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Development Info Kitchen Knife: The Reckoning - A Zombie Tale

VentilatorOfDoom

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Tags: Dead State; DoubleBear Productions

<p>Brian Mitsoda posted another <strong>Dead State</strong> <a href="http://www.irontowerstudio.com/forum/index.php/topic,1818.0.html" target="_blank">design update</a> on the Iron Tower forums, this time he's taking a look at a specific weapon: the kitchen knife.</p>
<blockquote>
<p>As you can see, it&rsquo;s a pretty common knife, not really designed for combat. That&rsquo;s reflected in its skills. But before we talk about its stats, let&rsquo;s take a look at the basics pros and cons of knives in the game.<br /><br /><strong>Pros</strong><br />-Bladed weapons, which means that every attack they do has some chance to cause bleeding. <br />-Lighter, quicker weapons, giving all knives some chance to counter an enemy&rsquo;s attack.<br />-All knives are one-handed weapons, which means there is no penalty to switch to them from other one-handed weapons.<br />-Good critical chance.<br />-AP cost for basic attack is on the lower side.<br /><br /><strong>Cons</strong><br />-Knives do less damage than most other types of weapons.<br />-Despite higher crit rate, critical hit multiplier is low.<br />-Better models of knives are harder to find.<br />-Knives do significantly less damage to zombies than humans.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Here are the stats of the kitchen knife:</p>
<blockquote>
<p><strong>Hands</strong>: 1 (Can keep another object in second hand)<br /><strong>Range</strong>: 1 (Must be standing next to target)<br /><strong>Type</strong>: Slashing (Counts as Slashing damage, not good VS armor with high Slashing Resistance)<br /><strong>Stat Chance</strong>: Counter 40%, Bleeding 20%&nbsp; (Good counter chance, decent chance to cause bleeding)<br /><strong>Noise</strong>: 2 (Extremely quiet weapon)<br /><strong>Strength</strong>: 1 (Strength required to wield effectively, this one is one of the lightest) <br /><strong>ZDamage</strong>: 40% (It only does 40% of normal damage against zombies, so not good for undead)<br /><strong>Critical Hit Chance</strong>: 10% (Pretty high chance for criticals) <br /><strong>Critical Multiplier</strong>: 2 (But only does double damage) <br /><strong>Weight</strong>: 1 (Very light) <br /><strong>Break</strong>: 5% (Low chance to break)</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Just look at all these numbers. What about those players who are not too much into nerd stuff like that? Will they be able to play this game at all? These are the questions RPG designers should ask themselves these days.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
 

MicoSelva

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The attention to details is rather impressive, I must say.
Although knife stats lack 'damage' line. Not that it would tell much if we don't know how HPs are scaled in the game.
 

Baron

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FANTASTIC NEWS!

The humble kitchen knife is a welcome sight in any horror offering. Now, please, a cleaver...
 

Angthoron

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I suppose additionally one of the pros is completely mitigated with the zombies as well, what with zombies probably not caring about bleed damage?
 

pipka

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I wanted to criticise zombies in Dead State once. I read Mitsoda's approach on the question and found his answers on ITZ forums adequate. I approve.
 

Ogg

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Luzur said:
i want to see a purple double dildo used as a weapon in this game.
I hope the Mistodas will read this post and take it into account. Might I add that I would also like a dildo with vibrator, same stats but with increased crit. damage. Pretty please, Annie and Brian, listen to your fans.
 

Dyspaire

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The nerd in me finds all these numbers and descriptors quite compelling, and frankly long over-due.

The geek in me is strangely aroused, and fully ready to consummate my new-found love.

Great job devs. Seriously. Godspeed.
 

Roguey

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MicoSelva said:
Although knife stats lack 'damage' line. Not that it would tell much if we don't know how HPs are scaled in the game.
I thought this was weird too, then I clicked the link. You get the attack types/AP costs/damage there, it'd make the newspost too long.
 

MicoSelva

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Roguey said:
MicoSelva said:
Although knife stats lack 'damage' line. Not that it would tell much if we don't know how HPs are scaled in the game.
I thought this was weird too, then I clicked the link. You get the attack types/AP costs/damage there, it'd make the newspost too long.

Forgot to switch off my stupidity for a moment there. Thanks for the hint.
Ok, I was wrong - the attention to details is not impressive, it's very impressive.
 

GarfunkeL

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Dyspaire said:
The nerd in me finds all these numbers and descriptors quite compelling, and frankly long over-due.

The geek in me is strangely aroused, and fully ready to consummate my new-found love.

Great job devs. Seriously. Godspeed.

Indeed. If AoD comes out in next year and Dead State 2012, it'll be happy days in indeed!
 

mikaelis

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I was wondering, why knife is predominantly branded as "slashing" type in cRPG. In reality it is more effective in "piercing mode". And that is how majority of kills using knife occurs. You don't slash your victim. You try to stab with the tip of the knife. It is more similar to dagger I suppose and not sword etc.

edit: At least if we are talking about normal kitchen knife. With proper combat knifes, or machetes, this can be different.
 

