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Obsidian working on an RTS?

Bluebottle

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Jaesun said:
Bluebottle said:
Seems so, according to a job advert at the Creative Heads website.

Platforms: PS3, XBOX 360, PC
Project: Upcoming undisclosed title - RTS
Software Utilized: 3D Studio Max, Alias, Photoshop, Softimage, Visio
Relocation: Yes
Start Date: Immediately
Required Spoken Language(s): English
Required Work Auth.: United States

Typo?

Link?
http://www.creativeheads.net/JobDetails.aspx?JobID=6508
 

Vault Dweller

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Dark Individual said:
Jasede said:
Why not? Explain, cite examples, you know the drill.

Because its archaic SF. Monsters have been around in every culture, too. The relevance and possible immersion is lost because we don't exactly live in chaotic environments filled with ravenous animals. That may be the reason why I haven't seen any famous SF author writing this primitive trash since maybe the 40s. Hostile *intelligent* aliens are still compatible with our lives and fears; that's why everyone is writing about that. Mega corporations ruling the world? Wow, that's sure original, Timmy! The point is that Obsidian are yet again playing greedy bastards. There are a lot better SF settings but they don't care anyway, since they're only after name recognition.
First, I don't think Obsidian is doing it because they are greedy. It's not easy (impossible?) to survive making original, innovative RPGs, so you can't blame Obsidian for not taking risks. You can blame them for a lot of other things, but not for working with the licenses.

As for the Aliens setting...
http://www.irontowerstudio.com/forum/in ... opic=330.0

Chris Avellone said:
So, let's take Aliens as an example. What's cool about Aliens?

Well, it's scary. But why?

The Aliens typically attack people in situations where there's little or nowhere to run, and there's no way to get help quickly. Isolation to spur terror is a big part of the genre… no one is coming to save you.

The Aliens are a primal, predatory force. The more you know about them, the less scary they are (knowledge and details about your opponents makes them less threatening in general), so when introducing them, it's best to keep them as a nebulous, predatory force that serves as an adversary to the player.

Next, the threats in Aliens are actually two-fold. One is the aliens themselves, which are shadowy, nebulous threats lurking in the dark. The other threat is the human factor – routinely in the movies, it's the human psychological element that causes the secondary, and usually greater, threat. One could argue "the company" is basically another, equal shadowy nebulous predatory representation of the aliens. As an example, Burke's greed in Aliens is a huge threat. Hudson's panic is another. Gorman's arrogant by-the-book incompetence is another, his unwillingness to admit he's in over his head nor that he is unfit to command. Apone follows stupid orders. Vasquez is recklessly berserk, and her keeping her storm gun in Aliens and opening fire during the first encounter in the Hadley's Hope nest actually sets the timer limit on the detonation in the colony. Dallas in Alien is clearly apathetic about following the company's directives, and his apathy puts the crew in danger. Parker in Alien wants his share, etc, etc. All of these human elements serve to create equal, if not more, significant problems for the player. So having the human factor as a gameplay elements is equally important, and it should be tied into NPC and PC psychology.

Now, let's take Ripley. Ripley is the hero, and her strength is her perspective on the situation (usually the smartest perspective – "nuke them from orbit"), and her ability to take the psychological handicaps of her crew and immediate party members and either course-correct or overcome them (Hudson's fear, Newt's catatonia, Hick's unwillingness to step up and take command, Burke's sliminess, Ash's company loyalty, etc.). So this also seems to be an important part of the franchise.
 

Vaarna_Aarne

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Well, at least Obsidian moves Del Toro way... Mainstream stuff followed with the occasional hardcore artsy stuff. Keeps them in business.

And Avellone hits the nail right on top of the head in there. Maybe they'll make the mother of all Influence systems in the Aliens RPG. I'd like that.
 

Letum Fol

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I don't know if Aliens has an Expanded Universe ala Star Wars but I've seen all the movies (including the AVPs which almost made me cry). I just don't see scope for an RPG, or at least a good RPG in that universe. What are the play mechanics? How the fuck do you talk to anyone? I just don't get where Obsidian's going.
 

Texas Red

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"First, I don't think Obsidian is doing it because they are greedy. It's not easy (impossible?) to survive making original, innovative RPGs, so you can't blame Obsidian for not taking risks. You can blame them for a lot of other things, but not for working with the licenses."

