Tacticular Cancer: We'll have your balls

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Vapourware [WiP]Zodiac Legion, a tactical RPG with a strategic layer(ex Project Ragnarok)

Discussion in 'Codex Workshop' started by Galdred, Jan 22, 2014.

  1. Make America Great Again Darth Roxor Prestigious Gentleman Wielder of the Huegpenis, Hater of Eternity

    Darth Roxor
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    Huh. I thought Invisiburu was running on its own engine.

    #themoreyouknow
     
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  2. Galdred Generalist Patron

    Galdred
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    They said it was a heavily modified one. That is one of the minor perks of moai. You don't have to write: "made with the personal version of Unity moai" on your splash screen. :)
    It is buried somewhere in their credits.
     
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  3. Galdred Generalist Patron

    Galdred
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    Fog of War is on, but I need a way to prevent seeing through walls and I need smoother hex borders.

    [​IMG]

    I used another tileset to make the transition to black tiles better in the middle of the screen, but it would involve automatically checking the neighboring tiles for each visible tile, unless I find a cleverer way to do it. The "standard" result, without tile substitution is what you see on the right edge.
     
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  4. I'm With Her Mustawd for prison Shitty Team Member, ditch at first opportunity Douchebag! Illiterate Sychophantic Noob Village Idiot Weasel Repressed Homosexual Possibly Retarded Trigger Warning Edgy No Fun Allowed Shitposter Cuck Manlet

    Mustawd
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    Wow, looking really good Galdred!

    :thumbsup:
     
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  5. Reinar Educated

    Reinar
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    The highlighted hexes are strange looking and the characters look like they're not in the right angle by a small amount in comparison with the terrain, but otherwise nice job.
     
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  6. Galdred Generalist Patron

    Galdred
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    Would you recommend a subtler highlight for movement range? Or maybe just coloring the edges?

    Regarding this game and Battle Brothers:
    I did play Battle Brothers, but the focus of Zodiac Legion is pretty different:
    Battle Brothers plays more like Mount and Blade with Turn Based Tactics.
    Zodiac Legion draws more from Eador when it comes to arranging things on the strategic layer, and Mordheim for the tactical part itself (with move points and action points), but with the objective based missions of XCOM2 (or Descent: Road to Legend for the ones who played the board game).

    On the strategic layer, most things will be rather abstract (especially on the military side. ie no separate mini battle system ala Birthright). Military campaigns will be abstracted as sending X points of Might vs the opposing Y, and they will open missions for the heroes to be able to improve the results (they might assassinate the enemy wizards before a battle, or lead twenty good men and raid the camp , kill and impersonate or mind control the enemy scouts, poison the castle water supplies...).

    On the tactical map, we want to have the tactical part play like special force ops in a fantasy setting, with the team going in, completing the mission, and going out before getting overwhelmed by reinforcements (or before the opponent completes his own objective), so this leads to
    a mission structure more similar to XCOM 2.
    The rationale for not going TU is to avoid crippling melee builds so that they can still move and hit things (ie charge), without requiring a special feat/skill or whatever.
    We plan to keep the number of AP small to avoid letting one side get too many action before the other one can act, so Mordheim would be a pretty accurate comparison (although we have no plan to draw inspiration from their UI).
     
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  7. Sturmgewehr44 Literate

    Sturmgewehr44
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    I just discovered this game through your post in the "Fort Triumph" topic, but I'm excited to see more about this and I'll be watching this closely -- at this point I have no real feedback, so I'll just say keep up the good work, Galdred.
     
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  8. oasis789 Arcane

    oasis789
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    Sounds good as long as you keep in mind the flaws of XCOM2's mission structure and how it interacts with other systems. X2 vanilla's XP system incentivized players to prolong missions as long as possible and farm every loot, every corpse etc, even though the missions were meant to be guerilla/stealth stuff. LW2 did the opposite and incentivized stealthing every mission, leading to a samey experience.
     
