate though... and a lot of the mods (insert 'mods == bad' comment here) focus on a custom character.
-- Z.
"hey, we ARE allowed 2 posts / year of unbridled fanboyism, right? Right...?"
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Astromarine
Angry Cunt
Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 2210
Location: Switzerland
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2003 9:18 am Post subject: |
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Yeah, I found myself agreeing with a surprising lot of their choices. The most important part of the article was, though, the mention of Laser Squad Nemesis. Go Get That Pronto, 2.1 is almost out.
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Visionary
Joined: 11 Jun 2003
Posts: 55
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2003 12:50 pm Post subject: |
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I don't think remaking Bard's Tale would be a good idea. It was a primitive dungeon hack. At the time I enjoyed it, but more sophistication is required these days. Giving it better graphics wouldn't change the gameplay of plodding through 22*22 maps killing everything that moves and stuffing everything that doesn't in your backpack.
Some games from the time could be remade in a way that completely re-invented their gameplay but re-used the original backdrop and story. I'm not sure Bard's Tale would be one of those, because it's story was quite simplistic.
They should definitely remake some of the Mike Singleton strategy games. Give them more sophisticated AI and update the graphics. The gameplay (recruit armies from factions and marshal them for a big final battle) could more or less stay the same. |
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Ibbz
GateKeeper
Joined: 20 Jun 2002
Posts: 318
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2003 2:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Even though I've mentioned it at least a dozen times already, I still think a Covert Action remake would be awesome. For those that don't know about the game, here's a brief precis :
You recieve some piece of intelligence about a terrorist organization. If its encoded (simple substitution cypher) you can decode it and find out information about where a local cell is located or who a key figure is (sometimes this information is given to you flat out - Stassi agent Bruubaker is active in Washington, etc.) You can phone tap the headquarters of the individual or group, tail suspects to find new headquarters, and raid said buildings in a top-down shooter, then rifle through their filing cabinets and desks looking for unshreded memos.
There was a time limit of sorts and if you were good/lucky enough, you could catch ringleaders and not just active members (it was dynamic too, if you put too much heat on an organization, key people would go into hiding, and the cell would cease to function.) You gained rank as well but that was merely cosmetic.
With the option of playing for a government organization or a terrorist cell, or even as a double agent, the gameplay could be massive. Considering Firaxis is doing a Pirates! sequel and have stated they have the rights to Sid's other Microprose games, we can only hope. Or perhaps I can only hope. |
Perhaps i was too young to realise half of this stuff when i played Covert Action but i can never recall being able to tap phones or being able to work for a terrorist cell. I always thought the decoding was kinda boring meself, i always went for the sharp shooter/driver skills 
Another thing i seem to recall - Masterminds would often carrier over from previous missions.
I never did get to the 000 status{ Which i presume is where the game ended}, i think i finished playing somewhere around 007 or 006.
| Quote: | | Syndicate cast you as a kind of coporate fascist dictator, that alone made it unique - you weren't charged with saving the world but ruling it. Its probably the only game I've ever heard tell of you admiting to liking a game with RT ranged combat Saint (it was RT wasn't it?). |
Syndicate was real time. Although this did create some very irratating moments such as the very last mission where lots of agents would rush your guys right at the start before you could get ready. {I had to pause the game and move my cursor to the squad selector so i could fill em all up with drugs right at the start just so i could have a chance }
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Zetor
Joined: 09 Jan 2003
Posts: 312
Location: Budapest, Hungary
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2003 2:50 pm Post subject: |
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@Visionary:
Bard's Tale IS being remade, for better or worse... Devil Whiskey (hmmm, wonder what inXile will have to say about this )
@Ibbz:
Yeah, the last mission was a pain...
what I did was load up everyone with 2-3 lasers each and a force field along with a few miniguns and 2 gauss guns, then upon arrival, I immediately hit both mouse buttons [maxing out all 3 drug meters on all agents and automatically selecting the laser]. After it the combat was basically trying to guess when the enemy was about to fire a laser and activate the force field two seconds before that. And after the first group was down, the rest of the mission was pretty much a cakewalk. Chest v3 and Brain v3 for all 4 agents were also mandatory augs for this mission, unless you had a reaction time of less than 1 nanosecond.