I don't think so. Even small business European developers are capable of developing their own license and very original games. Are you saying that Obsidian, with 3 successful games behind their back, couldn't find a willing publisher? Publishers would be piling up to contract such a big company. Obsidian isn't some small low life company anymore, they have like what, 3 projects and over a hundred employees? I don't really give a shit if they want to survive or not. True artists rather suffered being sent to prison camps than paint socialist pictures. Why would they want to "survive" in the first place only to make shitty games based on shitty licenses for console tards and their tarded twitch combat?
 

Jasede

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You are aware that in the game industry, one big flop can spell the end to a big company, yes? Even a rich company like Bioware is pretty much only one game away from becoming bankrupt.
 

Volourn

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"Are you saying that Obsidian, with 3 successful games behind their back, couldn't find a willing publisher?"

They couldn't/can't even get one of the publishers who published one of those games to let them make the sequel to it. Hell, LA likely begged BIO to make KOTOR3 MMO. L0L Don't think KOTOR2 was as successful as LA had hoped.


"Even a rich company like Bioware is pretty much only one game away from becoming bankrupt."

Unlike Obsidian, BIO isn't a company. It's a division. It can only go bankrupt if EA does.
 

Volourn

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"fyi KotOR2 sold nearly as much as Oblivion"

Then why is LA seemingly against Obsidian making KOTOR3 depsite the fact that Obsidian big wigs have done everything including practically beg for it? LA is about money, and if KOTOR3 was a huge money maker they wouldn't hesitate to use Obsidian again. Instead, they somehow managed to cinvince BIO to work with them again preusmably on KOTOR3/MMO despite BIO's resevrations. HINT: They threw tons of cash at BIO.

btw, That's not syaing KOTOR2 was a failure money wise (I;'m sure it made money and sold a bunch); but obviously not enough to make LA happy.

And, define 'nearly as much'. That phrase can be rather vague.
 

Texas Red

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Volourn said:
"fyi KotOR2 sold nearly as much as Oblivion"

Then why is LA seemingly against Obsidian making KOTOR3

Why was Interplay against making FO 3 or BG 3? Because they thought going to a completely different, yet larger, market would prove more profitable.
 

Volourn

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General consenus by who? Besdies, a MMO doens't stop a part 3. And, we still don't know exactly what LA-BIo is doing 100%.

Afterall, LA has its shar eof none MMOs in the works so your logic is dumb.
 

Vault Dweller

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Letum Fol said:
I don't know if Aliens has an Expanded Universe ala Star Wars but I've seen all the movies (including the AVPs which almost made me cry). I just don't see scope for an RPG, or at least a good RPG in that universe. What are the play mechanics? How the fuck do you talk to anyone? I just don't get where Obsidian's going.
How the fuck do you talk to whom? Other humans? Even a simple Aliens (the second movie) RPG where your goal is to get the fuck out and your chances of survival depends on teamwork (i.e. you alone don't stand a chance, you must work with other people in order to have even a small chance to make it out alive; its worth risking your life for someone because without that someone you are definitely dead, etc) could be much more interesting than most games.
 

Volourn

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In his household. He bought 2 copies of KOTOR2, and 1 of Oblivion. L0L
 

Darth Roxor

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Volourn said:
Afterall, LA has its shar eof none MMOs in the works so your logic is dumb.

They still have a share of none MMOs in the works, because running too many MMOs by one company is rather counterproductive.
 

Volourn

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So, why would they be opposed to a KOTOR3? Answer: they aren't. They're opposed to an Obsidian developed KOTOR3. Why? Despite whatever amount of copies KOTOR2 sold, it wans't enough for LA. Like it or not (and, I liked KOTOR2 fine myself); the facts speak for themselves.

And, remember, all the this while, Obsidian has pretty much begged to be allowed to make KOTOR2. Yet, nothing.

Maybe it'll change, and LA will give in. Who knows. *shrug*
 

Bluebottle

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Volourn said:
And, remember, all the this while, Obsidian has pretty much begged to be allowed to make KOTOR2. Yet, nothing.

What makes you say that, out of interest? It wouldn't be usual for a company to mention their (allegedly desperate) intention to use a licence if they were still in the process of aquiring it, and it would br even less likely that they'd announce their failure to do so if they couldn't.
Was this mentioned in an interview?
 

