Review Bloodlines mixed cocktail at Eurogamer

[Saint_Proverbius]

Tags: Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines

Probably the best one on the 'net so far, <A href="http://www.eurogamer.net/">Eurogamer</a> has done up <A href="http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=57265">their review</a> of <A href="http://www.vampire-bloodlines.com">Vampire: the Masquerade - Bloodlines</a>, where the game earns a <b>7/10</b> rating. It basically says the first part of the game is great, but the last part degrades down in to a combat fest. Here's a clip:
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<blockquote>Its decline is a slow one - things are going awry by the point of the Hollywood sewers - and you find yourself playing on, desperation growing as you hope it rallies. Sadly, by the final sections of the game, you find yourself fighting respawning katana-wielding mobs, boss-fights with enormous energy bars and simple Tomb Raider-style puzzles. If you spent the majority of your experience on making a talking character, for example, you'd be disappointed to find the last six or so hours lacking a chance to slut your way to victory. No significant multi-routing remains either.</blockquote>
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Yup, those sewers definitely suck.
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Thanks, <b>keeks</b>!

 

[Jinxed]

Yes, they are pretty bad, but at least the end is not a tight corridor filled with traps.

 

[Spazmo]

"you find yourself fighting respawning katana-wielding mobs"

This is very true and very crap.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Yep, respawning does suck. Considering that there is no XP or loot reward (because in the best traditions of FPS you can't get more than one weapon of any kind), it's a very stupid design decision. Although the game is fun, it's much more of an FPS than it should have been.

 

[Volourn]

Um... That's poor criticism. It was *always* a FPS/RPG. It should be 50/50.

 

[Vault Dweller]

It was indeed, no arguing about it, but there are some elements that shouldn't have been there, like respawning, unsearchable bodies, unpickable items, doors that are unlocked only after the nearby monster is dead, etc. To me, the FPS part was the first person view and real time combat. So, I was surprised to find so many other FPS elements there.

 

[Spazmo]

Endlessly respawning enemies isn't an FPS thing, it's just a bad thing, regardless of what genre the game is. And mein gott, the endgame is pretty lame. Just one large combat location after another until you're goddamn fed up and turn on god mode to get through it. I just finished the game and while I really dug the early bits, EuroGamer is totally right--the game really suffers towards the end.

And a warning: don't take the Camarilla ending. It's really boring. There's no satisfying conclusion to anything. I'm hoping the other endings are better, but I'd have to trudge through the painful combat areas again to check...

 

[Flink]

He isn't kidding about that boss either. My Brujah has been plowing through everything right up to it. But the thing can really take a beating. I've gotten it down to about 70% health then I run out of blood packs. Next time I'll spend every last dollar I have on them. I had no idea I'd meet something that tough...

EDIT: Alright. I just finished the game and I have to say that I'm VERY disapointed. What the hell?! Did the Troika folks leave and let the interns and a trio of lame, retarded monkies do the ending?! As a pure melee character I HAD to cheat to win the game. Sucktastic...

 

[dojoteef]

Well all of this is disconcerting. I always wish that games are balanced. In fact it would be nice that if they want to put lots of mindless combat they could do a check on your character sheet and scale the enemies based on how heavily you are a fighter type character. Imagine you played through the WHOLE game and only put into non combat related feats. I guess you'd be screwed, eh?

I haven't finished the game yet, despite being on my third character so far. It's my weird gameplay style. Whenever there a multiple choices to make in a game, I tend to play the game in parallel with different characters. I do have to say there is a lot of content in the game, at least as far up to reaching Hollwood for the first time. A lot of things have turned out different with the different characters I've played so far, Nosferatu, Malkavian, Ventrue, but most of it is just cosmetic so far. When you play it with three different characters as I did, you see just how much you are forced to stick with the main storyline. Not that it's a bad thing so far, it just sounds like it might turn into shitty one pretty soon with lots of forced combat.