Baron

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I feel like contributing to Double Bear if only get my favourite weapons in the game... the screwdriver and the brick. True, neither is particularly effective against zombies except on a brain damaging criitical, but when battling hordes of rotting humans elegance and style is everything. And nothing says class like hurling a household brick at some ghoul's noggin during the final days of humanity.

The screwdriver is also handy item to have on you to repair the odd door hinge that may have come loose in a prior assault by the ravenous hordes. If all you're carrying is a 9mm Glock and a riot shield then you, my friend, may have to defend an open doorway.
 

laclongquan

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Because for kitchen knives their main action is chop chop chop? Because only combat daggers need stab? Because by its nature chopping is less precise than stabbing and therefore more suited for newbie action?

I doubt you need to stab something with kitchen knives. It just not very efficient.
 

Baron

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There was a tit over on the Iron Tower forums going on about the effectiveness of kitchen knives vs combat knives and their respective merits for realism...

IT'S A FUCKING ZOMBIE GAME!!!
 

Baron

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On the Iron Tower forums Oscar said:
I love the special attacks. I'll admit that I groaned a bit when I saw there was an update about a kitchen knife, but now I'm dying to know what I'll be able to do with a shovel, bat, or whatever else you got.

What about a 2x4 wooden plank?
Oscar gets it. :salute:
 

Jim Cojones

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MicoSelva said:
The attention to details is rather impressive, I must say.
Although knife stats lack 'damage' line. Not that it would tell much if we don't know how HPs are scaled in the game.
It doesn't. The newspost doesn't contain all the details from the update on ITS forum. There's a couple of different attacks, all have their unique AP cost, damage range and sometimes additional effects.

Cannot wait for Brian to post stats of katanas. And a list of available spells. Well, somebody must fill Andhaira's role now that he's banned. (edit: oh, wait, he's back :-/) :P

mikaelis said:
I was wondering, why knife is predominantly branded as "slashing" type in cRPG. In reality it is more effective in "piercing mode". And that is how majority of kills using knife occurs. You don't slash your victim. You try to stab with the tip of the knife. It is more similar to dagger I suppose and not sword etc.

edit: At least if we are talking about normal kitchen knife. With proper combat knifes, or machetes, this can be different.
PS: So players will not be able to 'stab' with a kitchen knife without destroying it?
Precisely - it breaks the knife, and it's most likely the kitchen knife (which is designed to slice up meat and vegetables) would break at the tip as soon as it hit a bone.
 
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mikaelis said:
I was wondering, why knife is predominantly branded as "slashing" type in cRPG. In reality it is more effective in "piercing mode". And that is how majority of kills using knife occurs. You don't slash your victim. You try to stab with the tip of the knife. It is more similar to dagger I suppose and not sword etc.

edit: At least if we are talking about normal kitchen knife. With proper combat knifes, or machetes, this can be different.

Depends largely on the scenario. You're right in that stab wounds are the way most likely to kill someone, and that's compounded by ordinary knives as they are bladed only on 1 side. But it might not spread to using the knife as a melee weapon in a genuine 2-sided fight: most knife murders involve someone murdering an unarmed spouse/relative in a fit of rage. I'm no knife expert, but I occasionally do some knife sparring (martial arts, obviously not using real knives:)) just because it improves footwork and range-awareness, and I find that in a knife v knife fight you mainly end up slashing. Reason is that the primary target is the opponent's weapon hand + arm, because it's inevitably the closest thing ranged-wise (and to hit anything else means exposing yourself greatly) so you end up feinting with a thrust one way then slashing back through their wrist a lot.

On the other hand, you see prison docos of gang fights where it's always just jumping on some guy and repeatedly stabbing, no slashing involved. I think it would vary a lot on the mentality of the folks involved, and whether the other guy is aware or not - thrusting is usually aimed at the body/neck, so you've got to put yourself well into the opponent's own range in order to do it, with a big chance that he'll stab you at the same time. Then again, it only takes one side to be crazy enough to rush in and latch on without a sense of self-preservation, and there's nowhere the fight can go other than mutual stabby-stabby.
 

Elhoim

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Baron said:
I feel like contributing to Double Bear if only get my favourite weapons in the game... the screwdriver and the brick. True, neither is particularly effective against zombies except on a brain damaging criitical, but when battling hordes of rotting humans elegance and style is everything. And nothing says class like hurling a household brick at some ghoul's noggin during the final days of humanity.

The screwdriver is also handy item to have on you to repair the odd door hinge that may have come loose in a prior assault by the ravenous hordes. If all you're carrying is a 9mm Glock and a riot shield then you, my friend, may have to defend an open doorway.

The screwdriver is in, and it gives you a bonus to lockpicking. Also it has a cool attack called Brain Jab. You can imagine what it does.

We don't have the brick, but as you saw, we have the wood plank.
 

mondblut

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Sounds good... except I don't see the most important stat, "AP attack cost". :decline:
 

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