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  9. Galdred Generalist Patron

    Galdred
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    That is a very good point.
    In order to avoid incentivizing prolonging missions, I had decided to make all XP mission based, and not opponent based. It is also easier as we don't have to attribute XP for support and similar things now.
    Only the mission outcome and its difficulty are taken into account.
    Regarding stealthing vs brute force, Stealth will be handled off screen mostly (something like you choose the stealthy option on a text menu. A skill check is rolled, if you succeed, you start the mission in a better position, and with less guards, or slower reinforcements).
    These options usually will only be available to some characters (not the guys in plate armor, mostly), or some missions.
    But stealth might change a bit, even though I am pretty sure I don't want it to turn the game into a sub par Invisible Inc.
     
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  10. oasis789 Arcane

    oasis789
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    That is pretty much what happened to LW2 (1.3 is said to fix this but who knows) with the shift to mission-based XP and not much they could do about the stealth mechanics. After all, if you're making a squad tactics game where combat is the main point, you want players to fight.
     
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  11. Galdred Generalist Patron

    Galdred
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    I am almost done with ranged attack. I am not too sure about what to do when you click to attack a target that is out of range: move to max range and engage? move to optimal range and engage? Do nothing and mock the player (well, probably not)?
    Currently, they move to melee range and engage, which might not be the most sensible behavior.
     
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  12. Galdred Generalist Patron

    Galdred
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    btw, I added a totally unrelated blog entry about getting things done, especially when you work without a foreman:

     
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  13. Reinar Educated

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    I don't remember what I was thinking about it back then, but yeah, subtler (more transparent) highlight would be better.

    Just let the player know he's out of range and let him decide.
     
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  14. Make America Great Again Darth Roxor Prestigious Gentleman Wielder of the Huegpenis, Hater of Eternity

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    Yeah, this. I find that more often than not, something taking control from the player and doing things "automatically" leads to many unwanted situations and missteps.
     
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  15. Galdred Generalist Patron

    Galdred
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    I found quite an enthusiastic video about the game from Metapixelatron. That was unexpected and quite uplifting.

     
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  16. Goldhawk Goldhawk Interactive Developer

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    This game looks pretty neat - I like the unit sprites in particular. It's kinda nice to see something go through the shitty pixel art stage and then come out the other side into something that actually looks professional, so well done with that.

    BTW, I saw you mentioning a struggle with publicity etc in the Fort Triumph thread - feel free to drop me a PM if you feel you need some advice on publicity or a Kickstarter etc, I've had some experience doing that sorta stuff.
     
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  17. Galdred Generalist Patron

    Galdred
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    Thank you! That is very nice to hear from you. I will pm you soon.
     
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  18. Galdred Generalist Patron

    Galdred
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    I got a question on the Steam Turn-Based Tactics group about modding and customization, so here is the answer:

    Customization

    Graphic customization
    - Each armor type will match several piece of armor sprites (basically, light/medium/heavy, normal/magic, with several colors to choose from).
    So the player will be able to match pieces with each other within certain limits (no leather for plate armor and so on).
    - The helms will have to remain in line with a given zodiac sign, so there will only be 3 to choose for a given sign.

    Gameplay customization
    To be honest, his is not set in stone yet, as there are not many perks in currently, and we are still iterating on the core gameplay, so it will probably change a lot during testing. The idea would be to have around 50% passive skill or stat increases, and 50 % active skills (or active skill upgrade/sidegrade) on level up.
    Some will be random, and other will be decided by the player.

    Random skills will probably be given at the lower levels, because it would be a bit pointless to spend time skilling up newbies that will be sent to the meat grinder, and it makes it easier to plan the character build around given random perks than to have it compatible with all options.

    Given that the player is leading a small military order, hero characters will usually be supplemented by regular soldiers or spies. These will basically act as level 0 units that can be recruited to the player roster of elite soldiers after a mission.

    Character creation
    In order to make it viable to sacrifice characters to complete mission objectives, there will be no character creation: Your recruits will have a random perk in the beginning (cf gameplay customization).
    You will play the commander of the Zodiac order, but you can die. In this case, you will switch to the next one in charge, like in Crusader Kings.
    You lose when the frotress of the order falls to the enemy, not when the commander dies on the battlefield.