EDIT: Small Spoiler, highlight to read I'm especially disappointed at the fact there when you meet the first "Asian dude" in Santa Monica you have to fight him. Why couldn't I side with the guy? Maybe they could have just put it in and said I was working for them secretly, or something. At least it would give the illusion that I had more choice.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

It was indeed, no arguing about it, but there are some elements that shouldn't have been there, like respawning, unsearchable bodies, unpickable items, doors that are unlocked only after the nearby monster is dead, etc. To me, the FPS part was the first person view and real time combat. So, I was surprised to find so many other FPS elements there.

I agree. I was pretty stunned that you can only pick up one weapon of any given type in the game. It's pretty irritating, considering the first part of the game had me scrounging around for cash when there are locations I've plowed through that have a surplus of .38 pistols, baseball bats, and other things just laying around because I'm only allowed to have one at a time.

The doors that remain locked until you kill a certain monster thing is pretty lame as well. There are some missions that could be completed with just thiefy skills if it weren't for forcing a player to kill a critter just so a door unlocks. While this isn't an FPS thing, and there are CRPGs that do this, it's definitely lame ass design. It forces the player in to a combat role that isn't entirely required for the situations where this occurs.

 

[Mendoza]

If you spent the majority of your experience on making a talking character, for example, you'd be disappointed to find the last six or so hours lacking a chance to slut your way to victory. No significant multi-routing remains either

It's not even like hacking or lockpicking can help you either in that period. I don't know if you could avoid most of the grunts with a high enough sneak skill, but either way, it's not going to help you with the bosses. You really are completely reliant on your combat skills. It's really made me wonder if I want to bother replaying, at least past the hubs.

I liked the ending itself though (going the Camarilla route), it fitted and made a lot of sense.

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

Well, having gotten my sneaking feat maxed out by the time I got to the Warrens, I can tell you I had no problem whatsoever getting past any of the creatures down there. I didn't have to fire off a single shot. There is a downside to this good news though. I walked right in front of a creature in full light. I was close enough to reach out and honk it's friggin' nose.

Did it see me? No.

Well, later on I came across another creature that was patrolling, so I decided to test something out. I followed the creature and stopped about halfway through his patrol route. On it's way back, not only did the creature not see me, but it walked around me and continued it's patrol! WTF?! :shock:

Must be some discipline I'm running that my character doesn't even know about.

 

[Lomer]

The score is a little bit low though. At least in comparison with some other titles. For instance Eurogamer awarded a rating of 9/10 to KOTOR. And while I very much enjoyed KOTOR, Bloodlines (with all of its glitches, bugs and bad design decisions) is still the better game IMO.

 

[Sol Invictus]

Yeah, KOTOR pales in comparison.

 

[Mendoza]

I'd say the last third of KotOR is better than Bloodlines though, as each class could fight well enough that you weren't screwed by fighting lots of enemies, and you still seemed to get some use from skills towards they end. Bloodlines had it beaten on writing though.

Certainly for the first two thirds though, Bloodlines had KotOR comfortable beaten for the writing, characters, atmosphere and range of roleplaying options. And I'd consider myself a fan of KotOR.

 

[Sol Invictus]

There wasn't anything to do in KOTOR but fight. I'll take the combat in Bloodlines over KOTOR's uninteractive stuff any day of the week.

 

[Mendoza]

Maybe I'm just slightly bitter about how it went from being so good to so mediocre.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

KotOR didn't piss me off the way that many of the main plot areas in Bloodlines have. Chinatown is about as lame as anything I've made fun of other games for doing since it's filled with respawning machine gunners, jump puzzles, and many other piss poor design hallmarks. I haven't even gotten to the respawning fire ninjas yet, and I doubt I will. I'm pretty damned fed up with just how awful this game gets in the last map hub.