Volourn

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Both Mr U, and Mr. PST Writer have talked at length how much they'd love to do KOTOR3.

When i say begging, it's obvious an extreme exaggeration used for an effect. Not actual begging. Obviously, with the 3 games they're working on now; it's not like Obsidian are desperate for work.
 

Anthony Davis

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You guys are kind of all over the place with this thread.

I confirmed with our HR Manager, Jim Rivers, that the 'RTS' is indeed a typo. It should have read 'RPG'.

Also, I never said KOTOR2 sold as much as Oblivion. I said that it has sold between 1.5 and 2 million copies.

I have no idea what Oblivion sold, but I bet it was a lot.

As far as an Aliens RPG is concerned, there are a lot more RPG elements in that movie than you would think.

There are really only 3 action scenes in the whole movie:

The First Encounter.
The Aliens invade Medical.
The Queen Fight.

Everything else was dialog, character interaction, character development, and environment interaction. Vasquez and Drake, Vasques VERSUS Gordon, Ripley and Hicks, Ripley and Newt, Apone and the Squad, Ripley and Bishop, and much more. Hell, you could even argue that there was BASE development when the marines took over Medical and fortified the area.

If you count the novels and the rest of the 'canon' source material, there is a gold mine of information to work with, and J.E. Sawyer has really done his homework.

I know people are skeptical of movie licensing in games, but this isn't the Aliens Movie Game. It is an RPG set in the Aliens Universe that happens to chronologically take place after Aliens and before Aliens 3.
 

themadhatter114

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Volourn said:
Except I never said it sucked, I said it 'fell flat'. HUGE difference; but nice try in your lame attempt to put words in my mouth.

Experience by quests as opposed by experience by killing should, by design, limit the amounts of enemies needed. It's also suppsoed to cut down combat as a chore that must be completed yet it doesn't do that - but instead of feeling the need to kill everything; players feel the nedd just to run past enemkies because they MEAN NOTHING. Just polygons to be avoided. *yawn*

Why should hostiles mean anything? It's nice to be able to turn on Obfuscate and just avoid people that I had no motive to kill.

That's why REAL role-players prefer experience by combat, quest completion, AND skill use.

That is the BEST SYSTEM EVER. All other systems are basically 'okay'.


R00fles!

So, like, perhaps you could get equal XP for using your hide/move silently skills to avoid 3 enemies as you could get by killing them? Or giving equal XP for bluffing them or convincing them to leave? Er, wait, that would be the same fucking thing as giving XP for completing the quest.

Giving out XP for killing things encourages grinding, and grinding is FUCKING LAME.

Not giving out XP for killing things encourages people to handle things however they like, but balancing the AI so that avoiding enemies isn't a viable strategy unless you've invested in non-combat abilities. Actually running away from people should be a viable strategy if you have speed enhancements, but otherwise not. But if you make the combat actually fun, then people won't feel the need to avoid it all the time.

XP for kills works reasonably well in Fallout, because you don't really need all that XP unless you are killing everything.

XP for combat in Bloodlines would have been terrible. I played through with a Malkavian. I used stealth and obfuscate to avoid almost all of the combat in the game, except for that which was seemingly unavoidable. However, I did have decent ranged combat ability so I was able to shoot people when I needed to. It was bad enough that there were unavoidable big bosses at the end of the game which you needed good combat skills to beat, but if the game had actually given out MORE XP to combat-oriented characters, the disparity at the end would have been even greater.

Ultimately, XP for kills sucks almost universally. It sucks in every D&D game, it sucks in Mass Effect, and it sucks in just about every other game. If a game is focused on combat that much, I'd rather play a well-balanced FPS where you gradually come across better weapons and more tactical options, while the game gives a reasonable progression for why those better weapons and tactics are more necessary than before. It certainly makes more sense than artificial leveling mechanics in RPGs.

I'd rather have a system where your options are entirely dependent upon your starting attributes, your reputation, your equipment, your wealth, and training to some extent. Regardless, no amount of XP should ever alter the amount of damage you do with a fucking gun. If you want to do more damage you should have to alter your gun or buy higher quality bullets.
 

Murk

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I guess i'm like the only person who actually thinks would be rad?

sounds like a 'rad in space survival game.
 

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