I wonder how Syndicate would've turned out, had it used a limited [ala Space Hulk] paused realtime system...
Btw, wasn't the expansion pack (American Revolt) composed of Atlantic Accelerator-esque missions almost exclusively? [never got it myself...]
-- Z.
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EEVIAC
Joined: 30 Mar 2003
Posts: 1212
Location: Bumfuck, Nowhere
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2003 4:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Ibbz wrote: | | Perhaps i was too young to realise half of this stuff when i played Covert Action but i can never recall being able to tap phones or being able to work for a terrorist cell. I always thought the decoding was kinda boring meself, i always went for the sharp shooter/driver skills |
Phone tapping was a mini-game - you had to connect links in such a way that you completed the circuit, but that the circuit didn't link to an alarm. It was timed too which made things pretty frantic. (Sorry if this doesn't make sense, I find it a little difficult to explain.)
About working for the terrorist cells, that wasn't in the game, but on my wishlist for a possible sequel.
| Quote: | | Another thing i seem to recall - Masterminds would often carrier over from previous missions. |
Indeed, that was pretty much the only way to catch them, it gave the game continuity even though the missions were random.
| Quote: | | I never did get to the 000 status{ Which i presume is where the game ended}, i think i finished playing somewhere around 007 or 006. |
I doubt I did either. Just because I like a game doesn't necessarilly mean I'm actually good at it.  |
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Rayt
Joined: 24 Nov 2002
Posts: 192
Location: Swingin' Groningen
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| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2003 10:59 am Post subject: |
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[quote="Ibbz"] | Quote: |
Syndicate was real time. Although this did create some very irratating moments such as the very last mission where lots of agents would rush your guys right at the start before you could get ready. {I had to pause the game and move my cursor to the squad selector so i could fill em all up with drugs right at the start just so i could have a chance } |
It wasn't that hard if you equipped your men with that belt that made them invinceble for about 20 seconds. It would give you enough time to run to a better spot (behind a building) so you got al the enemies coming from one side.
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Constipated Craprunner
Joined: 22 Oct 2002
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Location: Chicago. And damn anyone who is not the same.
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| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2003 4:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Spazmo wrote: | | Mmm... Freedom Force. I'd say that game has easily some of the best villains ever. Too bad about the linear mission structure, though. |
No way. It did not even have a background on the villians,as all good comic book influenced stories do. Just look at Fallout!
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Spazmo
Fights like a dairy farmer
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Location: Monkey Island
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| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2003 4:25 pm Post subject: |
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You cannot honestly tell me you didn't love Nuclear Winter. Be you a red or not, Nuclear Winter is simply one of the best villains I've ever had the pleasure of foiling. Some of the others needed a little development, but many of FF's villains had adequate backgrounds.
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Constipated Craprunner
Joined: 22 Oct 2002
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Location: Chicago. And damn anyone who is not the same.
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| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2003 7:13 pm Post subject: |
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Besides Nuclear Winter, I just was not satisfied with the background of the villians. I found none of the used-to-be-goodness of Batman or XMen.
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JC Anejo
Joined: 12 Mar 2003
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| Posted: Fri Jun 20, 2003 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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Where is Autoduel on this list. Has to be the game from way back there that I played over the most. Loved the ability to do whatever you wanted in a unique setting. Have I missed something has there ever been another game like it ?
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Saint_Proverbius
Servant Mind
Joined: 16 Jun 2002
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Location: Behind you.
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| Posted: Sat Jun 21, 2003 1:31 am Post subject: |
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Autoduel would definitely be a good pick for a game that should be remade, probably not one people would think of either. RoadWar 2000 would be a great one as well.
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