Celerity seems to be the uber discipline for the majority of the game, much moreso than Force Wave was in KotOR. It would make those jump puzzles of DEATH in the Fu Syndicate and other things significantly easier. If you don't have Celerity, you're pretty much fucked when it comes to timing out those five to six moving laser beams. Did I mention those laser beams kill you INSTANTLY if you touch them? You're also forced to wade through wave upon wave of respawners and just deal with them.

Why there aren't other routes in these types of areas is just pretty lame. I have a pretty high demention discipline, but it does me no good versus Fu Jump Puzzle Land. Auspex and that invisibility discipline don't help either. What's even more lame about all that is that the bad guy of that area is standing not more than ten feet from my character, but because he's behind GLASS, I can't use my main discipline on him. What the fuck? Why can't I use Berzerk on the guy standing beside him and have that get me out of the jump puzzles I don't stand much chance of getting through in normal time? Is this DISCIPLINE PROOF GLASS or something? :\

 

[dojoteef]

Is this DISCIPLINE PROOF GLASS or something?

Yeah, how'd you know? It's the rage now.

 

[Mendoza]

Is this DISCIPLINE PROOF GLASS or something?

Yeah, how'd you know? It's the rage now.

It's super prevailant in LA, all glass is discipline proof. It's like how every sword in KotOR has a cortosis weave so it won't break.

 

[Jinxed]

for the majority of the game, much moreso than Force Wave was in KotOR. It would make those jump puzzles of DEATH in the Fu Syndicate and other things significantly easier. If you don't have Celerity, you're pretty much fucked when it comes to timing out those five to six moving laser beams. Did I mention those laser beams kill you INSTANTLY if you touch them? You're also forced to wade through wave upon wave of respawners and just deal with them.

What I did was save right before it. When I loaded the beams were gone for a short while allowing me to walk right past that area :D

Why there aren't other routes in these types of areas is just pretty lame. I have a pretty high demention discipline, but it does me no good versus Fu Jump Puzzle Land. Auspex and that invisibility discipline don't help either. What's even more lame about all that is that the bad guy of that area is standing not more than ten feet from my character, but because he's behind GLASS, I can't use my main discipline on him. What the fuck? Why can't I use Berzerk on the guy standing beside him and have that get me out of the jump puzzles I don't stand much chance of getting through in normal time? Is this DISCIPLINE PROOF GLASS or something? :\

While I agree it's stupid, think what would happen if you killed those fellas. You would probably be left there to rot and no one would let you out.

 

[dunduks]

Did I mention those laser beams kill you INSTANTLY if you touch them?

Actually you can disable those lasers, so i did not need to even jump over them.

 

[Elwro]

So, is the RPGCodex Bloodlines review coming up?

 

[Volourn]

"?! Did the Troika folks leave and let the interns and a trio of lame, retarded monkies do the ending?! As a pure melee character I HAD to cheat to win the game. Sucktastic..."

They must have hired BIo to finish the game since BIo was bored this year. :D


"There wasn't anything to do in KOTOR but fight."

You are an idiot. There are tons of non combat in KOTOR. What's also hilarious I remember having this argument with others where you pro KOTOR. Youa re so up Bl's ass that anytime any game is comapred favorably to it you attack the game on soemthing youw ere defending it on.

R00fles!


"I'll take the combat in Bloodlines over KOTOR's uninteractive stuff any day of the week."

From what I've read and seen the combat of the two is about the same; but I'd wager KOTOR's combat's a lot more fun since it at least has pause (or does Bl have pause n play; i sure haven't heard that it does) and isn't really a click fist that I hear Bl is.

In essence Exitium, you are a fool. Even SP thinks so (even if eh didn't say so directly) on this topic.

D0uble R00fles!


"So, is the RPGCodex Bloodlines review coming up?"

I can't wait for the Codex review as long as Ex doesn't write it.

 

[LlamaGod]

Um... That's poor criticism. It was *always* a FPS/RPG. It should be 50/50.

Then why do 2 of the 3 combat types require 3rd person? Shooting is just a skill, dummy.