    Stronghold customization
    Unlike in XCOM, there won't be a strict grid to let you arrange your base to maximize defense (X-COM) or adjacency bonus (XCOM). Instead, you will have several facilities to build or upgrade, and several spots in the citadel, inside the city walls, or outside.
    It will determine how easy it will be for the enemy to raid each of your facilities.
    The stronghold itself can be sieged and assaulted, so some of the inner building slots might be reserved to bolster its defenses.

    Building can then be upgraded by either using upgrade schematics to magically enhance them, or assigning characters or special rewards to them (like a 24/24 worker golem).

    Modding
    The game is made with moai, so most of the game logic uses lua (except for a few calculations that are made in C++, like line of sights and pathing). It means the scripts can be modified by anyone, but it may be a bit complex (I will try to keep data separated to make it easier).
    The maps are made with tiled, an open source map editor (I plan to move from maps assembled from preset parts made with tiled in the future, like X-COM or XCOM2).
    So these will be moddable. The only problem would be the documentation, and the need to be proficient with lua.
    For the graphics, it will be much trickier, as I use Texture packer, and I cannot really ship it with the game.
    The graphics <-> game data file will be editable, but the character sprite sheets themselves would require texture packer.
    That said, I doubt anyone will be willing to animate each character frame by frame for 20 to 40 frames/sec, so I don't think texture packer would be a big issue.
    So I would say that modding missions would be easy.
    Changing scripts would be much harder, and adding new pieces of equipment would require even more work.
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2017 at 9:26 AM
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  19. Davaris Arcane

    Davaris
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    Try it on hardcore mode: No games, no Internet, no TV, for 7 days.
     
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  20. Galdred Generalist Patron

    Galdred
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    But the thing is, I intend to keep gaming. I think one of the problems with game designers nowadays is that they don't play other games enough. So not ever doing it before having completed my objectives for the day works better (I just need to stop before 2 AM...).
    No gaming outside of week-end also works well.
    I don't watch TV already, and no internet would make it pretty hard to market the game, or find solutions to problems already solved by others. :cool:
     
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  21. Davaris Arcane

    Davaris
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    That's a interesting theory. If you watch the Tim Cain interview, he said he was in sensory deprivation mode, for around six months. Possibly more. They had no life outside of Fallout.

    Marketing is a problem, that's something I'd need Pomodoros to do. :P

    Getting help can be hard, depending on the engine you use. The engine I use is really easy though, and the help is inside it.

    I thought I'd mention it because my connection went out for a week. It was like coming off a drug + I got a lot of work done.
     
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  22. Galdred Generalist Patron

    Galdred
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    I don't think crunch mode is very healthy :)
    With kids, no life would not be an option anyway. That said, late in the development, it is true that the value of playing other games diminishes, but heh, maybe the lessons learned will serve later, and I have little concentration left after 12-13 pomodoros anyway :)
    I agree, I could not do community management/marketing or accounting without using pomodoros.
    The moai comunity is very small, but helpful, so getting by asking other devs directly does work, but hoping that the solution could be googled is usually futile. But most of the things I look for are not related to the engine anyway. It is mostly algorithms (for Line of Sight, procedural generation, AI...).
    I used to work in a company without Internet before, but I had to take walks when my concentration was dropping too much.
     
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  23. Davaris Arcane

    Davaris
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    An ISP that offers a service where you can book times you want Internet access, would work nicely with that. Unfortunately I've heard of no such service. Taking walks would be better than aimless surfing or news reading, as your brain can rest and wander, instead of being given more noise to process.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2017 at 10:19 AM
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  24. Galdred Generalist Patron

    Galdred
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    You can use stayfocusd, or a similar app to limit browsing. You can whitelist the sites you want, so it is pretty flexible. I think blacklisting everything, and whitelisting sites like stackoverflow and gamedev.net works better than the other way around. But I feel much less urge to browse news now that I use the Pomodoro technique anyway, as it usually fades away by the time I am done with the pom.
     
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